The "Stygian Abyss Client" input thread.

I've literally never played KR client although after downloading yet again, this time I can actually log in with it, so I have seen my toon and blue beetle (not really blue) in KR...

Don't know if it's worth learning the KR client since we're getting the new one though... thanks for pointing out that KR has this... I guess they know how to make it so we can expect it in the next client then.

To me, KR is a reflection of Dark Visions, whatever his name was. It has some good things, like the expanded graphic capabilities and macros, but is not a good client by a long shot. I prefer 800x600 in 2D as I would probably go blind playing KR, although I have the hardware to run anything.

If UO is to survive then we need a hot-shot client, so good that people will not even have to consider reverting to 2D. Sure, a lot of the old artwork can be used (but not all) but we need a clear (good contrast), fast, and bug free client. Hell, there are enough games out there, like Oblivion and NWN2, for the programmers to figure out what people like. Who cares whether it takes another year or not, just keep churning out events and we'll wait, but this time it had better be a good one.

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Don't know if it's worth learning the KR client since we're getting the new one though.

Since the SA client will be a revamped version of KR, I'd say that learning KR now would not be a bad idea and would give you a leg up for future client use.

The key to learning the client is twofold:

1. Do not expect to know how to do everything off the bat. Expect to take an evening or two on a given aspect of the UI not just to learn how to initially use it, but how to best set things up for your own use (case in point: If you have a miner, there are several different methods of setting up macros to mine, so it may take a while before you find the one that works best for you).

2. ASK QUESTIONS. The KR fourm is open and there is a good group of people there who are willing to help out in whatever way they can... even I'm still learning new ideas and techniques to better utilize the new client.

You can't make an informed decision if you don't try out the client, IMO. Plus, even if you end up not liking the client you'll be able to provide more informative feedback for improvement.

Now you know as well as I do Dermott ... the Devs will not get a say in this. The suits will decide as always, and SA will be released when they decide it needs to start making money. Whether its finished or even playable will have no bearing on the release date. Sad but true.

That's exactly why I kicked off this discussion when I did. With 3 new skills coming into the game (2 of which introduce elements that may be difficult to balance), I felt it important for us to talk about them now. My hope is that people will point out any design holes now, so the devs aren't scrambling at the last minute to patch holes.

In response to Dermott...

I think he's right. Every now and then I try to ween myself onto KR a little bit at a time. I'm starting to get to where I can do a decent amount of my gameplay in the client. It hurts me to lose targeting on my mouse wheel, which makes it challenging for me to use the client for combat activities, but I'm getting better at that too.

The client runs great on my computer. At first it was conflicting with some of the software that came with the computer, but after I removed that stuff it runs like a dream and it looks GREAT.

I find that it takes me about 1/3 as much time to make a macro in KR, and I love how you can hotkey your macros from the macro bulider gump, so you don't have to have a screen riddled with hotbars.

welll anyway... I'm getting offf point... like Dermott, I encourage everyone to give KR a serious try. It will be hard at first, but over time it gets easier. Over more time you start to prefer some of the things in KR to 2d.

Sarphus, the way that KR displays a pulsing light on active soulstones, I'll bet your house looks like a discothèque - LOL

Clicking the map button on the bar will chage make it go through the diff Type maps. Such as None, Spyglass, and the large map.

One thing I want changed from what we see in KR is that when you walk into Luna you see every vendor in the world and need it to clear before you go on. Too many handle in the house is about the same. You see everything on all floors. ad enough o see the tings on the floor I am on. At the same tme I want to see people come. That is revered

Those key bindings on the first bar I think should not be set up as number or F key. I want to make my own wih out it saying I alreay have it some other place.

Also Snap to grid would I think be the best rather than making new bars. That way we could just add things as we need in the shape and location. Rather than keep making bars. Drag a spell from the book one a location and not scater all over like in 2D. That way I could sape the things to the black area to fit by shape and number of boxes long.

Keeping new members of a party need I think on the right side not left. I keep my black area on the right. I see no need to cover up the only area I can view by the popping up of party bars. You never kow when a guy wll add someone to the party. He may not be in a fight and I am.

The area where my bar with the picture on it has a large clear area on it that can make targeting the wrong thing if at all. Then I end up moving it and cover up things worse than befor. The one for pets or followers is worse yet. Almost nothing there but and arrow.(please not larger) but a section I can't see that the name will show is there.

Things on the desktop needs to be cleaned as far as size of the area taken up.

I still can't play KR... too laggy...even on my new computer... though I prefer 2d as it stands anyway looks/feel wise

DEV´s, if u still read this thread,
i realy hope that we get back the loved 3D client backpack
i CANT use backpack/chests in my house, not in 2d or in kr both are trash

Accurate analogy
I have 51 or 52 (I forget exactly) of em lined up in my "soulstone library"

Your problem could be software other than KR lagging you.

I was having a problem where every time I would click on my taskbar or Alt+Tab to another application it would freeze me up for 10 seconds.

It turns out the culprit was some of the crappy 3rd party software that came with the computer (it is a Dell). I uninstalled the crappy 3rd party progs and now it runs like a dream.

I love it! In addition, night should be made to be 1/3 of the gaming time instead of what it is now. I can't remember how many hours it's day time, but it was several hours for sure. Night only lasts 30 min last time I counted.

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In the KR client, even with Nightsight/elf-nightsight active, you can still see the colored lighting effects, just more muted than normal.

As it is, the day/night transition would be a lot better if it were entirely redone. The whole concept of day vs night could add a LOT of new atmosphere and content to the game if the devs ever chose to focus on it.

It would also be nice if it dimmed in and brightened gradually instead of on off .

Does anyone know if this new client will fix the graphics lag that is in the game?

You know when you move your character and then they stop, run in place for a second or two and then continue to move. Or runs in place after you direct them to move and then they move. That continued to happen in the KR client.

I know it's not my setup as I'm running a cable connection and my computer specs leave those required for this game in the dust.

I'm picky but I think all of these things are reasonable.

I don't want my character's look to drastically change (KR Failed).

I don't want an all new interface, our current one is FINE even if it's in need of some updating (KR Failed).

I want things to have OUTLINES, this is a 2d game and 3d rules don't apply (KR Failed).

I want to be able to set my mouse wheel up as target self, and down as target last target (KR Failed).


This is the game I've been playing (if off and on) for 8+ years. If I wanted a new game I would have stuck with one of the many that have came out and I have tried over the years. They need to quit trying to "reinvent" this one and just improve it.

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Does anyone know if this new client will fix the graphics lag that is in the game?

Jeremy at the last Town Hall who stated that the SA (revamped KR) client will be using a new system to render animations and graphic load which will GREATLY lessen the memory strain and thus the graphics lag.

So while the answer is "we'll see", it SHOULD be better than how KR performs now.

I'd love to see that. I'd also like to see the Night Sight spell have a toggle effect when cast on yourself, regardless of items or racial ability. Having everything washed out to broad daylight 24/7 ruins the feel of a lot of locations & houses.

I know this thread is supposed to be technical/functional but I just wanted to also suggest MARKETING. I came back to UO after being away for 6 years because I happened to see there was a new interface (KR) and when I found out my accounts were still there, had to see.

Now I am remembering all the great things I love about UO that Everquest did not have. Especially the social interaction and the ability to actually log in and have fun for an hour or two (and not have to stay on 5-10 hours to do anything.) I do not know if WOW is the same but in Everquest, it either took hours (like 8+) to do a raid or hours to find a group to hunt with. Solo content was practically non-existent.

Many gamers today are not kids, they are adults that grew up playing video games. I've noticed that many UO players break to make dinner, go to work, deal with kids, deal with spouse, etc... UO still has the potential to offer great content that they first-person-shooter type games can not give. I don't know about the other shards but Siege has a rich social environment I am growing to appreciate again.

UO is still a great game and you guys have a lot to compete against the other games with. Please get some creative marketing and you will make money, and we will have a better population to play with.

That being said, I like much of the graphics of KR (except for the sizing inconsistencies) and REALLY love the ability to zoom in and out. People love to interact with each other in groups and one on one both verbally and graphically. You should leverage this and preserve the capabilities of the 2d client if you can't improve it. People LOVE to customize their identity and how they appear to others, you should invest more in the avatar system.

The chat system for KR is horrible and one of the top 3 reasons I'm still using 2d and UOAssist. UOAssist support is another, bag management the third.

Again, marketing marketing marketing. You guys have a great game that can lure people away from the other games. You need to get the word out though.

I hope this is helpful. Nice work devs, I appreciate your labor. I can't wait to see what is next.

I hope the graphics for the gargoyle is not the one used in KR. The color is not right. I think either more red to brwn hue. The female should not have a beard. The loin cloth should not hang down like an apron when flying. Targeting things while flying is impossable. Try opning a door with them things hiding it. Those wings are in the way when flying no matter what I do. Angle of the wing to body change may help that. May want to rethink the horn paterns.

Hi, I received a marketing mail from EA today about Stygian Abyss. Since I know Stratics from when I used to play UO before (4-5 yrs ago), I searched for a thread regarding SA.. However Im confused.. Is this expansion live or not? Is it a separate game or not?

No it's not live

No it's not a seperate game. It's a new CLIENT for the same game.

Thanks for clearing that up In Flames.

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An addendum to the climate effects above:

Day/Night cycles:

Reduce the number of UO to real time days to 6:1 (double the length of a cuurent UO day)
Set a day/night schedule based on season:

Winter: 1 hour light, 3 hours darkness
Spring/Fall: 2 hours light, 2 hours darkness
Summer: 3 hours light, 1 hour darkness

Alternative: lengthen to 6 hour days

Winter: 2 hour light, 4 hours darkness
Spring/Fall: 3 hours light, 3 hours darkness
Summer: 4 hours light, 2 hour darkness

Seasons would be based on the season of the server's physical location and change accordingly via the real life calendar.

Give an extended period of day-to-night and night-to-day transition for light fading purposes.

Kudos, Hawkeye...those are exceptional examples. I hope the devs are willing and able to implement these ideas.

As you said it can be better because they had worked on part of it in Beta. Actually you want to really see the magic that the they can do. Go to Winter Spur. The shadeing of the white runs from white in the center areas to a ice blue near the water's edge. It is a true winter wonderland. But that is a small area and to do large areas would take a lot of time. It did just to get Winter Spur looking so great. That is a true art. Also they was working on a fog effect that hovered over the swamp. That was very nice. It was something that never got in KR. I truly hope it will in UO:SA

I love Winter Spur, but wish they would fix the Lady of the Snow's hair. The passage going in is easy to find. Unless you go as often as I do lots of luck getting to the healer to rez you.

You need to look close to the exact spot you walked in. Don't hurt to walk back out and back a few times. I like the way they did it. That thing is only 1 tile wide and looks like you walk up a hill to get in.

Those artist are a true credit to their profession.

That would give so much to the game. I love those examples! I completely share your passion for atmosphere and I hope this is looked into!

I think the whole vendor system needs a good overhaul, or at least context menu repricing.

Being able to lock in positions of items for sale in the grid view, as well as classic view, and re-order them on list view would be great. That way shopkeepers would have complete control over the way their goods are displayed.

Also, for the classic view, maybe a "snap" mode that lets you space items by say 5 pixels, or maybe a % of the bag width/height. Better for neatly lining up rows or columns of like items than total freedom.

Just one rule, don't use any old code; too many bugs.

no time to readrything so forgive me if I repeat anything already said, but the one and only thing I would really really like to see is some looting options. I'm not a powergamer by any means anymore in fact it's been some months since I logged in and played, but when I play I don't like to have to sort through a lot of loot, especially gold. Sometimes I only can manage a couple of hours to play if that. I'd like to see in the new SA client (and 2d if possible) looting options that would work for guys like me who are also generally hunting by themselves.

My method is simple, any resources that are stackable I always loot. Since most loot from solo hunting is not worth the weight or space it takes up players can still sort through the weapons and armor. The KR client was cool in that you could simply right click and you picked up the loot you wanted, I'd like to see it expanded so that if only one player has looting rights his looting options will automatically take effect, no need to open the corpse the gold, gems, potions, fertile dirt, etc. is already in your pack, any stackable you don't want can be toggled onto a do not loot list similarly used in mining rocks and ore.

On that note miners should also be given the ability to mine gems. :>

Those seasonal and weather suggestions are very cool ... ( do summer/winter and spring/fall need to be swapped for Oceania? )

For spring, I might suggest an abundance of flowers.

For that seaside fog ... it would be nice for server to spawn pirate zombies to wander through it

Wow...I have been playing UO since day 1, and this is my first post here on Stratics ever.

Well, here goes:

- A good guide for people doing the art. Have both 2D and the SA client open. Walk up to the object in game. If the object/monster/player whatever does not even resemble the 2D version...it needs to be fixed. Of course you want to improve the graphics, but there is no need to make an Ettin look like something other than an Ettin. If I went to see the new Batman movie, and he looked like Spider Man instead...regardless of how the movie was written, I would not like it. As old time players of UO, some of us have grown somewhat accustom to the graphical representations that we have seen for the last 11 years...and when you change that, you make Batman look like Spider Man. Get it?

- Make the UI more like 2D...but make options for people that like the newer UIs. No need to exclude anyone. Just make more options.

- This is probably the one thing that I would request more than anything else beyond the client being complete and reliable...

Make all this horrid neon crap introduced in AoS go away. Make an option for the client to only display "traditional" color schemes. In the early days of UO, the characters and monsters looked pretty realistic, and pretty medieval/fantasy looking as well. But now, you have glowing blue haired freaks with day glow orange sunglasses destroying that look.

I know that is not a popular opinion, but I do miss the realistic appearance of old UO.

- Bring back the chest at login!!! That was the coolest!

- Keep the scale and size of objects in 2D consistant with that in the SA client.

- Make sure if I am riding my horse, that my horse animaitons are correct, and it is not like he is turning on a swivel base. My feet should not be dragging the ground.

- As someone stated above...if you can do it faster and easier in 2D, then you have done it wrong. But I will add...if the animation or graphic looks better in 2D, you have done it wrong as well.

Just my opinions!!

I had completely fogotten, but YES!

Weather effects, seasons, lighting, etc.

In the old days, wasn't there lightning sometimes? I seem to remember someone telling me back then that if you were wearing plate that you could be struck by it! (that was incorrect of course)

Also, what about FOOD? Eating should not be optional.

I know this is getting slightly off topic, as it is not just a client change, but really...can you put any of this in without client changes?

This is probably a huge ask, but.. would it be possible to have an intelligent filter for incoming speech? I realise there's a blanket filter for profanity, but what I mean is something like this:

"lol" becomes *laughs*
"ty" becomes "Thank you"
"idk" becomes "I don't know"

Obviously there'd have to be grepstr type control over what is translated and how or you'd run into trouble, and it would take some time and care to set up.

I remember a similar feature in the UO Wedding utility for outgoing text, eg: you can set it up to make your character talk with a lisp.. all your typing is as normal but it changes the words so that they "thound like thith". I'm wondering if the same can be done for incoming text in the SA client.

Swearing doesn't bother me so much, but I'd really like to be able to filter out most of the net slang and certain other words. I don't know if this could be achieved with a player-developed script or it needs to be in the client itself, somehow.

Please Dear God,

with the SAClient. please "fix" targeting. On a side note i love the legacy targeting way of life (not running around with a gold circle around me and such)
however. cooking a purple potion for 4 seconds is a huge amount of time in pvp and pvm. this is where my fury begins.

if you click the heal self macro while cooking, it blows up on you after hitting target last.

if you accidentally hit the heal self macro twice, even spells, potions, anything that brings up a target will auto hit you the second before the target hand appears.

so on a side note, to save me a hundred bandages a second. please dont let people re apply a bandage when one is pending.

just stuff to think about

Also, for the new client...

2 more things:

1 - Widescreen support. We need true 16:9 support here!

2 - Multi-monitor functionallity. Who has only one monitor these days? it would be awesome to be able to play full screen on my primary display, and have all my buttons, pack, etc. on the secondary.

Being both a roleplayer and someone who absolutely hates "133t speak" - I like your idea.

The only problem I see in this, is that then it may be harder to differentiate between the type of player. Imagine diving into a really lovely role play session, imagining that the other person is on the same page - when in reality they are LOLing at you behind it all.

Often it's actually good to be able to weed out the lollers from the role players. Not that one is any "better" than the other, but it is definitely a different play style and mentality.

There was a bug with the KR paperdoll at one point, I think if you equipped a polearm or the like your paperdoll's horizontal scaling blew out to 200% or something.

From that, it seems possible that the paperdoll and all its layers can be dynamically scaled. What I would like to see is a feature where you can set your own paperdoll's scaling, and when others view the doll they see it too.

Something like.. okay, I have a character that's relatively short at 5'4", around Björk's stature. But to look at the existing KR paperdoll, she looks willowy and statuesque.. something like Nicole Kidman's proportions. What I'd like is to be able to shorten the SA paperdoll somewhat, just to give a hint at my character's build.

I'm sure for broader characters too, some horizontal scaling would work just as well. I think paperdoll scaling would add just a little more individuality to characters' appearance.

theres only 2 things in the KR client that keep me from using it. firstly, we need overhead chat. this is silly to not give us that option. secondly, let us use more of the old resources. mainly the player characters and human NPCs. couldnt you let us have the old characters instead of these hideous inhuman monsters we're supposed to look at every day? in the paperdoll everyone looks like that wonkey eyed chap with the strange shaped head from the goonies and in the gameplay area everyone looks like they're in ethereal voyage spell. it just doesnt look like uo. i dont mind a new client with updated netcode and UI and all that, but is it really necessary to force us to use new player models? i am also a DAOC player and even in the lotm client you can still use the classic player models :/

i dont care how out of place the old player resources look, i just cant stand the new ones. its 95% of why i cant play the KR client. please let us use them in SA :>

KR has overhead chat...

This is straying into the Dark Past, but the only thing I enjoyed about the Third Dawn client was the use of emotes. I even bound a few of these to UO:Assist macros so that I could dance/faint/etc in 2D.

I'm just wondering if there are any plans to do this sort of thing for the SA client, at release or sometime in the publish future. I like the war-mode animation in KR and I'm hoping more of this avatar enhancement makes it into SA.

In all seriousness... everythign that has been mentioned here is implemented (and implemented well) in Lord of the Rings Online.

I think the developers would be well served by taking a look at that game and not copying it, but kind of using it as a reference point. I started in first phase alpha there and finally left recently (due to lack of solo content), but seriously, their development team implemented some excellent ideas, and I think it could revitalize UO and draw new players in...

I agree with this!!!

I wonder if people are even aware of UO anymore? Aside from just being a great game, it is a game a person can play without having to spend a fortune on hardware upgrades and such. I mean, there are other angles as well, but I for one appreciate not having to turn graphic settings all the way down to be able to play...

One of the things I really did like about KR was the ability to change your facial appearance. I'd like to see that kept. Maybe some more enhancements to that, like make up, tattoos, etc?

Adjustable "run radius", the distance between your cursor and your avatar when you start running, to be able to adjust the threshold would be good. (KR one is too small, leading to accidentally breaking into a run)

I don't know if this falls under new items or new client systems, depends on how it's implemented, but..

I would like to see some way of storing/searching jewellery, a jewel box similar in function to BOD books. Perhaps this is best achieved as a new item rather than a client feature, and as such not appropriate for this thread, but I feel as jewellery will be more important than ever with SA/Imbuing and so forth it should be part of the new client's release.

Similar to the ctrl-shift object handles, a hotkey-trigger that displays engraved labels on containers would be good for organising and storing containers of items. Call it "show labels" or something.

I finally figured out the KR client chat channels, but not enough people seem to use them to create a critical mass of players to get a quasi-permanent "veternarian channel" or "repairs channel" etc.