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Trammelization of Fel and Powerscrolls

Discussion in 'UHall' started by Sevin0oo0, May 10, 2012.

  1. I think... Power scrolls should stay in fel, I also think removing Insurance from Fel would make being in Fel more challenging and more rewarding.

    But then they should also give more reasons to go to fel.. I am stuck for those ideas lol
    Sevin0oo0 likes this.
  2. Mirt

    Mirt Certifiable Stratics Veteran

    That would probably be the death knell for fel. I suggested that if those that are red and raiding don't have insurance then they risk something too, but there is no way that those that they are trying to lure in will come its just to risky to lose your whole suit unless your running cheap faction arties. That would keep everyone out but factioners due to cost.
    hen and Sevin0oo0 like this.
  3. This is why you make the rewards worth the risk. Siege does excellent with out insurance and is a real buzz and sence of danger that gives it its lure.
  4. Rusko

    Rusko Guest

    Inccorect, I am saying these items that already exist in fel should be obtained differently than the time it takes, or the skill it takes, to obtain the EXACT same item in tram...
  5. garillo

    garillo Journeyman

    Removed all of the negatives of being red? Statloss maybe. It was tough back in the day rework a disarm nox thief wrestle mage... I'm glad it's gone. I guess restricting paid character slots to less than 17% of the total landmasses isn't a huge negative *cough* or the fact the facet was handed a broken system that is useless without the income of new players to the population.... Those reds crying weren't real reds, because everyone knew you could also bank through the walls of Empath Abbey...
  6. Petra Fyde

    Petra Fyde Peerless Chatterbox Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend Staff Alumnus

    There is a mistaken assumption somewhere in this thread that pvp in dungeons = fun.
    For the persons posting it that may well be true - but it's not true for everyone. Some people do not find pvp to be fun at all and would hate being forced into it.
    I do sometimes hunt in Fel dungeons, and indeed my testing of the new Covetous has been in Fel on test center. I don't hunt in Fel Shame though. Why not? Well it isn't for fear of being pk'd, it's simply because it's such a darn long way in and out, especially if you've got a GD in tow.
    I would love it if you could recall out, unless combat flagged. Granted this means finding a quiet spot away from spawn to get unflagged before leaving.
    Jade of Sonoma and Sevin0oo0 like this.
  7. Sevin0oo0

    Sevin0oo0 Guest

    A phrase I'd like to comment on, "When UO Started, it was Just FEL..."
    Think space flight... That program brought us availability and advancements of electronics, calculators first I think, look at what we have today. There's no longer trips just up and back down, now they've built a essentially housing up there, where people live. It was a good idea that helped us here on Earth, It didn't stay static, it evolved and is still growing. Both offer benefits to the other, sharing qualities. Life is quite different in Both. Fel and Tram are like that in a lot of ways.

    I was at a website awhile back, kinda like a Google of on-line games in database style. Sorting games, it was easy to see what Dominance the PVP effect has. Not in just D&D type games either, include space and military types in there, a progression from first person shooter games. I just don't think PVP got much progression, all it seems to have gotten is bits of Trammel
  8. Sevin0oo0

    Sevin0oo0 Guest

    SO, how about them Powerscrolls? And I'll go ahead and include Blues and Pinks in there too, any of them with a skill attached. I remember talking to a high level leader of an extremely large guild a few years back in regards to 'excess' scrolls farmed, she stated they get so many, they just ATE the extras. What a waste. Reminds me of the old "Power Hour" days, except this is kinda like power minute, per each and every Skill. Is that nuts, or what? The grind comes filling those extra points, it shouldn't be just for the chance to.
  9. NuSair

    NuSair Babbling Loonie Stratics Veteran

    Things haven't changed all that much in terms of people bitching a whining. Even if it's not exactly true, or there is another way around it, they will ignore that fact and bitch anyway.

    Personally, I hated the fact that I could spend hours working on mining/lumber jacking/whatever and someone could take 2 minutes to come and ruin it. Yet, there was no real risk or consequence for them- other than being red and being unable to go into towns because all they had to do was log on another character slot that wasn't red. I really don't mind the player killing all that much really, other than the scripting/hacking and the fact that there is no consequence for those actions. Your character can't go into another facet and kill other players... well... there is a reason for that. Don't like it, change characters or don't be a red.

    For all the good things I like about UO, the biggest negative to me is that it seems to be built to say- Yes, you can be a **** and we encourage it! Because there is no consequence for those actions/behaviors.

    I'll say it again. Factions should be shard wide, regardless of facet. I think a faction battle at something like Slasher would be awesome.

    I also think they should implement that and when they do, give everyone a 1 time reprieve to wipe all murder counts from their character.
    Jade of Sonoma likes this.
  10. NuSair

    NuSair Babbling Loonie Stratics Veteran

    I was talking to someone about 3 years ago about how every character on all 3 of their accounts was scrolled out (ie- 120'ed on every skill).
  11. Sevin0oo0

    Sevin0oo0 Guest

    I still hear it occasionally, not all of mine are scrolled out, but I'm not looking for an Easy Button, I just can't get excited over it, what's the difference when 120= GM?
    If that method is 'good', then maybe it should be expanded on up to 150? 200? Instead of being creative with mobs, they cheapened the skills and said here's a complicated PITA you can do to make up for it. There are very few I pushed to 120, and then because I felt I Had To - typically, in crafting.
  12. Lady Storm

    Lady Storm Crazed Zealot Stratics Veteran

    I made that suguestion years ago about a toggle for fighting.... it would open up alot of cans of worms.
    Worms like:
    They could free up fel/tram for more players to use but the reds and pks would be pissy at not being able to cream that rich guy who just wandered past them with all the bling......
    On the other hand the red that just walked past the LJ..... in Tram. That LJ would need to visit the looo to change his panties..........
    See I did think it through. :stir:

    It's too late to fix the Fel problem, I am wise enough to know that by now. The days of players running around in fel like it was normal is way gone... Reds will be forever stuck in fel and left out of the mix. :cheerleader:
    Ok next problem...........................
    Jade of Sonoma and Lord Frodo like this.
  13. Sevin0oo0

    Sevin0oo0 Guest

    Remember they tried removing all their counts, didn't work, It's both play style, and status symbol. Those that were once Red, simply became Red again. I originally thought that's what Forged Pardons were to be for. You could remove the status, or not. PVP'ers are Not gonna stop killing, that's why they PVP, that's their game. Maybe make the status a little Harder to obtain, or sacrifice it for some reason just to start over (like we do with Virtues) - something to make it Fun killing and Fun going Red. I have to disagree, it's Not too late to give Reds some dev love.
    Rusko likes this.
  14. I keep reading about Risk versus Rewards, mostly from Reds wanting access to Trammel, or more sheep in Felucca. Usually what they mean, is they want players from Trammel to take all the risks.

    Okay... if they want Risk and Rewards, give Reds full access to all of Trammel (their reward) with a few risks:
    1. Reds cannot initiate combat in Trammel.
    2. Blues can freely attack any Red anywhere, and then Reds can retaliate.
    3. Reds get no insurance, anywhere.

    This would increase their chance for PvP, they just cant' start the fight. And, if Reds don't like those risks, they can stay in Felucca.
    Lord Frodo and Sevin0oo0 like this.
  15. Mervyn

    Mervyn Slightly Crazed Stratics Veteran

    Some people do not find trammel to be fun at all and do not want to be forced into it to get items such as slither and lavaliere and essence.
    Sevin0oo0 likes this.
  16. Petra Fyde

    Petra Fyde Peerless Chatterbox Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend Staff Alumnus

    Which is why, as Poo posted earlier, Fel players sell scrolls to Tram players and Tram players sell those items to Fel players - trade.

    As a Tram player who doesn't do champ spawns I'll be looking for a +20 magery scroll when I've saved up enough gold. I'll be looking for a Fel player to sell it to me.
    Jade of Sonoma likes this.
  17. NuSair

    NuSair Babbling Loonie Stratics Veteran

    Risk vs Reward is a fallacy in UO.
    Lord Frodo likes this.
  18. Mervyn

    Mervyn Slightly Crazed Stratics Veteran

    10 mill, for you 20
  19. CovenantX

    CovenantX Certifiable Stratics Veteran

    I agree with some about having ALL peerlesses & Champs in fel & tram, I do think that the fel & tram artifacts should be different though... for example take the jewelry luck set that's from the brit clean-up, say it drops from lady mel, the ring would drop in tram, bracelet would drop in fel, and when you equip both of them you'll receive additional bonuses for using them both at the same time.

    Also supposedly the loot is increased in fel compared to tram, but it's hard to tell on most things besides peerless/champs [especially with the new re-vamped loot system in shame/wrong] I think people should receive a 500-1000 luck bonus for pvming in fel and maybe double gold in loot or something just as an added perk for taking the risk.

    ALL Artifacts/Replicas obtained in fel should hue your character to a different color so people will know who has received a drop and be Cursed for a short duration, [30 mins after acquiring] after curse wears off the item becomes insurable and your hue turns back to normal (person shouldn't beable to enter tram untill the curse wears off). [remove the Alter-gate to the star room that spawns when the champ dies]

    I think it'll be great for pvp for such a system and it would also premote group play, after all it's not always easy to pvm with a pvp char and vice-versa.

    I know alot of people would hate for changes like this because it sucks to lose something [especially something of value] to a pk that swoops in to reap the rewards at the end of your spawn/peerless.
  20. Mirt

    Mirt Certifiable Stratics Veteran

    Not compared to the other shards. Also I think if you tried to force that on the other shards you would see nobody doing it. It wound end up killing fel everywhere but siege.
  21. Mirt

    Mirt Certifiable Stratics Veteran

    If the scrolls didn't work nothing will work. Fel isn't going to lure more people in all your really going to do is piss folks off. Enjoy pvp with who is there already. If you need more try being nice and showing folks how to do it. Go after griefers and any that script or cheat and chase them from your shards. Get folks started in pvp. Then you might see them there. Of course that only those actually looking for a fight and not just easy kills. The days of the easy kill are pretty much done, so now if you want more folks in fel attract them yourselves. Hold public harrys to get folks interested in it. Try hosting an arena night with prizes. Thats how you get more players because forcing isn't working at all.
    BeaIank likes this.
  22. Rusko

    Rusko Guest

    I love your first 2 ideas, but i feel it should be half of that... Red's coming into Tram have no insurance and freely attackable, But still have insurance in Fel. Blues coming into fel have insurance and are freely attackable... that should compensate for the "swoop and reap of rewards" atleast you wont lose your suit or w/e....
    Lord Frodo and Sevin0oo0 like this.
  23. Risks verus Rewards is mostly a one-way street. Most ideas I've read have been targeted towards Blues, to get them into Felucca with Blues bearing nearly all the risks. Instead of trying to put all the goodies in Felucca, give Reds a chance at Trammel, but then adjust the risks for them.
    BeaIank, Ivor_MacGregor and Sevin0oo0 like this.
  24. Rusko

    Rusko Guest

    Thats what I just said.... Reds in tram, no insurance, freely attackable... But they still need insurance in fel....

    Blues should get insurance in both places. This might work... I dunno
  25. Gorbs

    Gorbs Sage

    Powerscrolls are a PvM reward that is placed in a PvP enabled zone. I'm fine with making them available as drops in Trammel as long as there are limitations set. Turn it into a tribute system in Trammel - to summon the champ that would drop scrolls a player would have to drop 1 million gold and 1,000 silver in an alter. The gold explosion at the end would be removed in favor of a stacks of cheese and bottles of wine/ale, but the group killing the champ would be eligible for scrolls. Something like that.

    This thread does highlight that you need something to bring people to pvp enabled zones. I say scrap the current faction artifact system for something new. Add a cross-shard match-making feature and instanced arenas of varying size / terrain. There should be objects that break LOS, sparkle teleporters, or whatever else might spice things up a bit. Have the current faction artifacts anyone wears be purchasable using silver and points earned through kills/participation/etc. in the new arenas I suggest. Give them a duration (in days or weeks) until they poof. While in the arena make no corpses lootable to ensure no using the system to exploit cross-shard transfer of goods.
  26. Ivor_MacGregor

    Ivor_MacGregor Journeyman

    Couldn't agree more here. Most pvpers these days, or dare I say pro-feluccians, do not realize (or just not care) all the risk is on the blue to come to felucca and not on the pker. I personally would love to see the removal of all insurance in Felucca. This simple dynamic would definitely change how current pkers operate. I know it would alter my tactics for traveling here. Plus it would increase the risk vs. reward for them. Moreover, I think it silly to have items of which you can ONLY obtain in either Felucca or Trammel based areas. Sure, having a greater chance of obtaining said item based on the difficutly of the location makes much more sense. But come on, there is no sense in keeping anyone from having the chance to obtain any item/skill JUST because they do not want to participate in specific game dynamic.

    My personal stance on the felucca vs. trammel argument is pretty simple. I do not like separate worlds for the simple fact it separates the population. However, I have yet to come up with a better solution in order to allow for everyone to pursue his/her play-style and choice. Trammel was a UO saving implementation. There is no argument about that.
    Lord Frodo, BeaIank and Sevin0oo0 like this.
  27. Viper09

    Viper09 Grand Poobah Stratics Veteran

    Everyone always talks about removing insurance in fel or removing it all together. But if that were done would all the players, both pvp and pvm, really be all that happy about it? Somehow I don't think many would like it and instead we would hear a ton of players complaining about the increased risk over losing their "uber" gear. I think many are so use to keeping their items that any revert to no insurance wouldn't be accepted very well.
  28. Goldberg-Chessy

    Goldberg-Chessy Crazed Zealot Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    If you think that dieing anywhere in todays UO is a grind you obviously are just looking for 'easy mode' and will never be satisfied IMO.

    Why not just completely take 'dieing' out of the game. Just put 28 billion base hit points on every new char and replenish them each server up?
    Why should anyone ever have the inconvienance of dieing?
  29. I don't know about removing all insurance in Felucca, because I think it would decimate the already dwindling population in Felucca. But to be fair, the PKs and PVP'ers need to assume more of the risk than what the current system provides.

    I think it's possible to intermingle the two system with some balance so that everyone gains. The current system isn't working, and I would like to see the Developers tackle this.
    Lord Frodo likes this.
  30. Lady Storm

    Lady Storm Crazed Zealot Stratics Veteran

    Remove Insurance for fel??? ARE YOU OUT OF YOUR EVER LOVING MIND!!!
    I can barely get people in fel as it is. Might I remind you why people went to tram in the first place??? (reds, pk's, thiefs, and the occasional swarm of monsters that would spill out of fel towns under siege) Dev think it was for the houses... boys do I have news for u. I totaly agree with Petra. No one wants to go to fel to hunt in a dungeon...getting in and out is hell with a pet, the constant spawns draw them off like a sponge every time you walk 10 paces. Reds? Make one move to hurt me, If I dont kill them, my pets will. Beleave me my GD or Puppy wil kill them. But there again is the rub.... WE WANT people in FEL. 90% of UO population uses less then 10 % of Fel for any reason.

    I live in many of my FEl homes and feel quite safe there, but to give others this feeling of semi safety is not easy when the first thing when a new or returning player comes in game some idiot puts a bulls eye on their arse and shoots. Not a good picture of a safe and good place to play.

    Perhaps make areas a pk and red can kill in.... and some they can't. Restrict thiefs to outside towns for their finger work... It's not much to ask. I mean if you like supporting a vast area of wasted space out side of houseing then keep things as they are...but if you truly want players to utalize fel make it more friendly to players who dont wish to be on the local hit parade of dead bodies who's owners took a chance and got wacked 1st thing out of a gate!


    Today I asked where everyone was on shard... was awfull quiet...... it took a few minutes to get a reply..
    The reply was they are waiting for factions to be fixed they are mad and wont play. They went to pk but there is no one to pk in Fel so they are laying off uo for a few. Babys want their toys back and the Dev took them. This was the gist of it. So they are having a temper tantrum. Keep it up kiddos, I have a wooden spoon and I know how to apply it to the seat of your problem. Meaning GET OVER IT. AINT GUNNA HAPPEN. LIVE WITH THE CHANGE AND GO BACK TO YOUR SLIDE RULER AND PAPER AND FIGURE IT OUT THE RIGHT WAY.
    Lord Frodo and Sevin0oo0 like this.
  31. outcry

    outcry Lore Master Stratics Veteran

    They did that once and boy did they regret that, the players who have say over 10k murder counts want to keep them................
  32. Sevin0oo0

    Sevin0oo0 Guest

    Sorry, I'd of replied sooner, but I was busy dieing to fire daemons, it's like a daily thing we do. :grouphug:
    One of my toons already has an "easy mode", he doesn't leave the house or venture out of the guard zone.
    The only thing I mentioned about dieing was rez-killing, griefing, unless you think that's 'cool' - maybe you should get some kind of special title or reward for killing non-clad, unarmed, 3hit point players, over and over? I stopped using the sacrifice virtue grind, so a title means nothing to me. I carry nothing I can't afford to lose, and have insurance, so dieing doesn't really have much effect on me and don't understand where you came up with that idea. If I wanted Easy, I'd restart and play FarmVille
  33. Sevin0oo0

    Sevin0oo0 Guest

    as stated, they tried that, maybe twice; I also commented on that in another thread... in a nutshell, Forged Pardons should remove your 'redness', similar to IRL, if you choose to go that route, doesn't remove what you did (total kill count), just the 'red', and Red status should be much harder to obtain, imo,
  34. Jade of Sonoma

    Jade of Sonoma Babbling Loonie Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    What does Rusko want? I have to agree with Old Man of UO. A Risk Free Trammel? Heck, I get killed in Trammel more often than in Felucca these days. There are many places, quests and events that are NOT risk free in Trammel with desireable items as rewards. If they are too risky to get I have to avoid the areas unless numerous players are there to help too. A simple mistake like recalling to a City to work on Loyality gains can easily result in being gang-killed by a pack of Red Raiders waiting at the Captain of the Guard's chest where you have to get the rope with which to arrest rioters. It is like being gangked by a bunch of pvpers as in the wonderful old world. So what on earth do these devout pvpers expect from UO? More victims any which way they can get them?
  35. Meatbread

    Meatbread Journeyman

    There are only like three powerscrolls that are even worth anything anymore. Spawns aren't even patrolled, and any pack of blue trammies can waltz in there and do one as long as it's not Despise during peak hours or something. I'm one of the blues that's been doing them lately on Atlantic, and my sampire has a 110-120 cap in half the skills in the game from eating scrolls I know nobody will want. I've never even died doing it.

    This whole idea that champ spawns are this super-competetive gankfest is woefully outdated.
    Thav12, outcry, Podolak and 1 other person like this.
  36. Jade of Sonoma

    Jade of Sonoma Babbling Loonie Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Seriously Rusko .. when did you start playing UO? In the old days, UO was the game-world's biggest test shard. It still is. What didn't work in the old world was corrected by having the mirror image without PVP. Trammel. That didn't mean the end of Felucca. I kept a house at the Entrance of Destard in the old world for years after Trammel was established, as did many old veterans of the game who stayed in UO. Many continued to hunt all over Felucca for years. Destard was my home. So what happened?

    Trammelite are not looking for easy risk-free anythings. You are simply talking about kids who want everything RIGHT NOW and aren't prepared to work to get it.
    Sevin0oo0 likes this.
  37. Podolak

    Podolak Babbling Loonie Stratics Veteran


    You understand this because you actually go to Fel. At least there are some voices of reason, thank you sir.

    Yesterday I popped every spawn in T2A, I advertised which were rats in GC. Hours went by before someone worked up Tortise. They popped the champ. I thanked them for actually making use of my effort and went on my way. I presume they finished the champ I didn't see anyone else about.

    Yesterday on Atlantic, Oasis. One red guild did a rat and another red guild tried to take it from them. It made for some great PvP. Anyone with GC on and went knew there would be trouble. If you were a smart blue you did a spawn somewhere else while all of the ebil reds fought amongst themselves.
  38. Meatbread

    Meatbread Journeyman

    Yeah it's all about Barracoon. Your odds of getting raided while off doing Rikktor or something in the backwoods of T2A are low, even on mighty Atlantic. Sure Rikktor isn't super easy, you can't just casually solo him, but I go with guild groups and we burn him down anyway. It's only PVE, he's not THAT hard.

    Even if you do get raided, so what? You're not any deader than you would be if some overpowered monster two-shotted you.
  39. Madrid

    Madrid Slightly Crazed

    The notion of Gankfests isn't outdated, it's the reality that no one is going to Felucca to farm powerscroll to get ganked i.e the demand for power scrolls has plummeted and I couldn't be happier. Never should have been allowed in Felucca only to being with...

    The Powerscroll market has been flooded and prices have dropped significantly over the last 2 years and many players were able to farm powerscrolls on secluded shards and sell them on those shards where the market was controlled by PvP guilds (gankfest extraoridinare guilds).

    I think it's been over a year since I've done a Felucca spawn or attempted to farm powerscrolls and I can't even remember the last time I munched a powerscroll of any kind. Combine that with the reality that UO isn't gaining any new players in it's current state and you have what we have.

    If the demand was high then the "trammies" would still be getting butchered like sheep led to the slaughter no doubt about it.
    Lord Frodo and Sevin0oo0 like this.
  40. Podolak

    Podolak Babbling Loonie Stratics Veteran

    I ran by two mystics in Oasis several days ago. They were tag teaming Rikky. They'd each cast colossus and hide. When there colossus went they'd cast again and hide. They did this over and over. I watched them (I was blue so they didn't feel overly threatened) to see if it would actually work. It took some time but sure enough it was a sound tactic. They did complain about no good drops though.
    Sevin0oo0 likes this.
  41. Goldberg-Chessy

    Goldberg-Chessy Crazed Zealot Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Sorry bud but no back-peddling. Thats why I specifically said "dieing anywhere"
    It has nothing to do with pks or rezz-killing.
    I never said griefing or rezz-killing is cool.
    A supposed vet player (yourself) complaining that dying to rezz-killers is a grind (what you clearly did complain about btw in your OP) is just ridiculous & pathetic. Please dont change your words to try and pretend that you were actually just being a fool while trying to say that you dislike rezz-killers.
  42. Lady Storm

    Lady Storm Crazed Zealot Stratics Veteran

    Look I have listened to 4 shards of pvp,pks and reds bitching about how they dont have enough to kill! No one is in fel they say.... Hell boy would you go to fel if the first thing you see out the gate is a bunch of idiots trying to kill you in 1 shot?????
    Forget the Spawns.... thats a reds love place... they love to catch the poor people who hope to get a few good scrolls, giving them hell and then bitch they got squat.

    You expect players with expencive items to go to fel and you to catch them uninsured so you can crow like a peacock on GC?? HAHAHA give the general population of uo credit for some brains. Oh there are a few pieces that get over looked or exchanged and forgotten to be updated sure.... we all have done that. But you who want the quick kills and to loot them dry of everything .... your the main reason the players dont do fel. I told the red guilds when tram became open that they were driving the players to tram and soon they would have nothing to hunt.....
    I play in fel all the time, I run my dragons and mare and fish, chop and mine. I see not one soul in all my runing around. If I do its scared and pops off so fast i cant even say hi before they raise a dust cloud as they disapear. You who sit here and rant and rave there is no one to pk or pvp with....... you did it to your selves.

    I would love to have it so fel looked like it did back in the day before tram but I wont blame Trammel for doing it...... It didnt do it without your help.
    think about it
    Love ya all
    Sevin0oo0 and Lord Frodo like this.
  43. Viper09

    Viper09 Grand Poobah Stratics Veteran

    Haha, yeah. Funny but at the same time kind of sad but I can understand those people being so scared to see anyone in fel. Usually those players are the ones who rarely every step into fel so their expectations are that everyone who is there is there to kill you. Sad though that their assumption is that fel and all those who play there are evil and sinister.
  44. Lady Storm

    Lady Storm Crazed Zealot Stratics Veteran

    Yes exactly. They assume I am a bad person and run for the hills. Its a sad day when the only person in fel outside of me is a red looking for a kill.....
    I have mined in fel and choped trees looking for that dumb frost wood tree...... yes I know i am in danger if a red or a pk shows up (pks come in blue too) but I try to hold my ground and talk to them. Perhaps they dont know I am not a enimy or a pk looking for trouble in disguise. Oh its fun to them to kill first and loot what they can and wait for you to return to body to kill you again.... not. Fel is a barren land void of people that are ghosts in my mind when I recall in to occelo or moonglow. How many friends I have seen leave never to return........ I am not saying they have to go away or stop playing them but think before you kill and loot them.... how few players do you see in fel that are not fellow pk's or pvp'rs?? Every one you drive away not to return to fel is one less you might have had to run with..... people need to feel happy in their enviroment before they will venture off to try more darring stuff. Long ago i use to have a few small houses off the boot's toe in fel.... I use to have vendors on the porch and in side the small house. I would cater to any and all who needed items but I kept special vendors for reds filled with things I knew they couldnt get their hands on unless they switched characters to a blue to buy it. One red came one day and surprised me and took me off guard, he killed me then once he opened my bag he found out i was the owner. He rezed me and said sorry. He thanked me for being so good to reds. He meant the vendor of things they had trouble getting. He told me he might forget and do it again but he would not loot me... He was a good friend after that.... Not all reds are bad, some are sweeties and know when its a good thing to not loot. Many reds learned who I and my son were and were very good about the killing at the shop. I dont hold grudges and I give everyone a second chance.....
    How about this as a idea.....

    All the pvp pk and red players out there take a break get players to come ot fel, invite them. make a truce and have the EMs announce it to the shard for set time and invite people new to fel...... give lessons on fighting and the art of what you do.... teach them Give the people the chance to get to know your better side. hell you might just end up with a new guild full of playmates! Oh I know it might not work on some shards as the population is too small for it. lets face it some shards are pretty much void of new players.
    Sevin0oo0 and Lord Frodo like this.
  45. garillo

    garillo Journeyman

    These two I can agree with. However, with the current complexity of gear and the intricate crafting system no insurances, Tram or Fel, should be removed. This is one of the main problems people have with Seige and playing there. If everything had stayed a gm made, sure.

    Reds already run the risk of being largely outnumbered, especially since friends won't be able to help. You're basically asking for the keys to single target focus and wipe a character slot's suit.
  46. Meatbread

    Meatbread Journeyman

    They can just scrap the entire murder count system, let everyone be blue no matter who they kill, and let anyone go to Trammel for all I care. Honestly what difference would it make in 2012?
  47. Sevin0oo0

    Sevin0oo0 Guest

    OK, sorry, I had re read my OP before that post. just re read it again - been easier if just that very last line was quoted. Immediately before that was the suggested change for the 'grind' and and examples, the immunity thing (maybe it should restore a small bit of honor virtue, enough to get your stuff, regroup, go at it again).I'll expand...
    I've died as many as 10 times, all in a small area, 1 step-> die, 1 step->die, etc. just to get away from the persistence - THat's a Grind.
    Rezz killing is a not just a Grind, it's also akin to trolling, imo.
    A mob kills you, loots you, "resets", gone forever, THat's a Grind.
    The ground covered with dead, layers deep, and you're trying to find You, THat's a Grind.
    The 'one-way short cut' in SA, fire island entrance - if you're dead (or alive) you can't use the short cut to go back - THat's a Grind. Bottom layer of Shame, dead, and tho easily done, that's a long trek out, Grind of sorts, as is no recall in Fel dungeons.
    You're a regular here, so you've already heard all of the above, because they came from others, I just happened to agree

    Dieing is Easy, it's the 'process' associated with dieing that is the grind - being rezzed is not the Restore Point like in a regular computer game, nor should it be, and maybe that's just a non-static penalty for dieing, That's why Insurance was born if I remember right, people thought it "too much of a Grind" to get their stuff.
    I say the grind was there, and still exists in lesser form. Some things can't be insured. A mob has unlimited weight- it doesn't count, so one with 50 str can loot 500 stones, without any effect on stamina, making finding that needle in a haystack of who looted you. I've killed them all and not necessarily found my stuff - maybe they 'reset'. Killing them all just to find my stuff, THat's a Grind. Usually after that, the Fun has been lost for me, and it's hard to restart at that point, so I just Log. and maybe it's just me, and others are saying What Fun, but I know others Aren't. Others can probably give more examples of why dieing is a grind, but it's one point in a complicated issue.

    THat's what I meant, back-peddling? no
  48. Sevin0oo0

    Sevin0oo0 Guest

    If you're PVM, you get a 'count' of such - called Fame/Karma. PVP is unique that it shows player Kill Count, That's the equivalent balance to me. In pvp everywhere, it's ALL about the kill, and in that aspect, that's part of the reward for being successful, maybe it should be a ration of kills/losses, dunno.
    But on that line... I think Kill Count should represent Negative Fame/Karma levels, and could be sacrificed). I have 'pure mules' with negative titles, not very representative, as a player that's just not any good, or gets rezz killed a lot can be 'negative'. just a Cheapened title, imo. Not scrap it, just change it to where it makes sense. I'm actually not a fan of 'negative numbers' - Killer Titles, Yes. Use negative and fun in the same sentence, it's just not very inviting. Possible, the current presentation of PVP is what stops more from trying. I remember players wouldn't trade with from you in person, if you had a negative title - you were a cheat or scammer, it was reflected to the real person behind that toon, unfairly - That needed changing, not removal
  49. GalenKnighthawke

    GalenKnighthawke Grand Poobah Stratics Veteran

    Apologies, I haven't read this thread, because instinct and experience tells me what it is going to be.

    While I agree with the sentiment the first post appears to espouse (why grant such critical items solely to a lifestyle most players don't want to participate in), there's little point in raising the issue. The team will never take anything away from Fel and indeed it's all we can do to remind them of the lessons of the past and hope they do not add stuff to it.

    Raising the issue will merely lead to a flame war. If I'm wrong and that's not what this thread has become, I apologize.

    -Galen's player
  50. Sevin0oo0

    Sevin0oo0 Guest

    I hear ya, tough subject, more often than not, getting locked and the original discussion PK'd, topic closed. I think it's stayed reasonably focused so the heat from any flame is taken well. It covers multiple subjects and has given rise to some great ideas. Read, come share your thoughts.

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