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2-H Weapons: Increase range to 2-tiles?

Discussion in 'UHall' started by Arcades, Feb 8, 2013.

  1. Arcades

    Arcades Sage
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    Would love to test this out on TC1 while we are brainstorming, keep all current changes, I like the Balanced only on looted 2-H, but if you cannot use evade/parry, that kinda sucks...might need a little extra, like increased range.
     
  2. Shakkara

    Shakkara Slightly Crazed
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    Yep I said something similar, but I'd base it on weapon type:

    2H Long Pole Arms - 2 tiles range - Bardiche, Halberd, Spear, Pike, Bladed Staff, Pitchfork
    2H Axes - Extra lumberjacking damage while on foot - Axe, Executioners Axe, Battle Axe, Double Axe, Hatchet, Ornate Axe, Two Handed Axe, Large Battle Axe
    2H Staff - Extra parry chance - Black Staff, Gnarled Staff, Quarterstaff, Crook, Gargoyle staves
    2H Mace - Ignore stamina loss reduction from heavy armor - War Hammer, Nunchaku, Tetsubo
    2H Sword - Hits multiple targets in front arc - Daisho, Scythe, Crescent Blade, No-Dachi, Runeblade, Talwar,
    2H Offensive Fencing - Ignores 5 points of resist on target? - Spellblade, Double Bladed Staff, Sai, Short Spear
    2H Defensive Fencing - Increases DCI (less than parry effect, but is not skill related) - Tessen, Kama, Tekagi, Layatang
     
  3. Vexxed

    Vexxed Certifiable
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    I really like the 2 tile range idea. Im not quite sure how it would work out in PvP but its intriguing. I do see the logic behindngrouping them by types but its a bit much imo. Id probably stick with the 2 tile range depending on how that worked out in testing. Perhaps justifing a 2 tile range with things like sai & nunchuch by saying the warrior can move / attack quickly for short bursts with such weapons etc.....
     
  4. CovenantX

    CovenantX Babbling Loonie
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    Please no, Increasing the range for two-handed melee weapons wouldn't help pvp... I think the problem with melee dexers is they don't hit hard enough with Two-handed Weapons to make 2-h weapons worth using... there's a reason 100% of melee-only dexers either use Nerve-strike,DeathStrike, Armor Ignore, or DP... the ones that do not use Nerve/DS, have either Archery or Throwing.

    Dexers not needing to stop to swing would act as if they had a mana-cost-free running-shot, obviously limited to two-tiles.
    Do you want a dexer chasing you with a two-tile ranged splintering weapon? I don't... I'd rather them cut my HP by 1/3rd-1/2 per hit without using a special attack. (PVP)


    The reasons people don't use most two-handed weapons, is because Base Weapon Damage vs Base Speed, isn't high enough. (This goes for both Pvm & PvP).

    Especially now that you can get shields with SSI & Damage increase it's harder to reach these caps with a two-handed weapon taking up two-item slots worth of properties, for a 1-2 to 2-4 more base damage.

    (The swing-speed cap isn't very friendly when it comes to making slow weapons useful either.)

    Armor Ignore is also a key factor in both Pvm & Pvp one-two-handed weapon use... due to the way percentage resistances work.

    The Armor ignore cap makes it to where, you only need to go so far with a weapons base damage vs speed, anything beyond that point is wasted... (This should Not be the case)
    in the end I honestly think Armor Ignore needs a nerf, but become un-capped completely (pvp)... for both PvM & PvP.
    (and no I don't want to see AI get nerfed either, but I also only use AI & Whirlwind for PvM (That is literally the only two-specials I use) and AI is among the specials I use in pvp as well... but I won't use a weapon with a base speed above 3.5s unless it's ranged (with AI))

    Currently Armor Ignore does this : Ignores targets defense but deals slightly lower than the weapons maximum potential.

    IMO Armor Ignore should do this : Ignores targets defense but deals 50% less damage (PvP) 30% less damage (Pvm) than the weapons Minimum potential.

    no weapons with a base speed above 4s should have the armor ignore special attack.

    It would make balancing weapons much easier IMO. otherwise two-handed weapons will still remain unused if Something isn't done (even after the current Pub81 changes)
     
    #4 CovenantX, Feb 9, 2013
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2013
  5. Lefty

    Lefty Lore Keeper
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    That's a no go. That would give the attacker 2+ free swings on a retreating foe.
     
    CovenantX likes this.
  6. CovenantX

    CovenantX Babbling Loonie
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    The way Damage Increase worked Pre-AoS wasn't a percentage (The percentage came from your skills/stats),
    it was a flat Increase to base damage +1 - +9 on magic items +2 bonus from exceptional weapons.
    Valorite Runic weapons were Exceptional & Vanquishing which would be a +11 min/max base damage.

    This means... a Vanquishing Katana if the pre-aos damage applied now, a Non-exceptional vanquishing Katana would look like this:

    Katana
    Physical Damage 100%
    Weapon Damage 20-22
    Weapon Speed 2.5s
    Strength Requirement 25
    One Handed Weapon
    Skill Required: Swordsmanship
    Durability 255/255

    Instead of this:

    Katana
    Damage Increase 35%
    Physical Damage 100%
    Weapon Damage 11-13
    Weapon Speed 2.5s
    Strength Requirement 25
    One Handed Weapon
    Skill Required: Swordsmanship
    Durability 255/255

    That was also with an AR system, instead of percentage based Resistances like we have now...

    a katana with 20-22 damage (according to the calculator on stratics) would do 79-87 (on your status bar) with 150 str, 120 tactics, anatomy, & 100% damage increase in items
    you then reduce that by whatever your targets resist is...

    say all 70s (pvp) your damage per hit would be 23-26, on an auto-attack. and that's why two-handed weapons aren't so useful anymore IMO.
    They're useful based solely on which specials they have.