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A good idea for Siege!

Discussion in 'UO Siege Perilous' started by Kage, Dec 21, 2008.

  1. Kage

    Kage Crazed Zealot
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    I think we should all get together and try to get passive detect on Siege.

    It would make PVP much more enjoyable... People would be forced into playing real PVP templates again... Dexers, Mages, Necro/dexers etc... Would pretty much eliminate GIMP PVP on Siege Perilous.

    I am not sure where we need to go with this but trust me this is a great idea for Siege... and it would definitely bring more fights and more people to Siege.

    There is no need to bash this because I'm sure some of you will say there is nothing wrong with it and that you Kage run it your self now yadda yadda but Trust me there is nothing I would like more to be able to run a non stealth template...

    So come on Siege help me support this!
     
  2. Sweeney

    Sweeney Guest

    There is no need for passive detect on Siege. If a stealther invests 175 points into a skill set they expect it to work. Adding passive detect is a lame lame fix. I might be for shortening the timer on Detect Hidden.. but you're wanting to turn Siege into Trammel.
     
  3. Arch Magus

    Arch Magus Guest

    Yeah man, you are so right!

    Siege needs to force players to play certain templates, because your Guild can't kill stealthers! :scholar:

    Real intelligent post..
     
  4. Sweeney

    Sweeney Guest

    And BTW.. Speedy already suggested this on UHall and it got no support.

    [edit] Rereading your original post.. you think that everyone that stealths is into pvp? You must have no idea about thieves, crafters.. anyone that is smart enough to not want to pvp because they don't have the template for it. I think it was Ru on UHall that said it.. there was ways to beat stealthers you just have to learn them, remember they do have a 175 skill point deficit on you. [/edit]
     
  5. Kage

    Kage Crazed Zealot
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    Siege is Trammel Sweeney... I know you don't understand but Siege is the Vet shard it supposed to be harder not easy... Everyone runs Hide, Stealth, and ninja in on there pvp templates for a reason...

    I have been playing around with it for a few days not and have killed so many people its almost sad... I have fought against 8-10 people and a time and have not broke a sweat once... it's just to easy to not die... If you have half a brain u will never die... I have not lost a fight or died or even came close to dieing in several days now.

    If I get detected I just hide again while that person with detect on has to wait several seconds before even attempting to detect me... and that is with only 100 hiding and 80 stealth and human at that... once I am 120 stealth I will probably never be revealed...

    I had a person with GM detect to see how long it took to reveal me with my skills at 100 hide 80 stealth and it took him 7 trys before he finally revealed me... that just dumb

    And he had to wait 6 seconds between every attempt... When he finally detected me I just smoked bomb again and stealthed away.


    I mean look at the pvp on Siege. Its either stealth Archer, fencer, weapon skill, or a stealth tamer...

    Now maybe if you have this combination of skills then passive detect or detect hidden should not work well against you... 100 hiding, stealth, stealing, detect, snoop etc... make it so thieves do not get revealed easily... depending on high you are in those skills would go against your chances of not getting revealed.
     
  6. Ru TnT

    Ru TnT Seasoned Veteran
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    how exactly would having passive detect bring more people? i'm not bashing, just curious. still waiting for you guys to post some solid reasons to add it. hell, give some good reasons and i may support this. it would be nice to drop detect and pick up something else...
     
  7. Kage

    Kage Crazed Zealot
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    Siege is Trammel Sweeney... I know you don't understand but Siege is the Vet shard it supposed to be harder not easy... Everyone runs Hide, Stealth, and ninja in on there pvp templates for a reason...

    I have been playing around with it for a few days and have killed so many people its almost sad...

    I have fought against 8-10 people at time and have not broke a sweat once... it's just to easy to not die... If you have half a brain u will never die... I have not lost a fight or died or even came close to dieing in several days now.

    If I get detected I just hide again while that person with detect on has to wait several seconds before even attempting to detect me... and that is with only 100 hiding and 80 stealth and human at that... once I am 120 stealth I will probably never be revealed...

    I had a person with GM detect to see how long it took to reveal me with my skills at 100 hide 80 stealth and it took him 7 trys before he finally revealed me... that just dumb

    And he had to wait 6 seconds between every attempt... When he finally detected me I just smoked bomb again and stealthed away.


    I mean look at the pvp on Siege. Its either stealth Archer, fencer, weapon skill, or a stealth tamer...

    Now maybe if you have this combination of skills then passive detect or detect hidden should not work well against you... 100 hiding, stealth, stealing, detect, snoop etc... make it so thieves do not get revealed easily... depending on high you are in those skills would go against your chances of not getting revealed.
     
  8. Ru TnT

    Ru TnT Seasoned Veteran
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    lol, highlighted that for me? we posted at the same time :)

    who were the revealers?
     
  9. Sweeney

    Sweeney Guest

    I'm out of my realm of knowledge now.. but can't a Reveal/Detect Hidden combo be executed nearly simultaneously?
     
  10. Kage

    Kage Crazed Zealot
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    See my last post near the bottom section...
     
  11. Kage

    Kage Crazed Zealot
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    I had Daniel to put on GM detect and GM Tracking.
     
  12. Sweeney

    Sweeney Guest

    I've been killed by tracking/conflag pots/detect hidden combos more than you can imagine. The smart pvpers can deal with stealthers easily.. they have the skills and talent.
     
  13. Kage

    Kage Crazed Zealot
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    It's monday Dec. 22nd I will inform you if I ever get killed on my new ninaja/stealth template and it's not from a lost of connection or client crash...

    But trust me it will be along time :)
     
  14. Ru TnT

    Ru TnT Seasoned Veteran
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    heh, get me shay's suit back and we'll see how long it takes :)
     
  15. Sweeney

    Sweeney Guest

    I think Ru is the master of stealth ninja PvPing. You do have a lot to learn about PvP evasion if this is your first time with that template. But please inform me.. I'm honing my pvp skills bit by bit.

    Here's your first tip.. don't eat yellow snow.

    [edit] I'm not on Ru's side.. I've evaded him a few times, and been tracked/killed by Bo a few times.. you need to quit asking for a nerf and learn some skills. [/edit]
     
  16. Kage

    Kage Crazed Zealot
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    I don't have a lot to learn at all. I can play any pvp template there is. I understand the mechanics behind the game and skills and combination of skills I know how to play the template. like I said a well knowledged person in regards to pvp will not die.

    Ru can not deny it. Ru how many times have you died on Shy'lei? I'm sure it's not often at all. And I would be willing to bet you can count on your fingers how many times you have died since teh faction items have came out.
     
  17. Sweeney

    Sweeney Guest

    So why are you asking for a passive detect nerfing? You say you have the skills, but you aren't comfortable using them else you wouldn't have started this thread.
     
  18. Kage

    Kage Crazed Zealot
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    Nm... Sweeney... Like I said you don't understand. I don't expect you to it's ok.
     
  19. Sweeney

    Sweeney Guest

    As I said.. if you want to lower the timer between Detects.. that would be fine with me. But asking for passive detect would instantly make everyone go elf and ruin any real talent in this shard (or at least show that devs cave in to every half-assed request).

    You may get angry about stealthers that survive.. but it takes more than skill points to evade the pvpers. You might be mad that certain pvpers survive your attack.. but you survived as well.

    Just because someone attacks you at low-hp and kills you and survives.. don't knock the template.
     
  20. Sweeney

    Sweeney Guest

    So you are saying this is a pvp only thing? You want to nerf nearly 200 skill points because it interferes with your pvp? Learn how to Track/Detect.
     
  21. enigma eb2

    enigma eb2 Sage
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    You know why you never see anyone selling back my faction items..... I am damn near impossible to kill on Coyote Jack. Stealth is the way to go. Fix it dont fix it i dont really care either way. But i think you would find that so many people play siege and you cant even see them.
     
  22. Aurora0811

    Aurora0811 Guest

    It seems there is a huge misconception here. Just because I play on Siege, does not mean I wish to PvP. I will if the need arises, although I suck at it. However, my friends and I came to Siege because it posed the greatest challenge and was as close to when we originally began playing as any shard could be. A passive detect would destroy crafters who were merely trying to gather resources to supply the PvPers...lol, not to mention those who played the game normally with the added bonus of possibly being raided - therefore requiring some intelligence about PvP and survival...with passive detect, I think you would lose more players than you would gain. Passive detect ruins stealth, like every other shard...and having stealth actually work is a major draw for some players.

    I am sorry, but I do not see any legitimate reason to support this as I feel this would not be in the best interest of the vast majority of Siege players.
     
  23. Sweeney

    Sweeney Guest

    All I am saying is that Track/Reveal/Detect can solve all your problems effectively with only 6 seconds in between. This combo is effective against stealthers I have been the victim of it many times.

    Passive detect is for weenies.
     
  24. Kage

    Kage Crazed Zealot
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    If you did indeed die on a stealther then you my friend are the one who needs to learn a few things... use you head... man if you get detected smoke bomb insta Hide! get out of the area... he can't detect u for 6 seconds... run in mount form hop a server line and they loose the track... Ru is good about this... like I said he knows just as I do. It's pretty much impossible to die on the template until you get cocky...

    And not sure what u are talking about killing people who have low hp lol I attack people when they are full life and end them within seconds..

    120 Fencing, 120 Ninja, 120 Stealth, 100 Hiding, 90 tactics, 100 tracking, 65 Med...

    Track your target 2 screens... mount up... Bleed, DS, Fuki, Conflag... they will die everytime. you hit them with a bleed which stops bandaids and pretty much every form of healing... if they run they take 60+ damage from your death strike... If they stand toe to toe they still die.
     
  25. Kage

    Kage Crazed Zealot
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    If you did indeed die on a stealther then you my friend are the one who needs to learn a few things... use you head... man if you get detected smoke bomb insta Hide! get out of the area... he can't detect u for 6 seconds... run in mount form hop a server line and they loose the track... Ru is good about this... like I said he knows just as I do. It's pretty much impossible to die on the template until you get cocky...

    And not sure what u are talking about killing people who have low hp lol I attack people when they are full life and end them within seconds..

    120 Fencing, 120 Ninja, 120 Stealth, 100 Hiding, 90 tactics, 100 tracking, 65 Med...

    Track your target 2 screens... mount up... Bleed, DS, Fuki, Conflag... they will die everytime. you hit them with a bleed which stops bandaids and pretty much every form of healing... if they run they take 60+ damage from your death strike... If they stand toe to toe they still die.
     
  26. Sweeney

    Sweeney Guest

    You have just stated why passive detect is not needed. Thank you.
     
  27. Kage

    Kage Crazed Zealot
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    How you gathered that is beyond me lol...

    Like I said I don't expect you to understand... my suggestion to you is UO PVP for DUMMIES... maybe you can find it on Amazon.com...

    When you have an intelligent response please reply to me.
     
  28. Weakling

    Weakling Guest

    I agree that Siege needs to have Passive detect.
    It is far to easy to stealth around on siege.
    I find it rather ridiculous that you can walk over a invisible person and still not see them.
    Stealth should be harder!
     
  29. Kage

    Kage Crazed Zealot
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    Thank you Weakling. You are a member of TNT and you are indeed a stealther. But I am glad you understand and admited that it is indeed over powered. Thank you.
     
  30. Sweeney

    Sweeney Guest

    I don't PvP.. I have been the target of PvPers many times. I have gotten away many times, but the few that are dead-set on finding me can do it.. Tracking/Detect/Reveal/Conflag pots and I am dead. Even if I was into PvP this would kill me as a stealther.

    Use your extra 175-240 skill points to be able to slaughter the stealthers, don't ask to nerf them. Supposing you have Tracking/Detect at 100 you have a good chance of finding them anyway.
     
  31. Hawkind

    Hawkind Guest

    I was pulling some bars today and I realized that 9 out of the 9 TNT bars I pulled were all stealthers. I'd like to see it where you can't instantly stealth after hiding or no animal form in stealth.
     
  32. Sweeney

    Sweeney Guest

    That is a different suggestion than adding passive detect. I'd be for this as well.. just not a whining nerf about adding passive detect.
     
  33. GoodGuy

    GoodGuy Slightly Crazed
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    i LOVE passive detect idea, but passive detect should ONLY reveal a moving stealther to close to people.

    Like if you are onscreen and someone is just running around and doesn't bump you or use any skill and you are just standing still they shouldnt be able to reveal you. But if you are actively stealthing around a group of people HOW THE HELL is someone not supposed to notice you. Ya know?

    This would force stealthers to be more diligant where they are stealthing and makes a trapped or known stealther A LOT easier to track down and kill.

    I also think spells like wither, holy light, and other area effects should hit stealthers and have a better chance to reveal than the current.
     
  34. Kage

    Kage Crazed Zealot
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    Ok you claim you was killed because of Trackin/Detect/Conflag potions lol at the potions but ya ayways lol... What was you wearing when you died to all that?

    You are a thief correct?
    Was you wearing armor?
    Was you equipped with heal potions, apples, smokebombs?
    Was you in a fast movement animal form?
    Was you on foot stealthing?
    Was you wearing max DCI?
    Was you wearing max enhance poitons?

    I would be willing to bet your answer to most of my questions will be NO...

    So again like I have said several times now... You don't understand Sweeney. I don't expect you to...:scholar:
     
  35. Sweeney

    Sweeney Guest

    So you want a PvP only fix? Why not ask for a PvP shard.. let's call it Fellucca. The non-PvPers can stay where they are, let's call that Trammel. You should go to prodo.
     
  36. Sprago

    Sprago Certifiable
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    I love the passive detect idea it would allow people to actually play other templates it would make seige pvp way more fun and tolerable
     
  37. Sweeney

    Sweeney Guest

    No response in almost an hour, and you're online? You must have seen the light. Admit such errors in judgment.. this shard isn't just for PvPers.
     
  38. Mr X

    Mr X Guest

    :sad2:
     
  39. Kage you are so lame....go play WoW

    I didn't waste time sitting here gaining hiding stealth gain by gain to hear your armor cutting/ jerkoff tongue spewing crap like this...you are really pathetic...I hate to say it, wish I didn't but its the truth, I sure wish you were better on the boards like you seemed to be in game....

    go get bent you lamer.
     
  40. Kat

    Kat Crazed Zealot
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    Lie #1 from Kage - I detected you several days ago and Neo and RP got you right in front of one of the JSV houses. Don't count on never being revealed at 120. :scholar:
     
  41. phreephisher

    phreephisher Guest

    i think there is a good solution. my idea is this, make it so you need 120 stealth to NEVER fail, instead of 75. then you would lose 240 points. this would be fine in a pvm or thief scenario, but make it much more difficult to pvp. also make the detect skill more effective. im not against stealth pvm at all, i run a stealth tamer (that i never pvp with, nothing against it i just think it's boring) but stealth in pvp should be limited to thieves and ninjas, although i think smoke bombing is sorta lame.
     
  42. RichDC

    RichDC Guest

    The one thing i like about this thread...

    I just found out theres no detect hidden!!!!!!!!!!

    AWESOME!

    should make my thief more playable than the one i play on GL (altho been very succesful with new temp im bringin to siege)

    Thanks for the info and keep an eye on your belongings, you never know when the could be TWOC'd (Taken WithOut Consent)
     
  43. Black magick

    Black magick Guest

    I agree with Kage, but make it less chance to reveal than prodo shards. And for all those who cry about how crafters/non-pvpers are going to get hit by passive detect, I ask you how? What are the odds that they run by someone who has high detect? Even better what are the odds they get revealed? Although, the idea of 120 stealth is the only fail proof level isn't a bad idea either.
     
  44. Patty Pickaxe

    Patty Pickaxe Certifiable
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    Since I don't know diddly squat about stealth or PVP I should probably stay out of this thread, but I want to put my 2 cents in. I have played a crafter since my first day on this shard and I do not have stealth. I have mined, LJ'ed, done champ spawns, you name it and have never felt the need for it. I do have hiding, however. Maybe some crafters or just non-pvp chars use it but to say ALL of those type of chars rely on it is inaccurate.

    *goes back to lurking*
     
  45. Speedy Orkit

    Speedy Orkit Grand Inquisitor
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    I play hide/stealth/ninja templates and it's just too powerful. I don't think passive detect should be added to SP in such a way that JOAT applies to it, but only those with 100 detect are given a 5% chance for every tile they are close to the person, up to 10 tiles.

    Ex: Guy smoke bombs 5 tiles away, a GM detecter has a 25% chance to passively detect him.

    The problem with the stealthers argument is exactly this:

    You invest 175 points into the hide/stealth template, and everyone who runs this also runs ninja, which gives you:
    -Ability to do 40-60pt death strikes
    -Shadow Jump onto walls etc
    -Move at a quick rate of speed while hidden
    -Use the overpowered HPR suits to regen 50-60 health in only about 5 seconds
    -Smoke bomb instantly

    And what does 100 detect give you?

    About a 5-10% chance to effectively reveal someone. It's simply not balanced. I do not think passive detect should be given without GM in the skill, but do think SP needs it.
     
  46. Ru TnT

    Ru TnT Seasoned Veteran
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    something is wrong if you only have a 5-10% chance to reveal. i'd say i have atleast a 95% reveal rate...
     
  47. TheScoundrelRico

    TheScoundrelRico Stratics Legend
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    Nope, learn how to fight stealthers better...la
     
  48. Nakukak

    Nakukak Sage
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    WRONG
    Killed your tamers with hiding and ninja and stealth, so stfu trammie and get the **** out!
     
  49. God_Majere

    God_Majere Guest

    im for anything to bring balance to the game.
     
  50. Kat

    Kat Crazed Zealot
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    Yep and the first thing that should go should be the BS faction equipment.