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Amalgamating Shards - Pro's, Cons and Solutions

Discussion in 'UHall' started by MrWilliams, Nov 14, 2010.

  1. MrWilliams

    MrWilliams Visitor

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    One recurring point which keeps appearing in so many of the messages on this board is the fact that people believe that their shards are now empty, not interactive, bereft of community and too large for their dwindling populations.

    One solution to this could be to combine various shards into one, I'd be interested to see if there is any support for this and what would put you off. More importantly if you could think of any solutions for these potential problems this would be most helpful.
     
  2. Uriah Heep

    Uriah Heep Crazed Zealot
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    I would need my house and all it's contents moved to the same location on the new shard...

    Plus, maybe, 500 mil in checks for the mental anguish and suffering ;)
     
  3. Basara

    Basara UO Forum Moderator
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    There's only two ways to keep everyone happy.

    1. Have the links go through T2A and/or Ilshenar, with the shards sharing them, and not being able to go to the "other" Trammel/Fel/Malas/Tokuno/Ter Mur copies.

    or....

    2. Redesign the land masses.
    Currently, 1 step is equal to 4 to 5 minutes of a degree on the map. If one redrew the maps to where 1 step is 1 minute, that would make every house-capable clearing 16 times or more larger. Once all the event-related items unique to each shard are copied over, it would then be easy enough to merge the shards, designating 1/4 of each expanded housing area to hold the contents from one shard, with room to grow, and without overlap (EA-vetted player-run cities would be copied first, then houses in clearings). Granted, some houses (those on open plains) will have to be moved by hand, but the expanded land mass (especially if the overland spawn was returned to that of the old days) would produce a greater sense of vastness.
     
  4. Pinco

    Pinco UOEC Modder
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    yes, then we will burn down the white house and we build a parking and in the meantime the marmot packing the chocolate...
    [​IMG]
     
  5. Babble

    Babble Guest

    Probably better to hand out free transfers if the population of a shard drops under a sustainable amount.

    Though I doubt that will ever happen.
     
  6. Coppelia

    Coppelia Guest

    A merge of shards is greatly needed, but honestly I don't know how to do it for Ultima Online. Players have been used to place castles everywhere. How could we ask them to go back to a log cabin?
     
  7. Chardonnay

    Chardonnay Visitor

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    Easily, force everyone to put there stuff in endless bank boxes then give them the value for thier housing and put them on a new wiped server and rename it...SP not so easy because we have no where else to go not unless you put us on SotD server and those that choose to go there can too...

    Not too mention what you need a server merge for anyways? That's what transfer tokens are for SP don't have those thank god...face it no one wants to give their precision pixels up...
     
  8. Tazar

    Tazar Guest

    Not so easy... that would kill every player run town, many communities, etc...
     
  9. Viper09

    Viper09 Grand Poobah
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    Shard mergers. Been discussed several times and it comes down to a couple issues. The houses of the people whose shard is essentially being shut-down due to a merger and the loss of the shards history which many people may not want to lose. Such as unique structures from past events and perm houses. I know of a few on my own shard.

    Perhaps the best way to do this is to start by offering free transfers to whole new shards to be fair so everyone will have to re-place their houses in addition to a box with unlimited compacity and no weight so it could be carried during the transfer. Biggest problem is with those with castles. Would hate to have those people not be able to get their castle back.
     
  10. Green Mouser

    Green Mouser Guest

    Definitely dont see your option happening. I would imagine a Shard Gate. Messanna mentioned during the meet that they had discussed/thought of a global area "memory getting foggy and not an exact quote".

    If dungeons and hunting lands (Illshenar) became global than why shut down the other areas?

    Those who will say "they will lose sales off of transfer tokens". Please point out to me any aspect of this game that is marketed effectively. Lets face it this game is not "Produced" effectively.
     
  11. DVI

    DVI Guest

    I would have to go with a gate that creates a shared ilshenar and dungeons etc, but with limitations of some sort as there would definitley be players who would try to abuse the system.
     
  12. yars

    yars Lore Keeper
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    apartment high-rises and timeshare condo's lol
    luna can be manhattan
    west brit bank can be yuma,arizona
     
  13. Alvinho

    Alvinho Great Lakes Forever!
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    I dont care about the location of my 4 keeps and 2 castles at this point if tehy could be put together ect would be nice but I would have to keep them all on the same facet they are on now, other than that i could care less the locations if my chard is condensed with another. Only stipulation keep tehm on teh same facet and im happy
     
  14. Lady Storm

    Lady Storm Crazed Zealot
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    I will say this much on the subject.
    Merger of shards, on some might help... But not all shards need it even though many feel as they do. Many have unseen player base.
    But the idea for a joint "champ dungeon" might help. With chat they could put up a universal chat for cross shard groupings for these.
    Reciently.....
    I was on all the shards in the last 3 days collecting my 13th an. tickets and found a few shards almost totaly empty of houses!
    Balhea for one had a few and i do mean a few castles.
    Arirang ... this shard has so few houses that you could fit them all in the land mass of magnicia.
    Most had decient numbers of players that I could see. Now I know this was done on a weekend but the player base on even Atlantic is medicore on a week day when people work or are in school.

    The Dev need to revert the rule on multiple house ownership. Sure they might loose a few$ at first.
    Come on be honest many of us have multi accounts that simply hold a house. Thou here is the "but" many houses are on the same shard!!
    So this is not a big deal I for one have used my alt accounts to the point that its very hard to shut off one and not have the use of a character I need.
    Truthfully, yes I could shut down about 10 of my 42 if that were to pass but I think id more likely add to my house load hehe yes I am a glutton for punsihment but I could use a bigger house on many shards that I got stuck on with a small house when the 1 shard/house came in effect.
    There is plenty of room.... just walk around any shard..... you can swing a cat in malas on many !
    Just thought of another thing that would help witha shard mergence.. open up malas to keeps and castles.. Many to move would be these houses so why not move them there... sure beats the alt of having people so mad they up and quit..... just an idea
     
  15. Striga

    Striga Guest

    Hi, I think that we need merger for some shards i'm on Drachenfels and the population is very very low :(
    Maybe is possible a merger shards by the moongate. If you enter in a moongate you can choose which shard wanna play for example Europa-facet or Drachen-facet (so no houses will be delete) there will be all lands but for this need an istantiation to load the world.
    I think it's possible and really help the game and community.
    The transfer tokens will be use for reach other shards and so on.

    Thx and bye
     
  16. canary

    canary Guest

    If they are unseen, then yes, there is a problem.

    I play on GL. It is one of the larger shards in terms of population, but if you removed the ability to multi account it would be pretty dang empty in terms of green area.

    I'm not sure if I support shard merging, as historical landmarks and housing would be affected. But I know that it would go a long way at making it so that you have more ppl in the way of overall community.
     
  17. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
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    As far as merging shards go... as someone living in a player run town... I think I'd be pretty upset if our town was scattered to the winds or moved in some way.

    I can't see any "fair" way of doing a shard merger. However I'll say this... "if" they built several "new" shards (not sure how they would go about this)... but shards that were more specified. Such as shards devoted to RP, Classic, PvM, and such say maybe two or three of each.... and then had folk "Choose" between them... by giving them basically a "packing crate" for their home... and allowing them to transfer. Perhaps that would work. But I think it would be bad all around.
     
  18. Chardonnay

    Chardonnay Visitor

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    Those still exist? Not really just a few...
     
  19. canary

    canary Guest

    To be honest, from what I see on most shards, player towns do exist. It's just that the houses have been handed down to other players in said cities, so in numerous cases you have 1-3 people owning 6-15 (or more) houses.

    I'm not saying that is good, or bad. I'm just saying that is how it is, as players have moved on from UO and other players have wanted to continue the legacy the player towns held.
     
  20. WarderDragon

    WarderDragon Babbling Loonie
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    This.

    Group the Shards into Regions (e.g. US West. US East. Europe. Asia.) or Populations (e.g. Group small shards with Larger Shards.). You enter the moongate and are given a list of choices; Trammel (Baja) and Trammel (Atlantic).

    Shard Transfers would still be purchased for those interested in transfering from one Region to another.

    No Townships or Houses would be lost. The Shards would benefit from a larger EM Pool. The Ilshenars and SA Content could be merged to increased the populations in hunting regions and encourage more cooperation.
     
  21. Babble

    Babble Guest

    Maybe hand out transfer tokens again.
    Shards should be pretty cheap to run, so no need to cancel them.
     
  22. Yalp

    Yalp Guest

    I could set my watch to this thread topic. It was asked in the last Town Hall. The developers answered resounding "No".

    If the population on your shard does not suit your taste; either relocate YOURSELF to a shard that suits your taste or get more people to come to your shard. Forcing shards to merge has been kicked around to hell and back. The problems it would create far outweigh any benefit gained.
     
  23. Poo

    Poo The Grandest of the PooBah’s
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    i have a concern about this.

    what do you do with people like myself who have been playing since the game began and we actually LIKE our small shard?

    or

    people like myself who have invested years on developing all of our characters on every shard?

    so we loose all that time invested on all our other characters?

    21 developed and scrolled and equipt toons per shard.
    there is no was to amalgamate shards without me loosing toons.

    in the end this is a dead issue.
    they allready put in transfer tokens for this very issue.
    if people dont like the shard where they are, they can move to another shards with thier character and start there.

    why would we want to force people to play somewhere?

    if i wanna play with my friends on a nice quiet night out.
    i play on my home shard.

    if i wanna play in lag and loose conn then ill go to atl and play some.

    with how easy it is to make a character these days this should be a non issue.
     
  24. Llewen

    Llewen Grand Inquisitor
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    I like this idea.
     
  25. Athens

    Athens Adventurer
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    Funny this has come up... been sitting around over last few weeks thinking about this. I think first and foremost the history of the shard doing the transfers must be saved! Next How hummmm k, first only need to get down to maybe a 3 to 1 shard diff with some exceptions like Atlantic or GL and some of Japan shards with higher populations. Next, any special areas on the shards that don't over lap being merged to one. Then any areas that do over lap given a drawing to see which special area stays but not without the loser given a new area to give remembrance's. ALL Player Towns given there towns Period that's why we would be doing this! Then everyone given a house token BTW on the new shard this is how placement is made Big guys first and then so on so forth and also all areas that can fit a castle or a keep open to them BTW. (yes, Dev's we are trying to make this game grow again not weather away to nothing so that even the things that we want to hold on to now are all but gone that is why we are willing to sacrifice our areas now, so open all yours up!!!!!) next what about running out of room oh no.. k got it maybe, well lets see I have seen you guys over the years blow up towns rearrange areas make all kinds of special areas take a world I was living in and add an entire new world,world,world...I think maybe you can move a tree. And now Ya I know the men that will and can crush it all your next....(for purpose of this post well call you guys...) The Luna Property Owners Association. :) OK what to do... well as I see it the guy that said take Luna up and I will live in a high rise had it a bit right make the town dupe itself Up^^^^^^ connected somehow from a gate or stairs who knows its the 21st century and I am no programmer. But I do know all the Luna Property Owners get there little homesteads :) Then what about the Dam lag will that be back s#$t!!!! I got it yet again, How about another Spring cleanup or something like it. Maybe even tie that somehow into who gets to place first in each size groups for the new house placements for everything else other than Player ran towns and Luna owners, sure would work on space I would think...besides maybe this will also fix this drop in our economy do to saturation of everything BTW you should have the best servers money can buy for the best and longest running MMO Ever anyway so we no longer Lag!
    K now to conclude with my little impute to it all If I where you guys I would first name the new Shards "ALL FOR ONE ONE FOR ALL" and with this new release I would have a small revamp on trades and maybe have trade only accounts no fighting ability's at all give them the ability to rent the building in our towns with some kind of house size bank box included with rental to make custom goods for us all with the dream of owning a spot of there own outside of town and playing our game from a differant angle and why you say i think this would even work well best thing about UO is the ability to become whoever you want to become and owning a spot to call home and show off your pride pixals and with people sitting around playing games like Farmville for heaven sakes even we can't somehow get them excited about something like this then I mean really Farmville... lets get some new blood!!! :grouphug:

    k well that's all I got to say about that....(are you stupid or something? Mommy used to say stupid is stupid does Sir.

    BTW Dev's Just one more small piece of advice if this gets to ya... You need to do whatever you have to to invite back groups like Shadowclan Orcs and so forth that have run off because of some kind of nerf or whatever and make sure they can play here there way somehow someway!:grouphug:

    Maybe more later who knows... Lifes like a box of chocolate ya have to pick one and ya never know whatch goin get.
     
  26. cdavbar

    cdavbar Lore Master
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    Really? They cant even get a booster pack with simple fishing upgrades released without totally screwing up the game, how in the hell do you expect them to do this?


    In all reality though if merging shards in anyway ever came to be then MOST people would respond "as long as its not my shard that is being shut down" which again would leave no shards to merge.....If people were that set on being on a more populated shard they would voluntarily move to those shards until their original one was so empty it would be imparitive that it be shut down due to NO USE by anyone.

    Since that is not hte case and not a great amount of people are voulnarily moving shards PERMANTLY to more populated ones then......it will not happen.

    Also UO has also placed great pride on allowing people to come back whenever they want with their char in tact. even if its been ten years. What are you gonna tell those that came back after one, two , four, six, or more years? Tough crap? you left so your crap is gone? start from ground zero again?

    That would not be acceptable. I have a 110month account. It would BE MUCH LONGER but i had to take a nearly 2 year break due to family situations and emergecies, so if those emergencies happend during a merger than my loylty to UO in the past would mean nothing in essence?

    Just think about it.










    Solution:

    If YOU want more population....advocate to your peers to move to the more populated shards etc.

    If a shard becomes under a certian threshold for active players the devs could put a notice up for new or returning players that select that shard that states something like this:

    ATTN: This shard is severly underpopulated and based on you geographical location we suggest you either make a new char on xxxxx shard or transfer your char to xxx shard.


    That way people dont lose their stuff.
     
  27. cdavbar

    cdavbar Lore Master
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    There is a Luna house on GL...The account owner passed away a while back....but his love for the game and the people in it inspired him to make a special account that i will pay for this game as long as this game is running. his house will never fall until the day EA says screw it. It is a standing testament to why we cant just merge shards.....monuments like this would essentially be lost. Monuments like this is what community is about. His guild is still active, people still reminisce about him all the time. It will never fade or go away.

    Things like this are not worth putting at risk for loss for a merger.
     
  28. Basara

    Basara UO Forum Moderator
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    That's why my suggesting of expanding the landmass, then physically relocating EVERY existing house into their corresponding clearing (now 4 times wider and 4 times longer, so an area currently 40x40 would now be 4 linked areas of 80x80, creating a buffer space around each shard's transferred houses to ensure everyone moves safely).

    The coding needed to reinterpret the data for the Housing server, I agree, would be a challenge - but only for the areas that are large areas of open space (the plains east of the Compassion desert, for example). Remodeling the map itself would be the easy part (the only tedious parts would be a redesign of Luna to have multiple ring roads, to accomodate access to the relocated houses). The open-lands houses and Luna would require manual movement of the houses after the expansion.

    But, I don't see it happening, either.
     
  29. Babble

    Babble Guest

    Way too much effort necessary.
    :)
     
  30. Neutron Bomb

    Neutron Bomb Journeyman
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    Just move the people on the near 0 populated shards to the more populated shards by force. They only get to transfer items, not houses.

    ^^^I Like this idea.
     
  31. canary

    canary Guest

    I would imagine many who then lost their cities or communities might have a reason to bail, then.
     
  32. Neutron Bomb

    Neutron Bomb Journeyman
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    You mean Ghost Cities and Ghost Towns?

    It was more sarcasm to be honest though, lol. I really don't see anything happening for these shards to be honest.
     
  33. canary

    canary Guest

    Well, you may see them as ghost cities... and I may see them as ghost cities... but to some, they are a viable piece of a specific shard's history. And for the player that has taken on extra accounts to preserve it, that might give them reason to pack up and leave. Which means UO loses accounts, and $$$.

    And I agree, it's all just conjecture with nothing that will be done regarding it. Still makes it interesting to touch on every blue moon.
     
  34. Striga

    Striga Guest

    Anyway dear Mythic, something will be done... i hope.:stir:
     
  35. Babble

    Babble Guest

    I doubt it.
    Server costs are negligable for UO these days, so why combine shards?
     
  36. hawkeye_pike

    hawkeye_pike Babbling Loonie
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    Aside from being a technical impossibility, I doubt that merging shards would change anything. Maybe on a short term playing on a more populated shard would be more fun indeed. But the root of the problem is the lack of new players, and no shard merging can change that.
     
  37. Smoot

    Smoot Grand Poobah
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    Shard merging will never happen, and shouldnt imo. As babble said, i know i would transfer at least a couple characters if free transfers were given. Seems easy enough, but you all know how EA works so i dunno.

    Aside from that, something that could be done to encourage population would be a long running em "event" on a dead shard. Long enough, and easy enough for a character with gm skills to participate in. It doesnt take long to make a non-scrolled fresh character, and im sure many would be interested.