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Archers a litte bit overpowered?!?

Discussion in 'UO Spiels N Rants' started by lucitus, May 17, 2008.

  1. lucitus

    lucitus UOEC Modder
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    I think archers are to overpowered at the moment concussion with 80 dmg lol! A spell does maximal 40 dmg, then mortal spam :lame:. so archers are able to shoot when moving at distance, can use pots, shooting like dexxers hitting so fast as the ak 47, can use quievers abilitys, a little bit overpowered ;). so i hope devs try to fix concussion so that it only deals dmg around 35 like ar ingnore, this would be a wonderfull first step.
     
  2. Limlight

    Limlight Guest

    lol

    While they are a little over-powered.

    Tamers are still far and away the most over-powered class.

    Frankly....I think an Archer combats a tamer nicely.

    Its actually shaping up nicely.

    Dexer>Mage>Archer>Tamer>Dexer

    The greater dragons just need a slight nerf.
     
  3. Limlight

    Limlight Guest

    Now,

    These Dismount Tamer Archers running around...

    Thats a completely ridiculous template.

    Smart...but that crap needs to be fixed.

    Its gimp.
     
  4. Krystal

    Krystal Sage
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    gotta be kidding me!
     
  5. Ben Dover

    Ben Dover Guest

    They have already nearly nerfed archers into oblivion already. Every time they swing the nerf stick, they beat archers with it the hardest. I personally loved the patch a couple of years ago, where I logged off with godly weapons one night, woke up the next morning to find out that all my weapons were turned into complete CRAP.

    Lets see, have they ever done anything even remotely like that to tamers?? Not that I can recall... ever go to bed with your dragon having 600hp and max skills and wake up with it having 300 hp and 70s skills? No? Didn't think so.

    Or, if your a mage, did you ever go to bed with your all 70's resist 40 lmc 12 mr 100% lrc suit with 2/6 casting on and wake up with a 50's resist suit with 5 lmc 1 mr and 60 lrc and 0/2 casting? No? Didn't think so.

    I say if they decide to nerf anyone, it should be anyone but dexers and specifically not archers. That class can take very little more nerfing before everyone with an archer just wakes up one day and their archer and equipment has been deleted by EA.
     
  6. ElRay

    ElRay Guest

     
  7. Still Frame

    Still Frame Guest

    Archers have been nerfed to hell but a 120 anat tact archer with 50 hld and 100 di will kill you 2 shots no matter who you are. If everyones going to be playing that sort of template (which they are, great lakes is over run with lame ass archers) bring back ninja and 70+ dmg pvp word of deaths and uncap the ai from 35
     
  8. ROFLTOFL!!!!!
    ben ur an archer right? and u mainly play archer right?
    i play a mage and an archer aswell but imo archery is so lame i dont use it pvp
    mages or dexers never got nerfed? what bout from 4/6 to 2/6 or the 2 sec bandies to 4 sec bandies?
    tamers got nerfed aswell (pet summoning time + ethy remount time shortened to avoid DMs)
    imo archers are the strongest template! a dragon cant run behind with mounted speed! sure u can be dismounted but dragons are even slower than u unmounted so outscreen, invis, mount or use a not ethy mount(no cast to remount)
    if u cant kil the pet kill the tamer! (most tamers die fast)
    lure the pet away rrun to tamer and disturb his pet summon (4 secs are easy to disturb)
    anyway back to the archer! an archer can take u down from 140hp to 30 in 2 hits (thats 110 hp in 2 hits 60hp per hit!!!!!!)
    an archer can spam dmg like flamestrikes while running!!!!!
    an archer can mortal spam u (sure eat an apple but what after the 2nd mortal? ss and evasion is to slow to heal the dmg up an archer does)
    an archer can dismount from distance with no delay like bolas!
    an acher got 2h weap and can drink pots! any other weaps 2h that are potable? nop
    only way to kill a good archer 1v1 is luck and outscreen, outscreen, outscreen
    archer with taming=imposble 1v1
    and ye let pets deal less dmg pvp
     
  9. lucitus

    lucitus UOEC Modder
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    i think the best fix is dmg cap conussion at 35 dmg.
     
  10. Setanta

    Setanta Adventurer
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    Not when you consider that even a legendary archer can only hit a barn every fifth shot, and that's from the inside!
     
  11. Limlight

    Limlight Guest

    Bottom line...Tamers need to be nerfed...
     
  12. Salivern_Diago

    Salivern_Diago Lore Master
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    I just noticed something, spells with a max of 40 damage? I must be bugged then I can kill some players with two spell hits (Explo and FS, or two FS's). And if its a monster I often do about 55-70 damage. Hmm I dont think Archers are overpowered at all. A arrow does alot of damage when its hanging out of your chest.
     
  13. Still Frame

    Still Frame Guest

    Archers do alot of dmg in pvm, and in pvp if they have a good suit and template they can spam specials forever. ai is capped at 35 which was dumb but most people play necro mages right now so they can't complain because they can pull off 60+ dmg flame strikes after a corpse skin and evil omen. An archer can miss, unless someone is using evade spells will never miss.

    Concussion *parry* *parry* *parry* Mortal *parry* Concussion

    compaired to:

    Corpse skin, Evil omen para, Exp, FS, Evil omen painspike dead...
     
  14. you see the problem with concussion is when applied its three different damages.

    Base damage. Which is like 22 hp itself
    Concussion damage 20-25 hp,
    then the hit spell damage, 6 to 13 hp.. depending on hit spells
     
  15. Hunters Moon

    Hunters Moon Guest

    Well something has to be able to compete with the tamers "all kill" attack right?
     
  16. Violence

    Violence Lore Keeper
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    Then give Ninja uber 70 Dmg DS and Poisoners new poisons that lower SSI or something?

    Or remove HCI/DCI/SSI from bows? :D :p
     
  17. o2bavr6

    o2bavr6 Slightly Crazed
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    If your on a mage template with DCI and a mage weapon (or not), you will still get hit almost every time by an archer. And you get the same results if you have wrestling on the temp.

    The only way to defend against an archer is to have a weapon skill, parry and tactics.

    If you have the proper suit, like mine, corpse skin doesnt do anything.

    Evil Omen para is just stupid, but par for the coarse when it comes to the decisions EA makes. It even shows their complete ignorance of the game by having trapped boxes be the solution to this problem.
     
  18. Mythic

    Mythic Guest

    Its easy to be a great archer in pvp but so many other templates out there are so much nicer than archer setups, Mace weilding mages for one, greater dragon toting tamers, ninjas, etc. If the archer is foolish enough to run around without resist then any necro makes poo of them quickly. fencers with poisoning and 90+ mana, now theres a sick template. archers kill melee folk, mages kill arhers, tamers kill mages, melee kill tamers(lol, well not really)

    Oh wow I just remembered something, theres this nifty skill in the game called PARRY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    ADAPT DAM YOU!

    In response to the post above, with 120 archery, 35 hci and casting df i still miss a lot against mages with parry, enough that they are more then capable of Killing me instead. I do understand though that it is a definate pain in the neck to work 80 dex into a mage template to make full use of parry, or you could just run up and disarm me like everyone else does :)
     
  19. Atlantian

    Atlantian Guest

    A mage doing 250 to 300 damage is ok? Mages are the ones that are overpowered. :cursing:
     
  20. Atlantian

    Atlantian Guest

    And that is true. Archers don't hit every time. Mages and tamers do though.
     
  21. Scratch

    Scratch Guest

    archers are not nerfed into oblivion
    fencer arhers disarm you and chase you down spamming 3mana cost moving shots while chuggin pots with their max mod heavys
    archers are almost as powerful as the 360 skill point tamers
    120 tame 120 vet 120 lore bolas and an all kill macro is all you need
    necro mages combo are next in line with eo corpse ex fs painstrike.
    simply ********.
    there is no fix for pvp
    adapt or quit
    ea done messed it up beyond repair and they know it
     
  22. Saris

    Saris Guest

    Stop stop stop.

    No they are not overpowered

    have not been since they got fixed by making them have to stop to shoot.

    moving shot don't counts

    I do think about some specials on all class weps need a timer for para effects that also do damage.
    Saris uses his axe to hit 60-70s resist for up to 87 points with concusive blow but it uses most his mana so its not something I do alot.

    In RL ppl cope with ranged attacers by taking cover.

    I use houses and other cover to make the archer or the mage play close qaurters with me.
     
  23. Mythic

    Mythic Guest

    My main is an archer. the only advanatgae that archers have in my opinion is balanced bows. Either make 2 handed weapons balanced for everyone or do away with balanced bows completely
     
  24. Viper09

    Viper09 Grand Poobah
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    Archers are not overpowered. A simple opponent with parry can deter an archer very easily. Archers do not have shields, lets not forget, dexers can have shields.
    If your opponent has a good suit, then dmg is not incredibly high as many try to claim. Also, ever heard of disarm? What about mages who run around with shields? You can't block spells. So if you have a pvper who actually knows what they are doing archers are not a big problem.
    What people really have a problem with are those incredibly fast magic bows with high ssi. But again, if your opponent has high dci and parry, its like *miss miss miss hit miss miss miss hit hit miss* If someone just knows how to heal it isnt going anywhere.
    Bottom line, learn good defense and get good armor and take a good look at all the other classes instead of running to the boards claiming its only the archers.
     
  25. Scratch

    Scratch Guest

    i have 61dci and a moving shot archer can hit me every time
    not to mention most speedhack while running with the balanced moving shot bow hitting for 17-21+ minimum in my all 70 suit

    what is the defense against a 40 ssi heavy with 40+hld, 40+hit lightning
    on top of the 40+damage inc? must we all have parry to pvp now?

    bows are ridiculously fast and balanced and it cost what 3 mana to use moving shot spec 6 for the penalty

    80 mana would supply you with unlimited moving shots while chugging pots with ehp jewels and rolling enhanced aids. you must be an archer to say they are not overpowered with these insane modded bows.

    and then there is concussion mortal concussion mortal
    disarm you say
    lol you cant disarm a moving shot archer they run they shoot they run they shoot they run and shoot at same time

    ea messed it up bad
    bandaids dont come that big

    uhoh here comes the salt
     
  26. Viper09

    Viper09 Grand Poobah
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    a 40 ssi heavy is not fast enough to disrupt spells or kill even before you finish healing. Moving shot and pot chugging? Maybe if you have a balanced bow. And of course I have an archer, how else would I know that I am not overpowered? Cause I am playing the evidence, I am not a god in pvp. I am not that great and I cant own everyone. I hit people half the time and I have 120 archery, thats not that good. Mages are better than archers.
    Make yourself an archer, give him 120 archery and go try and pvp before you go bashing them. I can speak since I have an archer and know what it is like.
    As for balanced bows, a good one with decent mods is not cheap, and the chances of getting a good balanced bow for pvp are rare. I hardly see archers running around with one of those
    But why not compare archers to dexers with shields and insane SSI kryss'?
     
  27. Ya, what he said.
    I am not a god either, but I do ok... and I can tell you my archer cost 3 times as much as my mage suit to build. and my necro mage has orny, inquis, aof, folded steel, crystalline, -20mage sc no -1 hander and a few nice barbed pieces that are prolly worth 30 mill a piece. It cost alot to chug and MS.
    Try burning 20 heartwoods to get one decent balanced bow. Is one bow gonna fill up my arsenal? NO, I cary 6 bows, all pretty damm good ones, my lowest bow is worth 20 mill
    Quit crying, if you wanna be leet, you gotta pay for it these days.
    UO has become item based, not as much skill is required.
     
  28. Still Frame

    Still Frame Guest

    You apparentally dont know the difference between a -mage wep skill and wrestling. Wrestling gets a dci bonus from eval so that statement is wrong. With 45 dci, 120 wrestle/eval archers will miss majority of the time unless your one of those people who always somehow get lucky and never miss.

    Even if you have the 85 fire on your suit for corpse skin to not work curse will knock you down to 60.

    Trap boxes were a dumb idea, they should be set so u have to destroy them with an axe to use and not just open.
     
  29. o2bavr6

    o2bavr6 Slightly Crazed
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    What about when tamers could have as many pets as they wanted, and had many pets stabled only to lose them when they changed the rules... but let me guess, you didn't play back then.

    If you actualy played before AoS you would know that your comments here couldn't be any more wrong. The number on template that was nerfed, maybe next to theives, was MAGERY. Since you have no clue as to the nerfs mages went through, I wont bother going through them.

    Let's see.. Dexers can hit on the run and heal on the run, they can disarm and dismount you. They can have DP and usualy chug pots like they are goin out of style.

    Archers have Balanced weapons allowing them to chug pots while armed. Does anyone know of any type of IRL bow/xbow that can be either armed or fired with one hand? I didn't think so. Some can be fired with one hand but not armed.
    Most dexers chugs pots as well. Now a mage can chug as well but there are a couple of pitfalls to that. First if a mage has a weapon and a shield in their hands to help ofset the super fast damage a dexer does, he cant chug without disarming. When he does disarm the dexer hits him even more often.

    A mage who doesnt use a weapon or a shield, but insead uses a spellbook, gets hit so fast and so often from most dexers that they cant even get a heal off, let alone an offensive spell.

    Differences between Mages and Dexers:
    Dexers have Swing Speed Increase and Hit Chance Increase
    Mages have Faster Casting and Faster Cast Recovery.

    Dexers have Hit Lower Defence, Hit Lower Attack, Stam Leach, Mana Leach, Life Leach.
    Mages have... um nothing here. Should't mages have spellbooks with Spell Lower Resist, or Spell Lower Attack, or other similar abilities?

    Also you said mages weren't nerfed huh, what about when they took the ability away for mages to use specials on weapons, even weapons with the Mage penalty. If there was a weapon a mage could use a special on, it should be a mage weapon.


    You see I did wake up one morning and they nerfed my 4/6 casting to 2/6 casting.. or what about when I woke up one day and the spells that were cast on me didn't reflect back on the caster, when i had magic reflect cast on me.. or what about the time when i woke up to damage I was taking from dexers with reactive armor on and it didnt damage the dexer back.. As I said before you don't know what you are talking about because you havent played this game long enough, let alone play a mage.
     
  30. your mage suit must be very bad the,

    I have a archer and he uses a bow I bought for 300, I have fencing also on him and he pretty much rips apart every temp in the game,

    Balanced bows are the stupidest thing this game has ever seen,
    and Someone in my guild has a 35+ ss 20+ hc 40+ hit fireball 40+ hit velocity comp bow,

    I saw this other guy with a balanced bow that can 2 shot people..

    I am sorry but if you play a archer its because your no good at the game.
     
  31. Mythic

    Mythic Guest

    Wait who said bows are too fast..................LOL, do you have any idea how hard it is to shoot anything other then a repeater or short bow faster then 1.75 seconds?! Ok with a comp bow which is the next fastest archery type weapon at 150+ stamina
    and 10 ssi on the suit(sammy helm, sux for suit building) 40 ssi on the weapon and cast df your barely shooting at 1.5. kryss on the other hand needs 0 ssi and a mere 90 stamina to swing at 1.25 cap, any archery weapons base damage is much slower then a melee weapon that does the same base damage(ornate axe verses heavy crossbow for example heavy does 20 to 24 base swings at 5 seconds naturally, ornate is hrmm 18 to 20 base at a 3.5 seconds, The DPS is higher on the ornate especially once you figure in tact, anat, str, and di, and definatly after you figure in the hitspell
     
  32. o2bavr6

    o2bavr6 Slightly Crazed
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    The issue is how the damage is dealt. You see my archer can take most players to half life in one hit with a conc.

    What happens is, at least in most cases, is I hit on the first attempt, and barely 2 seconds later i hit again. So the first hit is instant and the second hit comes 2 seconds later and the person is either dead or redlined.

    So yes they do hit to fast for the damage they deal. Some Melle templates with an ornate ax can do similar damage relatively quickly.

    A mage can not redline anyone in two spells, not even two flamestrikes in a row, at best they will do 80 damage total. Also to cast 2 flamestrikes it takes almost 6 seconds, in that time an archer has hit the mage 3 times, in most cases killing him.
     
  33. Still Frame

    Still Frame Guest

    Mages are easier to gank with, they can all target from far away and last target. Dexers have to get up close, and theres only so many possible tiles u can hit from while on the run. Archers have the luxury of not needing mana, or having to be right next to their opponent. An archer can 2 shot people, end of story over powered!

    Tamers "all kill" super dragon or cu = 2 hit = OVER POWERED fix it
     
  34. Scratch

    Scratch Guest


    lol archer do not hit mages that often now that thye have 60dci on their suits
    the archer would be lucky to get his first and fifth shot to land


    to the guy that said dexxers can heal on the run....well mages pretty much cast mini heals on the run and they can heal more damage than a dexxers 6sec aid. for that matter i have been out run by a mage casting flamestrikes on my dexxer. mages may have gotten slowed down since pre aos
    but are no where near the one of the weaker templates

    i would rate the templates like this from most powerful to least

    tamer with super dragon
    necro mages
    fencer archers
    dexxers
    theives are useless
     
  35. Still Frame

    Still Frame Guest

    cant forget the necro/mage tamers that are also all over great lakes now =/
     
  36. o2bavr6

    o2bavr6 Slightly Crazed
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    Even if they go over 60+ DCI, they take a huge hit in something else, like not enough MR, or resists, or LMC or something.

    And I have both templates a mage an archer and the archer CAN 3 hit kill anyone who doesnt have parry in 3 hits, sometimes 2 hits.

    And in a duel on Wrong roof an archer can just mortal spam 3 times in a row for the win, all while he chugs to his hearts content.

    I find it funny how archers complain about mages just beacuse they cant kill the mage 100% of the time.

    We have a guy on our shard with one of the best xbows inthe game. In a duel against a mage he is basically unbeatable. I have even dueled him with my fencer tactics parry mage and stil lost 6 out of 7 duels, and this was only because of his xbow. when he switched xbows I won 75% of the duels.

    On my necro mage I didn't win one duel even with 45 DCI he hit me every time, every time, every time, every time, every time, every time, did i say " every time", just in case you didn't understand me I said , every time!!!!!!!

    You see, the difference between a melle template and a mage template is the melee template can be unbeatable because of a weapon, where that will never happen with a mage. There is no item in the game that makes a mage unbeatable, like a special spellbook that does 80 damage flamestrikes.

    Also mages don't have a way to stop you from healing other than posion, but if you have resist, the poison fails 75% of the time, and when you succeed they just chug a cure pot. Imagine if mages had a way to cast a mortal spell.
     
  37. Still Frame

    Still Frame Guest

    They put a timer on apples so necros and mortal spammers are stronger but none on cure pots? Makes sense....*sarcasm for whom ever missed it*
     
  38. Mythic

    Mythic Guest

    lets go back to that Kryss that has a natural 2 secound swing speed.
    Make mine a 50 fireball, 55 di kryss with whatever other mods you prefer.
    Now at 90+stamina, your swingin it at 1.25 secounds, considering you only need 90 stamina leaves you plunty of extra points to dump into mana! So why not hit 3 back to back AIs for an easy 105 hps in 3.75 secounds and thats not takin into account the fact that the fireball is going to hit at least once so your lookin at 115+ hps in 3.75 secounds.; uhm so why are archers overpowered again?
     
  39. Mythic

    Mythic Guest

    Here you know what, lets just make all the wepons and spells and swing speeds and casting times exactly the same. God what a boring game that would be
     
  40. Mythic

    Mythic Guest

    I hate posting Like this but there are just so many dammed valid and so many completely comical responses that are givin from both sides of the fence, it makes me realize that its not the skills and stats and mods being the problem, its the player( Ill tell you straight up I get me arse handed to me daily, i suck at PvP) ITS MY FAULT I DIE, I cant have 1500 points spread across my template so I got to make choices, some are better then others in certain situations, enough said IM done
     
  41. o2bavr6

    o2bavr6 Slightly Crazed
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    In some cases you are correct here. but the main issue is the amount of damage that can be dealt with one hit, let alone 2 hits.

    I personaly think the imbalance comes from the dexer templates that dont have magic resist. Between Pots and trapped boxes they negate the need for it so they can dump a whole 120 more kill points into their already tough template, making them almost impossible to kill in as short of a time that they can kill someone.
     
  42. Syfka

    Syfka Guest

    Yeah so my question is why is EVERYONE ALWAYS ragging on archers? thats all i have to say aside from archers arent over powered seeing as to how i am one and thats all i play and i am dying constantly which is my own fault for getting killed just please if someone could answer my question with out coming up with something like "archers are over powered" or some BS like that. :wall::eyes:
     
  43. o2bavr6

    o2bavr6 Slightly Crazed
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    My archer has a pretty bad suit of armor, and his xbow has 40 SSI, and 50 Lower D and 35 DI and 170 Dex.

    This xbow is good enough to destroy anyone with no DCI (In fact it will 2 hit kill anyone with no DCI.), let alone anyone who has less than 45 DCI after my HLD goes off from the first hit.

    My mage on the other hand can not do that kind of damage in the same period of time.

    Just imagine how much more devastating a template i would have if I actualy bothered to build a decent suit for him and replace his current xbow with one that has 50HLD, 40SSI, 25HCI, 40DI and Balanced. Can anyone say "Mortal Spam?"

    I hope this helps answer your questions as to how Archers are overpowered. Also don't forget I have one of these in questions Archers, and I do think they are overpowered.
     
  44. Syfka

    Syfka Guest

    ok but that did not answer my question why is everyone always ragging on archers that is what i want to know my archer has an all 70's suit and i have a bow that could take down a fallen warrior in 5 hits and if you have fought them you know those things arent easy plus i have 115 resisting spells and i still get my butt handed to me by mages and tamers alike so again why is everyone ragging on archers being "over powered" when they are not.,
     
  45. lets make spellbooks balanced with dci,

    or how about this lets make it so mages never fizzle if they have inscribe
     
  46. ColterDC

    ColterDC Visitor

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    In order to actually hit anyone with that kryss you're going to have to be right next to them. With server lag and everything else you're not going to be able to stand next to the person the entire time in order to deal damage.

    The archer can do his damage from 8 tiles away, no need to worry about actually standing next to your target.


    Archers and Tamers are UO's version of easy mode. Lack the skill to actually play a real char? Just play an archer or tamer instead.
     
  47. o2bavr6

    o2bavr6 Slightly Crazed
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    This is the best example I can come up with, but keep in mind that i am strictly talking about pvp, not pvm.

    There are many times I fight archers on my tank mage. Inevitably what happens is I chase the archer around for about 10 minutes, while having redlined him 3 or 4 times and the archer is chugging pots like there was no tomorrow. Finally the archer will get two mortals of back to back leaving me redlined. the moment i turn to run they either use the archery bug (that i dont know how its done) but they can moving shot you with an xbow. but even if they dont use the bug they change to a composite bow and moving shot you for the kill.

    The imbalance is with the way archery is in general:
    Balanced bows should not be allowed. (there is no bow or xbow in the real world that can be loaded with one hand).
    Mortal should either take way more mana or have a timer between mortals.
    Concussion does way way to much damage.
    moving shot takes hardly any mana at all to use.

    No other template can do the damage that an archer can do, pure and simple.
     
  48. Lynk

    Lynk Grand Poobah
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    PvP is more balanced now than it has been in a long time.

    Only change I would make is put a timer (similar to the para) for mortal. If you can stop the chain mortal that makes archers much less effective.

    There isn't any one template that is > all the rest. My parry/bush mage handles the most well equipped archers without breaking a sweat. But he can't do **** 1 v 1 against a decent mage because no extra offensive damage and a lower mana pool due to needing 80 dex for parry.

    They made petballs have a 2 sec timer.. thats enough tamer nerfing for me.

    I think people just get upset when your character can't beat every template. Thats why you get 7 character slots per account!

    Think of it like Rock/Paper/Scissors.
     
  49. Scratch

    Scratch Guest

    beef up your dci with sc mage weps and youll do better
    without parry and the 80 dex requirement
    no one plays an 80 dex mage in pvp anymore
    dci pwns parry
    dci + parry is just ********

    i want spell defense jewels since mages never miss a hit
    with protection on you cant disrupt them or make them miss

    archers are gay
    tamers are OoOOooOoOoober gay
    necro mages with 60 dci dont need mana to get off their 4 spell 5second combos which kill alomost anyone without ehp and a chug macro

    take it back to pre aos when it was about skill
    item vs item pvp is fn gay
     
  50. Still Frame

    Still Frame Guest


    With protection on as an archer you mortal them twice and the concussion them and they die...wheres the difficulty? Nobody should die to a protection mage with all the ways to heal. Chiv, pots, aids, bush pro mages are just too slow

    I agree about necros being lame, they should change how mage weps work since thats all anyone runs now. Or fix dci because its so over powered. But if your on a MAGE its not hard to get up a greater heal and live through an explode fs omen *heal* then painspike.