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Are these people unattended macroing?

Discussion in 'UHall' started by Anderuin, Mar 10, 2010.

  1. Anderuin

    Anderuin Guest

    I have been playing on the Napa Valley shard here lately. I just made a new crafter character. I haven't played the game in a long time until now. I have noticed these characters on there mining and they recall spot to spot. It just strikes me as odd because they will recall like 5 feet from where they were standing. So I am under the assumption that these people are exploiting the game. I reported it to a game master but I haven't gotten a response. And I tried speaking to the people but they never say anything. Thanks.
     
  2. Capt.E

    Capt.E Guest

    The question should be "Are these people using an illegal 3rd party app?"

    Who can tell if they are staring at their screen?

    There is a way to setup a really long UOA macro. I am 99.999999 percent sure it is a 3rd party app.
     
  3. GarthGrey

    GarthGrey Crazed Zealot
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    UOA won't allow a macro that moves items to a container though...to the OP, don't waste your time paging a GM. Just move on...trust me, just move on..
     
  4. UOKaiser

    UOKaiser Guest

    Thats the best way to mine. You have to set up spots with mutiple veins is even better. But recalling spot to spot saves time walking.When it comes to mining and resource gathering you want to spend the least amount of time 2 get the most amount in the time you play. The best spots are the ones you already marked how much ore they give and how many veins you hit. I speak back only if they need help and are just not there to check me. If I stop to everyone who comes to check me in a day my time to ore management is ruin. Of course because this is the best method many scripts use the method as well. The next best method is firebeattle mining but i find it too slow for my taste and house mining,boat mining are also other methods. Strip mining is usually common with people who like to walk.
     
  5. the 4th man

    the 4th man Lore Master
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    Lord, I've seen this a trillion times.....and more than likely, yes they are cheating. Some will claim it's faster that way.....I see that as being weak sauce.

    If they recall five feet away, thats a dead give away. Ask yourself....do you really want to spend your game time messing with some loser who has to do it that way? Kinda creepy and sad to know someone has to cheat to get anywhere, in life or UO.

    Drop a bagball, then invis or hide and see who comes and moves it.
    Then at least you can put a name to the lazy ones.

    later
     
  6. Aran

    Aran INFRACTION INFRACTION INFRACTION!
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    The real question is: Does it hurt you?

    No.
     
  7. UOKaiser

    UOKaiser Guest

    What you talking about it's a valid way to mine. If you prefer to just click on the spot and waste 1 hour trying to get 100 ore thats your business but we crafter miners prefer to make it easier for our selves thats what macros are for to make it easier for you when doing repetative task. I can set up to recall 200 feet away but why do i recall 5 feet away because it takes 1 button and there is a good vein there for me to get at. you can accuraty tell how much ore a spot will give and how many veins you can reach from that spot. Easily program macro for the need of each spot. The only manual thing is just moving the ore to the beettle and the house or storage.

    Work smarter not harder. People who work harder but not smarter are labor. People who work smarter but not harder are management. I finaly found my sig!!!
     
  8. popps

    popps Always Present
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    Losers ? How so ?

    Scripters end up having lots more gold than actual attending players AND, without spending the same time in the game.......

    That is, investing LESS time they get MORE result and, in the end, have MORE resources to play the game.......
    And on top of that, they were still able to spend their time going to movies, studying for school, getting work done and all that.

    Losers ?

    Perhaps I do not get the meaning of losing but to my understanding, unless I misunderstood something, doesn't winning have something to do with getting the most with the least effort ?

    Nonetheless, I would really see scripting out of the game for good, finally........
     
  9. anvira

    anvira Guest

    I see people doing stupid stuff all the time....granted it's wrong, but, really. I play this game for fun, not to have to sit and see...."You are ... in the que" and then the "unfortunately at this time .....", which ultimately ends up with me getting no where anyways.

    People will always find a way to do whatever they want, that's just life. Either whine and complain about it, or ignore it and go on about your business. In the time you wasted whining about the other person, had you just ignored them and moved on, you could've done something else.

    I can guarantee you that the response you get is not going to be worth your wait :p
     
  10. popps

    popps Always Present
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    If it is scritpting oh yes, man if it DOES hurt other players playing........

    A thousand times !!

    How so ?

    Because it devalues a player's time worth.

    The thing that is worth the most is time.

    Everything one can make back but NOT time, the time gone is gone forever and will NEVER come back.

    Time is priceless.........

    So, those players who script can actually create something in the game while doing something else.

    That is, they do NOT use their time worth when creating that game item because they used their time otherwise, doing else in their real life.

    Players who actually were in the game, playing, instead, when they created any item they bound their time's worth to those items. Precious, priceless, valuable time worth,

    Now, the players scripting items will sell those items they created with their extra time at a fraction of what players who actually invested their time worth could be able to price them.

    Hence, they get undersold, and a LOT.

    That is, as I see it, players who script take the time away from players who spent time playing the game making their time worth less than what it really is, instead, worth to them.

    Scripters devalue other players' playing time.

    Hence, it DOES hurt other players playing and also, IMHO, immensely............

    Why ?

    Because there is nothing else worth as much as time.

    Time is the only thing we cannot make back, unfortunately............
     
  11. Lord Chaos

    Lord Chaos Always Present
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    How is that a dead giveaway? If you have a specific ore spot there, its so much easier just to recall to it, than trying to find it by walking over.

    You just use UOA, it can automatically recall, mine the spot and then you just drag the ore over, rinse and repeat.
     
  12. Zosimus

    Zosimus Grand Inquisitor
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    Try making 16 macros in UOA with mine marked mining spots, how many times you clicked to ore that spot, recall back to where ever your drop off is then add pauses in between all that. I do it for my miner and LJ. Its actually nice. One push for each macro. All I have to do is unload.

    I have a fire beetle and its nice to mine but since like fel mining for double resources its not safe to do all that mining and bam get nailed by a stealther and lose all those ingots & gems I had on me. So if I get attacked I use chiv and 4/6 casting I hit my escape macro and Im out and safe. Once in a full moon I may get killed but that the chances I take.
     
  13. Freelsy

    Freelsy Babbling Loonie
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    Exactly. In fact it makes crafting cheaper...
     
  14. Picus of Napa

    Picus of Napa Slightly Crazed
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    So this is the third thread on the same topic in 2 days. Clearly they are scripting, lure a dragon if in tram or kill them in fel. End of story.

    This is 9+ years old and not even worth the time bothering to post about anymore. EA has clearly done nothing and by default these actions are legal. They have now added "support" for duel clients and tried their collective best to "fix" these issues with the EC client, which failed mostly due to no one wants it.
     
  15. Tanivar

    Tanivar Crazed Zealot
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    I'd say yes they are unattended macroing. My miner has had characters recall around and mine the ore spots in a cave including the one he's mining, recall away, and come back 15 minutes later and repeat the pattern, over & over.

    Definitely report them if they're doing something so obviously automated. UOA can't do such macroing by itself. Describe the behavior and do the click on the character option. Hopefully a GM will get off his duff, watch the characters behavior, try & get a response from him, then boot his hide into that holding cell they have and watch him try and mine in the cell.
     
  16. UOKaiser

    UOKaiser Guest

    It's probably me. Don't feel like making new marked spots just to not look repetitive. I like my spots being at them for years. Im doing it now. Heh is that you mining there? Im just standing there now to type this. If it's you watch this...... I just recalled mined in a semi circle around you lol. Though chances are thats not you but if it is say something.
     
  17. Aran

    Aran INFRACTION INFRACTION INFRACTION!
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    So you advocate breaking the rules because... someone might be breaking the rules?
     
  18. Tanivar

    Tanivar Crazed Zealot
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    rolleyes: No that wasn't me. If you want to amuse yourself with attended playing my miner is my Thunter Randalin. Have at it. At least it will be obvious your there and not scripting. :)
     
  19. Fat Midnight

    Fat Midnight Visitor

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    I got caught doing it today. Char is Benjamin on Napa. This was my first venture into untended macroing and I dont think I would try it again. I had 122 Months and 12 days into the game without a strike against me. At 6:08 PM I got banned.
     
  20. Tanivar

    Tanivar Crazed Zealot
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    Ouch!

    You took a chance and a GM was paying attention. :(

    Closest I've come to being banned was one night I was munching my dinner between restarts of a UOA macro making potions. The GM apparently came in behind the open container windows, got no reply and sent my character to their jail. I suspect my immediate reaction to the screen change was all that kept me from getting banned.

    Appeal the decision to EA. Maybe it's being a first offense in 122 months will get them to restore your account with a one-more-chance flavor black-mark. They may decide they got your attention and let you off the hook.
     
  21. GreywolfUK

    GreywolfUK Sage
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    Why should we buy stuff gained illegally, by doing so you are just encouraging them to keep doing it. It harms the game and the community

    I have had a crafter since I first started playing UO, nearly 10 years ago. There was a time few years back, I could go anywhere and mine as much ore as I wanted, including high end ore, now I am lucky if I can find 20-30 golden ore, let alone anything higher.
     
  22. Ezekiel Zane

    Ezekiel Zane Grand Inquisitor
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    No it's not. Marking a rune is the fastest way to get back exactly to the spot, in my case, which allows me to mine several resource tiles from the same spot. Walking there takes way more time.
     
  23. GreywolfUK

    GreywolfUK Sage
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    Sorry to hear you got a perma ban for first offence, even if it was for unattending. Perma bans are usually not given unless it is serious abuse, like large scale duping, exploiting etc, I would appeal against the perma ban, 72 hours is the normal for first offence, or even a week or month ban for first offence unattending, would be fair.

    Unless of course this is not your first mark, no offence meant, but it would not be first time people have come to these boards, claiming innocence, it was first time I did it, or gm's over reacting.
     
  24. Ezekiel Zane

    Ezekiel Zane Grand Inquisitor
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    He didn't specify whether he was perma-banned or temporarily banned.
     
  25. popps

    popps Always Present
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    Well, as much as I am aganst scripting I think that perma bans "on the spot" are an excessive measure.

    A warning and perhaps a 24 or 48 or 72 temporary ban should suffice.

    Of course, if the players gets caught again after this temporary ban that changes things and grants a more definitive perma ban.

    The real problem with scripting is not the player who may do it once in a blue moon perhaps to raise a skill. I think the real harm from scripting comes from those who do it all over for extended periods of time to run automatic BODs production, Heartwood runics or resource harvesting or Library Collections made easy.

    I think perma bans "on the spot" should be more for things like duping or really bad things.

    Besides, those who are expert scripters hardly use their real accounts to run their 24/7 scripts, they use disposable accounts.

    So, banning the player who, mistakengly but only occasionally may have done unattended macroing I think only costs a subscription to the game without really solving the problem with scripting.

    Those who script 24/7 and really hurt the game keep doing it off of disposable accounts.

    Banning is not the answer to stop scripting as long as it will be possible to do it with dummy accounts using game time codes.

    In order to stop scripting for good It must be technically made not possible in the game to be practised, somehow.
     
  26. Arcus

    Arcus Grand Poobah
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    Wrong.
     
  27. Vertex

    Vertex Guest

    So if something does not hurt YOU, then it is acceptable, even if it is fundamentally wrong?


    So a guy robs a 7-eleven, it didn't hurt you, so therefore, we should continue letting people commit crimes?


    And I anticipate a few retorts to this would probably be something along the lines of:

    "OMG, this is a game. You can't compare a real life crime to scripting."

    and

    "So if I PK someone in game, does that mean I will murder someone in real life?"


    --- I have no comebacks to those statements, so that's why I'm pre-empting them now. :D
     
  28. Aran

    Aran INFRACTION INFRACTION INFRACTION!
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    A guy robbing 711 hurts someone.

    A guy macroing in a video game? That hurts nobody.
     
  29. phantus

    phantus Stratics Legend
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    I will add my voice to those not in agreement with you. Cheaters hurt the game as a whole.

    Unfortunately this is the nature of UO. It has long had a reputation for this type of stuff as well as other behaviors that are not tolerated to the extent it is here. Cheating happens in all games but it's not as common to find people who take up for it as we do with UO. That is where it hurts.
     
  30. Mapper

    Mapper Crazed Zealot
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    Its only wrong if your a miner and sell the ingots, You can't sell your hard work for a good amount because scripters have put far too much resources in the game and prices are cheap.

    However, If you don't mine or lumberjack.. It doesn't hurt you, Infact its cheaper to get resources.

    It's a bit of both really.
     
  31. Megilhir

    Megilhir Guest

    While you may be doing this legally I KNOW for an absolute that not everyone else is.

    I killed a scripter-miner repeatedly on Atlantic in Britian's (FEL) Guard zone until he added a "Call Guards if damaged" line to his script.

    Is it cheating? Damn Straight.

    Will UO/EA do anything about it? No.
     
  32. Merion

    Merion Lore Master
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    Wow, tossing robbery and video games in the same kettle - you're really getting desperate for arguments, aren't you?
     
  33. Picus at the office

    Picus at the office Certifiable
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    All I am saying is if you happen to find the guy in Fel well then he's a fair target. If you happen to tame a dragon and it goes wild and crazy on you such that its not a good pet to have but this all happens near said miner, who am I to be worried as a dragon is not that hard to get away from.....
     
  34. longshanks

    longshanks Guest

    Anything that impacts the game's economy hurts the playing base. While script mining may lower the cost of ingots for sale, it allows that player to easily afford the high end items, the most sought after items. This keeps the value of said items higher than they probably should be. This does hurt the player base.

    Script mining causes inflation of in game economics. Plain and simple.
     
  35. Aran

    Aran INFRACTION INFRACTION INFRACTION!
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    Are you ******** or illiterate? That was in response to someone referencing someone robbing 7-11.

    I'm going with ********, just so you know.

    Here, just so you see it:

     
  36. Aran

    Aran INFRACTION INFRACTION INFRACTION!
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    And who does it hurt if they're only mining for themselves and maybe one or two friends?
     
  37. Konge

    Konge Lore Master
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    Luna sellers. They need a stimulus package damnit Aran! Obama help!
     
  38. Megilhir

    Megilhir Guest

    One more consideration is in order.

    When these people who script enter the game it is not always a sole player trying to get over or do their homework or any of the other suggestions listed in the posts above.

    It is professionals.

    If you do not know (and if you do there is no need to read this) there are actual businesses which make a fair amount of REAL money from selling game resources.

    There are posts on the net of guys with like 12 computers hooked up and running scripts in various games. I say 12 computers but really the number of computers is only limited by one's ability to maintain the system and connectivity issues.

    A professional game exploiter will gather millions of resources and then simply sell them for real money. You have probably seen the gold-spam ads in various games. If not, go on-line and look at all the shiny swords, armor, ingots, wood, leather and what ever else you want/need for what we consider a few dollars.

    But wait! That is the hook. America's population in 2010 is somewhere around 280 Million. Let us assess that only 10% play on-line venues. That means 28 Million on-line competing for resources across numerous platforms. If 10% of the on-line population routinely buy items/resources we are looking at 2.8 million 'shoppers'. Assume they spend an average of $9.95 annually. Almost $28 million dollars from America ALONE going into virtual goods.

    And I suggest my presented numbers are actually a lot lower than reality.

    Now add in China, Korea, Japan, Europe (Eastern and Western) Australia and anywhere else that has internet connectivity and reasonable governmental stability.

    We are looking at a growth industry worth millions of $$ annually.

    So it is not exclusively the guy/girl next door macroing or scripting while away at the movies. It could be network engineers running computer farms and harvesting for resale.

    I believe the top grossing REPORTED on-line virtual resaler earned 1.6 million $US (or so) in 2009.

    And all I wanted to do was get to Legendary in a few crafts and sell my wares...gone are the days of the knights...
     
  39. popps

    popps Always Present
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    It also make those scripted activities not viable for non scripters.

    A player actually mining, logging, doing BODs or Heartwood Quests attended, will either have to devalue one's own gaming time not to be undersold by scripters or, would just need to give up doing those scriptable activities.

    Why ?

    Because players scripting them make it not worth for other players to actually do them.

    I will make an example.

    If it takes to a player mining attended, say, 1 hour of mining to gather 10 valorite ingots, how much should such a player price those 10 valorite ingots to justify 1 hour spent mining for them ?

    If another player can, instead, set up an overnight script while they sleep and in the morning wake up with a nice stack of, say, 1,000 valorite ingots, the scripter will be able to price them as little as they want since they did not spend any real time getting them, the script did it for them.

    What I am trying to say, is that scripters make these activities being scripted not worth bothering with for all players who do not script them.

    So yes, as I see it, scripters do harm other players game play............

    And quite some also.....
     
  40. popps

    popps Always Present
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    Well, if that is what online gaming has gotten to I believe my days of playing any online multiplayer computer game might be numbered.

    I see no point in playing any online multiplayer game where not only it is relatively easy to cheat, but this may also be done so extensively.

    I think the companies making and selling online multiplayer computer games should make it impossible for their users to cheat in any way.

    Most of all, I think it should be forbidden any possible sale of in game items for real money.
     
  41. Megilhir

    Megilhir Guest

    I agree with every point and comment made in the quoted post.
     
  42. Aran

    Aran INFRACTION INFRACTION INFRACTION!
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    I play for me. Not for you. Not for profit. Not for anything but my own enjoyment.

    You literally can't devalue my time unless you're taking away from me. Someone scripting in the corner, or random spots around the world, can not possibly hurt me.
     
  43. Surgeries

    Surgeries Grand Poobah
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    To put this in perspective...a person who steals a television set from a house when no one is home, as long as it isn't my house, doesn't hurt me.

    If I don't build televisions, and buy that stolen TV a LOT cheaper from the thief or his fence than I would have paid in a store for it...

    Is that "A bit of both", since it "Helps" me by getting it to me cheaper, and "Helps" the thief, because then he gets some money he didn't actually have to pay a real price for, in comparison to the gain?

    See...I see it as All Lose.

    Except the thief...unless he gets caught.

    And that, in my mind, is one crappy equation.

    I could be way off, but I don't think I am.
     
  44. UOKaiser

    UOKaiser Guest

    Doesn't work in comaparison. Both a unattended miner and attended miner spend the same amount of time mining. Only difference one presses a macro key once every couple of minutes and watch tv while the other is not there.

    Though I would buy the stolen tv as long as there is no possibility of it being tracked to me. Sure save me money. I've bought stolen items before. Can't prove it but didn't care it's not my job and whoever they stole the items from should of being more careful. I remmeber when starter hats were popular I was in junior high. I had at least 3 attempts of my purple one being robed from my head One in the train station another in the train and another in a bad area. All 3 attempts failed though all 3 times I fought and losed but i kept my hat. Untill this girl riped it from my pants one day... Ah memories.
     
  45. Theo_GL

    Theo_GL Grand Poobah
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    Not true.

    Lets assume that you want to buy an item - Crimson Cinture. Lets assume it cost 15 million.

    Now lets assume people would normally pay 10 million for it but the price has been bid up by a scripter using his scripting millions to buy low priced Crimmy's to resell for $14.95 on his site. Boom - price goes up to 15 mil.

    Now you have been impacted.

    What do you think caused the rares market to go crazy? Half the rares chasers either scripted to make gold via resource gathering or duped items to get gold to pay for them. Soon server births were going for 100, 200, 300 million. The casual gamer would have a hard time affording items at that level. But then some of those folks got busted finally and it hasn't been that bad.

    However, you can go to Cove Fel on almost any shard and watch either scripers or attended scripters recall mining in all day long. Double the resources and in a guard zone.
     
  46. Splup

    Splup Guest

    What is right, what is wrong does karma exist blaablaa...

    It all comes down to if you want to be a dickhead towards others or not.
     
  47. Lorax_Pacific

    Lorax_Pacific Lore Master
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    You are making a mountain over a mole hill. I just started mining again and marking runes like I did in the old days to make rune books. I mark and have books for every ore type. So if I go to a spot and it was verite and now valorite then I move it to the valorite book. Now so what if two runes are marked to the same location or five feet away. It is just a method used to locate the ore and no one wants to memorize every spot in uo ore landscape that randomly changes.

    Play the game and stop worrying about other people.

    -Lorax
     
  48. popps

    popps Always Present
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    Sorry, but it all depends on the playing style of other people.

    If other players' playing styles can hurt others' then I think that one has all rights to worry about other people........

    And, to my opinion, the Developers should too............
     
  49. aarons6

    aarons6 Certifiable
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    i do this all of the time and im not unattended or using any illegal programs..

    i am using the EC client..

    it has a great deal of more options on its macros then UOA does.

    people claim i am scripting all the time, they even bug me and try really hard to ruin my time by luring monsters or putting things in my path..

    i wish the gms would ban those who do that :(
    i page on them all of the time but mostly i get a canned response to check out the harassment website.
     
  50. Lorax_Pacific

    Lorax_Pacific Lore Master
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    B.S. and this thread is dumb.

    If the developers didn't want people to recall then they wouldn't have made 100% LRC. The only thing that cost me anything was having my Human miner using chiv to get around and never marking runes. My elf miner has magery so I am marking everywhere I need to go.

    If the developers didn't want people to recall then they would make areas of certain ore types rather than randomize. The affect of randomization didn't change the runebooks of ore spawns. In fact now that I'm mining again it really didn't change anything about the game except I mark more runes and move runes around more. I still got over 2k valorite ingots in two days so what...

    My recall spell does not hurt Bo Didley and if people want to cry about hurting others then the 100% LRC suits did more hurt for all the people that used to actually run around the landscape gathering reagents. It put us gatherers out of business long ago and now there are only hunters left in this world.

    -Lorax

    p.s.

    The developers made me more inclined to use a runebook because I used to only mine from a boat in fel and we had whole ridges of valorite or gold or whatever. There were even pirates that killed me at times. Gathering resources was much better prior to the developers cooking up band-aids for something they should have fixed in a primary way instead of secondarily attempting to make the play in UO worse. I liked pirates and there is no reason for anyone to mine from a boat in my opinion.

    This whole hypothesis of a person that recalls in close proximity to a previous marked rune is busted in my opinion and the hypothesis fails. I can't wait for this thread to be locked since it is just all dumb.