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Attn dev team: How to make pvp active (very simple)

Discussion in 'UHall' started by Varrius, Jan 29, 2015.

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  1. Varrius

    Varrius Sage
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    Make power scrolls go to 130
    Make stats scrolls that increase your stats to 290-300
    Increase str/dex/int caps
    Make the scrolls account/character bound (this is the most important part)

    That is all that is needed to be done. Not this VvV crap that rewards theives and not pvpers. You don't need focus groups comprised of rares collectors and people who have 50 accounts scripting around the clock that haven't pvp'd in 7 years.

    You're Welcome,
    Varrius
     
  2. Captn Norrington

    Captn Norrington Trade Forum Administrator
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    I don't see how this would change anything....if pvp'ers aren't active now, why would they suddenly become active just because the amount of points per skill/stat changes. If someone wants to pvp, they will pvp. I don't think changes like this would convince anyone to take an interest in pvp when nothing else created so far has.
     
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  3. Varrius

    Varrius Sage
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    One of the main reasons there is no pvp now is because people like to have something to pvp over. Not just pvp at yew gate for no reason. People don't like to check champ spawns since they are for the most part inactive but even when they are active, you get scrolls that are worthless. If you made scrolls have value, people would fight over them.

    Happy to clear that up for you.
     
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  4. OREOGL

    OREOGL Babbling Loonie
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    idk pvp has been active on gl, not sure id bother with this.

    i would like to see spawn drops updated as you work a spawn (I.e. pink scrolls and 105s etc). Maybe even adding a few new drops to the bosses would be cool.

    Not sure why you can return a few bandanas for up to a 5.0 but doing a spawn you might get up to a 1.0. And 105s are worthless.
     
  5. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
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    Powerscrolls by nature are a self limiting system.... eventually you reach a saturation. Where everyone that "had to have one" has bought it at EXTREME prices no normal player would pay... Many "normal" folk go to dead shards and farm them for themselves. Rather a pain because it takes forever to get something you really need through all the garbage ones you often get.

    Bumping them up won't do anything but make more and more complaints by the PvM folk about the game being "Too EASY"... Because on top of their uber gear they have uber stats and such where they can pretty much walk through anything an kill everything in 1 or 2 hits.... BORING.

    What you want is to draw lambs to the slaughter... Newsflash... there aren't any lambs left. Most of them quit in frustration. There aren't many diehard PvPers left because they got tired of trying to compete with the hackers and such... using cheats, speed hacks and everything else.... they got fed up and moved on.

    So what we have left is a few diehard RP groups dwindling and scattered, a few PvPers who "don't" cheat who can't find anyone to PvP with but the same 3 other folk... The Cheaters and Hackers, and the Greedy SoB's playing just to "make a buck", a bunch of die hard PvMers who keep out of Fel for the most part, a few folk who are "in-betweens, an even fewer bunch of "newbs" or returning vets on newb accounts because they gave up trying to get their real accounts back while trying to navigate the account-mis-management system, and finally the ones who pay for accounts but are NEVER seen or heard.

    I don't think we need more powerscrolls or stat scrolls. I don't think that the DEV's should waste any more of their precious time trying to "draw" people to Fel. People will go to Fel if they want to..... don't need any incentive... just need the ToS enforced. THAT is why most folk don't go there. That or like me they lack the computer/connection/ whatever to be able to survive more than a second or so at PvP anymore. The older I get the harder it becomes. I never liked the "panic" aspect of gaming. I like collecting, role-play and crafting/deco etc... Truth is Fel is only appealing to a select few. Several others "tolerate" it as a means to an end... and the rest pretend it doesn't exist.

    Adding more crap to force them to add more crap is just a waste of time.
     
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  6. Varrius

    Varrius Sage
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    I don't think you realize what "active pvp" means.
     
  7. Varrius

    Varrius Sage
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    You do realize there are more active people on free servers where pvp is actually active than there are on almost every shard on osi, right? Your whole post is filled with bad opinions.
     
  8. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
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    They are on free shards because production shards aren't policed..... Free shards have better control over the cheating than production shards.
     
  9. Varrius

    Varrius Sage
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    No. They are on free shards because the pvp is better. Maybe I should have been posting here longer since it seems the majority of people in UOHall don't have a real idea about pvp gameplay. No wonder why you guys let things like VvV get into the game. I bet you think that is a good system. It was one if not the biggest fails in UO history.
     
  10. Captn Norrington

    Captn Norrington Trade Forum Administrator
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    They also have much more corruption unfortunately. It's extremely common for the developers/EM's/GM's of free shards to take other people's stuff for no reason except that they felt like it.
     
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  11. James Moriarty

    James Moriarty Journeyman
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    PvP is dead due to the changes they made to factions a while back. PvP was active until they tried to make the PvP'ers farm silver for the faction items. People had characters on multiple servers and if one server was dead they would look at another server. This was when it took very little effort to make a PvP suit out of faction gear.


    Once they hit the PvP nerf loads and mean loads of people left UO and started playing other games. My entire guild had 16 hard core PvP'ers then after the faction nerf 14 of them left and they refuse to come back.



    So PvP is now dead for the most part and its unlikely to change no matter what they do to try and resurrect it. People have moved on to new games and i hold Mesanna totally responsible .
     
  12. The Craftsman

    The Craftsman Lore Master
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    You do realise there are more players on free shards because they are errr ... FREE, dont you?

    And there you have the answer on how to make PvP active ... the F2P model
     
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  13. Lythos-

    Lythos- Lore Keeper
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    That's one of the worst ideas I've ever seen. I don't even know what to say to this.

    Haha You're kidding yourself if you think they'd ever accept a pvper over names they know.

    The most popular freeshards are pre AOS where you don't even need scrolls and it doesn't take an engineering degree to make a character. I haven't seen a successful freeshard yet that runs SA or higher.
     
  14. Varrius

    Varrius Sage
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    Your last statement is 100% wrong. The most active free servers are AOS servers. And to your 2nd comment. They shouldn't ask for help from players if that group mainly consists of non pvpers. That doesn't make much sense, does it?
     
  15. Varrius

    Varrius Sage
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    You are incorrect. People spend more money on free servers than the 13 or 14 dollars it costs to play osi. So it's not about it being FREE. How do you think the people that run the servers pay for everything? Out of their own pocket?
     
  16. cazador

    cazador Crazed Zealot
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    1. The most popular pre AOS free shard has scrolls
    2. The best SA shard has been active with 1000+ for at least 10 years now


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  17. The Craftsman

    The Craftsman Lore Master
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    I am therefore correct. F2P simply means subscription free. Opening UO to be F2P (read subscription free) would bring in two things ... player numbers and further income because as you rightly stated, and is true in many 'free' games, players will often spend more per months on items etc than they would on a subscription.

    So ... going F2P is the answer to your 'how to make PvP active' question. Your powerscroll solution is ill thought and short sighted.
     
  18. Varrius

    Varrius Sage
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    I do think F2P would be better than what it is now, but the people playing on free servers are playing there because they like that version better. What makes you think the majority would return to the osi version? They will stay on the server that has better/more active pvp. Making osi a F2P isn't a fix all. People will still think there is no reason to pvp which is the main problem now.
     
  19. Lythos-

    Lythos- Lore Keeper
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    1: Did not know that!!
    2: Stygian Abyss (SA) has only been around for 6? Sure we talking about the same thing?

    I did not know that! The last time I was shard shopping the preAos ones were loaded with people.

    To me, nothing in this game has made sense for years. They bump up composite swing speed to keep people from reaching max swing then turn around and toss in reforged stam armor so max swing can be reached on just about all weps. That made zero sense to me. Casting focus. Splinter. Having a thief play the most important role in a pvp system. The list of wtf is happening just goes on and on.
     
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  20. cazador

    cazador Crazed Zealot
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    1. It's ok because odds are they don't usually last more then 5 years

    2. Well yes I know that but they have kept on par with OSI servers since its creation patch for patch.
    (It's actually imo a lame server, but it has many players just not my particular style)

    I've always felt like accomplishing something on osi "means" more..not sure why. I've always enjoyed making my own FFA test center type Pvp servers..but I just liked creating art/content while playing on prodo shards.



    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  21. Lythos-

    Lythos- Lore Keeper
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    Gotcha. I've seen a lot of flat out stupid shards but to me the more osi like the better.

    I'm just a creature of habit when it comes to osi. The good thing is I've been seeing a lot of old pvpers I used to play with/against in the tram areas with me. Hopefully they're just gathering some top end armor to come back.
     
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  22. Goldberg-Chessy

    Goldberg-Chessy Crazed Zealot
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    You cleared up nothing.
    People do pvp just for the sake of pvp.
    One example is the fact that all day long guilds will spawn Barracoon and then announce in gen chat that coon is up just to get a fight. They will then sometimes fight for 30 minutes to an hour just for the action. The few scrolls at the end are generally meaningless.

    On a side note though, do you still play and pvp regularly on OSI shards?
    Havent seen you post much lately and certainly haven't seen you around atl lately although I admit I do not know your alts. Plus you referenced that you know how active pvp is on free shards.
    I ask this because I would add to your OP that other than focus groups we also don't need much input from people that don't regularly play any longer...
     
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  23. cazador

    cazador Crazed Zealot
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    I also think revamping spawns would add to Pvp fun..but they couldn't just slap 125's and 130 scrolls and call it a day. All spawns would have to be geared back up in difficulty. Id even suggest removing some of the higher known trap entrances to spawns..and for Gods sake make the sparkles work so if flee you can't hop them..I always thought that was stupid when chasing people for the UO dungeon tour.

    Make it so spawns aren't popped by having a random virtue. Make it so in order to start a spawn based on difficulty is tiered to by person..

    If one player stands on the alter and has max valor, the spawn recognizes your on the alter and after a global message it is starting it then has a 4 minute period before the 1st level "approaches" and the difficulty and rarity of level scrolls exponentially gets better based on how many participants are active so..
    1 person has the same end for 105-120 but and extreme rarity to anything better so on and so forth


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  24. cazador

    cazador Crazed Zealot
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    The 2-3 guild niche group that actually does that, will and has become bored, the wolves starve if they have ate all the sheep.

    Even 5 years ago you wouldn't have to go through the great lengths you do now to get a decent fight.. I'm not talking the 5v5's im talking the massive 3-4 10+ man guilds..those type of fights no longer exist, and unless you place the carrot on the table, we won't anymore.

    Again I play 4-5 shards because all I do is Pvp, I very very rarely Pvm. But as time goes on its becoming harder and harder to get decent fights even on ATL, unless you want to gate fight for hours on end against a Zerg crew or group of stealthers. This game lacks meaningful,strategic fighting.



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  25. Lythos-

    Lythos- Lore Keeper
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    No no no no. Don't give them any ideas about revamping or we'll have shame str level crap for spawns that'll take hours to kill.

    I'd like to see more special items go on the champ. Add VVV silver for killing it. 3.0 pinks, hair dyes, whatever. Just something different. No more new OP items.

    I used to love taking the world tour. These pvpers now, they don't know where they going.
     
  26. cazador

    cazador Crazed Zealot
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    Well right now as it is, the game is flooded with scrolls because they can be soloed AFK non stop all day on random shards with no players and then xferred over to more populated shards. If at least anything make scrolls shard bound..that in itself would make them worth farming again.


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  27. cazador

    cazador Crazed Zealot
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    @Kroynix
    -Remove 105 scrolls all together they are useless and replace them with .1-.5 pinks

    -add chances for 1.0-3.0 pinkies on the boss(not in pack drops)

    - give each boss its own rare special dye (Blood of the baracoon) that add titles to armor 1 charge dyes Arcane Leather Tunic of Wizardry doused in the Blood of the Baracoon.. things like that.

    -turn T2A into something useful maybe add special resources and high shame level type creatures special resources would be
    Examples

    -Mined
    -Blazed Ingots (when applied to armor after reforging/imbuing/enhancing it adds +5 fire resist and a title) Mighty Platemail Arms of Defense Infused with a Blazed Tincture.

    Leather
    -Frost Dragon Hide(when applied after reforge/imbued/enhance it adds +7 cold resist and a title) Fortified Leather Arms of Vitality encrusted with Frost Dragon armor

    ..all easy'ish non game breaking "FUN" new activities


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    #27 cazador, Jan 29, 2015
    Last edited: Jan 29, 2015
  28. TheScoundrelRico

    TheScoundrelRico Stratics Legend
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    I see the OP's point. It's like what WoW has done of the years...it extends the end game requirements. Since we have individual skills as opposed to levels, it kinda makes sense.

    With that said, I'd rather see other ways of improving on the idea as opposed to increasing skill max levels...la
     
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  29. Kyronix

    Kyronix UO Designer
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    We've talked about this at some in-game meet & greets in the past. Simply "raising the bar" on powerscrolls is not an ideal solution for extending character development beyond what it is now, instead we favor skill mastery development similar to what can be done with the various bard skills. This makes balancing a little bit easier and also introduces incomparables in the form of the abilities granted by those masteries.
     
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  30. BeaIank

    BeaIank Babbling Loonie
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    Verily, but I am sure that adding rare scroll drops to VvV that would raise the skill cap to 730, 740 or 750 could prove to be quite the incentive to drag people to use the system.
    30 extra skill points can go a long way on a template.

    But then again, people like me would just wait for them to show up on vendors, as PvP doesn't entice me. I much prefer spending my time killing headless miners on my 200 ms ping for it is much more fun for me.
    For those who like to draw their fun by setting other players on fire or poking them with sharp sticks on Felucca, more power to them.
     
  31. azmodanb

    azmodanb Grand Poobah
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    oh wait you don't wanna make wow .... thanks in advance :)
     
  32. The Craftsman

    The Craftsman Lore Master
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    I dont think using the WOW model is the way to go at all. Where does that end? Increase the skill cap by 10 every year? Regularly increase the max total skill points total too? And youd have to keep increasing it to keep ahead of the curve as when everyone is running round at 130 your back to square one. And in doing so to set carrots for PvP you totally decimate PvM unlerss you just keep piling on the damage and HP of mobs. Its a never ending cycle

    Youve redeemed yourself you scoundrel.
     
  33. TheScoundrelRico

    TheScoundrelRico Stratics Legend
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    Haha, At first I was thinking..."hey...read the rest of my post...I wasn't supporting the idea, just explaining it." :) ...la
     
  34. Scribbles

    Scribbles Babbling Loonie
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    This is one of the reasons why i recommended the 120 scrolls start having a two week life span. There is no reward other than the kill itself for raiding a champ spawn. For the most part all the champ spawn people have moved to dead shards to stock pile scrolls. There are only a couple skills that have seemed to retain their value.
     
  35. Smoot

    Smoot Grand Poobah
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    My favorite champ spawn is primeval liche. Really not worth it to me to do a spawn just for the scrolls, or even the replicas, but adding in those deco items is a nice plus that boosts a spawn up to being somewhat worthwhile. I used to farm that one alot solo on atlantic and managed to get some sparkles and wall carvings. If every spawn had rare spawning deco i think more people would do them (fel only spawns btw. tram doesnt need more easy mode deco items)

    I also think that at least scrolls from a spawn should not be able to be transfered.
     
  36. Lythos-

    Lythos- Lore Keeper
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    Absolutely not sir.

    PvP is as balanced as I've seen it since before Age of Shadows. There is no sense in adding yet another complicated system to the mix. Zero. Zip. Nada. Throw it all out.

    Overhauling skills with masteries will NOT make pvp active. Adding new things for us to do will. Hell, recycle old goodies into spawns.

    When you go screwing with skills and templates that's when you have more people lined up to check out and leave than you see in Walmart on welfare day.
     
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  37. Smoot

    Smoot Grand Poobah
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    VVV could be saved if so much emphasis wasnt put on thieves, more on kills, and there were better rewards.

    Examples of GOOD rewards:
    dyes: abysal skin dye, glacial pink hair dye, any dumb color dye. (no one buys the blue/red they are boring)
    mounts: Live mounts. Think things like Dreadmare and Bane dragon. This should be a very high end reward. Glacial Dreadmare should take some rediculous amount of kills.
    Timered consumables: low cost item that adds a 25 hit spell chance to any melee or level 6-8 mage spell cast (NOT a low level spell like harm or something)
    possibly arrows with 2 extra tile range.

    Current rewards are a good start, but not many of them are actually very good for pvp. They need to be updated often to keep people's interest. Theres also not any good high point rewards that someone can save up for. Im not talking some 20mil value forged pardon. more like 500-1bil value. Something thats worth trying for and not just buying.

    Im pretty much done with PVP in UO at least for now. I might log on and plink around once every few months, but really just no reason to do it right now. that being said, i will continue to use the very nice / free artifacts for my pvm characters and crafters.
     
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  38. Scribbles

    Scribbles Babbling Loonie
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    I agree with @Smoot I had a lot of hope for VvV but it wasnt fun watching a solo thief beat the people that were actually fighting. Also none of the rewards for it struck me as worth while. Ive moved to pvping else where, League of legends, DOTA2, Heroes of Newerth.
     
  39. Lythos-

    Lythos- Lore Keeper
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    I had high hopes for VVV as well. It was disappointing. I can't tell how many times I've gotten ganked and slaughtered while Sneaky McStickyFingers wins all by hiding in a corner. Well actually it wasn't much because that got old quick.

    A pet you can't even rez. 2 Dyes. The royal pardon will have no value at all once the rest of the pvpers quit.

    I don't know what to say because I'm hardcore against anything else OP being added in this game. I think the 9-10-11 mod legendary armor addition was a really dumb thing.
     
  40. Tina Small

    Tina Small Stratics Legend
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    @Kyronix, has there ever been any discussion of doing some kind of cross-over between UO and DAoC? I'm not sure how it would actually work to do something like that, but it's been something I've always thought might be worth exploring a bit. At the very least, I've wondered if you guys have ever even tossed around the idea of having our monthly subscription fee give us access to both games instead of just one?
     
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  41. GalenKnighthawke

    GalenKnighthawke Grand Poobah
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    So "all" we have to do is radically change game systems, eh?

    Hell of a misleading post title.

    And an extremely bad idea. The evidence has been mounting up that it's content that makes people play. This actually appears to be supported in part by a system I've barely touched, and that's VvV. It is pretty active on Great Lakes. Why? If I'm right then it's because it's content. PvP content to be sure but still content.

    What you describe is a change in game mechanics which you'll make, in effect, accessible only to PvPers, would then require rebalancing of things (remember when they put in 120 and nerfed 100?), etc.

    -Galen's player
     
  42. GalenKnighthawke

    GalenKnighthawke Grand Poobah
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    Thank you for recognizing what a bad idea this is.

    While I think the evidence supports content trumps mechanics changes if you were to change mechanics what you describe would be an infinitely superior idea to what was in the original post.

    -Galen's player
     
  43. Varrius

    Varrius Sage
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    You do realize VvV was a complete fail right? I hope you're not one of the five people that don't realize that. Did you ever pvp or did you just steal story lines from the GL EM's for your own events?
     
  44. Varrius

    Varrius Sage
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    Did it seem like a good idea at the time to make a thief the most poweful person in VvV? If so, does it still seem like a good idea?
     
  45. Martell

    Martell Seasoned Veteran
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    Yeah, VvV is an abysmal failure and should just be yanked (like the first attempt at a faction revamp was).

    That said, the 130 skills is a dumb idea and wouldn't even make sense for anything other weapon skills and resisting spells (both of which would be unbalancing).

    While I hate tamers, I think the idea of adding dreadmares and bane dragons as rewards is probably one of the better ideas to encourage group fighting.

    What several successful free shards have done is give skills gains and unique weapons as rewards for champs and harrowers. When the champ dies, the reward drops on the boss' corpse, it's cursed, and the person who picks it up is highlighted so everyone knows who to target. This has usually provided a good amount of fun.

    That said, most free shard have a better, more diverse population than today's UO. If this were implemented it would just cater to the few 10+ person guilds still around...

    IMO what pvp (and UO in general) needs is to actually become an MMO again and incorporate new players. As is seen on stratics, UO is really just a small, old, exclusive clique. Many players are living in the past, like the little world they've made for themselves, and don't want anyone intruding on them and their group. At this point, all of the pvpers know each other, all the deco addicts know each others, all the rare collectors know each other, all the rper's know each other, etc.

    Just go f2p already, WE NEED MORE PEOPLE!
     
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  46. GalenKnighthawke

    GalenKnighthawke Grand Poobah
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    Take it up with OREOGL who replied above.

    -Galen's player
     
  47. Varrius

    Varrius Sage
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    It
    Or you could stop posting about things you have no clue about.
     
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  48. OREOGL

    OREOGL Babbling Loonie
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    Says the guy begging for scrolls...
     
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  49. OREOGL

    OREOGL Babbling Loonie
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    Make your own arguments. You don't even PVP.
     
  50. Varrius

    Varrius Sage
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    Begging for scrolls? I'm begging for pvp. Maybe you should take comprehension classes
     
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