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Back To Our Roots "a proposal"

Discussion in 'UHall' started by AtlanticVlad, Feb 28, 2011.

?

What do you think after reading this?

  1. Yes, I like this idea.

    2 vote(s)
    11.8%
  2. No, I don't like this idea (Please explain bellow).

    14 vote(s)
    82.4%
  3. Let's discuss this more so I can decide.

    1 vote(s)
    5.9%
  1. AtlanticVlad

    Stratics Veteran

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    I had originally thought I would just leave this message in the other thread that I wrote it but having thought about it more I decided I would throw it up on its own. I would like to get the rest of the community thoughts and perhaps refine things to find a way to make it work.

    Please attempt to read the whole post before responding

    Ok I know it is not likely happen but one of the only reasons I stuck with UO back in the day was the counselor system, yes knowing about Stratics would have helped too I agree, but it was the fact that if I was lost or confused I could page, and someone would show up and talk me through things.

    I know I know they ran into problems with scheduling volunteers and $ and things...

    Blah blah blah it was a volunteer program and they don't wanna run back into that problem again. So perhaps just make it a new part of game play. A new option if you will.

    I really don't think that should be an issue here is a simple solution.

    Proposal

    Any one with an account over *Shrugs* a year, or something

    1. Let them make a counselor.
    2. Do not allow them to effect the world at all, they would walk through doors like a ghost and could not pick things up.
    3. Do not allow them to turn invisible.
    4. Let them respond to pages all kinds of pages including GM pages
    5. Let them pass the legit pages that require a GM on to he GM's most of our players know what these are better then the GMs do.
    6. Let them suggest punishment *Gasp* I'm not saying a singe person gets to ban someone or something I'm saying if its a griefing issue or something make 3 of them or more if you want be present and have the page system completely random it picks 3 available people, maybe not even just form one server maybe let um server hop or something somehow, I believe our GMs that don't know the game do this any way, to pass judgment then they as a group would write up a single official report and send it to the GM to actually make what ever needs to happen happen.​

    Problems this helps to address

    1. GM wait time... Honestly most of the things I hear people paging about are simple things with housing that a more knowledgeable player could help them deal with. Councilors could be there in a matter of min if its something they cant handle they can pass it on to another Counselor or pass it on to the GMs if need be.

    2. It would reduce griefing if active players are helping to police the shards and passing only legit things on to the GMs we all win.

    3. It could serve as a deterrent for scripting and hacking in the same way.

    4. It would make our increasingly complicated game more accessible to new players.

    5. It would bring back a sense of community.

    6. They could help perhaps keep crowds in line at events somehow perhaps through 120 second squelching that only works if 2 -3 o them use it on you in the course of 60 seconds or something.

    7. Would provide bored old timers with something constructive to do to make the "Wold" a better place.

    8. It could also be used to help pinpoint bugs and issues more quickly as most of us old timers know how to pick things apart when problems pop up.

    9. It would reduce the workload on the over worked GMs that don't really understand the game and would give them feed back form us as to how the game works.

    10. This would provide players with a greater sense of "Customer Service" yes it would be provided by customers but I don't believe that any ones going to mind that.​

    Issues this might create

    1. I could see people attempting to use these characters to monitor things like spawns.
    Ways to deal with that
    a. As suggested above don't allow them to be invisible.
    b. Allow them to pass the same sorts of judgments on each other, so if they do that and someone reports them another one would pop up and call the others to pass judgment on to a GM
    c. some how limit how far the are allowed to wander form the paging player.​

    Again I know this is highly unlikely to happen but if you set up the system from the beginning so it is COMPLETELY voluntary, other then forwarding things to the GMs, or perhaps keeping the peace at EM events, there is no interaction with the staff. Then you can avoid the problems of our past.

    Honestly I'd gladly forfeit a character slot to help out and I would play far more then I do now. The community is why I used to play it feels so dead to me now, especially with the advent of team speak and vent, its sad. I think the cost of a character slot would be a fine price to pay to participate in such a noble cause. It would be a game play choice not a service your providing to the company.

    Please once your done with reading my proposal take the time to form your responses so that they are useful to the Devs if they read this don't just say yay or nay, actually I'll make this a poll for that.
     
  2. Symma

    Symma Certifiable
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    I'd like to point to what we have on Siege Perilous for a long long time. The NEW guild does exactly what it says on the tin.

    Most people on the shard would refer players they didn't recognise to NEW for support and help. I've done this quite a few times when I've seen someone running around. And even a good few murderers (PKs) would honor the NEW tag and don't kill that person.

    Our player base is smaller these days, so its role isn't as big.

    But without NEW, i think Siege would have been a different place. I'm proud to have been on this shard playing alongside the people that worked so hard in NEW.

    Sorry for blowing Siege's trumpet. I know it doesn't cover all the points you raised, but I feel that it shows the spirit of a shard.
     
  3. Sir Mastermind

    Sir Mastermind Adventurer
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    Account age has not' to do with knowledge and game play ability. I have seen players that have been playing who have no idea what they are talking about. Or worse, they pretend to, and put out a lot of really ******** misinformation.

    "pfft, eval doesn't have anything at all to do with magery!"

    Plus a lot of people buy older accounts so they can have the720 skill cap and be able to use cannons...(?)
     
  4. AtlanticVlad

    Stratics Veteran

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    I've herd of sieges efforts and I applaud them but this is about more then just helping out the new players this is about helping everyone.

    My suggestion of basing it on account age was just because I'm sure they would want to base it on something... I don't really like doing it off of account age but the other idea is to just make it open to everyone or perhaps have a questionnaire or test but the answers would just be posted online somewhere and that would be pointless.
     
  5. Sunchicken

    Sunchicken Guest

    While i would enjoy seeing a shard with the back to basic (lack if item properties) type of vibe going on i dont like your proposal.

    I dont think the majority of todays players have the proper people skills to be councelers. I know for sure the majority of the pvpers (while they probably have the greatest knowlege of game mechanics) have such competitive personalities it would just be a bad thing in general.

    I agree the gm's today dont know jack **** about the game. Something needs to be done. It just seems like a slap in the mouth if one would respond "thank you for playing warhammer.'' With that said i think there should be some sort of questionier to players with a personal conversation if they are interested in being a gm/seerer/couseler or what ever. It would be nice to see someone with knowlege come to answer my questions, but i dont want a smart ass know it all with 0 personality answer them either...


    SIEGE NEEDS LOVE
     
  6. AtlanticVlad

    Stratics Veteran

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    Honestly I would really doubt that those players you described would be the players who would give up a character slot to fill that roll. I would guess only the ones who enjoy interacting with people and being helpful would be up for such a task. I'm not saying that we wouldn't get the occasional unhelpful person but that just means you page again and try for someone new.
     
  7. They can't use volunteers to monitor the game due to legal issues.
     
  8. AtlanticVlad

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    I feel perhaps the part where I acknowledged the fact that they cant use volunteers for a for profit entity may not have been clear enough I don't propose this be set up in that way I propose this just be added basically as a new character class/race...

    Or perhaps you just did not read the whole thing before responding like I had asked people to do...
     
  9. I did read everything. What you suggest is have volunteers behave like Customer Service. It s how it used to work in the past and it stopped because of legal issues. Call those volunteers a new Character/Class or even chicken won't change anything.
     
  10. copycon

    copycon Guest

    Why not encourage a player to use a more community oriented help system (like chat) to answer questions instead of developing an elaborate "player counselor" system?
     
  11. 4th3ist

    4th3ist Journeyman
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    Actually, I'm pretty sure if it was coded in as a gameplay mechanic that anyone has access to, there isn't jack any law suit could do about it. Are you saying that the [NEW] clan is grounds for a class action law suit as well? They are just Counselors with a different name that cant teleport to people.

    If its part of the flipping game, there are no legalities.. If I want to play World of Customer Serivce Online who the hell is going to stop me? Its not being a VOULUNTEER... There is no agreement in this circumstance between you and EA. Or Mythic. Or Bioware. Or OSI. Or Lord British.... Only the same EULA you log in to every day... The difference would be it is an intended gameplay mechanic set up under the original EULA and if I wanted to play that way it would be up to me entirely...
     
  12. 4th3ist

    4th3ist Journeyman
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    I propose all players actively seeking out and helping new players with their new player experiences and game play trifles that the GM page system isn't helpful with, demand proper and immediate compensation from EA, if what Macrophage said above is indeed true. Theres no difference between you and Counselors....
     
  13. Zosimus

    Zosimus Grand Inquisitor
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    I didn't vote but I have a possible solution. The issue with volunteers that for some strange reason it was volunteers that wanted to be paid. So in todays world we have a fix for that. An unpaid intern.

    Maybe if Bioware would go that route we could have some GM"s while these unpaid interns could gain some experience in the gaming field they need. They may discover some hidden talent in one of them.
     
  14. Surgeries

    Surgeries Grand Poobah
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    This is a very gray and unstable area, as can be evidenced by this article from 2010 in the NY Times:

    http://www.nytimes.com/2010/04/03/business/03intern.html

    As much as lots and lots of For Profit Employers would LOVE to have a bank of nothing but Interns working...and many have The Federal Government takes a very different view of the activity, as do State and Local municipalities, particularly with regard to taxation issues.

    It can be done best in areas like a Not-For Profit, but volunteerism and internships must be evaluated ever so carefully. Violation of IRC (Internal Revenue Code) in these regards, particularly Willful Violation, can easily result in Jail Time for officers of the company and they have to pay the taxes and penalties themselves; they cannot use company funds if they are found to be in violation and convicted.

    So...as much as I would love to see something like this, the best we can do, legally, is use real "Community" to show new players how much fun UO can be.

    The trade off is EA gets our services for free, but we can shape and create our own little "worlds" with the folks we meet and help.

    My.64 cents worth...
     
  15. AtlanticVlad

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    Thank you 4th3ist that was my thought exactly. Again the reason I suggest this as opposed to things like NEW which I still whole hartedly support as well is that this would give us more rounded support not just for new players but for all. Also it would lighten the load of GMs and help to refine what issues are brought to them to insure they are only brought in when actually needed. I'm sure there are a lot of pages that are unnecessary. It addresses so much more then our new players.
     
  16. Tinsil

    Tinsil Guest

    No. Would be abused and wouldn't work well.

    Hire a couple more GMs and fix the issues which make you need a GM in the first place.
     
  17. Hoffs

    Hoffs Gilfane Keeper of the Hall
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    Whatever the merits, I just think the whole idea is pretty moot because there is no way that the Devs will bring back a program which in any shape or form could be construed as volunteer work. I think Mesanna made quite a pointed "we will not be bringing back Companions" statement last night, which seems to show the idea is not even open for discussion.

    Really, I think the only solution is to go the NEW route like we have on Siege. It really is a tremendous help, well was when we had a decent population, and a great boost for new players who were unsure how to make it on their own. As Symma said, nearly all Siege vets know to point newcomers towards NEW and will often see if Shalimar (the GM) or any of the co-leaders (alts of other senior shard members) are available on ICQ, etc. And on a shard with a much larger population and multiple character slots, it should work even easier. You just need to make sure you have a really good GM and that the guild remains completely neutral toward the rest of the shard population.

    I know that is only for new players, but you could also think about starting another guild, say HELP, which handles other people's problems, or just extend the use of the NEW guild to that area.
     
  18. Hoffs

    Hoffs Gilfane Keeper of the Hall
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    Further to the above, on Siege it was always really important to help new players as so many folk are afraid of the shard and have many wrong ideas about it. Every player was vital and, who knows, if they like it they may bring friends with them.

    The same holds true for UO in general these days. Anyone we can bring in to the game is important these days, and maybe if they get along well they will pass the word on to others and bring their WoW friends along.
     
  19. Ahuaeyjnkxs

    Ahuaeyjnkxs stranger diamond

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    SIEGE FTW !!!

    [​IMG]
     
  20. Woodsman

    Woodsman Guest

    That's really who we should be working on.

    There are a lot of bored MMO players floating around, that keep trying out different MMOs that open up every few months. Those people don't live in a vacuum - if we pull them in, they'll pull in their friends. The majority of people I played with early on were people who I pulled into the game - from where I worked, etc. Some of these people were not gamers by any means. Many pulled in their friends/spouses.

    Pull in the people bored with the other MMOs, toss in some people who want something that's social but that's more than FaceBook, and we're on our way.

    When we get the artwork upgrade, I will probably even seek out both new and old players.

    They really need to expand the mailbox system though. They really need a good way of communication within the game.
     
  21. Ahuaeyjnkxs

    Ahuaeyjnkxs stranger diamond

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    Lord Brittish was against nightshade for recreational use too :lol: