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blackrock golems wth

Discussion in 'UHall' started by Care Bears Rulez, Feb 16, 2011.

  1. So i'm killing a golem with my guild and one person runs up and starts hitting it when its redlined and even though he only hits it a few times he gets the armor piece off of it.

    Later we are killing another one when it happens again, its about to die (around a 4th left) and a group of 5 people run up and get the armor piece off of it.

    WHY would i want to keep playing in this event when all you have to do is run up when its about dead hit it a few times and get the item off it. They could at least spawn in fel.
     
  2. popps

    popps Always Present
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    One of the biggest problems I have with Ultima Online, is that my feeling is, that my time spent in it sometime is not much valued by the game as it is.

    Personally, I think that time is a very important value in one's own life. Time gone will never come back and I feel that time is never enough in my daily life when the things to deal with are so many.

    This is a game where scripting has been ongoing for many years and, it still is. That some players are able to run activities in the same game I play without having to spend their time on them (because of the use of scripts...), make MY time spent in the game worth much less because I cannot compete with what my time value might be worth with that of a script that allows to obtain my same results or even better, without actually investing the same time that I had to in those activities.

    Your findings when fighting Blackrock Golems I see it pretty much the same, a lack of sensitivity of Ultima Online as it is, towards time actually spent by players in doing activities in Ultima Online.

    I think that the most important differential in the game for looting rights should be time spent on the hunt, not most damage.

    As I see it, it is way more important and valuable that a player has spent 30 minutes fighting a target rather than coming to that same target that someone else has been fighting for a long time already, hit it a few time for huge damage and get all the goodies as you have unfortunately experienced.

    A game that does not value players' time spent on activities in the game, is not fair towards those players who then, feel deprived of their efforts, get upset at the game and, perhaps, close their subscription as a consequence thus depriving the game of resources.

    To my opinion, time spent on the fight should be what matters most in having the highest chances at a good item's drop.
     
  3. Aurelius

    Aurelius Babbling Loonie
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    Utterly exploitable.

    So in your method, when the monster spawns, if I'm quick, I could tag it with a tiny spell or single arrow and hide. Everyone else piles in to kill it, they do all the work, I get the looting rights for no tiny and no effort..

    There are problems with how the system is calculating rights now, but that's a much worse 'solution' - however it is one that flows logically from the incorrect starting point that other people are not playing the game too, and some of them won't do things you think are 'nice'. I'm noticing a lot of your ideas seem to build on that basic flaw in the logic.
     
  4. If you are killing something for a while and have done most of the damage, some random shouldn't be able to come in when its redlined and get looting rights at all, let alone the armor piece you've been killing the monster for
     
  5. Aurelius

    Aurelius Babbling Loonie
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    Completely agree - it's the damage done that should be determining access, shares and priority for looting. Most of the time, that seems to work. Annoyingly it sounds like there's a problem, maybe particular to blackrock golems but in UO it may be happening semi-randomly all over the place. Popps 'solution' of completely time-based, though, just won't work....
     
  6. popps

    popps Always Present
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    Not necessarily.

    A Greater Dragon on average does like 15-20 damage.

    I have heard of players being able to do 150-200 damage per hit and, if their suits are maxed out for hit Chance Increase, they can land most hits.

    This means that a Greater Dragon needs 10-15 times more the length of time to so the same damage someone else can do.

    For example, bringing down a Blackrock Golem with a Greater Dragon takes from 60 to 90 minutes time if not more while I heard other players claiming they were able to take them down in like 15-20 minutes (which is 1/5 of the time....).

    So, a high damager jumping in a fight that another player has been dragging on for an hour or so, can well make more damage in that short time frame remaining before the kill and get the special item.

    Perhaps only time might not be a good enough differential, but coupling it with the number of hits done in that time frame might help determining more fairly who has the most chances at a special item drop. Definately, in my opinion, the most damage is often not a fair meter to say who gets what.
     
  7. Klapauc

    Klapauc Sage
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    Did happen to me and to other players. Find a nice golem to solo far away from the other people, get him down to 20-30% , then a random group of mystics and mages shows up, casts some words of death and runs away with the armor drop... Gives me always a hard time to keep my mouth shut.
    While its actually nice that the armor drop does not go to the top damager, it encourages exactly this behaviour. Let some other guy do the work, then jump his kill when he is nearly done.
     
  8. Viquire

    Viquire Crazed Zealot
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    were they young?
     
  9. Javin

    Javin Guest

    I actually did this to someone, but im not a ******bag and I gave them the armor piece. I cast maybe 5 word of death on their almost dead golem and the armor piece fell on my instance.

    I hate that this can happen, and im glad, even though I scared them, that they understood, i think, what i was doing. Hence the reason my tamer will NOT be participating in this event.

    Im pretty sure the griefer tactic that were talking about is employed everywhere as we speak. (I think its griefer BS lol)

    Hopefully the devs will do something about this one of these days, but man, its been around forever. The only thing I can think of is the was champ spawns are setup. Higher amount of spawn killed gives better chance at replica.

    My 2 cents...

    ~J
     
  10. Shakkar

    Shakkar Guest

    Fact of the matter is, all skills need to be revamped toward pvm with the exception of mystic. Mystic is so over powered that a 2 k spell being cast is a bit overpowered compared to my 50 or 100 hp spell if im lucky. So with a
    2 k hp spell like word of death it opens up all the deviates to one sided play.Even in daily places now its hard to keep the one shot wonders off your kill. Navrey is a prime example 3 words of death they hide and wait for it to die.Gettting there chance at the same prize for little effort.Why not join and help in the fight? Because the game has rewarded them making them elite. Ha in my opinion, these type of players need to be shunned for there dumbness. Thus, losing even more assist to the game revenue. its a no win situation.so as a player I will sit back and watch and hope. Make all skill fair! :heart:
     
  11. G.v.P

    G.v.P Stratics Legend
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    Would have been nice if three dropped per, like the staves in Magincia ended up dropping off the light daemons.
     
  12. phantus

    phantus Stratics Legend
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    UO at it's finest! =)

    Anyone need more proof the developers(nearly all) don't play the game?

    This has always been an issue with UO though. Loot rights. Even back in the classic days when you would try and get Lord by killing the elder gazers and someone would hide behind the door, open, magic arrow and eat your fame.

    The solution of the current team:

    Leave the spawn in place for a long time. Therefore ensuring that if you wait long enough for nooone to want them and they are easier to buy than get for yourself you can get as many as you want assuming you can find people to help you.

    AKA the bane dragons. Same solution.

    Wait a week or two. Get the rewards you want today.
     


  13. :lol:
    spawn hogging leads to kill stealing
    both lead to bad feelings

    :scholar: Children: BEHAVE!!

    :lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:
     
  14. Frarc

    Frarc Stratics Legend
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    I would not mind a pemanent spawn of them somewhere so everyone gets a chance to collect the new armor. :)
     
  15. Sevin0oo0

    Sevin0oo0 Guest

    I watched a (quite beautiful snow white) Cu and a Chivalry bushido dexxer take one last nite in 20-30mins
     
  16. Apetul

    Apetul Rares Fest Host | LS April 2011
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    99.9% of the people is killing the golems from inside a boat. (and most of them are unattended)

    So a mage spellweaver is a good choice, just run near the shoreline or go to the SE corner of magincia where people is casting spells from the building roof .. then proceed to casts WOD when the golem is almost dead. Its like.. exploiting the exploiters.
     
  17. G.v.P

    G.v.P Stratics Legend
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    Mesanna said killing golems from a boat is okay because they have a range attack. So it's not an exploit, Mesanna approved of it. :thumbup1:
     
  18. Klapauc

    Klapauc Sage
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    Now thats complete bull****. If im fighting say a blackrock golem or demon guard, i got enough other keys to press and dont have time to talk to you.
    And after you would do this to me twice on purpose, i wouldnt talk to you anymore.
    Thats probably the reason why you think they script, in reality the griefer is you.
     
  19. yea i agree sounds like the griefers i was talking about
     
  20. Zosimus

    Zosimus Grand Inquisitor
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    I can see why people do it off of boats because they can get out of range without it still chasing them if they take to much damage by moving the boat back. So the players on the boats take range attacks minus any physical damage.

    People fighting on land have to lure them and not only take range attacks but physical damage also.

    Its a player tactic and Im not faulting the player for it. Smart tactic but epic fail on the devs part not fore-seeing this.

    Everybody just do it on boats and then its all fair.

    Bad call Mesanna.
     
  21. The people in the boats arn't the problem. It's the people going up to the boats and killing the blackrock golem when it's redlined so they get the item. =[
     
  22. Apetul

    Apetul Rares Fest Host | LS April 2011
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    I dont have a spellweaver char.
    And Im talking about the chars inside a boat that, even when the golem is out of reach they are still casting mind blast or -if archers- casting consecrus weap.
    Maybe u missed them... because you was super busy pressing so many keys :thumbup1:
     
  23. I have a spellweaver...but she's red...dang left out again :sad4:
     
  24. I had this very thing happen last night on LS. Someone use W-O-D and got a the armor item. I made the statement that I could not compete it that and the person piped up and said.. It's not damaged based but luck based. Then took the armor and left. I argee with the O.P.
    I also wish that bards had been included in the Blackrock Golem fights. Bards can do nothing to them and thus out of the pictures altogether
     
  25. G.v.P

    G.v.P Stratics Legend
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    Why don't all the shards have blackrock golems? :/ I want something to do on Chesapeake
     
  26. phantus

    phantus Stratics Legend
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    Discord bard songs(masteries) work on them.
     
  27. yea i'm on ls too, looks like we ran into the same person =\
     
  28. Nimuaq

    Nimuaq Lore Master
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    This is a good suggestion. However, I think the main problem is, the armor set pieces are considered as regular loot by the system and the overall loot is then shared amongst the top damagers. Even if this sharing would be based on the damage dealt, the system will not treat the item piece differently.

    So, what the OP wants is a system where the top damager gets the special loot, and then the remaining loot is shared amongst the top damagers.

    I've helped killing lots of Bane Chosen Guards and I was the player who dealt the most damage in many cases. However, -hundreds of Guards later- I got the special loot (Defiler of Virtue) when I dealt a particular Guard less than 200 damage. This proves the problem is not restricted only to Blackrock Golems.

    For the players who kill these Golems unattended on their ships, you can always decide to try some special fishing nets, coincidentally near their boat.
     
  29. Aurelius

    Aurelius Babbling Loonie
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    I think there's also scope, when the 'special' item is not meant to be incredibly rare, for a system that allows the top % range of damagers to get one of these items each (and I'd like something that lets partied people such as bards get a chance as a party, so the support characters will have at least some hope of getting something without relying on a handout from the fighting characters. It's great people share stuff, but a chance of them getting the item 'themselves' would be encouraging).

    These armour pieces, for example, look likely to be fairly widely available since word seems to suggest the 'golem invasions' are scheduled to run for some weeks - but yes, even a simple 'highest damager gets the special item' would be better than the problems of someone dashing in last second and grabbing it for minimal work.

    Still a bit rough on whoever does the 49% damage compared to the one who does 51% though ;)
     
  30. Decs0r

    Decs0r Guest

    i've been sat laughing at all the folks boat fighting them, seems to take them forever. where as a decently kitted out sampire can solo them in 10-12 mins with a little practice, the problem there being that if a mob of players comes along chances are no matter how much damage you have done you prolly wont get the drop, also i've noticed it becomes a lot harder as a sampire to stand toe to toe with them when u have a mob of players/pets trying to take it down, seems to trigger its special attacks a lot more often. all that said i now have all 4 sets completed but only because i chose to go there first thing after server up for a few hours each day when there was no-one else there, so i could solo in peace.
     
  31. Scoobs

    Scoobs Guest

    Decsor

    Can you divulge what your tactics are for your sampire? I tried with eoo, and perfection but couldnt leach enough life.
     
  32. Lings Bro

    Lings Bro Guest

    I would like to know the secret to close in combat myself. I have watched some people stand toe to toe for 10 minutes with these things. How is that possible? I have a 70 suit 44 leach life and 44 leach mana with 20 ssi on my Kryss and HCI jewelry --- and I die pretty quickly. No time for pots let alone aids.. what is the secret? I even honor them and they still want me dead!
     
  33. Scoobs

    Scoobs Guest

    Me thinks evade and an uber suit which I can't afford. Also max HLA?
     
  34. G.v.P

    G.v.P Stratics Legend
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    Probably requires feint. Lot of micromanagement though for 10-12 minutes straight.
     
  35. Ender77

    Ender77 Guest

    for a sampire, just make sure you have the right weapon; it's really not that different than any other high hp mob. in this case, high cold damage is a must. spamming consecrate sucks b/c you probably won't hit them without lightning strike. i keep seeing tamers with greater dragons (physical damage resistance is pretty high) and archers with normal bows waste their time on them; people just don't think about tactics. there is no "one size fits all" and there shouldn't be
     
  36. Klapauc

    Klapauc Sage
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    The secret for a sampire is doing high damage.
    Just did one on a char with bandie healing and ninjitsu and without necro or parry.
    Had to use feint most of the time, because his boulder attack immediatly destroyed all mirror images. Secret is 4 sec bandies, honor and eoo , and everything on hotkeys. So trade your kryss for a leafblade with 20 ssi, hml, hsl on it and try again. High cold damage helps, otherwise use consecrate.