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Brit boat - math is not the dev teams strong suit

Discussion in 'UHall' started by vvvaaannn, Jan 18, 2011.

  1. vvvaaannn

    vvvaaannn Guest

    I predict NO ONE will acquire the new boat by ONLY turning in ITEMS. I suspect the dev team never actually ran the numbers to see how LONG it would take to acquire the needed items to get the boat that way. Why dont they just say, "It is a gold sink" or alternatively "We priced the boat so high in UO gold terms that it will appear comparatively cheap when you put it up for sale at UOCODES.
    Here is the math for anyone interested:

    Fish: you can get about 5 fish/min. Fish are worth 1 pt, therefore you need 10 million fish. If you fished 24hr/day, at a rate of 5 fish/min it would take you 1, 388.88 days, or 3.8 years. Fishing 3 hr/day it would take 11,110 days or 30.4 years

    Crabs/lobsters: I can get about 300/hr. They are worth 10 per. Therefore you need 1 million. At a rate of 300/hr, if you fished 24 hr/day, it would take 138 days. At a more realistic rate of say 3 hrs per day, it would take 1104 days, or just over 3 years.

    About the only thing positive I can say about those numbers is that it it makes unattended macro shore fishing irrelevent because even that is futile.
     
  2. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
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    Geez you think?

    They did want to make it ridiculously hard to obtain.

    But lets face the other fact...... the boat itself is SOO big that if you still use the age old 2d client..... you can barely see the bow of your boat from the midship wheel.

    Thank goodness for the EC's superiority...

    So buy the boat in 2d and try to steer it around things you can't see... enjoy.



    Though you also failed in your own math..... if you have a guild all fishing 3 hours a day for crabs/lobster you would need at least 37 people in your guild fishing 3 hours a day at least to get the boat in a month.

    Or if you had 10 guild members... each fishing 3 hours a day for Crabs/lobsters they would take 111 days... to get the boat..... or nearly a third of a year.
     
  3. Madrid

    Madrid Slightly Crazed
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    The ship needs something else to make it worthwhile.
     
  4. Tanivar

    Tanivar Crazed Zealot
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    The Devs made saltpeter take a lot of time to gather.

    They made crafting cannon supplies take a lot of time.

    They made doing fishing quests take a long time to do.

    They made obtaining the fishing powerscrolls take a lot of time to get.

    Making the Brit Boat take a long time to get is just being consistant.
     
  5. popps

    popps Always Present
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    Bah, I am not much concerned of what it may take to get this new ship, if gold is the way at least it will be a gold sink...

    I am more concerned about it being not worth....

    The new ship other than being very large and a new thing does not have much for me to want it.

    It is very similar to an Orc ship as far as its defense/offence capacity goes, has no fishing bonus which makes it worse in that sense, and even though it has a larger capacity hold it is still limited to 125 items making it harder to handle such a larger capacity hold (containers have a 400 stones limit...).

    Besides, from what I understand it will follow the regular ships decay rules making it a headache should it go "poof"....

    As it stands now it is a no thanks for me, just not interested.......
     
  6. it seems they are very set on creating ways to delay gratification in this game.

    as a previous wow player, we would grind for months and months on doing very difficult 10-man dungeon raids in 'hard-mode' (which is a difficulty setting you can impose on your dungeon run) just to show we could. it tested our limits as players and a group. the reward was a flying dragon mount, while cool, it was just pixels to most of us, and a way to show our achievement.

    back to UO, as stated by the original poster, it's going to take people either months or tons of gold to get this item and there is very little function it serves other than a few perks that people can clearly play without. i think this is one of the biggest issues; however, i think the way it it's obtained is another issue.

    given the math, and the dullness of actually fishing up 1million lobsters yourself, who's actually going to try to attempt this crazy journey? i'm sure some will, but talk about a time or gold sink. not to mention, i think the time it takes to get 1 million lobsters would be far more time than it would to actually get 150m through other means. is this a way to make new players have something to look "forward" to?

    i personally believe that if they want to hold rewards over our head, such as this one, so clearly out of reach for most of the player base (due to gold or time constraint, not skill or dedication), that they ought to put some excitement into the process of obtaining it.

    for example, 120 fishers should have some sort of benefit here to get the ship easier as they have dedicated their playing time to solely raise their fishing. i'm sure the fishers are the only people who are going to be looking into getting this boat, (other than rich players with gold to burn), and they should be rewarded a bit further for sticking with their craft. i believe this would not only give more incentive to get high seas, but also bring more fishers into the game.

    i'm sure some will take this as a plea to buff the 120 fishers, but i don't see very much function in being 120 as it is. the fish pies? let's get serious. if the developers want to put us on this long journey of delayed gratification, i'm all for it, but make the process enjoyable, exciting, and adventurous. nobody, nobody, is going to enjoy this type of dull grind.

    but this is just my opinion on the matter.
     
  7. Viper09

    Viper09 Grand Poobah
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    Guess that's why gold will work then. Gold sink. I think it's neat though. An item that actually takes time and gold to get rather than a simple in-and-out and got it.
     
  8. Cerwin Vega

    Cerwin Vega Lore Keeper
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    If there is so much gold floating around they could always just stop making it so easy to get. Some years ago they doubled the amount monsters dropped... how do you expect people to not have more gold after doing that?
     
  9. i think the idea with monsters having double gold drop is for the new players who are actually fighting monsters and feel the need to even loot corpses (i know i stopped once i passed about 20m). gold is easy to obtain because people have so much of it that (because of luna + vendor search sites) the players with millions are willing to pay an arm and a leg for something they want/need right away, rather than waiting hours or days or months to get that said item.

    for example, when i returned to the game, i just found out what was the most expensive thing that people buy on vendors that i could easily obtain. for me, at that time, it was essence of order because it took little or no time to gather 10 essence of order. with very little effort they were sold general chat or on my vendor for 650k per 10. i had a few million with very little time played or risk involved while also not costing me anything to do this. granted, not everyone takes this approach, but the idea that there are players out there with billions of gold, people up their prices knowing that one of these players will buy their items. this is why gold sinks are created.

    if i remember correctly, there was a huge issue with duping (when is there not), just before AOS came out and all the sudden prices started to rise out of no where. small towers that were previously 100k started selling for 500k, log cabins began to sell for 1 million gold. the shard was full, housing was limited, and people were getting loaded out of no where. very soon after, they released the NPCs that will dye your hair neon for 500k, and everyone and their grandmother bought this stuff. i remember spending 20million back then just to dye all my characters beards and hair two-tone.

    the point is, in this current item driven game, gold exists in massive quantities and until they keep re-introducing new ways to make gold sinks (this boat, neon hair, etc.) and not just player opportunities, this will continue as it has for so long. this booster has been the start of the gold sink era, and really, it's about time.
     
  10. popps

    popps Always Present
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    Just noting here that reaching 120.0 Legendary Fishing does not help with magic pies other than giving a little more chance in pulling up rare fish which is not that hard, already.

    Without using a single bait I already have a stock of some 4,000 Yellowtail Barracuda steaks which could last me a long time to make magic fish pies. If they were used by players, that is, because hardly anyone uses magic pies, unfortunately.........

    Sadly, as it stands now, there are not many incentives to wanting to go through the troubles to become a Legendary Fisherman. The only known bonus (a little higher chance to fish rare fishes...) looks simply not enough to many for the time and effort it takes to get there.......

    So, adding more bonuses for Legendary fishermen would be a welcomed addition.
     
  11. Cerwin Vega

    Cerwin Vega Lore Keeper
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    wanna make a gold sink, make things that can only be gotten for a small amount of time... rare collectors are the ones that spend tons of gold on items.
     
  12. GalenKnighthawke

    GalenKnighthawke Grand Poobah
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    I think it's actually pretty clear that they wanted the primary means of getting the boat to be buying it with real money. I recall them implying this pretty strongly at that webcam conference thingie. UO is, after all, a business.

    We don't even know, at the moment, that the in-game price of the boat will remain the same when the Publish goes live.

    If it does? Well, even if it were half or quarter I wouldn't get one....Galen likes his Tokuno ship. I suspect I'm not the only one.

    I actually like the Britannian ship; I just have no need to get one.

    -Galen's player
     
  13. Unless it's changed I'm pretty sure you didn't need to stand right next to the wheel to use it and voice commands still work anyway.
     
  14. Cerwin Vega

    Cerwin Vega Lore Keeper
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    If they need to sell in game items to make real cash to keep this game online then we are in trouble, Im not sure thats what they are using the money for but you never know.
     
  15. Mapper

    Mapper Crazed Zealot
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    Aye you can stand on the bow, double click the wheel and be able to drive which is helpful. :)
     
  16. GalenKnighthawke

    GalenKnighthawke Grand Poobah
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    Proposition One: EA sells in-game UO goods for RL money.
    This proposition is obviously correct.

    Proposition Two: EA does so because it thinks it will make money by doing so.
    Again, undeniably true.

    Proposition Three, copied and pasted from the post I reply to: "they [EA] need to sell in game items to make real cash to keep this game online."
    Proposition Three does not necessarily follow from Propositions One and Two. And indeed there is little reason to believe this. EA has tried to make a little extra cash from UO, or probably other properties it has too, in all kinds of ways. My personal favorite was the Virtue Bears.

    If selling extra stuff, in-game or out-of-game, was a sign that EA "needed" this "to keep this game online," UO would have been dead a long while ago.

    As to where the money's going? Like all for-profit businesses, it's going the same places our subscription fees are going: To enrich its owners. This is Capitalism, as I recall.

    -Galen's player
     
  17. THP

    THP Stratics Legend
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    Quite simply guys and gals..if UO dont make EA real money then there will be no EMs and ultimately no UO....

    Please dont wish for stuff for free all the time or u may just wish the game goodbye.
     
  18. G.v.P

    G.v.P Stratics Legend
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    I can't imagine getting 300 crabs/lobsters in an hour. I can't make it past 10 minutes, heh.
     
  19. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
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    Meanwhile your standing at the bow and something runs into your back... you would never know it till it stopped your boat.
     
  20. Nyses

    Nyses Lore Keeper
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    Apparently, I am under the erroneous assumption that we all pay a monthly fee, per account, to "make EA real money".

    and, EM's are volunteers last I knew. It was the GM's that are supposedly paid to assist us with in game issues.
     
  21. Ox AO

    Ox AO Grand Poobah
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    I remember a few posts said the new expansion they would be done with it in a week and be finished with it and for that reason it wasn't worth the $15.


    No one can complain they are not listening.

    A million crabs and lobster? yeah, I can see doing this I am on my way at 1000 so far!
    oh gee
     
  22. cdavbar

    cdavbar Lore Master
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    Well I love the pies. PLUS THEY ARE INSURABLE!! So i always have a few of each on me. I love the HPR and Mana Pies on my sampire for doing medusa.


    I lukily found a vendor that sells em for 5k a pc. That is a decent price. You will never see me pay the 75k a pc that luna wants for them and that is the issue. There are a lot of overpriced vendors and no one in their right mind will pay that much. Until the lower price vendors are finally sought out interest will seem lower than in actually is.
     
  23. Martyna Zmuir

    Martyna Zmuir Crazed Zealot

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    EMs are contracted employees who definately make money from EA. With all the whining and crap they have to put up with, I hope they are paid well.
     
  24. cdavbar

    cdavbar Lore Master
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    Two Words: Enhanced Client.
     
  25. Martyna Zmuir

    Martyna Zmuir Crazed Zealot

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    Malag uses the EC... I harassed Malag into switching about a year ago now :p

    It was a slight jab at the CC :p
     
  26. Viper09

    Viper09 Grand Poobah
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    :thumbup1:
     
  27. Elric_Soban

    Elric_Soban Babbling Loonie
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    Oooorrrrr.......


    ..if you happen to be a luna scam--er..'vendor'.. you can just buy a boat with gold in 0.3 seconds. You know, one for each of your guildmates.

    It wouldn't be so bad if your donations to the library were universal and not specific to the NPC. That would make it alot easier/more realistic. The collections i think were meant as a gold/item/resource sink... but in order to get something you want, you have to try and aquire something u dont have (fish.. for instance).. instead of offloading that 600k boards in your house.

    EA has a gift for creating broken/******** systems.
     
  28. Nyses

    Nyses Lore Keeper
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    Ok, my bad. Makes sense.
     
  29. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
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    Considering I've not ever really had a vendor... I guess I'm Sc***ed..... Oh well. I agree that I really wish I could "Link" all my donations.... but such is life.

    Infact I almost wish I could get a ticket of reward points that I can "trade/sell/give"..... Like if i could take all my tamers and each one of them I know has over 150,000 points and combine all those together..... that would be nice.

    But since they are all different kinda stuck.
     
  30. UOKaiser

    UOKaiser Guest

    Lol the merchant playstyle is now a scammer playstyle . Thats news to me going to have to inform the merchant/supply guilds of this new development :)
     
  31. yars

    yars Lore Keeper
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    didnt noah build a bigger boat faster than this?
     
  32. LordDrago

    LordDrago Certifiable
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    Perhaps Noah was one of the luna venders/scammer. Or maybe he was a scripter. I know he had a lot more tames than he had either stable slots or control slots for.

    oh....and i will never...ever....ever get me one of the BABBs (Bad Ass Behometh Boats). Hell, I still haven't GM'd taming. :)
     
  33. Sevin0oo0

    Sevin0oo0 Guest

    Look at it POSITIVELY,
    They're Planning for the future, building Longevity into UO
    Sounds like the Devs were being pretty smart if you ask me - I'll be able to pass this on to the grand kids. A virtual Legacy!
     
  34. IGaretjaxI

    IGaretjaxI Adventurer

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    people...people...people...lets be smart here ...
    yes account bound so you cant buy it from someone else...BUT look at the point givers and think about this....you thinking crabs and lobsters...think outside the box...a book gives you 3 points...books are 15 gold...that means instead of going the gold route of 150mil your giving 50mil...
     
  35. Demonous

    Demonous Rares Fest Host | Ches Jul 2010
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    woot first one with the new ship on my shard ! and you couldn't pay me enough to use the enhanced client, 2D for the win !!! ill use my radar to see if a boat is about to hit me thank you very much !
     
  36. Calis M^N

    Calis M^N Guest

    i think i was the first on my shard and maybe the only one :)
     
  37. Radugast

    Radugast Seasoned Veteran
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    Brit Boat = 150,000,000
    Castle = 865,000

    Is something wrong here? Im thinking there needs to be adjustments made across all the boards including what these monsters hand out.
     
  38. Demonous

    Demonous Rares Fest Host | Ches Jul 2010
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    thats placing a castle... do you know of any open castle spot ? if so please share, people sell castles for like 400+ mil depending on the shard, cant even imagine what castles go for on atlantic
     
  39. Viper09

    Viper09 Grand Poobah
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    Pretty much the gist if it. But please, if you know of an open spot fitting a castle, please indeed share!
     
  40. Radugast

    Radugast Seasoned Veteran
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    I understand at this point in the game that finding the land for a castle is still difficult on some shards and the Land is what makes the lot worth something. Consider a small shard like LA and the Brit boat still costs them 150m but castles there go for like 50m. The economy isnt the same on all shards. At any rate when you compare apples to oranges, if Brit boats goes for 150m on any shard then castles should be going for around 1Billion, but that seems outrageous in the current economic state for alot of shards maybe not Atlantic though or the blessed Chesapeake. :p
     
  41. Elric_Soban

    Elric_Soban Babbling Loonie
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    lmao... spending 50 mil to buy over 3 million books to donate to an NPC in exchange for a boat..

    ..welcome to Ultima Online.
     
  42. Hera75

    Hera75 Adventurer
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    or just pick up all of Tim's books around luna 20 times a day!! :p
     
  43. Elden of Baja

    Elden of Baja Journeyman
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    That just SCREAMS Script.

    Assuming you could donate 1 book per second, and just rounding down to 3 mill

    3,000,000 / 60 / 60 / 24 = 347 days..... :pancakes:

    Hahahaha, If they were intending on making it a scripter trap...... Me thinks they needs Better Baits!!!!!!
     
  44. math check 34.72 days ...
    premise check: what is the manner of "donating"?
    Drag and drop each book?
    or like this?
    reloading/unloading a mule train might be an easy task for a script to follow.

    The bait could be sufficient ... :danceb:
     
  45. Lord Gareth

    Lord Gareth UO Content Editor | UO Chesapeake & Rares News
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    1. Find out what shard EM Team gives out the BEST AWESOME ITEMS!
    2. Attend the EM Events on that shard
    3. Get a decent EM item
    4. Sell to Rare Collector
    5. Make 50-100m
    6. Do another EM event
    7. Get a decent EM item
    8. Sell to Rare Collector
    9. Make 50-100m
    10. Buy New Ship

    or team up with a few people and work together
     
  46. IGaretjaxI

    IGaretjaxI Adventurer

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    At least 1 Billion Gold on Atlantic
     
  47. Elric_Soban

    Elric_Soban Babbling Loonie
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    1) That tells me that gold on Atlantic is meaningless and

    2) remind me to set up shop as a 'broker' on atlantic because it is logistically impossible to complete such a trade with UO's game mechanics. Unless your not using gold, but rather a bag full of obscenely valuable rares. Wow I could make alot of money offa people who have no choice but to trust me. lol.

    I dont care how rich you are, 1bil for anything = ********. fuxxored economy or not. Especially considering i dont imagine the original developers of the game ever intended ANYTHING to be EVER sold for more than a mil.
     
  48. Mairut

    Mairut Guest

    No, that just means that there is a bigger number of obscenely rich people playing on Atlantic. Which shouldn't come as a surprise, considering that it does have the highest population of any shard.

    Some people may use obscenely valuable rares, but I think most use transfer tokens for buying things that are 'up there' in price. They go for about 15-20m right now, slightly less if your spamming at the bank. No, I don't think anyone would use several packies full of tokens to buy a castle. No, I don't know what one would use to buy a castle.

    If someone was able to make over a billion in the game without using illegals means, and they decide they want to buy a castle with it, then more power to them.

    The original developers aren't around are they? Even though I halfway agree with the sentiment you seemed to be expressing and I wish that the later developers had been a little bit more insightful... I've never heard of any of them having had a degree in economics.

    :thumbsup: