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Can we fix faction rank? So I can have a shot at rank 10 without cheating?

Discussion in 'UHall' started by archite666, Apr 24, 2012.

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  1. archite666

    archite666 Guest

    Seriously this system is busted.

    Why is factions competitive amongst the same faction? Shouldn't I WANT my members to succeed? Why am I helping opposing members gank members of my own faction in hopes their rank will go down and mine will go up?

    I'm tired of trammel farmers coming on here and talking about how happy they are with the new system. I understand you want your arties to sell for more, that does not mean that factions is fine.

    Factions can be one of the coolest systems in this game and it is completely busted. Why would I be apart of a system that rewards players for stacking the odds either by gimp templates, cheating, or by being apart of a huge pvp guild.

    Don't I deserve a fair shot at rank 10?
     
  2. tjm6f4

    tjm6f4 Guest

    I'd agree that the system is busted pretty badly. It's causing me to move a PvPer to another shard in order to play the way I want to play this game.
    If they're so concerned with making faction artifacts hard to obtain, limit their use to Fel only.
     
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  3. Podolak

    Podolak Crazed Zealot
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    Maybe a compromise is in order.

    Have zero rank for faction arties in felucca but make it so you need to keep rank to wear them in trammel?
     
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  4. T'Challa

    T'Challa Certifiable
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    Soooo, the system was working before?

    No.
     
  5. Mervyn

    Mervyn Certifiable
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    several of these threads have already been locked, as if to say request denied.
     
  6. kelmo

    kelmo Old and in the way
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    Several of these threads have been locked due to the fact it gets old to have "several of these threads".
     
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  7. Mervyn

    Mervyn Certifiable
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    I have to say if i knew it would be this long, i probably would have made new suits, I've not been running with all engines fired for a while, I'll continue to coast for the foreseeable future, i think a lot of people are just logging on, seeing if it's been fixed, having a little play then drifting off.

    apologies for the random nautical theme
     
  8. kelmo

    kelmo Old and in the way
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    I do not think it is gonna go back to everyone being rank 10. I have no more info than anyone else... just a gut feeling. I do hope more is in store for factions. While PvP seems to be picking up on Siege it is unfortunant that so many others have seen their suits ruined by fixing the long standing point bug.
     
  9. Viper09

    Viper09 Grand Poobah
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    I wonder if it would have been better if they just wiped everyones points like they had initially planned?
     
  10. IanJames

    IanJames Certifiable
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    This would have been better. Everyone starts at the ground level and you earn your way back to the top.
     
  11. archite666

    archite666 Guest

    By earning you mean: Cheating, Getting points from guildies, and running gimp templates.

    I pvp all the time. I play many hours a day. I spend tons of gold and farm. So why do I not get access to the top tier equipment?
     
  12. garillo

    garillo Journeyman

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    How about just make faction arties the same as their PvM counterparts and lower the rank needed to wear them. They fall of when you walk into trammel ruleset, or they allow orange fighting in trammel ruleset. Problem fixed.
     
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  13. spoonyd

    spoonyd Seasoned Veteran
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    This is actually an AWESOME idea! Best one I've seen yet. :thumbup:
     
  14. Petra Fyde

    Petra Fyde Peerless Chatterbox
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    I wonder how difficult that would be to code. What might be easier could be to re-use the code that keeps reds out of tram and just disallow them outside of fel completely? I think most folk don't wear the same suit for pvm as for pvp anyway?
     
  15. spoonyd

    spoonyd Seasoned Veteran
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    Faction gear just makes PvM suits insane and cheap too. Just hope they do something soon since there's been a NUMBER of "Quit Threads" started recently.
     
  16. Petra Fyde

    Petra Fyde Peerless Chatterbox
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    I know, and I hate to see it. :(. I wish I could come up with a solution, but it seems everything I can think of is inadequate.
     
  17. GalenKnighthawke

    GalenKnighthawke Grand Poobah
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    I kept reading for years about how UO's supposed to be this vicious, savage competition, what a Trammie or Communist I was for asserting otherwise. Seems that's all gone by the wayside now that one of the results of that competition are harder to get. It's rather surreal. The terms of the discussion were driven by talk of these mythical "Trammies" who got Faction Artifacts then never set food in Felucca again. Now, suddenly, it's "Trammies" who support the change, and everything was fine before?

    -Galen's player
     
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  18. PJay

    PJay Seasoned Veteran
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    They need to revert to the old system imo minus the points there wasnt anything wrong with it other than neglect of devs by allowing things to get out of hand.

    Talking about neglect its still present the bug lists nice and full and they have tackled 1 EPIC fail!
     
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  19. Driven Insane

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    Alot of people feel this way about PvP in general which is the current problem I see with the way things are. The Oped artis are probably only obtainable by the types you mentioned.

    It would have been better to:
    1. Never introduce the Faction Artis in the first place.
    2. Remove them entirely.
    3. Change them to match their normal counterparts.
     
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  20. Mervyn

    Mervyn Certifiable
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    Then what would be the advantage and therefore attraction to being in faction? Everyone would just play as a griefer blue then surely.
     
  21. Driven Insane

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    Who really wants to be in a broken/boring system anyways?

    I for one have no interest in being in a Faction. And for the record, unlike alot of so called PvPers, I PvP for the excitement, not for items.
     
  22. archite666

    archite666 Guest

    Items are forever a part of pvp.

    Some people like having an endgame to farm for. PvP allows players an outlet to design the biggest, baddest suits possible. I enjoy it almost as much as the pvp itself.

    As long as there is an unacheivable level of power to be gained from factions, there will be complaints from people like me.

    I should have the right to get to the best suit I can make. Not being rank 10 in factions is such a handicap.

    You may not agree with me, people are leaving and factions is as dead as its ever been thanks to the recent patch.
     
  23. Driven Insane

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    I would argue that there were more people like myself who left when they were forced to join a boring/broken system in order to obtain the artis 3 years ago. In fact about the time I left there seemed to be 4-5 times as many people PvPing as there was right before they killed the Arti ATM. When I left there were still very large fights with 20+ players going on. Right when I came back I was lucky to see a fight that included more than 5 people. So what happened?

    And the reason Factions is dead as it's ever been (as you put it, although I would argue it was even deader before the Artis were added) is because it's a stupid, horribly boring system that took a huge carrot to even get people to join it. And my guess is that 99% of the people who joined factions had no interest in guarding towns, stealing sigils, etc and only joined for the OPed, basically free uber gear. So really what kind of a flawed system is that?

    As I've said before, I do feel for those of you who built suits based on the Artis. As usual it's just one big foul up followed by another from our wonderful Devs. And really the worst part is, as you said, the people who are still able to maintain rank 10 are probably not doing it legitimately.

    I am wondering however, how many people on the shards you guys play are still rank 10? I haven't seen a single person still running around in rank 10 gear. Admittedly it's not like I stop and check people's gear when I'm chasing them or vice versa, but I do try to look when given the chance.
     
  24. Picus of Napa

    Picus of Napa Slightly Crazed
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    On napa, that I have seen, none. One person in my guild managed to rank for a night but the next moring it was below the range....hard to understand that. At best it's been rank 4 but that never lasted either.
     
  25. NuSair

    NuSair Babbling Loonie
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    Because of the way UO is and it's gear and caps, having an item system like this where you plan and balance your suit around these top end pieces, just doesn't work.

    It would be different if these pieces of gear were just like their normal counter parts and then gave extra abilities or allowed exceeding of the caps. so, if you fell below the requirement, you could switch to the normal version and still have a 'complete' suit.
     
  26. archite666

    archite666 Guest

    Make it so people have to go to felucca to maintain rank, but not be insane killing machines.

    I say make faction monsters give points and take away the brackets that make the system competitive.

    The end result- People have to go to felucca every few days to farm points and just like farming silver, enemy factioneers may come looking for them and pvp may insue. In the roleplay aspect it makes sense that you would earn rank by killing enemy monsters.
     
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  27. Bob the Merchant

    Bob the Merchant Adventurer

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    I have an idea. Go kill people. If you cannot do that, you do not deserve to wear rank 10.
     
  28. Picus at the office

    Picus at the office Certifiable
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    Do you actually play factions and are able to maintain rank 10? Could you give everyone else some guidance on how you manage to achieve this when, it seems, no one else can do such?
     
  29. Bob the Merchant

    Bob the Merchant Adventurer

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    Yes, on the character I do faction with I can wear rank 10. How? I kill people. I hope that answers your question. Do I take advantage of the items in factions? No. Why? I prefer a challenge. Yes, the 10 DCI on the kasa would be great as would the extra 5 dex on the crimmy. However, its not me. I wish to make due like everyone else so those players I kill can't use my being in factions as an excuse. In essence, I ACTUALLY PREFER A FAIR FIGHT.

    Again, if you can't kill the *top dogs* in the opposing factions then welcome to rank 4. Deal with it. I certainly did way back when in the *earlier* days of factions before all this fancy crap. I was happy with my 3 temporary blessed items and faction war horse. I looked forward to advancing through the ranks by being a badass, and not by being a simpleton meatshield.

    Take what you wish from my comment Picus. I have a feeling that no matter how I reply you will have something up your sleeve as a reply.

    Also, an important thought. I honor thee is once again useful!


    Here, I think you need one of these to cheer you up. :mylittlepony:
     
  30. Risso

    Risso Babbling Loonie
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    Which shard do you play Bob?
     
  31. Bob the Merchant

    Bob the Merchant Adventurer

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    All of them. Aside from Mugen or actively on Siege.
     
  32. PJay

    PJay Seasoned Veteran
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    lol @ bob for thinking there is such a thing as a fair fight in uo pvp unless all your opponents have exactly the same template equip ping hardware etc etc etc its just not possible to run around fel and have a fair fight with the people u meet.

    As for the artifacts why not just set a target once u get to it u get rank 10 i.e.

    190 - 200 rank 10
    170 - 190 rank 9
    150 - 170 rank 8
    100 - 120 rank 7
    90 - 100 rank 6
    70 - 90 rank 5
    50 - 70 rank 4
    30 - 50 rank 3
    0 - 30 rank 2

    Keep the decay rate if you wish (personaly i dont care either way) Then at least if u loose 1 point a day your not going to loose rank instantly you can top up your points at reach a max so youve less time to keep rank 10. If your killed u can loose rank etc etc.

    I dont think i need to explain. To me its soo damn simple u have to keep your points for the items if you sigil cap or pvp its still possible to keep rank you dont effect other peoples ranks and you can also have pvp at MAX potential for the best fights.

    But the fact there has been nothing for months speaks volumes.
     
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  33. PJay

    PJay Seasoned Veteran
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    Ooooops i forgot to insert Client to the fair fight part :p
     
  34. Bob the Merchant

    Bob the Merchant Adventurer

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    A fair fight to me is 1vs1 or teams of equivalent numbers without interference. Perhaps you didn't get the memo, but arenas have been around for a while now and offer just that.

    Being open minded goes a loooooong way.
     
  35. PJay

    PJay Seasoned Veteran
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    same templates same ping same equipment same client? it all makes fair fighting arenas are for trammies who cant handle the real world.
     
  36. Mervyn

    Mervyn Certifiable
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    You'll be surprised how money talks, this game is all about the bottom line, if people don't like playing, we stop paying.
     
  37. Goldberg-Chessy

    Goldberg-Chessy Crazed Zealot
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    My 2 cents after going through this thread:

    1) Anyone complaining that they cannot play entire shards because of faction points is just plain gimp/nuts. Are you kidding me?
    Factions were not created for the sole purpose of making uber gear as easy to obtain as a pile of fishsteaks! Get real & gear up if you want to compete.

    2) Faction gear quite obviously should not be able to be worn anywhere other then Felucca for any reason!
    Faction gear should drop off when leaving Fel or the player wearing the gear should remain orange everywhere

    3) Bring back Order/Chaos! It was simple, fun as hell, and not broken. Are you frikking kidding me devs?

    Peace :)
     
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  38. Bob the Merchant

    Bob the Merchant Adventurer

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    Who mentioned playing the same template? Same ping? Who cares...I am perfectly fine with being at 100 ping vs. 20. Arena makes it fair because both sides can agree to the rules before hand and don't have to deal with outside interference once the fight begins.

    Real world? We are playing a sand box style video game.

    Trammies? I recall running around collecting reagents for hours with the hopes of making full use of power hour. Half of this time was spent running from reds, the other half was spent running around collecting more regs once the reds already got to me.

    If I were to guess, I imagine you didn't play factions until well after this bugged version began. So of course you have a lot to lose, you were one of those unfortunate many who took advantage of something you knew would eventually get fixed.
     
  39. Goldberg-Chessy

    Goldberg-Chessy Crazed Zealot
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    Dont sweat it Bob. I am sure his version of the "real world" includes running into his house lol.
    No offense bud but when most people talk about fair pvp they simply mean 1 vs 1. And arenas go a long ways towards achieving a fair 1 vs 1 agreed upon fight. They are a good thing and no less hardcore then your "real world" nonsense.
     
  40. archite666

    archite666 Guest

    I not only want to see Bob the builder of fairy tale's supposed rank 10 faction guy but I also want to see his max mage stat suit with no faction arties. He says its soo easy to get. When we all know its not.

    Your logic is that you should be able to kill rank 10 people to earn rank 10? Kinda hard when they cheat and have better gear thanks to this patch.

    Fix factions- Make it so people have a chance to get rank 10 without being uber pvper/cheater.

    Better pvpers should not be rewarded with even better gear!
     
  41. PJay

    PJay Seasoned Veteran
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    Dosnt bother me the arties its the Broken system which makes no sense why would you want to be in a system which punishes your guild mates for you getting kills? It also promotes solo play rather than team play.

    And arenas is safe pvp so basically totally nonsense how can you truly achieve your best when you know you will loose nothing?!?
     
  42. archite666

    archite666 Guest

    Indeed!

    This needs fixed!

    Fix factions!
     
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  43. PJay

    PJay Seasoned Veteran
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    Well! theres your answer to fixing whats the top issue right now!


    [​IMG]
    Attention Housebuilder
    Kai Schober
    26 Apr 2012 15:42:15 EST
    Greetings,
    If you have recently followed some ill advice on how to achieve an illegal house foundation in Ultima Online, now is your time to undo it. From tomorrow on, agents of the housing office will search for such foundations and sanction the owners.
    Thank you!

    Im lost for words at my place of work if you neglected your duties this much you wouldnt last months trust me weeks minimum.
     
  44. Bob the Merchant

    Bob the Merchant Adventurer

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    Sorry to burst your bubble PJay, but factions have been fixed. Deal with it, instead of tossing a fit. Thanks.
     
  45. Risso

    Risso Babbling Loonie
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    Who are you on Europa?
     
  46. Don't Tread on Me

    Don't Tread on Me Lore Keeper
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    Factions hasn't been fixed... there are bugged characters out there that have massive points in factions preventing others from legit reaching lvl 10. I notice points starting to go back up, so I will retract earlier statements on different threads that the system is completely broken with total kill points going down... but I think that until points get a little beefier... there should be no decay. Maybe give everyone a month or two (30-60 kill points of decay) without decay and then implement it after kill points totals are a little higher. I pvp nearly every day, usually get into a couple good fights with my guild each time I play, and sometimes I die but I almost always get more kills then not. But I'm still not even lvl 7 on my primary char.

    As for people who want to change the arty system... stop. It's a good system that allows casual players to field viable pvp suits. You can't imbue HCI and DCI on armor. You HAVE to have arties (regular or faction) to field a viable dexxer suit. And without arties, mages would be huring bad too. I don't know why everyone gets all up in arms about faction arties, they help pvp out!

    Lastly, I would fully support the system if the rankings were not against your own faction. I shouldn't have to compete with my allies to get rank. My rank should be based off the other 3 factions, not my own (or the whole field). If my guild wins, and we all gain 100 faction points in the fight.... that doesn't help us at all. All it does is raise the current chars an equal amount and drops all our other chars we're not currently playing on down in rank. That doesn't make sense.

    Happy fighting everyone!
     
  47. PJay

    PJay Seasoned Veteran
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    Im affraid its broken because fighting for rank with your own faction alone makes no sense whatsoever infact if anything the current setup means you may as well play a solo char.
     
  48. Driven Insane

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    It would be a good system if the Faction Artis were the same as the ones earned in Doom or Peerless.

    Adding the extra mods was a mistake. I first thought it was a good idea to let people only interested in PvP get their gear through the playstyle they preferred, but when the new Oped Arties came out it forced everyone into Factions, whether they wanted to or not. That is not a good system design and I still argue that more people quit over being forced into that broken/boring system (aka..Factions) and the exploiting that occured due to the addition of the Artis than the handful of people who are claiming that they're quiting now.

    I agree with all of the other fixes that Factions needs. But Faction Artis that require zero work and are more powerful than their normal counterparts was and still is a giant mistake. I PvP all the time, but unlike alot of my fellow PvPers I don't think that entitles me to advantages over anyone who chooses to spend their game time differently. Just because someone prefers to PvP or PvM doesn't mean one or the other deserves better items. They're both valid playstyles and both types of players are needed in a healthy game.
     
  49. garillo

    garillo Journeyman

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    People must keep in mind that a faction system that is working as intended would be rewarding people according to their skill. Therefore, if you play at a high level, you will attain a 8-10 rank on a competitive shard. If you are an average player, you will be rewarded accordingly.

    Despite what we were told growing up, not everyone is a winner. I know this can be hard to take in for some.

    The faction arties should offer the same mods/weights/intensities as their PvM counterparts. If anything else, the ranks may/should be toggled with so people have a better chance of attaining pieces. However, by no means, should the guy who sat on top of daemon temple in fel afk for 4 hours farming silver be able to turn around and go buy a crimmy when the PvM counterpart is out farming or dropping 16+mil on the piece.
     
  50. Bob the Merchant

    Bob the Merchant Adventurer

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    Well, blame your issue on all those who decided to unfairly *tilt* the system. Blame all those who left because they were sick and tired of dealing with a so called *priviledged* element in fel. You know, a gaggle of 10+ people ganging up on 1 or 2 because they could. Blame yourself for not taking heed of the faction changes before they came out.

    Let me be blunt, if you can't fight your way out of a paper sack then there is no reason you should be allowed to wear gear designed for ranking members. If your version of PVP was determined by killing an opponent with 3 members while you had 20, you should probably give up on the woe is me attitude.

    Now as for the OP, it sucks to see another player go. However, when a group of griefers gathers into 30 people with the sole intent of destroying everyone else's ability to play in small groups on all shards, something needs to give. In this case, a few poor souls have to actually work to get the silver spoon the game handed them.
     
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