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Character Art.

Discussion in 'UHall' started by In Flames, Jan 4, 2010.

  1. In Flames

    In Flames Journeyman
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    Awhile back I commissioned a piece of work for my UO character.

    I would like to share it with you all as I think it's brilliant. Also, there is no longer a pics forum so I brought it here.

    *I would like to note that I am obviously biased, as it is MY character, looking awesome.

    [​IMG]
     
  2. Zooithion

    Zooithion Crazed Zealot
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    Not bad at all.
     
  3. GarthGrey

    GarthGrey Crazed Zealot
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    Is it a chick with a beard, or a dude with a pony tail?
     
  4. Experimental

    Experimental Lore Keeper
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    I love the combat boots, just like irl, lol.
     
  5. Arcus

    Arcus Grand Poobah
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    Its your dad in a dress. lol
     
  6. GarthGrey

    GarthGrey Crazed Zealot
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    A perfect example of why I leave my signature the way it is....you are the COOLEST Arcus...
     
  7. Smokin

    Smokin Guest

    Its ok I guess, kind of amateur. Could have used some finger nails and a few other things. I am not the best to judge really because I hate new comic book art also and many other things that have changed to be cheap.
     
  8. sevan

    sevan Guest

    Looks great - is the artist still taking requests!??! :)
     
  9. In Flames

    In Flames Journeyman
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  10. In Flames

    In Flames Journeyman
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    btw.

    Male. 2 Tails.
     
  11. Restroom Cowboy

    Restroom Cowboy Visitor

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    Not bad...but lots of error. I see she is still young so im sure its just inexperience.
     
  12. Experimental

    Experimental Lore Keeper
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    You can do better perhaps?
     
  13. Sarsmi

    Sarsmi Grand Poobah
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    Lol, she's 20, hot, and talented. She > people who threaten to sue gaming websites when they get their feelings hurted. :lol:

    [​IMG]
     
  14. GarthGrey

    GarthGrey Crazed Zealot
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    Thank you, I seriously didn't know...looks good though. :)
     
  15. In Flames

    In Flames Journeyman
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    She's also involved in the Gaming Union Final Fantasy podcast (which is how I got in touch with her). She's definitely got her ducks in a row.
     
  16. Restroom Cowboy

    Restroom Cowboy Visitor

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    did i say she wasnt hot or talented? i thought i was just stating that there were mistakes...something you try not to do if commissioned to do a piece for a customer. is that or is that not the way artists work?

    i agree with the latter tho...those who threaten legal recourse in an online forum should be shot, then quartered, hung, drug through dog $#!+...then thrown over a fire. thank god OT is just perfect for people who do that however. (perfect for both parties that is)
     
  17. Sarsmi

    Sarsmi Grand Poobah
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    I don't think you can legitimately state that there are mistakes in any piece of work when you don't know the artist's intentions. But I'm sure you feel more comfortable speaking from a position of illusory authority.

    I think the piece came out well, and it made the customer happy which is the most important aspect in a service transaction.
     
  18. Restroom Cowboy

    Restroom Cowboy Visitor

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    Artists intentions? Please miss artist...tell me what you were thinking when you drew, penned, and colored this piece?

    Anyway...

    1) was it the artists intent that the hat and cloak faced the viewer instead of being centered on the character itself?
    2) was it the artists intent to not only miss out on the adams apple but also fugger up the neck and shading as well?
    3) was in the artists intent to avoid proper anatomy and perspective? (the positioning of the character is all wrong, including left foot to left knee...left hand...neck)
    4) was it the artists intent to *hide* the left pony tail down the shirt without showing a hint of it again in the crease of the collar?
    5) was it the artists intent to put the skirt OVER the robe?
    6) was it the artists intent to have the right sleeve up left down? Physics would dictate that a counter clockwise rotation would have the opposite of *intended* effect.
    7) was it the artists intent to give no illusion of a right foot?
    8 ) was it the artists intent for the char to focus away from the viewers main focal point? It would appear to me the left hand is a point of focus for the character...why arent their eyes matching this viewpoint too?

    but you are right...it doesnt mean crap if she is hot. :coco:

    edit...you know...if this were a piece i had done...it would have been redone. period
     
  19. Stupid Miner

    Stupid Miner Guest

    Quickly looking through her art profile, she seems to typically form the fingernails as lighter parts of the finger. (in addition to the obviously sharper edges)
    Look closely, at the ring finger in particular, it's noticeable.
     
  20. Restroom Cowboy

    Restroom Cowboy Visitor

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    That is a penned outline of a fingernail...there is no variation inside of the lines to dictate form aside from poorly done light and shading effects.
     
  21. Sarsmi

    Sarsmi Grand Poobah
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    1. Hats always face forward eh? Especially when you're casting complicated arm waving spells
    2. Not all guys have super visible adam's apples. And keep in mind there is nothing here that says this is a detailed, anatomically correct drawing. Considering the style it really does not seem to be.
    3. see #2
    4 It could easily be down the back of the shirt.
    5. And I thought you were nitpicking before. Half apron? Creative costuming licence?
    6. Layers snag on layers. When I push my sleeves up over another shirt it will make it stick.
    7. Should the artist draw everything that could possibly be there?
    8. I don't know the artists intentions and neither do you

    Not what I said, but unsurprising that you'd have issues with understanding. I just meant that she has a lot going for her, more than say someone who has to throw their weight around in a position of illusory authority and attempt to drag themselves into the picture in an useless attempt to make themselves feel better about their life. Or something like that.

    I'm sure you are dying to show off your artistic skills so I can be suitibly chastened and impressed. It was pretty obvious as soon as you launched into criticism that thats the way you wanted the thread to veer - in your direction. Sorry but I have no interest in your work. FYI, this thread isn't about you, so maybe stop trying to push what you do in it?
     
  22. In Flames

    In Flames Journeyman
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    Restroom. With your keen eye for errors, and your great commitment to realistic perfection, perhaps we can see some of your work?
     
  23. hawkeye_pike

    hawkeye_pike Babbling Loonie
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    It is a good drawing, but it looks like a manga, which doesn't suit UO at all.
     
  24. Experimental

    Experimental Lore Keeper
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    LOL
     
  25. Xenobia

    Xenobia Lore Keeper
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    I think "Anime" type characters all have fingers that look like that and I personally think it turned out very nice.
     
  26. Restroom Cowboy

    Restroom Cowboy Visitor

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    No...a hat should match the stance of its wearer however.
    Anatomy and perspective...not anatomically correct. You know...paying attention to how the body is *supposed* to work.
    No..it couldn't. Not unless you are M.C.Esher...
    As an artist you should be open to critique. A half apron? is that what you were going for there? Creative costume license? lol wut? :lol:
    The character is not in a stationary pose...they are in a pose following counter clockwise movement...cue the right pony tail for evidence of this...as well as left leg and hand.
    Not at all...did you consider my wording? There is nothing to give any visual cue that the right leg even exists. Where is it? Does he have a wooden leg with a kickstand?
    Neither does the artist...lol


    Did you bother reading my second comment in this thread. Also, this is not about me...its a critique of the young artists work. I always appreciated constructive criticism when it came to my own work...most artists use such to improve over time.

    No...this was never about me...but thanks for the numerous subtle personal attacks along the way. All I did was give my opinions...and in return you take it as a selfish attempt at my own agenda. Sorry...this was never about me.
     
  27. Restroom Cowboy

    Restroom Cowboy Visitor

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    You will have to take a raincheck on that...I have never been interested in photographing my work...and what I create I donate as functional art to various local charities. (tables...chairs...anything you could pretty much think of made from recycled hardwoods...most often mission)

    btw...i mentioned nothing of realistic perfection...i mentioned striving for artistic perfection...if you are happy with a polished turd...im happy for you. however a turd is still that...a turd
     
  28. Sarsmi

    Sarsmi Grand Poobah
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    "I always appreciated constructive criticism..."

    Really? Calling someone else's work **** is constructive?

    And that right there is pretty indicative of how you are. She isn't even here to stand up for her work or argue with you but you still attack her because you're arguing with someone else and losing. Pretty petty. Oh but I'm sure you make up for that character flaw with your numerous charitable donations. *snorts*
     
  29. Restroom Cowboy

    Restroom Cowboy Visitor

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    it would help if you didnt put words in my mouth. (I referred to the work like I did because it is IMO only a *rough* image...a draft if you would. In literature do you think a writer is satisfied with the first draft? Enough to put it on the shelf?)

    lol...way to flip a critique of a piece into a personal attack. i made an initial comment...you offered rebuttal...i give ample reasoning behind my initial statement to counter said rebuttal...then you call me a petty personal attacker. am I getting this right?

    take your BS back to OT, perhaps you can make a thread about being butthurt there...mmk? If the original poster didn't want to hear opinions regarding the piece...then he should not have posted it here in an online forum where opinions are commonplace.

    perhaps you preferred that I fib next time? :lol:

    EDIT: btw...sars...hope you realize I never would have gone beyond my original statement had you not opened your yap. :) ...just sayin...
     
  30. Sarsmi

    Sarsmi Grand Poobah
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    You say a turd is still a turd, and you don't see how this might be considered non constructive criticism?

    Please, the whole argument is extremely weak. The artist didn't post here, the customer did. So your negative comments aren't at all being directed in the vein of giving any sort of feedback. If you were interested in that kind of thing you would have just posted on their deviant art page.

    But no, you have some personal knowledge of art and you felt the need to use what little you know in order to attempt to belittle someone else.
     
  31. Sarsmi

    Sarsmi Grand Poobah
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    You realize we aren't just arguing why you are wrong? It's not about you not posting your opinion, it's about me showing the reasoning behind what you're doing. Self-interest and self-absorption.
     
  32. Sarsmi

    Sarsmi Grand Poobah
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    Yeah I realize you said something vaguely insulting, hoping someone would bite. There's no other reason for you to have made that comment. It wasn't an intent to troll though, you saw an opportunity to talk about something you have some knowledge of while reinforcing your own person feeling of superiority at someone else's expense. Not a troll, but an empty self esteem boost.
     
  33. Restroom Cowboy

    Restroom Cowboy Visitor

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    go cry somewhere else about what you don't like about my posts...then refer to your initial post...mmk?

    i didnt belittle anyone...I replied to your initial BS here...

    if you want to look at attempts to belittle...reference each one of your postings...you have thoroughly trashed a perfectly good thread. (for posterity, please note my replies...none of them were personal.)

    well done.
     
  34. Restroom Cowboy

    Restroom Cowboy Visitor

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    Uhhh no...I said she was young and (because she was young)...probably inexperienced. That was my honest critique...which I had to expand upon only because you continued to not only doubt my ability to critique...but my simple ability to debate your post.

    The result? You saw that as an opportunity to belittle me and my opinion.

    The result? I had to say more than I wanted to about a piece I wasnt happy with...which in turn made me out to be an ass to the OP...lol thanks.

    Its ok though, at least you get to look like a butthead too for turning this into a me vs. you thread.
     
  35. Fink

    Fink Guest

    Yeah, it's a simplification common to Manga and Anime. There's a hint of the fingertip's shape in the flattened (nail) side, depending on the orientation of the hands.. enough to suggest what you're looking at without going into painful detail. To regard it as a flaw is like complaining Mickey Mouse has only 4 digits per hand. It's just the economy inherent in the style. Also, the adam's apple and other overtly masculine features are minimised as part of the style.. he's a pretty boy, not a rugged manly man.

    The style isn't to my taste as I've seen an awful lot of it (and a lot of awful of it), but it's not a bad bit of work.
     
  36. Sarsmi

    Sarsmi Grand Poobah
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    Are you unable to take personal responsibility? You started it by putting your opinion out there and I replied. Technically if you had never said anything that happened to grate on me to begin with then none of this would have occurred. It's a ridiculous argument to blame the person who chooses to debate with you for being responsible for where the debate goes, because you can always drop out and end it. Stop debating, no more debate.
     
  37. Restroom Cowboy

    Restroom Cowboy Visitor

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    I suggest you read the rules of the forum if you do not like what I said. Personal responsibility in this case would dictate that posters follow those rules...in particular the one rule about the trolls and the other rule about personal attacks (i count *points at fingers individually one by one*...this many trolls...in sars posts). Where can you say the same about my posts? (well...I will defend my opinion...and if the result of said opinion makes another buttsore...so be it...but that hardly would make me the troll.)

    Again, I state again that all I did was share an opinion...which is something expected and encouraged if I am not mistaken here in Uhall. If you have an issue with that take it up with staff. Arguing with you any further over something so petty is pointless...

    Don't like my opinion? Block me so you cannot see my posts...however don't rip me personally for stating my opinion on a subject I am actually knowledgeable of. (which was ironically a surprise to you...hence the source of some of the bitterness...I understand.)

    Lastly, this has not been a debate unfortunately...debates involve point/counter point...not point/well your fat. It doesn't work...its that simple. I can end this when I want you say? Mmmk...doing so now...I think beyond people not liking my opinion, my reasoning for the replies is sound.
     
  38. the 4th man

    the 4th man Lore Master
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    I never liked the anime look,......there's too much of the same in it.
    Hair, eyes.......What is presented is good, though not awe inspiring.

    I've been drawing since the 60's, and know what "I" like. I won't sit here and pick apart someone elses work though. People like that are people I wouldn't be friends with, too flippin judgemental.

    I also give someone credit for having the guts to post a piece of art work, here, of all places. And, no, I won't post my art here, I know better.

    later
     
  39. Harlequin

    Harlequin Babbling Loonie
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    Well, I don't want to play in an anime version of UO either, but there's nothing wrong with using anime for sigs and such.

    I am one of the few posters that use an anime rendering for my avatar as well :D

    That's the actual gear I am wearing :
    [​IMG]



    As to the pic that In Flames commissioned, it's actually pretty good. Remember that the artist is a student. Forced perspective is very very hard to get right, such as the making the left hand appear nearer in the foreground. It's a very bold move as well.

    Hands are also very difficult to draw, and I have to say the hand is very well drawn except that the 2nd joint of the index finger is a bit too far up.



    A couple of constructive feedback for the artist -

    Because of the way the collar bone is drawn, it makes the neck look too long. If depicting the chest, use softer lines.

    In a squatting position, a person's knee cap should come up somewhere near the elbow. The left sleeve in your drawing makes it look as if the elbow is a little too far back behind the knee cap, which looks a bit odd. You can draw in the bracers for the left forearm to force the perspective of where the elbow is.
     
  40. Faeryl

    Faeryl Babbling Loonie
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    Restroom, you could have easily found a way to reword your opinions of the artwork so that it would read as being less offensive and more constructive.

    Frankly, as far as I'm concerned, while an artist should always strive towards improvement, everyone's style is different. So, just because you have an eye for more realistic and anatomically correct works, that doesn't mean this is crap art just because this artist's style is different from what you like. She's still young, and has plenty of time to learn from mistakes and improve on them.

    Also, the most important aspect of a comission (in my opinion) is that both artist and customer are satisfied with the artwork when it's finished. So what if there are a few mistakes if everyone's happy in the end? An artist is only human after all, and mistakes give an otherwise ordinary piece of art character and personality. Not everything needs to be textbook perfect, especially when it comes to art.

    Instead of spending my time picking apart a piece of art and focusing on it's issues, I'd prefer to be encouraging them: telling them what they did well, giving them suggestions on what areas they could possibly improve on, my overall impression of the piece.

    *EDIT*

    Not my art that was posted, but I just have to say that when drawing, hands are the bane of my existance...
     
  41. Sarsmi

    Sarsmi Grand Poobah
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    Lol, I haven't broken any rules. But if you feel that I have go ahead and notify the mods on whichever posts you feel are bad.

    BTW you seem to be unaware of what constitutes debate. I'm not arguing with you to troll, but because I disagree with you.

    I have yet to see that you have any significant amount of knowledge of perspective or drawing or anything art related. Though from your leading post I figured you had some background in art. It was actually the opposite of a "surprise" to me. You came off like a type A show off, who has to in some way let others know they have some knowledge of whatever is currently being discussed. Very obvious, and personally grating to me.
     
  42. Restroom Cowboy

    Restroom Cowboy Visitor

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    We have teachers and mentors in so many aspects of our lives...art is no different. These people encourage growth in many ways, including constructive criticism. Judgemental? No...not by a longshot. In this case however I will gladly play the bad guy...sars made me do it. :D
     
  43. Restroom Cowboy

    Restroom Cowboy Visitor

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    Trolling is against the rules silly, as are personal attacks...no matter how ********.

    Oh!!!!!!!!!!! So now you are debating. Gotcha.

    OK...I am still waiting for a counter point beyond the proverbial *your fat* styled comment tho...*scratches head*. I haven't seen a disagreement however, only a distaste for my opinion.

    Oh no? I thought that was apparent in the several examples I noted above. None of those needed any insight into the artists personal intentions...as they miffed on some pretty basic concepts.

    Show off? Not at all. I don't require nor desire my work to be shown with adorning signature...or plaques...ect. In fact, most of what I have done has no markings at all...as most are used as functional pieces. I GIVE my art away...I don't sell it. Those that get it have usually done something I considered exceptional within my community.

    If I am grating to you...again...put me on ignore. However do not expect me to stop putting down my opinion...ESPECIALLY in matters I DO know much about. I personally take offense to people who call themselves artists...sell their works for profit...yet don't put their heart into it. (yes...this shows with over 30 years of experience...)
     
  44. Ni-

    Ni- Guest

    RC, technically, the only people that could say the artist is 'wrong' is the artist and possibly the commissioner, if it doesn't match what they imagined. Art is extremely subjective. The artist may not have been going for realism. Anime often exaggerates size and angles for dramatic effect and South Park rarely uses any legs or arms on the kids and the heads are huge.

    One small exclamation: The boot not being in line with the knee could be because the ankle can pivot. The only defintive part of the boot is the toe, the laced up section doesn't actually have a definate outline, without one, the direction of the shin can only be guessed. It can also be because the artist purposefully chose that angle. I could also agree that the artist may not have meant that, in which case the artist would be wrong. However, unless the artist says they're wrong or right, we may never know.

    I understand that from your point-of-view or artistic tastes, it is wrong, and personally, I am fine with that.

    As for me, I used to be more of a fan of Anime(Ninja Scroll/Ghost in a Shell/Macross Plus), but not so much recently. I can definately see how it would be interesting to see a personally created character come to life.
     
  45. Sarsmi

    Sarsmi Grand Poobah
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    Really? Pretty sure a couple pages ago I said that only the artist knows what they intend, and the thing that matters most is if the customer is satisfied. You never bothered addressing those points. As others have pointed out, anime is pretty stylized and certain things will be exaggerated or minimized. Characters can be drawn in pretty strange positions, etc.

    Oh...can't sell it eh? Well not every artist can be a commercial success.

    Giving me advice? I know what my options are. I'd prefer to debate. Where did I say I expected you to stop putting out an opinion? What I'm really trying to do is show you how your opinion is wrong. It's really sort of the essence of debate. ;)
     
  46. Restroom Cowboy

    Restroom Cowboy Visitor

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    You are correct to a certain degree...however...there is a large variation between sweatshop speed paper cutouts frames and a commissioned single panel. Any artist worth their salt takes the time to do their craft right, without taking shortcuts.

    The position of the shin can be determined by the angle of the patellar surface of the femur...

    Its wrong because you say so? If you think something I say is without merit...feel free to point it out so it can be discussed...not avoided.

    I agree...if done right...
     
  47. Xenobia

    Xenobia Lore Keeper
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    Wow, this blew up while I was asleep. If someone does a piece of art (no matter what it is or if YOU like it) If the artist is happy and the recipient is happy then to hell with everyone else. I don't feel that saying it is a "turd" is constructive criticism. It's just plain being a jerk. If you have some advice, then give it or just leave it alone. It's nice that others donate what some (that person) sees as "works of art" to charity but is it charitable to come on here and have such harsh criticism for another's artwork? I don't think so.
     
  48. Gowron

    Gowron Guest

    Holy Crap! A nun with a gun!
     
  49. Restroom Cowboy

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    I didnt address what? the artists intent? does a critique need to involve the artists intent...or the work itself? Go look up the definition please for your own posterity.

    No issues selling my work either...but I just didn't find the same satisfaction in pimping out my work to the highest bidder. Commercial success? Considering my work is appreciated and admired daily...that is all the success I care for or need. I take great pride in what I do...and save only the best of the best to give away.

    debate is a logical argument based on factual information(point/counter point) between two opposing viewpoints...not (point/nuh uh because I said so). if you are going to call an apple an orange...at least be willing to give reason as to why you know it to be so. :coco:
     
  50. Restroom Cowboy

    Restroom Cowboy Visitor

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    again, look at what I was responding to...and you will have reason why it expanded in that direction it did...at that time. I didnt pull the comment because I stick by what I said. Was what I said mean? hell no...

    EX: would you buy a car made by a guy who knew he was getting fired? of course you wouldnt...but the problem is...if you didnt know he was getting fired...would you be able to make that choice? why would you think that art is any different?