1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.
  2. Greetings Guest!!

    In order to combat SPAM on the forums, all users are required to have a minimum of 2 posts before they can submit links in any post or thread.

    Dismiss Notice

Classic Shard - Don't Bother (To the Devs)

Discussion in 'UHall' started by Jesusislord, Dec 4, 2010.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Jesusislord

    Jesusislord Guest

    Don't release a classic shard. It won't be classic even if you cut and paste the code from 1997 into it. 5 players compared to the thousands that used to play just won't be the same.

    Don't waste your time. No one will activate an account to play it.

    All the people that roleplayed Orcs are playing games where they can be an Orc.
    All the Murderers are now playing games where there are other players to kill.
    All the Great Lords who spent their time hunting Dread Lords are playing other games also.
    All the thieves are now playing games where they can steal from other players.

    The only people left in UO are item hoarders and money farmers. And as we all know, 1k from a dragon is not enough; especially when it could be stolen by another player!

    No, we current subscribers are happy with chasing the Turkey's at Thanksgiving.. we are satisfied that we now have a turkey feather to place in our homes. And we cannot wait to see what the colour the gift boxes for Christmas will be this year! The candy canes we already have, but if they are from a new set of developers then I, personally, will have to open to open up my other account just so I can get them all!

    Just as the Shard of the Dead was doomed to die, so to shall the classic shard. Save on the energy bill, and don't bother opening up a classic shard.

    Don't respond expecting to get a response from me,
    Thanks.
     
  2. Chardonnay

    Chardonnay Visitor

    Joined:
    May 12, 2008
    Messages:
    2,876
    Likes Received:
    1
    QFT...
     
  3. Vlaude

    Vlaude Lore Keeper
    Stratics Veteran Alumni Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2003
    Messages:
    817
    Likes Received:
    57
    Would like a final answer on this from the devs sooner than the end of December so I can know whether or not to cancel my account. Thanks.
     
  4. Babble

    Babble Guest

    I agree that EA should not make one, though for different reasons
    :p
     
  5. Babble

    Babble Guest

    You can cancel now as houses stay up 90 days ...
    And I really doubt they will make one
     
  6. Vlaude

    Vlaude Lore Keeper
    Stratics Veteran Alumni Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2003
    Messages:
    817
    Likes Received:
    57
    I know.. I was trying to make a point genius.
     
  7. georox

    georox Sage
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 9, 2004
    Messages:
    623
    Likes Received:
    5
    You know actions speak louder than words, so cancel it.
     
  8. Vyal

    Vyal Guest

    I am with everyone else....
     
  9. Viper09

    Viper09 Grand Poobah
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    May 16, 2008
    Messages:
    6,680
    Likes Received:
    824
    :thumbup1:
     
  10. Vlaude

    Vlaude Lore Keeper
    Stratics Veteran Alumni Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2003
    Messages:
    817
    Likes Received:
    57
    Reading comprehension anyone?. I just said I will if they announce no classic shard will be released, not before. I'm sure I'm not alone.
     
  11. Sevin0oo0

    Sevin0oo0 Guest

    It's kinda taboo anyways, to go back to old ways/days, like when it required Devs to be worked 100 hrs a wk, or the Monday morning deadline (so they wouldn't have weekends free) - they aren't going there again, they have an ugly history.
     
  12. Babble

    Babble Guest

    I really doubt it is 'better' these days for developers.
    :p
     
  13. canary

    canary Guest

    If anything, given the skeleton crew, it is probably worse.
     
  14. It Lives

    It Lives Lore Master
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2008
    Messages:
    1,086
    Likes Received:
    138
    Well the OP missed a few opinions...

    I would be Glad to open an account for a classic shard as long as it was a permanent shard.

    I've been entertained for 10 years now, and any thing that will keep my time wrapped up has my vote.

    If you are no longer entertained move on quit crying.
     
  15. Vlaude

    Vlaude Lore Keeper
    Stratics Veteran Alumni Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2003
    Messages:
    817
    Likes Received:
    57
    Simple minds (aka idiots) are so easily entertained... Also, no one's crying.

    The math is quite simple here really. Add a classic shard, generate income from new accounts and returning players. Weigh that against the cost of creating and maintaining the shard and see if it adds up.

    Don't add one, lose customers and income.

    I'm pretty sure the Devs are smart enough to know UHall threads and posts aren't canon. There's a community interested in a classic shard, those opposed to it have no reason to be opposed other than wanting to have their opinion known.
     
  16. Luvmylace

    Luvmylace Sage
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    May 14, 2008
    Messages:
    575
    Likes Received:
    194
    Pretty sure they don't need your kind of input
     
  17. Vlaude

    Vlaude Lore Keeper
    Stratics Veteran Alumni Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2003
    Messages:
    817
    Likes Received:
    57
    Actually I think they ARE looking for input from their customers on this one. While the majority of the people in this thread seem to be opposed to the idea (as is the topic of the thread), there are also those of us who would support one.

    Am I the only one here who goes (or went) to a good university? This is all pretty basic stuff really...
     
  18. MrWilliams

    MrWilliams Visitor

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2010
    Messages:
    30
    Likes Received:
    0
    I've just cancelled the account I activated for the Shard of the Dead, however, open a classic shard and I'll reactivate all 4. I also know hundreds of others who will do the same.

    There seems to be a fear amongst individuals of what a classic shard will do to the game as a whole. Maybe they are worried people will leave the sparsely populated production shards when they discover the full potential of UO.
     
  19. Demonous

    Demonous Rares Fest Host | Ches Jul 2010
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 13, 2006
    Messages:
    2,218
    Likes Received:
    49
    ill keep playing uo either way, but i would definitely start playing a classic shard if they made one

    the people that role played orcs always annoyed me, no other mmo allows you to steal from other players, most old UO players that played between 97-99 play darkfall now, many of which have said they would return to uo if a classic shard was created.

    i think they should make it so u need to open your house door to refresh your house instead of just an active account to prevent people from going on vacation :)
     
  20. Martyna Zmuir

    Martyna Zmuir Crazed Zealot

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2007
    Messages:
    3,052
    Likes Received:
    632
    Le sigh.

    Until the classic sharders can decide just what the hell a "classic" shard is, all of these threads are moot.

    Until every free/private UO shard has been sent a cease and desist notice (and complied), all of these threads are moot.

    You can throw hyperbole around all you want, knowing "hundreds" of people who would come back to form "guaranteed" stable population... Please, these people have been burned several times by the UO show runner du jour. Nothing with UO is guaranteed, remember its all coming "Soon," "It's on the Radar," and "We're looking into it."

    It’s silly to assume the thousands required to make a classic shard a financial success would magically appear out of the woodwork and return to a 13 year old dinosaur just to get their unregulated PvP on.

    Unless Cal has come up with a foolproof way to cook the books and blow enough smoke up the EA suits collective asses, a classic shard ain’t happen’n.

    Now, must we rehash the same damn threads week after week?
     
  21. Naisikras

    Naisikras Guest

    Considering "word" from the devs is supposedly coming before year end, I think it is justified. And YOU don't need to rehash anything week after week, just skip the thread.

    I think that is the big thing for a lot of people. I know my brother and I are eagerly awaiting the "word" from the devs on a classic shard. So that is account activation +2 right there.

    I'm assuming a lot here as this is out of my area of expertise, but the amount of private servers around leads me to think that it can't be too huge of an investment for a large company to do this if lots of regular folk have a few running themselves.

    EA has shards running RIGHT NOW with very very little activity, again, this is just what I have seen running around as there are no numbers to take into consideration. Granted these shards aren't running on different rule sets.

    Just my two cents.
     
  22. UONoob08

    UONoob08 Guest

    You do realize that when you use "all" to make a point you have automatically invalidated your point?

    As a 13+ year vet I would play a permanent classic shard.

    But just how classic will it be?
    Classic professions only?
    Heat seeking arrows?
    10 screen ebolts?
     
  23. Vlaude

    Vlaude Lore Keeper
    Stratics Veteran Alumni Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2003
    Messages:
    817
    Likes Received:
    57
    Way to exaggerate just about everything :)
     
  24. Naisikras

    Naisikras Guest

    I feel safe in making the statement, that pretty much all classic shard supporters would be happy with ONE thing. Pre-AOS

    A few other things are debatable on how far to go back, but nearly EVERYONE that I have seen said they would be there with Pre-AoS.
     
  25. Martyna Zmuir

    Martyna Zmuir Crazed Zealot

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2007
    Messages:
    3,052
    Likes Received:
    632
    Sorry, but no. Go learn about business and then come back to the thread.

    A new alternate-ruleset shard would have to be financially viable for EA, Cal has already stated such. There would have to be expenses for hardware, development time, and if they were to do it right - advertising. Nothing happens without money and EA isn't exactly flush at the moment, don't go expecting the necessary injection of cash on a speculative venture right now.

    But, just think... If they did create a new shard, you too could enjoy the fabulous support Siege has received over its lifetime.
     
  26. Babble

    Babble Guest

    I doubt that, as all who play these days seem to be content with what EA offers.

    You know that almost all of the bigger freeshards are PRE AOS settings, so would EA really go in competition with shards you can play for free?
     
  27. Vlaude

    Vlaude Lore Keeper
    Stratics Veteran Alumni Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2003
    Messages:
    817
    Likes Received:
    57
    LOL. Don't make me laugh telling me I need education in any form when you are throwing out clear exaggerations and I pointed it out to you. The point is cost-benefit analysis, you can name as many things as you want that will cost them money. But as I stated earlier it all comes down to whether or not they are going to make profit. Those of us in favor are just here to say "I" to let them know we are here and ready to pay for it.
     
  28. Babble

    Babble Guest

    Actually I think is can Cal sell his superiors the success of a PRE AOS shard.
    Success in 10.000? additional accounts or more.
    Anything less probably is not worth the effort in their effort.

    Don't forget in a year they expect at least 1.000.000 new accounts so why bother with seperate development for a few ten thousand at best?
     
  29. puni666

    puni666 Slightly Crazed
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2008
    Messages:
    1,491
    Likes Received:
    66
    Yep, I agree.
     
  30. covert

    covert Journeyman
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2009
    Messages:
    157
    Likes Received:
    5
    It'd take forever to get a healthy balance of classic with the good features we've gained over the years, and by then it wont be classic. I think people underestimate the amount of things they'd be losing by going back to a T2A or pre-T2A shard...
     
  31. Zosimus

    Zosimus Grand Inquisitor
    Stratics Veteran Alumni Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2004
    Messages:
    4,370
    Likes Received:
    720
    This is on UO Wki....

    That alone should be convincing enough for a pre AoS shard. Most of the community knows the other options but most would prefer Mythic Bioware to run it. Besides fine tuning it it would never need updates.
     
  32. Uriah Heep

    Uriah Heep Crazed Zealot
    Stratics Veteran Alumni

    Joined:
    May 26, 2008
    Messages:
    3,834
    Likes Received:
    2,363
    *laughs heartily*

    I never understood why it is such a production to make a classic shard, pre aos. Devs in the past have said it can't be done, there's no coding, it costs too much, blah blah blah.

    yet a coupla high school kids, sitting around toking a J and listening to Staind, STP, and Disturbd can build a free shard to any spec you want...Where is the extreme cost in that? *laughs*
     
  33. Martyna Zmuir

    Martyna Zmuir Crazed Zealot

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2007
    Messages:
    3,052
    Likes Received:
    632
    Please, point out one exaggeration.

    I stated:

    Classic sharders can't come to a consensus as to what "classic" means. Pre-AoS? Pre-Trammel? Felucca with T2A, or without?

    EA would need to shut down free shards. Free shards which run the gamut of "classic" to wildly divergent. Why pay to play what you can get for free? No sucessful MMO sits back and ignores free servers, they litigate them into submission.

    The rest of what I said was reusing what others have said in a manner that shows it’s not so easy. People who claim to know "hundreds" of people who would return are the exaggerators. UO is a dinosaur in game years.

    So nice straw man tactic there, so sorry that it fails in reality.

    It’s also not an exaggeration that there would need to be thousands playing this shard for them to consider the expense of its creation acceptable. EA does want to make a profit, but that profit isn’t going to come out of the self-indulgent hyperbole the classic sharders spew with such aplomb.

    Simply because you want to believe in a classic shard isn't going to make it a financial reality.
     
  34. Babble

    Babble Guest


    The real fun stuff is that there is not one UO emulator but 2 different ones!

    Actually I think there was a third one too, but that one is discontinued.

    Don't forget there is also a german project Iris to get UO into 3d ...

    UO has a decent fanbase working on the game.
     
  35. Vlaude

    Vlaude Lore Keeper
    Stratics Veteran Alumni Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2003
    Messages:
    817
    Likes Received:
    57
    Staw man? LOL you're really pulling things out of your ass now. Who are you to say there aren't hundreds interested? And why would all of the free shards need to be shut down in order for EA to make one in the game? UO has existed for years along with the free shards silly.

    Also, why would it take "thousands" of new accounts to make it last? Aren't there already that many playing now? This isn't a whole new game here, it's just one additional shard.

    Please don't use exaggerations to prove your points. Let's stick to the facts. Cost-benefit analysis is rudimentary business, you don't need to be a business major to understand it. But you obviously aren't one lol.
     
  36. Thunderz

    Thunderz Certifiable
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Jun 3, 2008
    Messages:
    1,729
    Likes Received:
    64
    What gets me is why sooo many people wana go back in time to when life was "better". Grow up. I wish i was 18 again as it was amazing, best 4 years of my llife. But its never gona happen time goes on and so should your life.

    We all wana live our best times again, those stuck in the past need to create a new future of fun not dwindle in the good old past.

    We cant go back so make the future your priority not your damn past, and make the most of it as 10^1000000000 is how long you will be dead, gone forgotten, compaired to 10^0.5 you have left to live and enjoy it....

    Thunderz
     
  37. Zosimus

    Zosimus Grand Inquisitor
    Stratics Veteran Alumni Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2004
    Messages:
    4,370
    Likes Received:
    720
    My life is rocking better now then I was 18. I was in college playing football ,parties, bills paid for by mom, and getting an education. Im well off now and can still do the same thing except play football and depend on my mom ( which I dont have to :p) to pay for my stuff. Everything I own is paid in full. Life is good :)

    UO was good once. Pre Aos proved that. After Pre Aos we have proof something went wrong. So going back isnt a bad thing unless you live with regrets. I have none. Well I do have one. Was the time when a kid told me there was no santa and I should of punched him for ruining xmas for me at that time.
     
  38. Uriah Heep

    Uriah Heep Crazed Zealot
    Stratics Veteran Alumni

    Joined:
    May 26, 2008
    Messages:
    3,834
    Likes Received:
    2,363
    WHAT?!?!?!?!

    There's no SANTA?!?!?!?!!?

    Waaahhhhhhhh!!
     
  39. Vyal

    Vyal Guest

    There is pre-made software out there that can support 5x the number of players Atlantic has. How hard would it be to host one if they already have the server to do it? Literally no work would need to be done aside from flicking a switch.
     
  40. Zosimus

    Zosimus Grand Inquisitor
    Stratics Veteran Alumni Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2004
    Messages:
    4,370
    Likes Received:
    720
    QFT!! Vyal post FTW!!!


    I'll repost a quote yet again from another gaming company. If the blind wants to believe what they want to believe what EA and Mythic Bioware says I'll quit preaching. :p

     
  41. Aragon100

    Aragon100 Guest

    Well said and i agree that the ones that is against a classic shard is just scared that their game will be less populated.

    And i can understand their fear cause UO before AoS was a way better game then the one that is available for subscription today.
     
  42. Viper09

    Viper09 Grand Poobah
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    May 16, 2008
    Messages:
    6,680
    Likes Received:
    824
    It is not as simple as some of you think. First question is with the creation of a pre-aos shard what is the actual period of pre-aos wanted? Will a ton of people really come back or is it just total unsupported bs? Sure, a handful of people said they will, but enough to even bother? Those who do come back, will they even stay or will it turn into another low population shard within half a year? Will this shard even get the attention it needs after release or become messed up and ignored like siege? That would drive away a lot of players.

    And even if all those questions get positive answers, will it be profitable, will players want to pay for it as opposed to the free shards, and biggest question, can they convince EA to let them do it? Something tells me EA is truly the biggest obsticle if a classic shard is to ever be creatd. Because in the end it's a business, and the people at the top (EA) are the ones who need to approve it and be truly convinced it will turn a profit and keep it.
     
  43. UONoob08

    UONoob08 Guest

    So you disagree with this?

    Uriah Heep wrote:" yet a coupla high school kids, sitting around toking a J and listening to Staind, STP, and Disturbd can build a free shard to any spec you want...Where is the extreme cost in that? *laughs*"

    I made an emulator once probably 7-9 years ago on a $200 dollar computer.
    What 256mb ram 400mhz cpu? or some where there about.

    IF EA did this it wouldn't cost them much. If the load is high then obviously there's money to expand.

    Do yourself a favor and go see what it takes to make an Emu.
    You could download the software and have it running in half a day, easy!

    Roughly 770 new/returning subscriptions would give them 10k a month.

    Obviously they wouldn't have a bandwith problem which could be the only draw back for a home Emu, but again if the demand is high then the money is there for upgrades.
     
  44. Martyna Zmuir

    Martyna Zmuir Crazed Zealot

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2007
    Messages:
    3,052
    Likes Received:
    632


    Yes, straw man. It refers to your argument technique where you don’t focus on facts. You’re trying to divert attention away from the actual problems of creating a classic shard instead of acknowledging and addressing them.

    And again, you fail to recognize the issue with free shards. There are dozens of them out there. Several of them purport to be a ‘classic’ server. Why would anyone PAY EA to play on an official one? You do realize that this classic shard would be feature locked at whatever point ‘classic’ is eventually distilled to. Meaning there will be NO progression of any kind past those features. No new content aside from what EMs or the metafiction might do, less your ‘classic’ just becomes a Siege retread.




    One additional shard that has to be specially created. Draconi has already stated that pre-AoS code doesn’t exist. So yes, this would be a completely new game, since they would have to remake “classic” from the ground up, it’s not as easy as flipping a switch. Nor is it as easy as a few HS code geeks hashing out a custom server in their leisure time.

    It’s not as though this would be a cheap project or even a quick one since we have empirical evidence of the caliber of the current Team’s coding (dis)ability.

    Yet, say by some miracle, a classic shard gets EA’s blessing. We’ll conservatively estimate it takes them six months to get to a ‘ready’ state. So, say 500 people rush to reopen their accounts or create new ones. 500 x $12.99 = $6,495 gross. Then, let’s say those 500 people stay around for 6 months, $38,970 gross. Just for the fun of it, let’s say 1000 NEW people subscribe for six months, that’s $77,940 gross. Now, do you really think that’s going to cover the cost of six months of development time/labor, cost of the actual server hardware, bandwidth, electricity, etc?

    Then do you actually believe the regular shards wouldn’t suffer during the time it takes them to create the classic shard? In reality, they will need to hire additional programmers so the rest of the players don’t revolt. THIS is what brings us to the shard requiring thousands of players so that gross doesn’t instantly get eaten up by costs. The cost has to be significantly less than the return so EA sees a profit.

    So, since the Cal – the actual producer – has already stated that the number of paying subscribers would need to be in the range of thousands, how exactly are the statements of a few random board posters (saying there are hundreds of players just waiting to hand them money) sufficient to justify the cost? Lip service doesn’t pay the bills.



    Please don’t keep using the same tired crap and b.s. lines to try to blow smoke up everyone’s butts when you can’t support your case. If cost-benefit is so easy for you, why do you fail at it so hard?
     
  45. Babble

    Babble Guest

    EA is definitely the biggest problem for the 'classic' shard.
    Neither UO nor DAOC got their classic shard as far as i know and it was announced for DAOC a year ago or so
     
  46. Martyna Zmuir

    Martyna Zmuir Crazed Zealot

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2007
    Messages:
    3,052
    Likes Received:
    632


    Right....

    Because a few code geeks hashing out a custom server in their leisure time based on readily available emulator software is equivalent to Mythic setting up a classic server. Not.

    The simple errors in logic there are:
    1) These servers aren’t known for their robust stability
    2) Aren’t as “classic” as many want them to be
    3) Mythic wouldn’t USE emulator software in the first place, assuming they are professionals.
    If the classic sharders are willing to accept an emulator hackjob, why haven’t one (or more) of you done it yet?
     
  47. Vlaude

    Vlaude Lore Keeper
    Stratics Veteran Alumni Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2003
    Messages:
    817
    Likes Received:
    57
    Provide sources for your quotes please.
     
  48. Martyna Zmuir

    Martyna Zmuir Crazed Zealot

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2007
    Messages:
    3,052
    Likes Received:
    632
    That would be quote, singular.

    I will wade trough Cal's post history when I get back from dinner, as that is slightly more entertaining. However, something is telling me that it was said during the Town Hall Question & Response section, so go watch that.
     
  49. Vlaude

    Vlaude Lore Keeper
    Stratics Veteran Alumni Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2003
    Messages:
    817
    Likes Received:
    57
    Draconi too.
     
  50. Martyna Zmuir

    Martyna Zmuir Crazed Zealot

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2007
    Messages:
    3,052
    Likes Received:
    632
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.