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Co-ownership (please let this be last time we need to flog this dead horse!)

Discussion in 'UHall' started by MissEcho, Jul 12, 2012.

  1. MissEcho

    MissEcho Slightly Crazed
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    Please increase the amount of co-owners a house may have. The current level of 10 doesn't even allow for a player with two accounts to have all characters co-owned, and we all know there are a LOT of us out here with more than two accounts.

    Most of us with multi accounts are not going to have one stack of wood/ingots, powders or reagent in each house they own, they will have one stack in one house and all characters they have need to access those resources, similar for items, forges, etc etc. The reason most of us have multi accounts is for 1) like to build houses - into deco, dif functions etc, 2) need more characters 3) need the lockdowns.

    If I wish to give 50 people a key to my real life house, I can, it is my discretion as to who I allow, and what function or permissions they have. Why should a computer game be any different?

    I currently have 3 of my 5 accounts open and am playing on two different shards, I am down to having to 'friend' my own characters to my houses so they can access the resources etc. This now means I CANNOT actually have any game 'friends' granted access as it compromises the security of all my containers. This limits game play.

    Not allowing additional co-owners is actually more of a security problem than allowing them.

    So: Please find the line of code that says 10 and change it to max, or at least equal to the amount of 'friends' a house can have.

    # it makes no impact on any other player accept the house owner.
    # if you personally do not want more than ten fine, don't add more, but it should be up to the PLAYER how many co-owners they wish to allow on their houses, not a hard coded perfunctory number.
    # it has no impact on the game play etc, there is no difference to the game if a house has 100 friends or 100 co-owners, who would or should care if I had 50 people co-owned to my house. NO ONE.
    # if the aim of the game is player satisfaction this is one niggling bug bear that has been around for a long time and needs to be changed as it serves no purpose than to aggravate.

    The change so characters could be co-owned to more than one house was a vast improvement, now let's take the next step and make this change.
     
    Apetul, Ryna, Mapper and 3 others like this.
  2. CryptisRavenous

    CryptisRavenous Adventurer
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  3. Ludes

    Ludes Babbling Loonie
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    I agree.
     
  4. christy1221

    christy1221 Slightly Crazed
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    Nyses Lore Keeper
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  6. Snakeman

    Snakeman UO Forum Moderator
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    Samaira Lore Master
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  8. Barok

    Barok Grand Inquisitor
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    It would be nice if we could co-own an entire account at once. Rather than having to co-own or friend each character one at a time.
     
    Ryna and christy1221 like this.
  9. Lightning 1

    Lightning 1 Adventurer
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    There is another reason this is about to become very important. The creation of Consulate buildings, such as those in the new town of Oasis on Chesapeake. It will become a potential problem when 6 different towns each hold an office in the building, and only one town leader from each town can access the containers and office doors. It is wonderful that only those who locked it down or secured it can open it, but the limit of one town leader per consulate office having access is a real dampener on the concept of embassies.

    AS a programer I understand the data base will grow significantly, whether players use the extra co-owner 'slots' or not, but all things considered I don't see any other reason it might cause a problem. I admit I don't have access to the code, of course, to rewrite it.

    CO-OWNING OR FRIENDING AN ENTIRE ACCOUNT AT ONCE, requires a lookup of unique player ID numbers at the time of granting access. However, what if a player loses an account. How well would you remember all of their character names to delete. It might not be as easy to automatically remove all the associated unique character names attached to an account when you delete one.

    The list of accessible friends or co-owners, if you added all the character account names at once automatically, would be huge in no time. The weakness is this. The data base was not designed to run compares on an overall account name, but rather on individual character names. I don't believe there is in game tracking of overall account identifiers. If I am correct your plan to append all characters from an account just by adding one of them, would require a serious rewrite and bring a mass of incompatibility. -- You can see this individual character ID number in general chat, appended to every player who speaks. This is how we in fact identify town residents qualifying for town resident benefits in Oasis. The number cannot be hacked. The entirety of a characters existence carries this number. If it doesn't match our written list, then it's a player pretending to be someone who is eligible for town benefits.
     
  10. Multani

    Multani Journeyman
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    Like many things in life, this went over my head. What?
     
  11. Lightning 1

    Lightning 1 Adventurer
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    Heh. The typo may be the problem. Replace "layers" with "players". House owners can grant friend or co-owner status to a player character standing at the house. Why not automatically make all of that players other characters also have access automatically, instead of having to bring every single one to the house and grant them access individually? I suggest the game did not incorporate an overall account number that is invisibly carried by each character. The overall account numbers are for logging in, and not to track who has which skill and what not. Why would you need an overall account number attached to individual characters? Well now, that lack of extra coding begun 15 years ago, in each individual characters 'descriptive data record' comes back to make this 'one click to add access to all characters on your friends account' very difficult to do.

    As for the consulates, the new town Oasis in Chesapeake has a nifty plan presented by the town leadership of Nidaros. Oasis is, among other things, a town where other towns can meet to make plans, such as who will coordinate repelling an orc invasion or whatever. The participating towns each have a consulate building, or at least an office in one. They can meet in one safe convenient place, check messages, discuss plans and treaties, etc. But a building having only 10 co-owners means each township with a consulate office, can have only one character with access to the office door and the containers within it. What if a war starts and that character is simply away from UO? Their town's consulate is out of service, so to speak.
     
  12. Schatzi

    Schatzi Seasoned Veteran
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  13. Martyna Zmuir

    Martyna Zmuir Crazed Zealot

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    /Signed

    KR used to allow you to co-own an unlimited amount of people to your homes. It was nice. Then we got the EC and that ability vanished. People (mainly MalagAste) threw a fit, and the list was increased to 10.

    10 isn't anywhere NEAR enough if you have a happily functioning community or people with multiple accounts. There are zero logical reasons from a coding or data storage standpoint to limit the number of co-owners.
     
  14. Tina Small

    Tina Small Stratics Legend
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    This might backfire if the account that you want to co-own is not yours. You might just co-own someone you trust, without realizing they have characters on their account that you know nothing about and that they could then use to rob you blind.

    I think banning a character automatically bans all characters on the same account, which will sometimes reveal someone trying to pull a fast one on you when suddenly a character that you knew was friended/co-owned for some bizarre reason can't go in your house. But I don't think that it would be prudent to go the other way and automatically give an entire account co-owner access to your house at one time.
     
  15. MissEcho

    MissEcho Slightly Crazed
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    Aye well I am not after co-owning an entire account at once (nice idea but not necessary), just the ability to add one char at a time is fine, the overall number needs to be increased. Won't add anything to server or data base load as instead of being on the 'friend' list the chars will be on the 'co-own' list. Swings and Round-a-bouts as far as that is concerned.
     
  16. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
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    I have made this my main goal to get from the DEV's since they finally Granted me the ability to be Co-owned to more than one freaking house... FAT lot of good it did since each house is LIMITED to only 10 Co-owners... kinda lame!

    I've begged pleaded and begged some more.... and still NOTHING.... I've been told time and time again that this or that DEV is going to "look into it".... but still I'm limited and I'm still waiting.

    The biggest problem for me with being left nothing but a friend in my own frelling house is that I can't SECURE things.... so then I am stuck locking things down..... which means I come home with a bag full of crap I need to unravel and my Imbuer not only can't unlock the stinking bag from the floor but that also means he can't take anything out of it! If I could SECURE the bag he could at least take the stuff out and put it in another bag and go unravel..... but NOOOOO I have to get on another char secure the bag...... or run 2 clients lagging up my computer like mad so I can transfer the bag from my hunter to my imbuer.... what a crock of Smeg... when if I were co-owned I'd have NO Problems.

    I have 56+ Characters I can't possibly choose only 10 to co-own to all of my homes. I have 1 character that is actually co-owned or owner of all of my homes... this stinks..... I should NOT be limited to being a friend in my own frelling house.

    It's been a pet peeve of mine for MANY years.

    That and I can't have friends. NO ONE can be a friend of my houses if I want to actually have access to my own frelling stuff...... otherwise I have to SEVERELY limit myself as the owner... letting only choice few of my own characters even get full access to my own stinking house.... that's not right. NOT right at all.. I've explained this many times over and heard dozens of times how it's being looked into but I have YET to see any action..... and Martyna is correct we HAD this ability once before with KR.... Gods would I love to have that back.
     
  17. MissEcho

    MissEcho Slightly Crazed
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    hehe yeah KR was beautiful for that, and the world didn't crash and the tides didn't swamp the earth and there was peace and bliss all over the lands. All my 5 accounts were very happy, my life was simple, all chars co-owned to all my houses. I didn't have to remember what character was a friend, what character was a co-owner, and to what house.

    Alas, I took a 2 yr break and gave my castles and luna plots (who had my nice co-owned characters) to friends. So now am back to pre/post KR housing rules and it sucks the big one. I was asking for this back in 2005 or before, time gets away from you..... it has always been my biggest frustration with UO. Such a simple thing to fix too.
     
  18. Lady Storm

    Lady Storm Crazed Zealot
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    I too agree with this one...... its hell to remember who the co on a house when you got 46 or 47 to keep track of and only 10 co's per makes it adoozie to figure who is on first! Forget what on second and idontknow on third....

    Oh and I would love if they would fix the bloody ladders! I can have a co put up one of the kinds on the menu but when i need the castle one .............pfft u need the owner! I'm the co owner geesh I should be able to put up a silly ladder
     
  19. BeaIank

    BeaIank Babbling Loonie
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    Signed as well.
    I recently opened a second account, and this is being a pain.
     
  20. Merus

    Merus Babbling Loonie
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    Signed!

    Devs I hope you are reading this... A thread where virtually everyone agrees. With 7 active account I can't even come close to co-owner status for all my characters.
     
  21. Tina Small

    Tina Small Stratics Legend
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    It would also be great if they could bring back the ability you had with KR to use the house sign gump to change a character's access level without having to target the actual character in question for each change.

    Below is an example of what that screen used to look like if you wanted to change the security level for the characters that were on the "general access" list.

    KR Housing Menu Access Modify Status Screen.JPG

    You could do the same thing with the characters on the friends list and those on the co-owners list.

    KR Housing Menu Access Modify Status Screen Friends.JPG

    KR Housing Menu Modify Status Screen Co Owners.JPG
     
  22. MissEcho

    MissEcho Slightly Crazed
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    OH my goodness, memories, that was so nice ........... why did it go backwards *sobs*
     
  23. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
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    Thanks Tina.... I totally miss that ability. :( Please give it back. At least let me make all my characters co-owner again... give me 100 co-owner slots PLEASE. And just to super clarify I like being able to BE co-owned to 10 houses that is great! Might up that to 15 but 10 is awesome....... but my HOUSE needs 100 co-owner slots now to go with the 10 co-owned house slots my characters can have.
     
  24. Aurelius

    Aurelius Babbling Loonie
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    Agreed. Would be helpful to many, cause no problems for anyone, and should be simple coding to do.
     
  25. Tina Small

    Tina Small Stratics Legend
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    I also dug up these comparison pictures that I made in August 2009, during the Stygian Abyss beta, as we were getting ready to lose access to KR. They show the various house sign gumps in the "legacy" client (we now call it the "classic" client), the KR client, and the SA client (which we now call the "enhanced" client).

    House-Sign-Comparison-1.jpg
    House-Sign-Comparison-2.jpg
    House-Sign-Comparison-3.jpg
     

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  26. RaDian FlGith

    RaDian FlGith Babbling Loonie
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    Speaking as a programmer, I doubt the database would be any larger than it is today. Given how KR changed the access list, I am willing to be that a person's access is added to a list, and then a simple flag indicates what access they have.
     
  27. Airhaun

    Airhaun Seasoned Veteran
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    *Signed & Underlined*

    That's all I had to read and I'm in. This limitation makes things very difficult. Devs please increase the number or give us a practical explaination of why the limit is 10?

    Maybe there is some strange conflict in coding with the orbital tranficturators and the flex compasitor?

    :eyes:

    Hey... ya never know...
     
  28. Flutter

    Flutter Always Present
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  29. Felonious Monk

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  30. MissEcho

    MissEcho Slightly Crazed
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    Agreed, not to mention all you are doing is swapping a character from one list to another, and only the 'list' of access rights changes. Ie Friends to Co-owners. You are not actually adding anything to the data base just switching columns!
     
  31. Aibal

    Aibal Slightly Crazed
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    Signed. The total max of 10 is absofreakinglutely ridiculous.