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Considering canceling subscription due to Poor Server Performance

Discussion in 'UHall' started by rwek, Feb 8, 2009.

  1. rwek

    rwek Guest

    There are a dozen posts and screen shots for a couple months now about this issue.


    It happens to SOME players across most shards. 2 hops from the server I get 240 ms ping with 10-100% packet loss randomly through out the day.


    Whats funny is, why it effects some players and not all I dont know. Too many times have I come back from the lag to see a storm of damage above my head and a ghost waiting.


    Cheats, not enough content, old graphics etc. I seemed to work through and keep playing. But I won't pay for 1999 internet performance.

    If they don't fix this problem before my month is up, ill cancel my 2 accounts and just write it off as unplayable.

    There is no reason to get 120 skills and great geat etc. When every 15 or 20 minutes you 1-5 second lag spikes.


    I have run UO trace and trace routed/polled the server during these lag spikes. It's always the same hop. Folks have screenshot it, but no developers comment.

    What else can I do.
     
  2. Blesh

    Blesh Sage
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    come play WoW, our customer service doesn't blow *ss and even when we do lag the client makes up for it.
     
  3. canary

    canary Guest

    Bye.
     
  4. Shh!

    Shh! Lore Master
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    Too bad the game lacks any depth whatsoever.

    To the OP, stop paying if you can't play. Hate to see anyone leave but it's kind of silly to donate to EA. They aren't a charity.
     
  5. Viper09

    Viper09 Grand Poobah
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    Did you try contacting your own internet service provider? Because it may not even be EA's fault.

    Did you even try contacting EA?

    Sure their customer support can be horrible at times. But sitting around expecting them to do something doesn't do anything. Especially when you are only part of less than a handful of people with this issue.
     
  6. Nexus

    Nexus Site Support
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    That's a good point, if i was on EA's end it should be effecting pretty much EVERYONE. If it's only a portion then you folks really really need to look at your ISP or at networks between Your PC and EA.
     
  7. rwek

    rwek Guest

    This link might work..

    http://vboards.stratics.com/showthread.php?t=123006



    if not, look for the post that says "Whats up with the Lag today"


    Here you will find screen shots, from people all over the country, to servers all over the country, and always its a hop with issues 1 or 2 prior to reaching the server. Where people experience 250 ms ping with packet loss.



    I am on Atlantic and I ping 11-12 ms when no lag. When I feel lag, i tab out, hit the UO trace traceroute/poll buttons quickly and I never see lag through any of my providers hops. They are always 10ms or less. But when it reach the one just near the end, it shows 240-260 ms with packet loss
     
  8. Snakeman

    Snakeman UO Forum Moderator
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    Lag for me has not changed since then. I think possible only 3 days in the past month I have Not had any lag/lag spikes at all in the last couple of hops. Even did a 100+ ping test on another prog ( http://vboards.stratics.com/showthread.php?t=123459&highlight=[uo+herald]&page=3 ) showing spikes in hop 9 from 128 to 322 (usually it was a combo of hops 8 & 9 with spikes) but I guess it wasn't enough. I know what you mean, its sad to play when things just appear next to you when the last you saw it it was a half a screen away. This am I was in the Dojo working with my dog, one sec be right next to me & the next second he is clear across the room, never seeing him move.
     
  9. Basara

    Basara UO Forum Moderator
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    Yes, and as always, I point out that 2 hops above the game server is typically an Internet backbone provider's gateway router to EA, that EA has little control over, except to say "Hey, guys; can you fix this?" It's making my customers cranky." We're finally finding out how badly this is getting FUBARed by certain specific companies, as Snakeman's tests have shown.

    It might have EA in the name, since it's usually a router dedicated to connecting EA to their system, but it's not EA's machine, as a "Whois" command will show, if the router is actually configured to respond to that command.

    For example, in my trace to Lake Austin from KY (only last three hops shown).
    Host Name IP Address Hop Ping Time Ping Avg % Loss Pkts r/s Ping best/worst
    sl-st20-sj-13-0-0.sprintlink.net 144.232.9.58 10 124ms
    * Unknown Host * 144.223.242.14 11 98ms
    * Unknown Host * 159.153.192.238 12 125ms
    central-aw1.owo.com 159.153.209.6 13 103ms

    The two 159.153.x.x machines (#12 & 13) are EA's.

    sl-st20-sj-13-0-0.sprintlink.net (144.232.9.58) at #10 is obviously Sprintlink

    The problem location most people have is their equivalent of this one.

    #11 - 144.223.242.14

    While hardly conclusive, the fact that it starts 144.2XX.x.x, and is located between the San Jose Sprintlink machine, and EA's machines, would make it almost certain to be either Sprintlink's, or a third party providing the connection between EA or Sprintlink.

    The equivalent link in all Snakeman's traces show his trace goes through alter.net, and that it is an alter.net machine dedicated to EA, but belonging to alter.net - the real mystery is why it's seeming to want to jump from CA BACK to the East Coast server's gateway, then back to California, when nearly every other provider's routes to the West Coast shards do not take detours through Ashburn & Reston, VA.

    BTW, Snakeman, the problem with your ability to poll with UOTrace comes from your security software - I had it on several machines with three different firewall programs (worked on a 4th machine) until I found out how to fix it.

    Look in your firewall settings, and enable the various types of IMCP, one or two at a time, until polling works. If you have to, you can always write down the settings, change them to run a poll, then set them back after your are done.
     
  10. It's probably not EA. It is more than likely a hop in your connection somewhere.

    I would take the matter up with my ISP if I were you instead of quitting UO.
     
  11. Cadderly

    Cadderly Journeyman
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    Would still be nice to have customer service help. Called and emailed customer service and the responce, "not us not our problem." Called my local provider and got the responce, "Not us and not our problem." What next?
     
  12. Petrify

    Petrify Lore Master
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    Can I have your stuff?
     
  13. Ask to speak to a supervisor at your local ISP. If that meets with no success, try a new ISP.

    Every ISP delivers the same thing...internet access.

    There is only 1 UO.
     
  14. HD2300

    HD2300 Certifiable
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    If I choose to pay for a cheap connection which is equivalent to satellite during the day and evening and switches to T1 after midnight to cut costs, it is going to be laggy during the day and suddenly at midnight everything is fine. Similarly if I choose a cheaper dial up connection, it is going to be laggy in comparision to a T3 connection. Point is, I choose the connection.
     
  15. Lady Aalia

    Lady Aalia Atlantic's Finest
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    Oh we had something like that once...

    After running Uo trace we figured out it want UO but our ISP.

    Hubby is a network guy at work so he knows about the stuff... he ran a program (dont remember the name but had an eye icon) and it showed the route the lines take and where there is server stations etc..

    Sure enough one in Texas was messed up. Owned by our ISQ. So we called em up told them..the guy didnt even know they had anything in Texas...

    So we gave him the telephone number of the place (aye that program showed even that) anf guess what a day later it was fixed :p


    Guess those ISP guys dont know everything, mainly because they are a bunch of peeps trained to read of a walkthrough they are suppose to do with customers they call and if they cant fix it with the walkthrough they forward the call to tec support

    and i play from germany (on Atl) and most of the time i have little to very little lag :)
     
  16. Lady Michelle

    Lady Michelle Sprite Full SP
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    If your modem is over a year old have it replace. every year. I take mine in and have it replaced with a new one. Make sure nothing is loose like cables and wires. Go to your network connection under support click repair. Keep your modem clean by vacuuming the dust out of it. just remember dust is your enemy :D
     
  17. AesSedai

    AesSedai Guest

    - Yes, that seems to be the case for ~9X of 100, imho ;)

    All the same, best of luck to the OP :)
     
  18. Harlequin

    Harlequin Babbling Loonie
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    I was tempted to say that, but you beat me heh

    To the OP: If it only affects some people, it's not a server issue. Esp if people on the same screen/subserver moves along normally while your client "hangs" for several seconds.

    The hanging part is normally due to dropped packets. These needs to be resent to the server, it's how error handling for TCPIP is done. Depending how much data needs to be resent, your client will freeze during that time. If it cannot recover from the error, your client will disconnect or even crash.

    Since you have isolated the problematic router to the 2nd last hop that is giving 10%-100% packet loss, you should be familiar with tracert. It's likely that it belongs to EA, check the hostname and post the results.

    I had a similar situation several years ago. The technical desk kept telling me to contact my ISP even when I show them the problem starts with routers belonging to EA. It's pretty frustrating sometimes when you try to explain technical stuff to technical support people that do not deal with networking and do not know how/when to escalate.

    My ISP has no authority to their routers, they can only raise a weak case to EA's ISP.

    Oth, EA is in the best position to raise a case to their own ISP, afterall, EA is their direct customer. But to do that, they need a good sampling to tell their ISP "Hey look, these are the reports from my customers globally and the problem seems to be this hop here, can you investigate".

    So just post your tracert results in the other thread so the customer rep can forward it to the right people. Calling technical support might not help since they may not be network trained.
     
  19. Having worked as a tech support supervisor before, this is SPOT ON.

    Most of the people I managed knew little about PCs, much less networking. The industry I worked in relied at least as heavily on accurate, fast, data streams as UO does...with probably 5-10 times the subscribers.

    When you get someone on tier 1 tech support, either with EA or your ISP, often you are talking to someone that knows very, very, little about anything. They are working from a knowledgebase. I know, I wrote the KB for my old company :)

    Our techs simply entered keywords into a search, and followed the instructions they got from the KB articles.

    Once you eliminate the obvious (dusty modem, etc...no offense to whoever posted that), you need to escalate your issue to someone above the tier 1 tech.

    If the issue is with EA's ISP, then EA needs to take care of YOU as a customer. Don't give up. EA is a big company, and there are many people between you and someone that actually has a clue. You CAN get to that person if you handle it the right way.

    - Don't come across as angry until you get that person.
    - Never become abusive.
    - Present your case using only FACTS. Never throw your opinions into it.

    If it is your ISP, the same thing can be said...but remember, you have choices when it comes to ISPs.

    I hope you get this straightened out, because I would hate to know that you got lost in the system.
     
  20. Harlequin

    Harlequin Babbling Loonie
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    *Puts on best Dory voice* Are you me?

    Lol, we seem to have uncanningly similar career paths, even regarding the KB :D

    Also, sometimes the tier 1 support person may not know when to escalate the problem or who to escalate to. And it may be compounded by the fact that alot of people are afraid to check with his/her supervisor for fear of reprisal.

    So if it doesn't seem to be getting anywhere, very nicely explain to the person it's fine and ask if he can help forward you to his senior/supervisor/manager. Assure him/her that it's not a complaint, you are just looking for a person that may be in a better position to escalate the case to the right people. Add that you'd be grateful for any person who he thinks can help you.

    Do not diss or insult the tier 1 support person, it's not his/her fault. The poor guy/gal is not a network person nor is paid like one.

    He's (I'll just use "he" from here on for simplicity) hired as a first level support person to more or less act like a screen so that the 2nd level support engineers aren't swarmed with calls. Insulting the person or insinuating that he is inept will give him cause to not help you (or at least not go all the way).

    Hey it's human nature, if someone asked you to call an ambulance but was abusive (hey, a*hole, stop staring like an idiot and call an ambulance), you may still call the ambulance, but you probably won't proceed to offer any further assistance.

    So always remain calm and rational.
     
  21. Exactly.

    Tier 1 techs are there to weed out calls like "I cannot connect to the server!! Your product SUCKS!"

    "Sir, do me a favor and double click your Internet Explorer icon for me, and tell me what happens."

    "I get this thing that says Page Cannot be Displayed"

    "What type of internet connection do you use sir?"

    "Dial up."

    "Are you talking to me on the same line you use to connect to the internet with sir?"

    "Yes."

    "......"


    "Oh....Well, thanks!"

    Click



    ---------------------------------------------------------------


    They are not there to handle REAL issues...just morons.

    :D
     
  22. Snakeman

    Snakeman UO Forum Moderator
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    Thing is, I have no extra firewall software other then what XP & XP Pro comes with:sad4:. Only thing I can think of, that is different, is the software in the DSL modems themselves. One is a Verizon Westell & the other private DSL provider is a SpeedStream. Has to be what firewall software Verizon loads up in their modems is my only guess.

    Yes the Ma (East) to Ca (West) back to Va (East Again) back to Ca (West again) is odd.
     
  23. Fortyniner

    Fortyniner Guest

    I was having this problem with the Atlantic server, and I probably have line of sight to it from where I live.

    After enough people complained, there was a note here from EA that they were aware of the problem and a couple of days later it went away. The problem wasn't theirs but they had to lean on one of the companies that provide their feed.
     
  24. rwek

    rwek Guest

    I think thats what some of these posts are missing.


    Ok it's not EA, but how can it be my provider when its 10+ hops away, and nothing to do with their network?


    No I'm not a network engineer. But you mean to tell me, if I Ping to china and get a bad ping at a hop somewhere in Asia its my ISPs fault? Similar situation here.



    Yes, if EA is having issues with customers getting to their server through a major backbone their techies should be looking into it IMO. It's in their best interest. If it was just me with this problem, then I'd say who cares.
     
  25. Farsight

    Farsight Crazed Zealot
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    Yes, it is in their best interest to look into the problems.

    But that isn't the reply I wanted to give.

    I'll start with the example:
    When the lag problems happened a few months ago, I would lag horribly, yet if I used a friend's house, I had no lag at all. The difference was that they used a different ISP, and thus the information sent to and from Catskills server went through a completely different route. One of our ISPs sent all the data through sprintlink (I believe) and the other sent all the data through alter.net. It was one of those two paths which then had the bad jump near the end of the line (can't remember which), and thus, as far as I was concerned, it was a problem with my ISP. I didn't switch though, it's less trouble to cancel UO than to switch ISPs. My personal solution was playing a different shard until the problem passed.

    So no, the trouble is likely NOT with your ISP, but changing ISPs could help.
     
  26. Duskofdead

    Duskofdead Sage
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    When I had internet issues with UO in the past (I played back in 97-01) and then pretty much anytime I had lag or connectivity issues with any online game, I got PRECISELY this response from both ends. This seems to be the standard response to make people go away and only the real bugs will end up getting any actual attention.

    It's amazing though, I called the game, they said it's your ISP. I called my ISP, they said it's the programs you're using or your phone line. I call the phone line, they say it's your ISP. I call my ISP, and they say it's the game. That is par for course with any sort of technical support issue sadly.... "not our fault", and when all else fails, make a vague accusation about how there must be some ambiguous semi-illicit virus program or download on your machine that's causing it that we have no way of knowing about.

    If you aren't tech savvy yourself, trying to get any ACTUAL direct help from any service provider on the internet (whether you're talking about an ISP telephone line, or a program's in-game support or technical support line) should immediately give you like 38 bubbles in the virtue of Self Control.

    I think sometimes when people run off with the Greek of "well you just run a trace and then a whois command and then blah blah blah tweak your router settings so that the 2nd port is connecting directly to the blah blah blah" they fail to realize this isn't 2nd nature... it's not even 10th nature...to the majority of people just trying to log into a game on the internet. ;)
     
  27. When EA has problems with a major backbone, like they did a little while back...it affects pretty much everyone in a region...not individual users.

    And yes, your ISP is the only entity that can determine what routes their connection uses.

    Blaming EA for bad hops in your connection is like blaming the weather man because it's raining. It is not within EA's sphere of influence to control every switch and router inside and outside the United States that leads to their servers.

    Like I said before...if you are having connection problems, and your ISP won't help you, then you should change ISPs. Unless you are under some kind of long term contract, ISPs are a dime-a-dozen, and they all more or less do the same thing.

    Bottom line is if you are having connectivity issues, and no one else is (or a relative very few) then odds are high it is not a server issue, which is pretty much all EA is responsible for. That leaves you with your connection. That's the tree you want to be barking up, if want to solve the issue.
     
  28. Nexus

    Nexus Site Support
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    Living down the road from a sever doesn't mean much.....you still have to go through your ISP's routers, and hops to get on the backbone which will route you who knows were to get to that server down the street. It depends as much on how your ISP's network is set up as actual location.