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Dear Dev's - Tamers Request for Zoo Changes

Discussion in 'UHall' started by Guest, Mar 2, 2008.

  1. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Dear Dev's,

    I hope someone can please take the time to read this and respond at least letting us know we are being heard.

    Over and over again when anyone has tried to spike interest in the zoo collection on any shard we hear comments like "why bother", "it decays to fast" ,"it needs new animals" and the list goes on.

    I play on Oceania a very small shard and trying to raise interest in the Zoo is becoming a challenge because people are focused on the negative and the extreme hard work it will take to then watch it decay or to have it be a never ending chore.

    I believe it is worth donating and would love to see the zoo full but I do agree the decay rate could be turned down a notch or two and there is a call and a need for more animals to be added to the donation list or it just gets boring and sites like the unicorns get over run with tamers.

    So are there any planned changes for the zoo or tamers in general?

    Thank you for your replies in advance.
     
  2. Sabbath

    Sabbath Guest

    *Casts vote for lengthening the decay rate*
     
  3. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Count me in, I've gotten some pals together and donated a ton of animals, only to see all the points plus a few extra thousand gone by the next day. The decay rate was ok when the shards were packed but now we have so many less tamers donating, my poor Napa doesn't even have the first tier....


    Rey~
     
  4. Frarc

    Frarc Stratics Legend
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    The decay could be a little to high . its 3% every 24 hours.

    But the points for 1 pet is too low for certain animals. It takes alot more time to tame one or 2 pets and donate then compared to chop wood and donate that too the Museum. We also have have to recall back and forward to get the animals. When a packhorse is full of wood you can donate alot of points at ones.


    We also need more variety in animals to donate.
     
  5. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Greater dragons also need to be added in and give you a hell of alot of points when you turn them in.
    Somethings got to be done!!
     
  6. Anne

    Anne Journeyman
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    I agree with the changes mentioned above.

    Very very much agree
     
  7. Guest

    Guest Guest

    The zoo collection thing definitely needs an overhaul.

    Things like:-

    - All tameables should be included, categorised so the list isn't huge [​IMG]

    - Points changed because it takes a lot longer to tame a dragon, than to chop logs! Some pets are also much more dangerous to tame, and points should reflect that.

    I agree that the decay needs to be looked at too, it does feel pointless boosting our efforts then seeing them decay [​IMG]

    Wenchy
     
  8. Guest

    Guest Guest

    I agree with ye 100%.
     
  9. A few weeks past we had a tamer event on our shard. After 2 hours of hard work and donations (no gold) from 25 tamers, we added over 200,000 tier 1 points. By the time the weekly shard totals had been accumulated and posted.. we had lost 160,000 of those points... netting us only a little over 40K in additional points over the previous week. This decay rate is heartbreaking.

    LORD Yalp of Zento, CTDM
     
  10. Uthar Pendragon

    Uthar Pendragon Seasoned Veteran
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    Just to throw this in the mix of ideas being put out there.

    What if after a certain amount of time above a Tier, it becomes permanent. For example Catskills has the longest living crane out of all the shards. Under this idea that crane would never die. I am not sugguesting that the tiers change once a level has reached non decay status. Just that hard work and effort has an end goal. I would make this long enough to be achievable but not to short to be overly easy.

    I also like the idea that has been put forth before, that once the Silver Steed level is achieved, a spawn of Silver Steeds is triggered. As long as this level is maintained the steed would spawn. If it drops below this level then the steed would stop spawning until the level is again achieved. (I do not know who originally put forth this idea but I love the idea)

    Both these give tamers a reason to continue to donate and a sense of achievement.
     
  11. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Let me first reply to this by saying your quite right and I play on a heavily populated shard. I play on GL and the highest I've seen our zoo is at level 6.... that was ages ago usually it hovers around level 4 that's with the occasional tamers like myself working more than occasionally.....

    Another complaint sort of I have is the sheer number of points to the system... without using gold to get what you what (something I really don't have in aboundance and since the changes to the BoS I don't think I ever will have as that used to be my only way to generate any real income was to use that with my tamer while training my pet on bloods{I never recall out while hunting cause in that 2 min you do someone will jack your hunting spot and that's and end to your training or a waste of 30 min finding a new spot to hunt or from Illsh it takes 20 min just to get back to your spot}So now I really don't know what I'm going to do to generate any gold for insurance{My guess is I'll have to buy it online from those who still cheat to get it dispite the nerf of the bag) but I digress..... anyway.... I have been casually taming 5 unicorns every few days since the advent of the Zoo..... I have only just recently actually gotten enough points to be able to select the LOWEST of low rewards..... By the time I actually tame enough unicorns to get what I would like..... UO will be either having it's 20th anniversary or the game will have passed into oblivian and my point gathering will have been in vain. I once figured up how many solid hours of taming it would take to generate the kind of points I wished to see... and it would take me roughly a full week of taming that's taming at least 12 hours a day.... And turning in a unicorn once ever 4 min... Average time given sometimes it takes under a min and sometimes you have to run about for 10 min looking for one to spawn and othertimes you have to "take turns" with someone else or go find another spot... anyway I averaged it out at 4 min a unicorn. And that is to make only 350,000 points.. (again this is where comma's in game would be nice).... anyway that's my beef.
     
  12. Guest

    Guest Guest

    I too think the decay rate needs to be adjusted again, but it would help even more if more animals were added to the donation box and if the amount for the animals were adjusted higher. I know that Catskills is actively trying to get people in the zoo again, but it is a struggle to maintain even for us on the large shards so I can't imagine what the lesser populated shards are going thru.
     
  13. Guest

    Guest Guest

    I've always been a fan of scaling the collection decay by the highest point total across all the shards so that exactly one shard is at the top tier. Yes, it's a little unfair to the smaller shards, but even so it would let them get further than they can now.
     
  14. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Thank you to all the tamers showing support for this and offering up more suggestions. I just hope that the Dev's can take some time to comment and perhaps implement some of the changes we suggest.

    And I hope more tamers comment and offer suggestions as the more input we get the easier it will be for the Dev's to understand and see what we want done.
     
  15. Jahira-Tor

    Jahira-Tor Lore Master
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    *Adds my vote to the slowing down or making tiers permanent*
     
  16. Guest

    Guest Guest

    I agree too!

    Even thought both my tamers are low-skilled still, I try to get gains from things I can donate...even the Timber Wolves, hehe. It's fun, and adds a little something more to the training experience. I enjoy taming anyway, so the Zoo Contributions is something really nice to participate in.

    I'd love to see the Decay Rate changed. Seems as though when we do get lucky enough to acquire some of the Creatures, they are gone quickly. I'd like to see the animals hang around a bit longer so that others visiting the Zoo have a chance to see them.
     
  17. Guest

    Guest Guest

    I would love to see a whole lot of creatures added to the donation list.

    It was also suggested on Oceania forums by Fink that we perhaps add a herding option meaning you could herd animals up to the zoo and heard them onto the box for donation. He also suggested an animal trainer that would buy the non donatable (is that a word?) animals from a tamer and give gold that could then be donated.

    Any more suggestions or requests from Tamers?
     
  18. Frarc

    Frarc Stratics Legend
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    I'm against a permanent Tiers and no decay at all. Should be slower but if one person just gives alot of gold (and yes it has been done) Then no other people have a reason to keep working on it to see progress.

    There needs to be decay but it has to be slower. Maybe 5% in a week instead of 3% every day.
     
  19. GreywolfUK

    GreywolfUK Sage
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    Agreed the decay rate is too high, and does need a lot more creatures added to the list, why not make it by the creatures family group, for example dragon kin, exotic (for the mares, Unicorns etc), Feline and so on.
     
  20. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Agreed. I barely have a part time tamer but even the few times I have donated, it all decays too rapidly, and makes it seem pointless.

    Agreed also on the list it could include a wider array of all the vast tamables that are available for taming in all of Britannia so few are included upon the list.

    I would like to see more lower end critters for the newest tamers, from mongbats to cattle, bulls, llamas etc. livestock could be turned in as well from new tamers. So many more types of bears and wolves, crocodilles, etc. could be included as well as more critters in the medium and higher skill tameables could be included on the list.

    *also I sometimes wish there were a way even for *non tamers* to donate to the zoo, by that I mean someone oft leaves pets, all over Moonglow and elsewhere, to go wild, wish there was a way for a gump to come up for even non tamers, when confronted with a tame gone or going wild, to be asked some question in a gump as if an animal control officer was asking the question saying in the gump, "this pet has gone/going wild, do you wish to contribute it to the zoo. Would be one way to clear out pets parked and left abandoned, by some folks and help *donate* to the zoo even for non tamers.

    IF said pet was not abandoned perhaps the owner can reclaim it at/from the zoo, but if it was abandoned, not claimed in x amt of days.. then the one turning it in would then get the zoo points etc.

    It would be one way to clear out some tames that are left oft right all aroun Britannia and Moonglow too and the zoo, that can be a threat to newer players left to go wild, like moonglow for example where on the island, new unsuspecting players and pets going wild attacking them on Moonglow, is oft a bad combination if both are found wandering around the zoo & moongate area.*
     
  21. Guest

    Guest Guest

    The animal control officer is a very cute idea, I am not sure how it work but perhaps this could be the person that tamers could also hand over non donateable animals too or even a person with herding could take them to.

    Maybe a stock yard or something needs to be constructed near a city for such things as herding donations. Aim the animals in the pen and wallah you donated.

    I also agree with Frac that there has to be some decay level....I just believe it needs to be turned way down as it is impossible for most to keep up with.
     
  22. Guest

    Guest Guest

    I *love* this idea, QueenZen!

    It is scary to confront a wild beastie when you're a young adventurer, especially in a place that was previously believed, and should be, safe for exploration and enjoyment.

    I understand that a pet could go wild because of disconnect or computer problems or RL things. The timer would help these tamers recover their pets, as Zoo Donation wouldn't be an option yet.

    I certainly would like to see some way for these wild pets to be returned to their own environments. It's sad to see an abandoned polar bear or White Wyrm stuck in a much too warm environment! Or how about that poor scorpion, wishing only for some sand to sharpen his stinger but he's been left to freeze somewhere. I'd love to see a humane way for these to go towards helping the Zoo. =)
     
  23. Guest

    Guest Guest

    I know the dev's have been busy with town hall but it would be very nice to at least have some acknowledgment they have read the thread even if it is not to give us an answer as I am sure they do not have one yet but just to say we are being heard.

    I also encourage all tamers to post there views on the zoo and the decay rate, keeping it respectful of cause like this thread is thus far. I feel the more of us that comment and add suggestions the more likely we are going to be heard.
     
  24. Belmarduk

    Belmarduk Guest

    Lenghten the decay rate and for christ sake have creatures you need for train taming from 0-120 be donatable - Same should be for all community donations when training from 0-100(120) (smith,tinker,etc etc) This was really badly thoguht of when ML came out.....
     
  25. Korso

    Korso Guest

    *tee hee*
    I thought this game couldn't get any easier. I guess I was wrong. While your at it Dev! How about putting 100gp in my bank every hour!

    Hey, you can't say I didn't try [​IMG]
     
  26. Guest

    Guest Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    *tee hee*
    I thought this game couldn't get any easier. I guess I was wrong. While your at it Dev! How about putting 100gp in my bank every hour!

    Hey, you can't say I didn't try [​IMG]

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Thank you for the sarcasim and needless input.

    I actually met someone today who had not ever donated to the zoo so I was happy to show them the ropes. I felt the disheartening suffered when I was asked how long it would take to gain points to get rewards and I had to explain it can take awhile and a fair amount of unicorns.

    Do you guys feel that the reward levels are a tad high also? We know the decay rate is but what about the points could they be allocated better or the levels needed lowered?
     
  27. Belmarduk

    Belmarduk Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    *tee hee*
    I thought this game couldn't get any easier. I guess I was wrong. While your at it Dev! How about putting 100gp in my bank every hour!

    Hey, you can't say I didn't try [​IMG]

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Whats your problem?
    I think it would be better to be able to donate things while training instead of just getting rid of them.Thats what the zoo etc should be IDEAL for.
    What pisses me off is that it was not thought about proply - There are big gaps while training for donating.

    Better than just scripting the things in the library etc......................
     
  28. Belmarduk

    Belmarduk Guest

    <blockquote><hr>



    I actually met someone today who had not ever donated to the zoo so I was happy to show them the ropes. I felt the disheartening suffered when I was asked how long it would take to gain points to get rewards and I had to explain it can take awhile and a fair amount of unicorns.

    Do you guys feel that the reward levels are a tad high also? We know the decay rate is but what about the points could they be allocated better or the levels needed lowered?

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I think the levels are fine as they are - You can allways donate Gold if you want things fast (talking about personal level that does not decay anyway)
    The whole thing is meant as a Goldsink - Thats a good idea about it.
    It just needs adjusting:
    Shardwide decay decreased a little
    Types of creatures etc thought about for training reasons.
    Library and Museum - better more eyecatching stuff that spawns when level is higher (like in Zoo)

    I myself dont need anything more for training - Have a legendary Tamer and my worker is Gm or Legendary in any working skill there is,but for new players it would be MORE FUN that just mindlessy throwing the stuff away again.
    Also in the library and museum it should be possible to donate all type in backpack - Not doing so might be a small hinderness for scripters but is a LARGE one for honest players !!!
    Greetings Belmarduk
     
  29. Guest

    Guest Guest

    I doubt any devs will answer this post as I can't believe adjusting the zoo is a high priority for them at this point [​IMG]. I know all to well how frustrating the decay rate can be but can't think of a fair way to adjust it and still maintain the challenge.

    As long as we are tossing out other ideas for the zoo, Sarphus has posted a while back about having an item that would allow a tamer to donate to the zoo remotely. After taming a creature, instead of having to gate or recall back to the zoo, a tamer could donate directly to the item to get credit for the donation. This would save time and repetitive hand movements on the keyboard. An even more elaborate idea (therefore less likely to ever be implemented) is to have reward points based on the stats / skills of the creature. If a creature was donated after some training or if a fresh tame had exceptional stats / skills it would fetch more points. The points could be based on a system similar to the calculator that rates pets.


    As much as I'd like to see improvements to the zoo I can't imagine it is a high priority for what is apparently an understaffed game.
     
  30. <blockquote><hr>

    Greater dragons also need to be added in and give you a hell of alot of points when you turn them in.
    Somethings got to be done!!

    [/ QUOTE ]

    i agree, it takes ALOT to tame these [​IMG]
     
  31. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Oh, yes please!

    At least make it so every tameable creature is allowed to be donated!

    SO hard to keep up with the zoo, and harder still if you're at a level where taming some of the cretures just isnt possible. One of my tamers has no magery, so she can't tame anythign that isn't rideable =P
     
  32. I agree the decay rate is way too fast
     
  33. Guest

    Guest Guest

    ooo I like the idea of donating un needed zoo points to the zoo.
     
  34. Frarc

    Frarc Stratics Legend
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    Also send your feedback to EAmythic.

    Feedback.


    Can't hurt to try. [​IMG]
     
  35. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Several members of the "Senior Citizens of Britannia" Catskills are part of an ongoing effort to keep up our Zoo. We agree that although upkeep of the zoo should be a challenge, it should not be an exercise in futility.
    Expanding the types of tames over the range of taming difficulty would certainly be good to help maintain interest of tamers-in-training to taking time to donate. And yes we agree that the decay rate is excessively high and is in need of attention by the devs.
    We have regular events on Cats to raise funds for the zoo which several creative citizens have organized such as pet fight tournaments, champ spawns, dungeon hunts and taming marathons, even a peerless hunt to get a mounted dreadhorn for the pet tournament arena bar. These events also foster community comraderie and are just plain FUN. But these devoted citizens have to go out into the rl world to earn a living, take care of their families and personal needs and it is distressing to see that every few days the hours of group effort are all undone due to the high rate of decay.
     
  36. *adds name to the list*

    I would love to see some changes made. Either slow the decay, or make them permanent after a set time. Definitely add to the turn in list or jump up the points on the ones allowed (or both).

    It definitely need something done though.
     
  37. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Since Leurocian's post about Pet AI changes, I thought the Zoo might benefit from the good news and increased activity. *smiles*

    I think the concept is a great one...continual reason and rewards for donation, added fun to training. Some shards have used the Zoo for wonderful community relations. I think it would be even more popular if the Decay Rate was adjusted. I think the Rewards are fine as they are. I'd love to see even the smaller communities have a better chance of reaching the higher Tiers.

    Help support the Zoo!
     
  38. Guest

    Guest Guest

    I also agree, I've been taming unicorns for a very long time now for the zoo. Taming dragons for the collection just isnt worth the points unless you have a friend to help with you. Its only what a 200 point diff? Its true that the Library and Museum collections are no where near as difficult. I have to say though I've gotten some really nice things from all my turn ins'. Would love to see the zoo comeplete though. [​IMG]
     
  39. Vallend

    Vallend Sage
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    I agree that it is near useless to work to get the Zoo to the very top tier only to have everyone’s hard work decay away at such a high rate that all that all that effort was pretty much futile. I have seen Catskills tamers reach the Silver Steed level so many times only to have it decay quickly away in a few days time that it gets discouraging to even try anymore. Catskills has a great group of tamers, but they cannot spend all their in game time just turning in monsters to try and keep up with the decay rate. They do need to change the rate of decay to be fair to all the tamers who do help the zoo so much.

    <blockquote><hr>

    I also like the idea that has been put forth before, that once the Silver Steed level is achieved, a spawn of Silver Steeds is triggered. As long as this level is maintained the steed would spawn. If it drops below this level then the steed would stop spawning until the level is again achieved. (I do not know who originally put forth this idea but I love the idea)

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Also I admit that the idea posted by Uthar Pendragon of having Silver Steeds spawn across the lands if that tier is met is an intriguing idea to me. It may keep tamers turning in pets if they could get rewarded by being given a chance to tame one of these famous pets. Only problems I see there is most tamers have their stables full already so everyone would be wanting the size of their stables made bigger, which is another idea I support. Plus many players would want the Silver Steed boosted up some to make it worth taming as a pet to use, though as it is now it will be more of a status symbol to have one more than anything else.
     
  40. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Tina Small posted the following on the tamers forum


    <blockquote><hr>

    Below are updated figures from around 9:00 am Mountain Time this morning (Saturday, March 8, 2008). The following eight shards, identified with an * below, had net increases from last week as follows: Catskills (1,446,640), Lake Superior (1,009,619), Hokuto (920,523), Yamato (793,482), Chesapeake (612,712), Great Lakes (234,054), Arirang (220,725), Siege Perilous (10,219).

    The following shards were within 97% to 99% of their previous week’s total: Pacific (99%) and Izumo (99%). The following shards were within 90% to 96% of their previous week's totals: Mizuho (96%), Sonoma (95%), Drachenfels (95%), Sakura (94%), Napa Valley (94%), Formosa (92%), Oceania (91%), Lake Austin (90%), and Asuka (90%).

    The total points across all shards was 100,808,756. The net decrease across all shards in one week was 863,640 points.

    Tier 11
    20,203,100 Drachenfels
    11,197,862 Catskills*

    Tier 8
    8,051,447 Lake Superior*

    Tier 7
    7,512,996 Atlantic
    7,045,221 Great Lakes*

    Tier 5
    5,798,302 Asuka

    Tier 4
    4,039,003 Hokuto*

    Tier 3
    3,882,899 Baja
    3,812,844 Wakoku
    3,586,537 Yamato*
    3,548,372 Sakura
    3,445,853 Pacific

    Tier 2
    2,752,923 Europa
    2,695,810 Origin
    2,337,147 Izumo
    2,247,416 Mizuho

    Tier 1
    1,781,970 Chesapeake*
    1,307,092 Arirang*
    1,163,613 Oceania
    1,027,071 Sonoma

    Tier 0
    920,773 Formosa
    839,625 Legends
    793,364 Lake Austin
    559,866 Napa Valley
    155,761 Siege Perilous*
    79,188 Balhae
    22,701 Mugen

    [​IMG]

    [/ QUOTE ]


    Some great feedback here tamers keep it up, hopefully soon we will get a response from a Dev at least acknowledging this thread.

    Some of these changes just NEED to be made hopefully soon they will see that.
     
  41. Guest

    Guest Guest

    So sad, my poor Napa is practically at the bottom. I'd like to see either more points for donations, or the rewards drop some, it's not like any of the rewards are some high use arty like mace and shield glasses. Most of it (even realistically including the armors) is just house deco, so why does it take so much grinding to get em?


    Rey~
     
  42. Guest

    Guest Guest

    This is the bit that amazes me.
    <blockquote><hr>

    The total points across all shards was 100,808,756. The net decrease across all shards in one week was 863,640 points.


    [/ QUOTE ]

    This is just a huge point loss I can not fathom this, it is just so high and so fast.
     
  43. Guest

    Guest Guest

    So I wonder what happens (if anything) once Drachenfels hits like 60,000,000?
     
  44. <blockquote><hr>

    Tina Small posted the following on the tamers forum


    <blockquote><hr>

    Below are updated figures from around 9:00 am Mountain Time this morning (Saturday, March 8, 2008). The following eight shards, identified with an * below, had net increases from last week as follows: Catskills (1,446,640), Lake Superior (1,009,619), Hokuto (920,523), Yamato (793,482), Chesapeake (612,712), Great Lakes (234,054), Arirang (220,725), Siege Perilous (10,219).


    [/ QUOTE ]


    Some great feedback here tamers keep it up, hopefully soon we will get a response from a Dev at least acknowledging this thread.

    Some of these changes just NEED to be made hopefully soon they will see that.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    For Chesapeake, anyway, I know that last week I contributed 350,000 points in gold so I could get an interactive statue for my museum. I can not imagine how many unicorns, dragons, etc. I would have had to tame to get that during normal play. The decay rate for the zoo is too high, especially since it would be really neat for new players to see some of the higher level creatures in a safe environment.
     
  45. Kayne

    Kayne Guest

    Im adding my name into this one after seeing some good work done on europa yesterday wiped out, saw 80k worth of points wiped out in one hit.

    I like the ideas put forward here, especially lowering some of the rewards 100k points is not all that easy to obtain especially for the tamer in training.

    Points need to be increased for some pets, some are ridiculously low.
     
  46. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Thank you all the tamers who have show support thus far. I really do believe that the more of us that show support for this idea the more likely the devs are going to pay us some attention........well we can hope any way.

    I am about to try and organize a taming event for Oceania involving the zoo, perhaps other shards could do the same to gain some interest in the zoo.

    Dev's can we please have some acknowledgment you guys have at least seen this thread.

    Tamers - KEEP POSTING.
     
  47. Guest

    Guest Guest

    I'm still here, and I'd still like to see these much needed changes for our lovely Zoo! *smiles*

    If you're a Tamer on Chesapeake, considering donating just a few creatures, if you can spare the time. Even my newbie tamers donate their wolves and polar bears, hehe. It's a fun addition to your training time if you're working skills. I'd love to see us go up a Tier!

    Britannia Royal Zoo &lt;3
     
  48. Guest

    Guest Guest

    I have a tamer on Oceania, for the last few weeks I've been donating Ki-Rin &amp; Drakes. I'm up 100k donation points &amp; yet the Oceania Zoo is down at least 100k points......
    It's good that we get a reward for our efforts yet as a new day dawns, I dread going back to see how the points have diminished &amp; also alot more have been taken away.
    After donating 10-15k taming Ki-Rin one day.....Looking at the points the next day is like getting a big slap in the face.
    The Points decay on smaller shards is unrealistic. Dev's take note &amp; change the decay........Do something, At least to know that this thread is being read!
     
  49. Guest

    Guest Guest

    I would like to add my voice to the needed changes to the Moonglow Zoo Community Collection. The decay rate desperately needs to be reduced and some serious thought into the types of pets that can be donated needs addressed as well.

    The limitations that have been set in place with regards to the current list of creatures that can be donated has been brought up by numerous players numerous times. By expanding the current list, not only would it encourage donations to be made but would also lead to players (both old and new) exploring more of the lands of Sosaria. If there are only a limited number of animals that can be donated and they spawn in a limited number of areas... one could assume that a large proportion of "taming time" would be spent in only a few finite spots. Expanding the list of creatures would get more players out into the world...

    And... while I'm at it... I'll also add to the voices that want to see more rewards being offered. The more options, the more interest you'll get... [​IMG]
     
  50. Guest

    Guest Guest

    If someone wants to buy me a 800K point statue my birthday is St Patrick's Day...
    [​IMG] [​IMG]