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Devs dont nerf Sampire template because of scripters...

Discussion in 'UO Spiels N Rants' started by Omnicron, May 28, 2008.

  1. Omnicron

    Omnicron Stratics Legend
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    Not saying they would, just hope they dont. I dont want a bandaid fix that destroys the template!

    Just focus on the program used...
     


  2. They just need to set it so you have to have the real skill to cast Vampiric Embrace. That would solve some issues.
     
  3. Sure, nerfing Dexxers again so they get put away and not used would solve the problem real fast....:lame:
     

  4. Get the required skill. Wow that is so nerfing dexxers. I play a dexxer and don't rely on the crutch of skill jewerly and am able to do almost anything in this game. :thumbup1:
     
  5. Nexus

    Nexus Site Support
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    maybe so but that's one of the few templates that is a general all over powerhouse. There needs to be a few like that out there for the casual player or someone who runs odd hours and doesn't always have a guildy or other peeps they trust to run with. Removing the ability to use Jewelry would destroy this templates effect and make a rather nifty Doom artie useless at the same time. Under your line of thought all skill jewels would be useless if they just gave up "numbers" and not the benefits of them.

    I personally think it's a crock that they change the game to compensate for support staff not doing their jobs in a timely effective manner. It would be much better to find and catch those running scripts, or to introduce a solid piece of anti-script code that programs can't get around than to constantly alter game play that is enjoyed by many legally.
     
  6. ColterDC

    ColterDC Visitor

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    It's not worth arguing with these clowns.

    These guys think you should be able to solo the hardest boss monsters in the game.

    They'll defend an obvious abuse of a poorly thought out game design to their last breathe.
     
  7. silent

    silent Lore Master
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    Oh ya you're right only tamers should be able to do that since it's tamers online.
     
  8. Lord Kotan

    Lord Kotan Slightly Crazed
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    That would basically make + nerco items (midnight bracers) usless if you needed real skill to cast the spells.
     
  9. Lord Kotan

    Lord Kotan Slightly Crazed
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    I haven't seen anywhere where they plan to nerf it.
     
  10. envinyatar

    envinyatar Guest

    I think he's talking about the change in mining and lumberjacking.
     
  11. Beefybone

    Beefybone Visitor

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    QFT. I can't wait for the next stage of the event, where tamers get invincible super flying acid-shooting ninja rideable fire-breathing nuclear powered mongbats to tame, while everyone else gets some boots with 2% cold resist or something.
     
  12. Wenchkin

    Wenchkin Babbling Loonie
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    Methinks some posters here really need to work on their anti tamer issues. Or does this tamer need to get her dexer and show you how to kill things without twinking? If you want to use necromancy on a sammy, train the skill. If you suffer from tamer envy, make your own and quityerwhinin' :p

    Maybe you should ask yourselves whether the issue isn't that you'd have to use real skill to use vamp form, but that your expectations of power are too high. I've played my tamer then sammy the same night often enough, I never felt the latter was underpowered. Going from one to the other would logically highlight any shortfall in damage. In fact, before the advent of the greater dragon, none of my tamer's pets could out damage the sammy. Nowhere is it written that the warrior class should beat every other PvM class in UO. Sorry.

    There are 2 things which should have been set from the outset:

    1) Real skill should always give better results than twinked skill.
    2) Training "in the field" should give better gains than parking at a golem etc etc.

    Wenchy
     
  13. timbeOFbaja

    timbeOFbaja Guest

    Just make it so vampire disappears once you no longer have the skill.
     
  14. All or nothing imo! Either nerf all skill items or leave them all alone. I would consider it completely riddiculous to get nerfed on a vampire template while still being able to get away with the benefits of talismans on my tamer etc, you can even use taming items to increase your stable slots.
     
  15. jelinidas

    jelinidas Guest

    problem solved!
     
  16. timbeOFbaja

    timbeOFbaja Guest

    Just doing my......er......other people's jobs.
     
  17. galefan2004

    galefan2004 Guest

    Yes because we all know that dexxers are pointless and can't fight without the sampire template. My guild master only plays a dexxer that doesn't even have bushido and is still more than capable of dealing damage and taking hits. Sampire is not the only warrior template. If I could handle playing a warrior (I perfer mages and tamers) I would probably play a sampire but they are still playable without the sampire style.
     
  18. galefan2004

    galefan2004 Guest

    Not even tamers should be able to solo the biggest and the best but you have to understand that chasing bovine around for a year is not equall to beating on a golem for a week. When you realise that you will realise that the majority of tamers earned their way.
     
  19. galefan2004

    galefan2004 Guest

    Give forms of all types a skill check. You would have to have the desired skill to cast the form and as soon as your skill drops below the skill needed to be in that form you lose the form. That seems fair and still gives people a reason to use skill items.
     
  20. galefan2004

    galefan2004 Guest

    Its no fun if its invincible I actually like healing my pets with magery and vet. Flying pets are very annoying I wouldn't want it to fly. Acid would be cool especially if it works like solen acid but only towards unfriendly targets. I don't care if they are ridable by ninjas as long as they are ridable by tamers. They shouldn't be nuclear powered because this is UO not Second Life. It best come in many different colors if they keep the same graphic as the mongbat and not follow this nightmare and dragon with different stats example.

    Maybe they will be really nice and give you boots with 1 luck 1 lrc and +1 to all resists.
     
  21. galefan2004

    galefan2004 Guest

    I disagree because this would negate the purposes of skill jewelry entirely. People really don't desire to put the work in to have a finished template in some cases, and in some cases the cap simply isn't high enough to allow you the template you desire.

    Playing through normal game play should always give better gains, but the gains still need to come quickly because in a game with some 10 year old characters its pretty hard to start late and catch up to end game, and the vast majority of players don't play MMORPGs for the journey.

    Also, on the note of gaining skills through normal game play, there is no way in hell you can make any reasonable arguement that a tamer that can control an all powerful dragon still has to chase bovine around to learn how to tame creatures.
     
  22. silent

    silent Lore Master
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    You have no clue. First of all the golem thing has been fixed, second gaining skill is still the easiest thing to do when building a sampire. Try finding a weapon thats decent, prepare to spend upwards of 60 million gold IF you can find someone selling one. The suit? Prepare to invest another 60mill gold. Can a tamer say they have the same gold investment? No. I'd gladly trade you time instead of the time and gold spent trying to find the right equipment or burning countless runic tools.
     
  23. timbeOFbaja

    timbeOFbaja Guest

    People WILL play for the journey if they aren't placed on a treadmill. We all did from 97-00.

    As far as the cow comment. 7Mill buys you an advanced character token which will give you a tamer with 85 skill. A ring and a bracelet with + AT will get you to 115. I'm sure there's something else out there with +AT. Either way, you're now 5 minutes old and pwning all up and down this game. Next argument.
     
  24. galefan2004

    galefan2004 Guest

    Nice to know they fixed something. Gaining skill is easy for any warrior template. Tamers spend years chasing animals aroun.

    Or you could be smart and burn through 10 or more bronze hammers yourself and get a weapon that is beyond usable. My friend made a katana that is worth 20 million with a bronze hammer. We all know bronze hammers are hard to get.

    Artifacts and crafted items simply don't cost that much anymore. Granted you could say 20 million though and I would buy that.

    So all in all you invest 40 million if you were unable to make any of the items yourself or get any of the items yourself. Thats susposed to make you leet or something?

    Lets equate gold to what it really should be equated to...time. Lets say you can farm 100k an hour. Lets say the average hardcore player plays 10 hours a day. That would take 40 days to farm 40 million. That is still looking at at a lot less than chasing the bovines around for a year to get to 120 taming. Also, if you consider the actual values of tamers pets...some of the high end pets are worth about as much as a suit.

    Then go out there and hunt. Gold is just the result of how you chose to spend your time. Assuming you got none of your items yourself it would take you 400 hours to build a suit for 40 million if you can bring in 100k an hour which is not at all a stretch.

    You act like tamers never did anything. I have pets worth about 20 million sitting in my stables that I worked up myself over a period of weeks after bonding them (another week when you can't even use them) and that is after I worked my skills. I also spent around 5-7 mil on my hunt suit and my luck suit (100% LRC with 1200+ luck) is worth about another 10 million.
     
  25. galefan2004

    galefan2004 Guest

    I was talking about bulls. Ok, so in order to become a viable player I am forced to give up 2 slots (there is a huge shortage of those +15 rings and bracelets with decent actual mods on them). I am also forced to spend 7 million (if I'm new to the game I guess I'm buying that) or $19.95 to EA (to actually buy the token the way it was designed to be bought) before I can even start to play my character.

    Then I have to get those super pets. Then I have to wait for those super pets to bond. Then I have to wait for those super pets to get trained (because it is completely possible to take a fresh pet to Mel if you plan on it dieing over and over).

    On the contrast...dexxers have to spend about 2 weeks to have a fully gmed toon without spending any gold on them then make a suit...if you make the suit yourself it falls much less than 40 million. Then you have to make a weapon (capable of making a 20 million weapon from a bronzed runic hammer and man those are HARD to get).

    I fail to see the arguement. I never said tamers should be able to own everything, but actually spending time and investing into skills instead of farming gold for 400 hours is a joke. Especially when you consider that you get that gold through normal game play in most cases where as chasing bulls is not normal game play.

    You forgot about the library talisman (+5 taming +5 lore) and the mark of travesty (+10 taming +10 lore).

    So if you use all the +taming items you would have +45 to the skill so to get to 120 you would need 75 real taming, but you also give up a lot of decent stats in a hunt suit or luck suit in order to get those items into the suit. Realistically, you have no real reason to take taming above 110 for pure hunting purposes, so if you used all the items you would need 65 real taming. You can start an advanced character with 50 taming. You would need 150 gains. At that point you gain on every 3-4 tames if you are unlucky, so you should need between 450-600 tames period to get a tamer ready to hunt through the use of items.
     
  26. timbeOFbaja

    timbeOFbaja Guest

    OMG two whole slots. NOOOOooooooooooooo. The humanity. Tamers need a buff.

    As far as armor, I just burned through 4 barbed kits all on sleeves and didn't get a single pair that fit my template. To get all 70's and good mods you ARE looking at 20 Mill + if you take your time. To a dexxer armor is life. It can't just be resist, it needs maxed HCI and DCI and some DI and stat boosting. I've been working on a suit for three weeks and am still missing one more piece and when I finally find it I'll still be lunch for a 5 minute old tamer who bought a junk 70's suit for a couple hundred k. And while he's "bonding" and "levelling" his pet he's raking in more than enough gold to cover his investment costs.

    And you really think people are making 20Mill weapons with 300K hammers? If that were real the hammers wouldn't be selling for 300K now would they. Or do you just know about a money making loophole nobody else has caught on to yet? Maybe once every 30 hammers if you're very lucky + cost of colored ingots and an ancient smithy hammer + ALL THAT TIME and money grinding your blacksmith mule (requiring another character slot OMG). And I need a mount which will run me another 5Mill.

    Yeah, I'm totally seeing how it's all equitable.
     
  27. silent

    silent Lore Master
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    I'm not looking for anything to be taken away from other classes, just stop screwing with my class. The bottom line is tamers for the most part fight for more and all other classes need to fight to keep what they have. Sad but true...
     
  28. Stigmatas

    Stigmatas Babbling Loonie
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    First off, nobody said anything about power. In regards to warriors vs. tamers, its all about tanking ability. Why do you think more people have tamers? Why do you think MOST people use tamers for peerless and high end PVM? The whole vampire issues #1 use is because it adds to a warriors tanking ability. It adds to it due to the life leech. Warriors do not get 900 HP. I would think someone who has played both templates would know that. Unless your hunting trolls and ettins, and using this for your "comparison".

    As someone who has played a warrior since 1997, and has TWO tamers, there is no comparison as to which template is the EASIEST template to play in UO. It has always (and apparently always will be) the tamer. All kill and vet/heal away. There are many more concerns on a warrior template, not to mention how many more mods on a suit a warrior needs to compete, but I'm sure you knew that. :wall:

    There needs to be better tanking ability for warriors in PVM. We now use the vampire ability to do so. Even then it doesn't compare to 900+ HP. And nowhere has it been written that tamers should beat every other template in UO. But that is how it's been for over a decade now. Take a look around at you next peerless hunt, if you do them, and note how many tamers compared to warriors you will see.

    As usual Wenchy, your analysis is dead wrong.

    /edit:

    Oh, and as for your little "golem bashing" episode, think about how many tamers use Shadow Iron Ore Ele's to train their 900 HP pets. Betcha never considered that eh? SAME THING AS GOLEM TRAINING ONLY NOBODY EVER CRYS ABOUT THAT.

    Tamers online.
     
  29. Stigmatas

    Stigmatas Babbling Loonie
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    Advanced character token

    SKILL JEWELRY

    First day hunt with a cu sidhe.

    ROFL

    Try again.
     
  30. galefan2004

    galefan2004 Guest

    This game is all about luck. Yeah you won't get a 20 million weapon from every 300k hammer, but you have a chance to get one with each hammer and they are not hard to get. I have a mule for a million different reasons and making and repairing guild for my toons is a bonus not a desired goal of my mules.

    Also, if you burnt 4 barbed kits even if you didn't get the items you needed I am sure you got some decent items to sell anyways. A few of them probably even paid for the barbed kit. I'm not going to argue that dexxers don't need decent suits, but you are asking to do things that shouldn't be doable with any character.
     
  31. Stigmatas

    Stigmatas Babbling Loonie
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    Yes because we all know that those bulls bite hard.

    Seem to be a bit hypocritical here as you want your tamer to have the benefit of skill jewelry but not a sampire. You think a tamer template is cramped to make? LOL. Go try a good warrior template and build the suit to boot. Your not showing bias here. None at all.

    *goes to dig up another shadow ore elemental as we speak to train up his third Greater Wyrm*

    Relax, your ok with that.
     
  32. Stigmatas

    Stigmatas Babbling Loonie
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    Well said home slice.
     
  33. Stigmatas

    Stigmatas Babbling Loonie
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    Dang! You guys are all beating me to the punch with your wisdom! I basically replied to Wench with the same ideas/truths, but it seems that some of you have been also paying attention for the last ten years. Good on you.

    So, YEA!...What he said...and the other guy too lawl.

    Word up home slice. Word up. I bet half these guys play their tamer 99% of the time since it's so easy to do so. No other template presents the challenge in high end pvm than a melee template. NONE. The people who know this actually play said melee templates moire often in high end situations.

    Over the years I got so sick of tamers being catered to, I made TWO of them. One was a peace tamer, now a spellweave tamer, and the other is a disco tamer. Talk about gimpy there LOL. But hey when I'm sippin coffee or want to just farm gold and not really think, thats the template to use. Oh yea, on just about every peerless too.

    Word.
     
  34. galefan2004

    galefan2004 Guest

    Pay attention to UO history. Tamers have only been the end all for PvM since AoS (thats not 10 years). Before that it was bards all the way. Bards ruled the PvM market between the birth of UO and AoS and still have a sizable chunk of power in PvM today.

    Also, mages still rule PvP if they are any good. Tamers need to gimp their templates insanely to be any good in PvM and will still be destroyed by a good mage.
     
  35. galefan2004

    galefan2004 Guest

    LET ME SAY IT AGAIN AND MAYBE IT WILL SINK IN!!!!!

    On a mage you macro for a day and you can hunt on the first day. On a tamer you HAVE to HAVE an advanced character token to hunt in the first week and you still have to level vet and lore to 110 if you plan on solo hunting and that doesn't go as fast it once did.

    NO ONE SHOULD EVER HAVE TO USE AN ADVANCED CHARACTER TOKEN JUST TO HUNT IN THE FIRST MONTH!
     
  36. "(capable of making a 20 million weapon from a bronzed runic hammer and man those are HARD to get)."

    Hmm. I had to go through 150 bronze and copper runics to come up with ONE single ornate axe that is viable for the meleer template. I've gone through close to 300 more of the same runics trying to make a radiant scimitar with the same mods and still haven't come up with a single one.

    So yeah, it only takes one to make the weapon you want, but it could take 500 runics before you get to that magical "One".

    Sorry, lousy argument there.


    For the rest, I think Wraithorn pretty much summed it up.
     
  37. galefan2004

    galefan2004 Guest

    NEWS FLASH!!!! You can't train greaters on shadow elementals. They simply don't gain worthwhile off of them after they gm all of their skills.

    Also, I am more than happy to lose any bennefit I have from my jewelry when that jewelry is off...oh wait I do.

    I never denied biast. I think warriors are pointless. I haven't been able to play a warrior since AoS. If I wanted to play a melee character in a game it wouldn't be in UO. However, instead of finding interesting ways to abuse the system you should be asking developers for buffs that make you better if you get the gear for it. I believe that completely trained, completely geared warriors should be able to take on almost everything solo with enough skill. I don't like warriors, but that doesn't mean I want to see them nerfed to all hell. I just also don't think that peerless should be soloable by any class.
     
  38. ColterDC

    ColterDC Visitor

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    HAHA...... Show me a mage with 900 hps who can do 300+ damage in 5 seconds, then we can discuss who is currently ruling pvp.

    A Tamer can throw on a no resist lrc suit with stealth and ninjistu and kill almost everyone who stupid enough to stay on screen and let their overpowered dragon kill them.
     
  39. How long it takes has no bearing at all. The end result is a template that's easier to play than any other, and can even now handle more of the high end stuff than meleers can with the introduction of the greater dragons.
     
  40. galefan2004

    galefan2004 Guest

    I perfer a necro mage to a tamer but my current necro mage isn't finished, so yeah I play my tamer 100% of the time while hunting. Believe it or not you can still find challenge as a tamer. Go solo dreadhorn and travesty keys with a tamer...it can get quite interesting. Plus, I stopped playing MMORPGs for a "challenge" a long time ago.

    Its kind of interesting because I consider warriors gimped. I mean, honestly, you guys will never compare to the difficulty to play that mages have. You will never have the power that tamers have. That puts you in some sort of limbo.
     
  41. galefan2004

    galefan2004 Guest

    Some get people get lucky and some people do not. It seems that you have not. That doesn't change the fact that my friend has been offered up to 13 million for his katana that came from a bronze runic hammer, and has been told it is worth 20 mil.
     
  42. galefan2004

    galefan2004 Guest

    L2castparalyzeonpet!
    L2runoffscreenofpet!

    As long as dragons will get paralyzed every time it is casted on them they don't pose the threat you claim they do. Just because you can't run the dragon in circles doesn't mean they are overpowered. Also, why the hell does it matter how many hp the dragon has...if you are trying to kill the dragon you are an idiot. Dragons do not do 300+ damage in 5 seconds even in PvM so you must be thinking of bushido paladin archers that got to honor the monster (and that is only in PvM).

    Having no skill doesn't mean tamers are overpowered it just means you need to learn how to kill tamers like you had to learn to kill every other "over powered" template.
     
  43. galefan2004

    galefan2004 Guest

    No offense, but you point out that you have known this for 10 years but yet you still desire to play UO with a dexxer. That seems like your issue. My answer to realising how jacked this system is was to roll a tamer and stop playing melee toons in UO. I haven't played a warrior since before AoS when I soloed balrons and ancient wyrms with a mage archer although everyone said it couldn't be done.
     
  44. Cowgoesmoo

    Cowgoesmoo Guest

    I have no problem with people using jewelery to get their skill high enough to cast vampire form. I do have a problem with the spell remaining active once they take the jewelery off.

    After a transformation spell has been cast if for any reason (including discord) the casters skill drops below the required casting level then the transform spell should end.
     
  45. Wolfman

    Wolfman Seasoned Veteran
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    How about allowing the spell be cast with Jewlery, but as soon as the skill drops below the required skill *poof* back to standard form...so either you wear the items all the time, or you do not get the benefit (also makes it impossible to use Soulstones as an alternative).
    Btw I am playing a Sampire almost exclusively, so I know how strong the template is!
     
  46. Kith Kanan

    Kith Kanan Guest


    true and make the resist the tamer has on his armour reflect on the pet , good luck trying to build that uber luck suit whilst not killing ya pet because of ****ty resists :p , and ofc if you log on with + taming/lore/vet jewelry on , the pet turns on you and insta kills you and un-bonds :D
     
  47. Pariah_KoV

    Pariah_KoV Guest

    Then tamer's pets should unbond when their jewelry is taken off and the pets in those extra stable slots should disappear when the jewelry is taken off. Now it's fair.
     
  48. Kith Kanan

    Kith Kanan Guest

    Ok so we should just delete all melee toons and go play tamer online , no thanks dude , I got a tamer I play once every blue moon , because all kill no skill gets freakishly borring realy fast , if the sampire templet needs nerfing then tamers need to get hit with a nerf stick the size of the Eifel tower , but thats not gonna happen because of the loss of life by drowning that would happen from all the crying..........
     
  49. This is complete nonsense. I don't even have to give a reason why.

    Hmm, yes. I feel that you're the person I should listen to when it comes to the matters of a warrior.

    Ultratamer Online.
     
  50. Raziel

    Raziel Guest

    Oh well nerf vamps doesnt bother me. my soloer is a wraith :)