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Devs want to bump art, remove beta tag from EC

Discussion in 'UO Enhanced Client Discussion' started by Woodsman, Apr 15, 2011.

  1. Woodsman

    Woodsman Guest

    http://vboards.stratics.com/uhall/240017-[uo-herald]-producers-update.html

    I'm hoping they put a lot more into bug fixes, but glad to see high resolution terrain coming.
     
  2. Roland'

    Roland' Lore Keeper
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    I could care les about the art atm. i think it is fine. But untill they get rid of the memory leak and hourly crashes to desktop they cannot say it is out of beta.
     
  3. Woodsman

    Woodsman Guest

    They definitely can't take it out of beta if it's still got the crashes.

    If they fix the crashed, and if they do some of the art right, including the dragons, and fix the terrain up, I could see quite a few people switching.
     
  4. Storm

    Storm UO Forum Moderator
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    If you will note they said stability also so this means to me they are going to tackle this problem! and i am sure they are going to be watching and reading the posts here in the EC forum especially for feedback and locating the exact problem!
    So with that in mind I am going to be watching the posts extra close for positive feedback and ideas!
     
  5. Woodsman

    Woodsman Guest

    When I talk to people in game these days about the EC, and about why they aren't using it, a few things pop up, not necessarily in this order:

    1) Crashes
    2) Landscape
    3) Dragons

    Obviously there are third party applications that some cling to because they are so used to them or because certain things they can do can't be done in the EC, but those three seem to general come up.

    And honestly, I completely understand those things. What Cal posted, at least the first two are addressed, but I can completely understand why some people cling to the CC - the landscape is not always the best, the dragons in the EC do suck, and most importantly, the crashes make it unplayable for many.

    I also like that they aren't just going to dump it on us. In theory, with the first update being landscape, it'll be easier for us to find problems or missing art. What Cal said at the House of Commons now makes sense.

    I am still curious if we'll be seeing Kingdom Reborn art or if it'll be existing art scaled up.

    I do think it's a step in the right direction. It's a shame it didn't happen before, but it's happening now and so it's hard to complain.
     
  6. Storm

    Storm UO Forum Moderator
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    I think the crash issue should be number 1 people will play with different art and dragons for a time but if the client always crashes they will get disgusted and give up this is not to say the art does not need work
     
  7. Dermott of LS

    Dermott of LS UOEC Modder
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    ...

    I REALLY hope that the landscape does NOT end up looking like a redone version of 2d. I PREFER the KR version but can live with the current tweaked version in the EC and would prefer NOT to go backwards from there. Out of all the art, the terrain IMO is probably the LEAST in need of attention compared to the out-of-native resolution Legacy art.
     
  8. Woodsman

    Woodsman Guest

    After the last patch or tow, definitely this.

    There are enough people posting about crashes (myself included) that it probably doesn't help the case for the EC.

    Something definitely broke recently because I've had some stretches where it was incredibly stable.
     
  9. Hannes Erich

    Hannes Erich Seasoned Veteran
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    The comment about terrain raised my eyebrow too. I hope Calvin was referring to trees, bushes, plants and such, which are 2D art that begins to pixelate in the EC's default zoom. Bumping up their resolution (and that of the characters and mobs) would create a sharper, clearer appearance. If he's talking about the ground itself, like the roadways, grass, cobblestone and such, then he may not be on the same page as the rest of us. The ground itself is extremely impressive and sharp. Some people have problems with just the grass in the EC, but the grass in the CC isn't deserving any awards either. I strongly suspect it just depends on what your eyes are used to looking at.

    And it's unrelated to terrain but worth mentioning, I've met folks who think the EC's biggest problem is the dragons. Y'know, the classic red dragons. In the EC they're sort of cowering and diminutive. I think EVERYONE agrees they've lost their majestic stature. However, I don't think everyone agrees on other sorts of dragons. I was impressed by my first swamp dragon sighting, though I lamented the apparent loss of two of its legs.
     
  10. Roland'

    Roland' Lore Keeper
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    Im sorry but addressing any issue aside from #1 the game crashing (i get so many people to fall in love with EC only to have them stop the second time they crash to desktop in ten minutes). #2 the memory leak, which is forcing me to restart my client every half hour... if i make it that long before i crash.

    Im not trying to sound unpositive, i just would like the devs to take these issues in all seriousness. I have literaly had 10+ people try EC and love it and after a bit, they crash, they refuse to play it at that point. These people are all full time long time players who swore up and down for CC. Once i was able to show them the features of EC, and the benifits of our modders they loved it.

    Ive played UO longest, ive tried other games for good stretches. I always come back. EC keeps me playing on the only large server left due to ping. If i had to go back to choppy 2d with my ping id prolly give up on UO. I hope these fixes come sooner than later.
     
  11. Hannes Erich

    Hannes Erich Seasoned Veteran
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    I'm sure it depends on what sort of computer you're using, but in my case, the default EC is very stable. I have run it for hours with no trouble. It crashes on occasion, but this is extremely rare. The benefits far outweigh the trouble, so I continue to use it. If some people are crashing more frequently, they SHOULD REPORT the bugs, as well as report their computer specs. Especially if you know exactly what action or feature is causing the bug. Help squish the bugs! :)
     
  12. Martyna Zmuir

    Martyna Zmuir Crazed Zealot

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    If they are going to redo the terrain art in a higher res, I would hope they would take a bit of extra time to add in a 'winter' version for most tiles.

    Personally, I think winter looked god-awful in the EC with the odd blueish snow.

    I'd be nice to see the weather and seasonal effects which were to be a feature of KR...
     
  13. Woodsman

    Woodsman Guest

    I do think the CC users who are attached to the classic red dragons have a point, and I know one or two that will not give up the CC as long as the dragons look the way they do in the EC.

    Personally I think it would be a great peace offering to the CC users for somebody to work on the classic red dragons. We got a taste for sharp colors and outlines with Virtuebane, so it can be done.

    As for the problems Roland mentioned, I've felt that my crashes are directly related to memory problems for the most part - I can predict where my crashes are going to be - Luna/Zento. It's not that I'm out of memory either - I've still usually got 6GB or more free, but it's the memory handling.
     
  14. Roland'

    Roland' Lore Keeper
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    I can predict my client will crash somtimes after memory get to 600k+ regularly after 700k+ and omg here its comes at 800K+

    Although i do not crash that i know of in luna or zento, i spent 90% of my time around fel yew. These are where my crashes are happening. Yes some people are stable on EC. Id love to know the specs of the stable ec clients computers. Ive spent hours on teh phone with EA techs and post a bug report every time i crash (yes as often as 10 times a day). As i said above or in another post ive had many people try EC client after i told them the benefits and they have all crashed. All have crashed. People who used the client before me, they all crash. everyone one of these peoples computers ive determined is 4 years old or newer. I hope this info helps.
     
  15. Storm

    Storm UO Forum Moderator
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    Roland i am curious are these crashes when you are moving or recalling ?
     
  16. Storm

    Storm UO Forum Moderator
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    in my experience they only happen when I am doing one of the above NEVER when I am just crafting or doing things that do not involve movement of some type
     
  17. Roland'

    Roland' Lore Keeper
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    yes sir i had one memorable death from casting recall. crashing to desktop and logging back in infront of my house dead. I only remember this happening once though. Always when moving, alot near the grassy area within a couple screens of fel yew gate. alot all around the major yew area. and often when running into a house.

    Heck i set chache to maximum made a few trips around luna running into every vendor house making sure to load everyhting recalled to other busy areas then back to luna and made a few more loops getting my client well over 1mil k and still didnt crash. at that point i closed my client reopened it went to fell yew and crashed 3 minutes later on the grass within site of the gate. im guessing at that time my memory was only up to 400k no more than 500k.
     
  18. Woodsman

    Woodsman Guest

  19. Pinco

    Pinco UOEC Modder
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    it will not. Those statues are 3D concept arts. EC use 2D models so it's impossible to use them if they don't change how the client works.
     
  20. Kons

    Kons Adventurer

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    That's right, EC is exactly as CC for drawing animations (it just has a bilinear filter in addiction)..

    I don't know a lot about graphic designing, but I hope they are storing the 3d concept arts somewhere to make them be used in some future! :)

    I don't know what a higher resolution for the ground means, but i'm really curious about that!
     
  21. Roland of Atlantic

    Roland of Atlantic Journeyman
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    Dragons? Really people? Dragons?

    The dragons in CC have terrible animation. They look like they are statues that are stiff-legged and flat drawings with no apparent depth. They have no idle animation, they just freeze when they stop. When they walk, their legs seem to wiggle randomly as they glide over the terrain. Its like they are suspended above the terrain and their feet are not in contact with it.

    When something walks in a game, I would prefer that it walks naturally, and it appear that their foot stays in place as it walks from one footstep to the next, but apparently that's just me.

    I can see a problem with the enhanced client dragon on one issue, you can't tell a red one from a brown one. But in realism, and looking like a living, breathing animal, enhanced dragons have everything over the classic dragons.

    And I do realize it's a fantasy game, and not really comparable with the real world, but can someone show me a reptile that has more than 4 legs in it's natural state? :D The enhanced swamp dragons took a bit of getting used to, but I'd have to say I do like the way they look now, especially with armor and running. They actually look alive when they run.

    I think it is just what people are accustomed to seeing was suddenly changed, and people don't like change.

    And there MAY be a couple random things here or there that can be done in classic and not in enhanced (I won't rule out the possibility, however remote), but the majority of the things people say can't be done in enhanced can be, but it just wasn't readily apparent how to do so in the 10 minutes that they had alloted to learning the client. On the other hand, there are many things that can be done in enhanced that can't be done in classic, even with all the various add-on programs.
     
  22. Ezekiel Zane

    Ezekiel Zane Grand Inquisitor
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    The dragons in the Enhanced Client are way too small.
     
  23. Lord Raven

    Lord Raven Seasoned Veteran
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    I see quite a few posts on the EC crashing. This happens to me but not very often. I wonder if this correlates to certain in-game activities.

    In particular I wonder to what effect cheaters can have on the client stability of people nearby. I don't engage in many activities where speed-hacking is prevalent, but there have been times I've been around players that seemed to be able to move/cast at an accelrated speed.

    Sometimes just being in the same screen with these folks seems to trigger a crash on my end. (Both EC and Classic clients)

    Just thought I'd toss that in.
     
  24. Roland of Atlantic

    Roland of Atlantic Journeyman
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    Maybe a little, but think about targeting when your dragon visually takes up the entire screen, but in reality only occupies 1 tile. That's another thing they need to fix. If dragons are so big, they should occupy as many tiles as they visually occupy. That would mean no more dragon heads and wings protruding through walls, no more magically squeezing a creature which in reality would weigh several tons through a single doorway... And if they were going to make it a little more realistic, it would need to be eating what it's killing, because an animal that size wouldn't be happy being tossed a scrap of meat every week. Feeding it would be a full time job. :D
     
  25. A Thought Elemental

    A Thought Elemental Journeyman

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    The main thing I think about when I read this is - - I hope the EC Hiryu art as it exists today isn't finished. The 2d one looks like a life form, whereas the EC one looks like a fluorescent rubber chicken.

    I can actually appreciate the way the 2d one looks, and the way the various color phases integrate into the texture of the feathers and such. 2d Hiryus feel worth looking at. The EC one, on the other hand, makes me facepalm.


    This would be a catastrophe in Felucca with it's current "push-through" setup. The multi-tile-size pet would habitually block people into corners where it stands. Combined with the fact that UO tamers cannot despawn their pets or make them move away for positioning purposes, players both friend and foe would be trapped next to it.
     
  26. Cloak&Dagger

    Cloak&Dagger Guest

    While we Don't normally give a ton of credit to the coding ability of the team, I will say it is perfectly possible to code it so while the dragon takes up 2 tiles or more when a player "Pushes" through it, you could have only 1 push check for that Mob.
     
  27. A Thought Elemental

    A Thought Elemental Journeyman

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    Possible: sure, but it doesn't sound straightforward in the context of making it occupy multiple tiles in the first place. Kinda like, making the mob be multi-tile for every physical interaction in the world except for *insert list of gamebreaking things here, including collision with players and all other mobs and player housing doorways and ... *
     
  28. Cloak&Dagger

    Cloak&Dagger Guest

    Well I was not advocating to make them take up the multiple tiles, although I can understand why anyone would want them to (being able to hit them when standing "next" to them and such). I was just simply stating that it is possible to do it with out any game breaking problems. The only real one is the push through, and it is possible to simply overlook the extended part of the dragon when you are walking through it. Either way it is not much of a concern to me, and I don't expect them to do it anyhow.
     
  29. looker118

    looker118 Adventurer

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    No crashes for me so far with the EC but I am amazed how stupefyingly ugly my avatar now is. She no longer looks like a female, being built rather like John Wayne. I am not a happy camper. Why so ugly devs? Yes, I remember, vaguely, how incredibly ugly the early 3D avatars were. I went back to 2D and stayed there. Is this the return of those hideous creatures that haunted my paperdolls?

    Reading this thread, it's clear that the EC is no where near ready to leave beta. It's too unstable. Better to get it right than rush out a disaster that will only anger the player base.
     
  30. Pinco

    Pinco UOEC Modder
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    if you don't like the paperdoll image, enable the legacy paperdoll and you have the 2d version :p
     
  31. Violence

    Violence Lore Keeper
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    Re:

    I can't even play UO at the moment for some obscure reason, so if EC gets out of Beta and that and other issues persist.. It would look real bad.. Regardless of Advanced Grass & Dragons.. ;P :wall:
     
  32. looker118

    looker118 Adventurer

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    Thank you. I didn't know I could use my legacy paperdoll. Still learning this new client.

    Question: Can I use UOAssist with the EC? I'm heavily into crafting and use my mining macro just about daily.
     
  33. Pinco

    Pinco UOEC Modder
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    no but you can use a target by resource macro...
     
  34. looker118

    looker118 Adventurer

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    First, thank you for that amazingly fast response.

    Now, it's back to the learning curve for me. I have no idea - yet - how target by resource works. I will, however, learn. :)