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Don't let Pinco's UI die

Discussion in 'UHall' started by Warrick, Jun 11, 2015.

  1. Warrick

    Warrick Adventurer
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  2. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
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    Done
     
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  3. CovenantX

    CovenantX Babbling Loonie
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    I thought Pinco was hired by EA/BS to keep working on the UI, was that not true? or maybe it was for the default UI only?
     
  4. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
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    He was hired to update and revise the default UI... That project is done.
     
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  5. Lord Gandalf

    Lord Gandalf Babbling Loonie
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    I guess they ran out of budget again :D

    Did anyone ever think about the amount of inactive accounts that still pay their monthly fees? How many houses are owned by players on 27 shards, and how many free to play games are out there... So how much money they can actually make, and what we get in return? Lets not mention the amount of unofficial websites selling gold out there, i think you already know what i mean ;)

    My opinion about pinco will never change; he is the only person who invested money and time developing the UO UI, great output and huge efforts!

    @Pinco is there a way we can donate without using paypal? My country is blacklisted
     
  6. Poo

    Poo The Grandest of the PooBah’s
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    this here is your problem, and its not Pinco's fault, but what he needs is a couple people to donate a small amount every month.
    so like 5 people to donate $5 a month EVERY month.
    or 50 people to donate $1 EVERY month.

    its the same all over.
    take JC for example, he stopped hosting guild maps for those of us that use map with our guilds, i guess i was the last one paying monthly for it and it wasnt enough to keep it going.

    problem is doing that every month people forget, people leave, people get busy.

    i myself dont run EC and when im forced too for whatever reason to use it i use Pinco's for the Hue ID.
    so i made a one time contribution for that a long time ago.

    unfortunately that is as deep as my kindness runs, cause like i said i use it maybe once a year to ID a hue.
    i paid $15 for uoassist 18 years ago and its still working, just saying. Maybe Pinco should have rolled out his product with a one time buy in? but even that only goes so far i guess. we may have to face the facts, having to constantly update a product that has a diminishing clientele is not fiscally viable. its sad but its the (virtual)world we live in.

    im still waiting for the day that UOassist dies.
    and like the die hard Pinco fans that will be the day i will have to leave, because i dont think i could play without my uoassist.
     
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  7. Lord Gandalf

    Lord Gandalf Babbling Loonie
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    Pinco's UI shouldnt consist on entertain us - its the devs job to do it. And im not talking about UI design and cosmetics, im talking about advanced mecanics, better options, actions, settings etc...

    The devs should come up with a UI that pleases everyone and encrypt it, other wise players will keep using secondary softwares to field hack, remove trees, this will also stop people from using other scripts...
     
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  8. Smoot

    Smoot Grand Poobah
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    standard EC has hue id now. dont need pincos just for that anymore.
     
  9. GarthGrey

    GarthGrey Crazed Zealot
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    Someone enlighten me as to why Pinco needs 50/mo to maintain this UI ? How much is that per key stroke, or is he out mining precious UI ore at his real life home to sustain the 1s and 0s ?
     
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  10. Lord Gandalf

    Lord Gandalf Babbling Loonie
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    Here's the link:
    http://stratics.com/community/index.php?threads/:(.342578/
     
  11. GarthGrey

    GarthGrey Crazed Zealot
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    I can only speak for myself, but i would have never volunteered to create a UI of my own free will and accord, if I weren't able to maintain it out of my own pocket. I had typed out a much longer response on my feelings about the link you copied, but then I backspaced over it before hitting Post Reply. It's probably a good thing. :)
     
  12. Smoot

    Smoot Grand Poobah
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    i agree. if he was doing it for love of the game, he wouldnt need donations. what exactly do they go towards? his time? profiting off of it? if he wanted to do that, he should just charge people for the download.

    perhaps if pinco explained why these donations are actually needed more people would donate. even if he does just say "its not worth my time to do it for free" i think people would respect hes at least being honest.
     
  13. Merus

    Merus Babbling Loonie
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    Not sure, but from reading his comments I'm guessing this is related to server hosting for the download and patcher site.
     
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  14. Smoot

    Smoot Grand Poobah
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    he should really say that then if hes lacking blind donations.

    personally, i could never get pincos to even download correctly, and when i tried i got a bunch of bloatware with it. took me an hour just to get rid of the bloatware. I understand some people really like pincos (i find most of it not needed for a classic game like UO) and they should probably donate according to how much they value it.
     
  15. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Grand Poobah
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    Why can't UO or UOStratics host his download
     
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  16. GarthGrey

    GarthGrey Crazed Zealot
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    IBTL :gee:
     
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  17. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Grand Poobah
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    WTF
     
  18. petemage

    petemage Seasoned Veteran

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    IIRC the donations were also meant to keep accounts open so he develop the UI. He might have closed them otherwise, thus not being able to provide his UI at all.

    In fact it's a great piece of software, depsite the love-hate some of us have for it and the new Default UI. There is alot to learn from it technically and it's basically the pinnacle of EC UIs because it's not only his ideas but also a lot ideas of older (now dead) UIs.

    Of course I have a very biased view, but I *personally* don't know a single person playing the new Default EC UI. There is an odd number of private and semi-public UIs, many Pinco's users and of course a lot of CCs.
     
  19. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
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    Personally I wouldn't still be playing UO if it weren't for Pinco's UI. That time I had to go without I hated logging in. I couldn't stand playing in the base EC.... and I'll never ever go back to playing in the CC. I'd rather quit entirely.

    Fact is Pinco's makes the game more enjoyable and less of a hassle. With the way it plots the MIB's, to the way the maps look when I'm trying to do a T-Map.... to the incorporation of the Pet Power Calculator, Hue ID and Item ID as well as the ability to look at a piece of loot and see if it might be relic worthy or if it's just a pile of crap in .02 seconds... And turning it off to loot... just makes me not care about looting... I like the color coding of the loot.. blue good, green Meh.... red garbage. Simple and easy to use. Trying to figure out what something might be worth in the CC or without Pinco's... is just too much of a headache... takes all the "fun" out of the game.

    UO is supposed to be fun and enjoyable... not a chore.
     
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  20. Poo

    Poo The Grandest of the PooBah’s
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    fact of that matter is if Pinco cant even bring himself to pay for his own account or much less even play UO anymore i would say that even IF people pay your gonna see him eventually just fade away.

    if your not playing a game and still drawn to it eventually your gonna just pull off that bandaid and walk away, we have all seen it a hundred times.

    when i read this posted by Pinco its very obvious to me he is dishearten and disinterested - a deadly combination.

     
  21. Poo

    Poo The Grandest of the PooBah’s
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    hehe, its friday and i just had a funny thought.
    funny that 'good stuff' like Pinco's needs funding and cant get it so will fail to be continued.
    YET, 3rd party programs that shall not be mentioned have no problem ticking along for free year after year.

    kind of ironic, no?
    ironic.... moronic.... prophetic?
     
  22. petemage

    petemage Seasoned Veteran

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    Because Pinco's never crossed the line into the darker areas :D It doesn't farm just away :p
     
  23. Smoot

    Smoot Grand Poobah
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    i guarantee you your throwing away tons of gold, and probably keeping junk if your basing whats good loot off those colors. a 5, or even 1 mod item can be tons more valueable than a 15 mod item.
     
  24. GarthGrey

    GarthGrey Crazed Zealot
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    ................
     
  25. Kayhynn

    Kayhynn Certifiable
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    From what I recall from a year or two ago, Pinco also ran into RL issues which made UO a "luxury" that he couldn't easily afford to keep going and other priorities came before the game and the website. At times like those, if we can afford to help out Stratics in the past and other sites to keep going/defer costs, we can definitely help Pinco.

    Pinco - expect a donation after the 19th.
     
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  26. Yadd of Legends

    Yadd of Legends Certifiable
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    I think there was always a rift between Pinco and the rest of the developers. They wanted a basic UI and he wanted all the bells and whistles. He helped deliver the basic EC and then added all his bells and whistles in his version. There's no doubt that Pinco's is superior, but it's too much. @Smoot has made the same argument. I would rather see the basic EC with just a few of Pinco's features added. We don't need all the bells and whistles that Pinco's added - which is why I disable the advanced layout and the advanced crafting system, which are just ridiculously cumbersome and slow you down. So no, Broadsword is not going to support Pinco's UI. But I wish the basic EC could incorporate some of the features (one simple example: autofill for BODs). Or if you CC fans want to argue for adding some EC and Pinco's features to CC so people don't need uoassist, that's fine. Why make people play a game where they have to install third-party programs to make it playable? Talk about erecting barriers for new players.
     
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  27. Kayhynn

    Kayhynn Certifiable
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    Strangely, that has become common place these days.
    WoW
    Wildstar
    World of Tanks
    I can go on all use thirrd-party programs to make it easier to play.
     
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  28. Yadd of Legends

    Yadd of Legends Certifiable
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    Yea, I understand your point, almost all games have user mods - easier, fine, but UO is not even playable at all without outside help
     
  29. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
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    Some would argue with you there... but I totally agree... and Yes @Smoot there are a few pieces I do pick up that have 1 or 2 base properties on them... But I don't "sell" anything... and most the relic stuff I pick up I pick up to break down into relic fragments. If I need the other parts for crafting I just dig up or fish up a couple chests and destroy all of it that usually gets me MORE than enough of the other two Imbuing ingredients.

    I only keep pieces that I think will be useful to someone... either if they are just working on building up skills... or if they might actually be something worth putting on someone... More often than not I unravel most of the stuff I pick up.

    I keep any piece that has SSI on it if it's alone or with something like HCI, DCI or DI.... then I can add what I need to it... But if it's SSI and other crap I don't need or want it's not worth picking up in the first place... I'll ALWAYS pick up rings and bracelets with 1FC or 3FCR if that's the ONLY property on them or if it comes with SDI. But if it's got stupid stuff like DI on it then it's not worth picking up. I don't have a single magic user that needs DI.

    I've found that most jewelery seems to be geared towards having a Chivy/Dexer... or something... I have no idea why I'd want SDI or LRC on a warrior bracelet. Top things I want on a warrior/dexer bracelet is SSI, DCI, and HCI. I'd be happy if it came with some sort of stamina increase or Dex bonus, and sometimes I'm ok with it having LMC. But I honestly don't have any use for LRC on it or SDI.
     
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  30. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Grand Poobah
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    That depends on what you are doing. The only thing I use UOA for anymore is filling BODs all other play is done with the CC only. If there were a way to fill BODs without UOA then I would not even need it. No I will not use the EC but glad you are able to.
     
  31. Poo

    Poo The Grandest of the PooBah’s
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    ...................

    ?
     
  32. sibble

    sibble Lore Master
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    I've donated plenty towards Pinco's UI in the past and I've been an advocate of his UI since I started using it. You won't find a bigger promoter (except for Pinco himself of course.) I've used it up until recently, resorting to making my own UI since the only two options for user interfaces are buggy.

    With that being said... there are bugs in the default UI, there are bugs in Pinco's UI, you can see these bugs clearly by typing /debugwindow, clicking on Show Options, enabling all types of logging, then check Enable Logging and go run around a bit. It has been this way for over 6 months. These are not new bugs, these are old bugs that have been reported and discussed. The bugs that the log catches are actually easy to fix, but there are also bugs that don't show up in the log.

    As far as the default UI, Pinco is not the one to blame. He obviously wasn't paid to keep the default UI updated and/or is not on the payroll.

    As far as Pinco's UI, I honestly think he just lost interest in it. These bugs existed for over 6 months, while the project health status was still healthy. The donations started as something to get people to post new ideas and donate towards getting them added. I stopped donating because bugs stopped getting fixed.
     
    #32 sibble, Jun 12, 2015
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2015
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  33. kelmo

    kelmo Old and in the way
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    I am OK with Pinco's light we have a default EC user interface.
     
  34. Corpin

    Corpin Journeyman
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    Oh come on, if we all used that logic we would have stopped paying our UO subs years ago!...
     
  35. Smoot

    Smoot Grand Poobah
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    i do all pvm content classic no EC or UOassist even. seems to work fine. the thing about UO is its a very casual game. the content is relatively easy, meaning you can pretty much just go with the flow after you have a solid character / suit. no need for maximizing or timing things down to split seconds cuase its just not needed to complete content like it is in other games.

    when i pvp (which is rare in the past year) i try to use EC for the "features" but mainly just to compete with others using EC like the speed and auto-pathfinding among other options previously only found in cheat programs.

    for me, and i think many more oldschool UOers theres no need for extras that are actually necessary to be successful in other games.
     
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  36. Yadd of Legends

    Yadd of Legends Certifiable
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    not helpful for new players, though, right?
    EDIT: I mean, OK, I started and built up all my characters on CC, have never used UOAssist, but would I recommend that aracane macro system to anyone starting out? I don't think so
     
  37. GarthGrey

    GarthGrey Crazed Zealot
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    Thats the response I use in gc a lot when someone says something that just leaves me sort of speechless, even though I have lots to say . :)
     
  38. Pinco

    Pinco UOEC Modder
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    I've fixed all that has been reported and that I can replicate, what I can't replicate I can't fix.
    (there is still the vendor hair color bug that requires some time)
     
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  39. Poo

    Poo The Grandest of the PooBah’s
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    ah, k, understood.
    not really, but ill say i do...... and smile, maybe a little wave..... everyone look away.... nothing to see here...... SQUIRREL!
     
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  40. Duncan McDermott

    Duncan McDermott Seasoned Veteran

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    I can see me making a regular donation to keep the UI running. What I can't see is me paying for someone elses account for them to play.
    If that is the case then I need donations to keep my account running. Sorry Pinco nothing personal just an opinion.
     
  41. Xanthril of LA

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    Given the contributions Pinco has made to the game, perhaps Broadsword can just let him play his account(s) for free. That would at least give him a start on a monthly amount that will allow him to continue his good work. Pinco gets something, Broadsword gets something, everyone that uses Pinco's UI gets something. Sounds like a good start to me.
     
  42. Pinco

    Pinco UOEC Modder
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    that would make sense if I was playing the game, but I'm keeping the account just for the UI, it's been a VERY long time since I played the game....
     
  43. Yadd of Legends

    Yadd of Legends Certifiable
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    That makes sense, because if you were playing the game, you'd be seeing the problems that need fixed - not blaming you, just saying
    In any event, it seems the OP makes no sense in this context
     
  44. Galingree

    Galingree Journeyman
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    I just donated. Money talks and ******** walks.
     
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  45. Olcher

    Olcher Crazed Zealot
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    While I don't doubt it is a lot of work, care to give a breakdown on your expenses? People may be more likely to donate if they knew exactly what/where it was going to.

    (I don't use the EC or the UI just saying in general terms)
     
  46. Pinco

    Pinco UOEC Modder
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    Probably, but I would also have added more features (and people don't want any more new features), and I've wanted to fix and improve things (that cannot be improved because the client doesn't allow it) :p

    The domain + database is not free at all (and right now the cost is already shared with someone), the game itself has a cost since I have to keep the account active just for the UI, and sometimes I have to activate more than 1 accounts for certain features and fixes + any new booster/expansion is required in order to adapt the contents. And let's not forget about the art used in the UI, a simple icon costs 5-10$.
    Then remember that I don't play this game anymore so all the time I spend on this project since I stop playing has been the only thing that has been free...
     
  47. cazador

    cazador Crazed Zealot
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    I don't see why he's getting such a hard time. Who cares what his expenses are. Either you donate or don't. If it doesn't get funded he doesn't keep it up to date. It's a pretty simple thing. Btw I don't use the EC..but it's still good to have people that put so much of their "OWN" personal time to try and make other players playtime that much better! +1 to @Pinco for all the hard work without reward!


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  48. Yadd of Legends

    Yadd of Legends Certifiable
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    This is what I've always suspected has been the root problem, Pinco doing his best to overlay a foundation that itself needs fixing. In any event, thanks, Pinco, for what you did.
     
  49. Yadd of Legends

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    So did I today. Not to keep it going, since Pinco has made it pretty clear that he's done all can or is inclined to do, but for services rendered, since I have been using it and appreciate the effort.
     
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  50. Duncan McDermott

    Duncan McDermott Seasoned Veteran

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    Yes he deserves that much I am donating also today. I just hope he gets enough donations to keep the UI going. I for one would hate to keep playing without it. T-hunts are so much easier with his UI.
     
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