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Don't worry even the "best" of us do it.

Discussion in 'UO Oceania' started by Guest, Jan 30, 2008.

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  1. Guest

    Guest Guest


    Removed the link because I couldn't get it to change *feels embarrassed*.
  2. Not sure exactly what you're trying to say here Petrify, tho if you're implying that UOWedding is an Illegal Third Party Program, then perhaps you should read this:<font color=red>UO Stratics - UO Wedding Essay</font>

    And, when you're posting urls, it's better if you don't post them as you do and therefore make the entire thread a mile wide.
    The instructions on how to do that are in the Stratics FAQ, or PM me and I'd be happy to show you how it's done. [​IMG]
  3. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Cbbed... Anyway. UO wedding isn't legal according to EA. Stratics doesn't = EA.

    Counselors = long gone from UO and GM's will only enforce stuff that's said on that "support" website I asked a GM too, they gave me that link. So according to them it = not legal.
  4. Shouldn't come as any great shock to anyone that our current GMs don't actually know everything about UO.
    Maybe next time you talk to a GM about UOWedding, you should give him the link I gave you, and see what he/she says about it then, huh? [​IMG]
  5. Cymoril

    Cymoril Guest


    Cbbed... Anyway. UO wedding isn't legal according to EA. Stratics doesn't = EA.

    [/ QUOTE ]True enough, but Stratics is an official Fansite,
    and as such, Stratics isn't permitted to have links to any illegal programs.
    If we did, I believe our fansite status would be revoked.

    I think the answer as to why UO Wedding is legal is in the link you posted:

    <blockquote>...any other program that runs independently of UO,
    and has no effect on the UO data stream or software are generally ok to use.
    </blockquote>UO Wedding effectively copies and pastes text into UO.
    It's no more illegal than using notepad to copy and Ctrl-V to paste into UO.

    So for someone who "Cbbed", you went to a lot of trouble to post a journal log,
    search for a link and make a post about nothing.
    Though to be fair to you, at least you didn't bother to check your facts. [​IMG]
  6. Cellmate

    Cellmate Guest

    LMAO... Pet pwned! [​IMG]
  7. Tal'shiar

    Tal'shiar Guest

    If one wanted to be exact you could say that it is Illegal because it doesn't say that it is one of the safe programs to use.
    Mind you, you can use the same logic when discussing speed hacks. It doesn't state clearly that it is against the TOS or whatever its called in the game (and that little help thing there) so it can be defined as being on the border.
    Especially hacks that speed up your whole computer not just the individual program. One can say that it is being used for other means and is "technically" legal.
  8. Stratics dont make the rules. So your link is invalid and Pet is correct, the person is using a third party application that has NOT BEEN APPROVED by EA.

    So in other words you condone cheating because automation of tasks by programs other than those approved by EA is CHEATING.

    In this case the GM is CORRECT and STRATICS are hypocrites for promoting an application that IS NOT UOPRO.

    Just in case your simple mind can not GRASP THE CONCEPT, there are NO COUNCELORS ANYMORE. I should know, I was one for 1 1/2 years until they shut the program down.

    So get off your high horse, CHEATING is CHEATING.
  9. There are no semantics to play with here. The UO TOS states only UOPRO applications can be used.

    This program is not UOPRO and even says so on the link provided.

    Just because the application appears to be harmless, does not justify CHEATING, which using that application is.

    You cant have it both ways, either you use UOPRO only applications or you sit in the same group as those that script for skill gain. You are both using applications not approved by EA.

    I love how people think that rules only apply in some circumstances and not others.
  10. <blockquote><hr>

    LMAO... Pet pwned! [​IMG]

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Are Pet pwned as you said you trammies that this cheating is the scurge of this game yet when caught cheating yourselves you now defend the use of ILLEGAL THIRD PARTY applications.

    You have been pwned for showing your ignorance.
  11. You can justify it anyway you want. But the line was drawn in the sand by EA when they said they only approve the use of third party applications.

    I have a program that records my mouse movements and does not interfer with the UO Data stream. Therefore under your logic I can use that program with UO.

    WRONG, its not an approved third party program and therefore is illegal.

    I laugh at how even Stratics cant even follow the rules EA have published, even though Stratics are so far up EA's .... they havent seen daylight in years.
  12. Lol, more trolls in your last 4 posts to this thread than you'd be likely to see in Level 3 Despise there.

    Still, since you claim to have been a councillor, and I have no reason at all to doubt your veracity on that claim, I guess you're speaking from an experience and understanding few of the rest of us would share.
    However, in reference to Cymorils quote, that you seem to have passed over, I believe that was taken from the UO KB, in fact the same article that Pet quoted in the OP.
    I tend to think that a statement made by EA as quoted by both Petrify and Cymoril, albeit different parts of the same article, would/should/can/does satisfy anyone's queries at the use of such "tools" in the game. And that would be even moreso for one such as yourself who clearly has long standing and profound understanding of the game and it's rules.

    Anyway, in case you missed it...here's the complete article again, and I believe UO Wedding, as well as many other programs such as UO Bod, UO Rudder, UOA Translator, UO Vendor and others...all listed on the UO.Stratics.Com main page are covered by the EA statement, as per the section I have highlighted below:


    From EA Customer Support:

    Which 3rd Party Programs can I use with UO?

    Only these programs are permitted to be used with UO. If you don't see a program listed here, it is not approved for use with UO.

    * UOAssist: Website - Details
    * UO Auto-Map: Website - Details
    * UO Calculator: Website - Details
    * UO Curse Tool: Website - Details
    * UO Journal Converter: Website - Details
    * UO Magic Tool: Website - Details
    * UO Spawn Map: Website - Details

    These products were created, and are marketed and distributed by individual authors under license from Electronic Arts, Inc. Electronic Arts HAS NOT TESTED THESE PRODUCTS IN ANY WAY WHATSOEVER AND DOES NOT KNOW WHETHER THEY WORK IN ANY OR ALL REASONABLY FORESEEABLE SITUATIONS OR THAT THEY WILL NOT CAUSE DAMAGE IN SOME REASONABLY FORESEEABLE SITUATIONS. The individual author solely warrants that these products will work as intended to your reasonable expectations, and does not infringe anyone's intellectual property rights.

    Electronic Arts has not checked the source code for any of these programs. Electronic Arts will not be held responsible for anything that should happen to your account or computer as a result of using these programs. Electronic Arts does not support these programs. If you have problems with them, please contact the author of the program directly. Use at your own risk.

    Programs such as ICQ, AIM, UO Trace,
    <font color=blue>or any other program that runs independently of UO, and has no effect on the UO data stream or software are generally ok to use.</font>

    We are frequently asked about programs such as Multi-UO and some programs that automate macros in the game. Again, if it is not in the approved list of UO Pro programs, then it is not ok to use with UO.

    We are not currently accepting submissions to the Third Party Affiliate Program.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Hopefully UO Stratics as well as many other players interpretation of these rules is in the same general spirit that the answer given by EA conveys.

    Still, I can't help but think that you know that already, and you just made those 4 replies to this thread to get a few bites...or maybe just to bump your own post count. I've never heard of anyone having action taken against there account for using any of the applications mentioned by Stratics, have you?

    Anyway, I think there may be sufficient "grey area" there to warrant further investigation on all these utilities, so I'll post to UOHall and hopefully get an even more definitive and up-to-date answer from someone like Jeremy or Robert from EA Mythic, just to be sure. No-one would want to be unintentionally breaking the rules now, would they?[​IMG]
  13. Guest

    Guest Guest

    I found these the other day digger and after reading your post I thought you may like to have them to use *smiles*


  14. The EA customer post as you mentioned is open to interuptation and heres one way of seeing it, as is your way.

    ICQ, AIM and other such applications have no direct impact on the game, they dont touch the game client.

    UOWedding, Ghost Mouse and other applications that DO TOUCH the client are a violation of the TOS.

    Now if I want to take my troll hat off for a minute, you could say that the spirit of UOWedding is not to provide an advantage to the user and therefore is harmless.

    My point is that becomes a slippery slop because I could argue that using Ghost Mouse does not give me an advantage if I dont use it to give me an advantage.

    So I was arguing that the TOS state only UOPRO applications can be used in conjunction with UO and that the slippery slope is what you stand on when to start making exceptions.
  15. <blockquote><hr>

    Again, if it is not in the approved list of UO Pro programs, then it is not ok to use with UO.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    EA are quite specific on this point as well and you using the AIM and ICQ are not the same thing.
  16. Ghost Mouse? Not heard of that, and I'm pretty sure it's not listed on the Stratics Main Page with the other apps we're talking about, so I can't comment on it.

    However, because it can be argued that there is a potential for mis-interpreting the stance as stated by EA in that answer, as you point out, I have posted to UOHall in the hope that we can all get some clarification. Hopefully we'll get a satisfactory answer because I think it's long overdue and could end any confusion that may exist in the whole issue.
    That would benefit all of us, including Stratics, yes?

    Anyway, here's a linky to my post on UOHall, feel free to bump it now and then, lol :<font color=blue>Jeremy or Robert, please -UO Wedding, UO Rudder, UOBod et al - Clarification of Legality?? </font></center>

    (Sheesh Pet, edit that url you posted will you? Even you have to agree it makes it painful to post replies, and I bet UOPodcasting agrees too!)
  17. I wouldnt hold my breath of getting any response from EA.

    Mainly due to the fact that have answered the question a heap of times and will refer you to the customer service page for EA.

    I know Stratics are an official fan site and GM's will even tell you to post on Stratics, but Stratics cant start making policy decisions for EA by just posting what they approve.

    The end of the day, UOWedding and other applications in the same spirit wont get you banned. Ghost Mouse is not in the same spirit and therefore would get you banned as it can be used to automate thing more so than just speaking in game.
  18. Guest

    Guest Guest


    LMAO... Pet pwned!

    [/ QUOTE ]


    I don't see any possibility of exception in that statement - "Again, if it is not in the approved list of UO Pro programs, then it is not ok to use with UO." That's pretty blunt. No?

    [/ QUOTE ]

    LMAO... Constable and everyone else pwned!
  19. Guest

    Guest Guest


    I guess he shouldn't hold his breath on a thank you for pointing out that you guys that use UO Wedding are risking your accounts.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    As I said "even the best of us do it".

    Oh and according to them my post is a "troll". The truth backed up by facts is a troll eh? Well you guys dug your own hole, I was prepared to not post and concede that it didn't interfere with the data stream but you had to go and make a thread on UO hall, Jeremy replied and owned you.

    The whole of UO hall has basically proved you guys wrong...
  20. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Not sure exactly how UO Wedding works.. admittedly I looked at it, unaware of an legality issues at the time.. either way, I was spared any moral angst by being too thick-headed to figure the program out.. but, and here's where I was going with this..

    UO Curse is a pretty decent tool for preparing speeches and other text macros, and it seems to have the thumbs up from EA. We've used it in Thunderdome for announcements and quips, etc. I've never bothered with the curse function itself as I'm not a fan of Elizabethan English, but if the curse words could be customised I'd probably mash that button non-stop...
  21. Guest

    Guest Guest

    So will all you trammy's change your morale stance on third party programs or accept that you've been using them too and continue to use them?
  22. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Me? It's not my anti-3rd-party stance, matey. [​IMG]

    Just offering an alternative endorsement for those who might find themselves in a bind over UO Wedding. If it did what I wanted, I might use it, who knows.. can't say I've considered running any UO weddings (I find them a little creepy, to be honest).

    At any rate, I use UO:Assist for 98.95768% of my gameplay.. *shrug* frogloads of purists consider that cheating, but I'd be up a proverbial creek without it. Sure, UO:A's legal etc, but it's all a "slippery slope"; EA just can't be buggered looking at stuff like UO Wedding, etc, to ratify it. I remember some guy called "a pantomime" who did the most amazing street theatre using a 3rd party app that let him access all the emote/actions in 2D. Shame that app couldn't be given the official seal. I just wish there was more cool stuff like that to be had, wouldn't want to lose my account over street theatre though.
  23. Guest

    Guest Guest


    So will all you trammy's change your morale stance on third party programs or accept that you've been using them too and continue to use them?

    [/ QUOTE ]

    NO I wont change my stance and no I don't use any third party programs what so ever so please do not say "All you trammies" as that is like us saying "everyone who goes to fel is a mindless forum troll".

    On the topic of UO wedding given that it is merely spieling out words I don't see it even remotely the same as speed hacking or scripting to gain an advantage in some way.

    I am curious to see if Digger gets a response on UHALL and what that response will be. As the lines definitely seem to be blurred by the quote given.
  24. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Lol, read the thread. He's gotten a lot of posts and has been proven wrong.
  25. rtlpfc

    Im not sure what response anyone is waiting for.

    The orginal question was, "are these applications allowed" and EA said no, only these ones are allowed.

    Any further dicussion is like a child that ask's his/her mother for something and she say no, so the child runs to dad to see if they can get a more suitable response.

    I guess if they continue to behave like children Jermey may seek relief and give them whatever answer they seek, just to get them off her back.
  26. Guest

    Guest Guest

    The response does seem to say ONLY this list is aloud.....and that list does not have UO wedding on it, why that is I do not know and it does seem a shame as I know alot of event holders use it or It is believed they do I actually can not say who does and who doesn't.

    I personally don't use anything that is not in UO, so it doesn't really affect me either way but I can see how it would be painful for those who do use it, as uo wedding is simply making talking or long winded explanations and speeches in game easier on the fingers.

    Perhaps EA need to look at allowing it, or making something available in game that can do the same or bringing back EM's so that we don't have to run our own event's so much as it was apart of the game alot of people enjoyed.
  27. Dalecti

    Dalecti Guest

    no, stump, dont you see - *this* 3rd party prog is ok, because its different...

    sure its not on the list, and a dev has directly stated that anything not on the list is not ok, but only evil pks use 3rd party programs, so therefore it cant be bad...

    dont worry trams, all your kind will ***** and moan and get their way once again and you can all have your weddings.

    though having gotten what they wished for, theyll ***** and moan again because someone will figure out how to use it in an 'illegal' way, thus further breaking the game.

    are you seeing a sort of pattern here?
  29. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Pretty much cut and dried, yeah.. rather, exactly.
  30. Guest

    Guest Guest


    locked for obvious reasons.

    Dont make me go back through this thread and kick some butt...

    oh and drac, give it up, you cant hide from me.
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