1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.
  2. Greetings Guest!!

    In order to combat SPAM on the forums, all users are required to have a minimum of 2 posts before they can submit links in any post or thread.

    Dismiss Notice

Draconi - Please give us a clue about the new upcoming faction changes...

Discussion in 'UHall' started by imported_Daelomin, Mar 26, 2008.

  1. We heard you have been working on faction changes. If only minor changes, it would be great to hear what thrilling things you have come up with...

    Maybe we could help you with ideas and feedback...

    If a faction update is done right I am sure both old and current pvp-faces will be very happy... its long-awaited!!
     
  2. Guest

    Guest Guest

    As JC posted in another thread, these initial changes are structural, and aimed at enabling better participation in factions.

    The following changes are slated for Pub 52:
    <ul>[*]Turn off load balancing; factions can grow to any size[*]Allow multiple characters on the same faction, from the same account[*]Reduce quit time from 7 to 3 days[*]Fix stairs for ghosts (should resolve issues with the SL base)[/list]
    Further publishes will then focus on gameplay bugs, and then enhancements
     
  3. Chap

    Chap Babbling Loonie
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2003
    Messages:
    2,023
    Likes Received:
    6
    Thanks!

    love you longtime &lt;3
     
  4. Thanks for the quick response...

    Looking forward to any new changes... [​IMG] factions have been pretty stale for years - and it was once a loved system.

    The main reason no ppl play in factions is that there are no rewards for doing it. There used to be rewards of blessed armour and good weapons but these are pointless atm.

    If only a small reward for being in factions were put in, it would be a good start... perhaps add 5% chance to get 120 Powerscroll on top of the current 5% if you are in factions AND control a town... that would be a start...
     
  5. Winder UO

    Winder UO Guest

    IMO you should add damage increase for your chars on champions and harrowers based on how many towns your current faction is controlling. Aswell as faction only gear that can be bought for silver.
     
  6. Chap

    Chap Babbling Loonie
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2003
    Messages:
    2,023
    Likes Received:
    6
    When it comes to the reward system in faction you would want to go through the design phase to do any of these changes. if first doing the design phase you might aswell follow the proper Method to ensure a good end product. Faction is something that will be inteded to last for a long time, rushing out products/systems doesnt make a good system. Allthough the changes Draconi posted seems quick fixes, the ideas posted by Daelomin &amp; winder are not.

    Take your time, make it properly.
    but start now, not next year :-]
     
  7. mrrippletip

    mrrippletip Guest

    a percentage of all goods sold in a faction town on the Trammel facet should get deposited into that city's treasury on the Fellucca facet, and you should be able to access it if you control that town...to spend it any way you see fit
     
  8. Guest

    Guest Guest

    That's an excellent start. I hope more is in the works!
     
  9. Thanks for finally spilling the beans, Draconi! It will be interesting to see how these couple of changes work out....the second one is the one I find most intriguing. [​IMG]
     
  10. Guest

    Guest Guest

    So the way is being paved for the final decline of factions.
    Helping to create a stronger "monopoly" effect, as if there are not enough of these types of play in uo already.
    And! changing base code cross shard which has been around for eight years because one loud and inexperienced "player" asked it to be changed is very disconcerting.

    If I knew I could ask for anything if I posted enough about it I would have been more squeeky in past years. hmmm maybe we can get rid of Tram and expand Fel 3 times its size. Ya I like that, please get rid of Trammel and improve Felluca.
    Make a few no red zones, but keep the good stuff in Fel so players have to work together again. Tram destoyed the great connections that used to be in uo. Removing Tram will improve the players ability to work together again...
     
  11. Looks good for the most part.


    unbalancing of factions should be watched carefully as it could be harmful.


    May we also think about faction allowing runics to be used once again?

    it was taken away when runics first came out because it was over powered... Now the runic system is a lot different. Perhaps re implement that ability?
     
  12. Chap

    Chap Babbling Loonie
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2003
    Messages:
    2,023
    Likes Received:
    6
    The faction system is outdated.

    It can not handle large guilds which is common today. This change will make larger guilds able to join faction. The idea is to get guilds to join, not to make "stronger monopoly".

    Secondly its not a one shard change. its a all-shard publish.

    Thirdly, ever seen V for Vandetta?
    In this case its many people who want faction changes, but someone has to be infront of the campaign and I think JC is doing a fine job.

    As for all 'quick fix' ideas:
    I have a thousand ideas for Faction system myself, but I wont post any 'quick fix' ideas. Ideas are only reasonable if thought well through. I dont think yours 'remove trammel' is much constructive Faustis. A thread of ideas has to be constructive, well thought through and be presented in a proper manner. This thread is not one of those.
     
  13. Sheri_UO

    Sheri_UO Guest

    Please consider this...
    1) Massive guilds will own factions and i think its a bad idea. Community is good but everyone joining the same guild is bad.

    2) reduce the stat loss timer. Factions totaly suck because of this and people have asked sence it began to lower this.


    Thanks.
     
  14. Guest

    Guest Guest

    It's a potential risk I agree.. But when no-one plays factions anymore anyway it's hardly a big one.
    I think you'll find in most cases the community can moderate itself in this regard rather than having solid contraints. I for one would prefer to join an undermanned faction and I'm sure many feel the same.
     
  15. The Man Who

    The Man Who Visitor
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Apr 12, 2003
    Messages:
    20
    Likes Received:
    1
    Statloss needs to affect all faction chars on you're account when one dies, or fights may never end.
     
  16. Guest

    Guest Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    Please consider this...
    1) Massive guilds will own factions and i think its a bad idea. Community is good but everyone joining the same guild is bad.

    [/ QUOTE ]
    When I did my census last month only two shards had what could be considered "active" factions, Great Lakes and Siege Perilous. What difference is there if a massive guild can own factions when almost every shard has no activity in factions.

    The limiters served their purpose 7 years ago but don't make any sense today.
     
  17. Sakkarah

    Sakkarah UO Legend
    VIP Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2004
    Messages:
    1,332
    Likes Received:
    11
    <blockquote><hr>

    The limiters served their purpose 7 years ago but don't make any sense today.

    [/ QUOTE ]
    In the short-term, limiters could be detrimental, but in the long-term, it might very well be another story altogether. Do we want to see Factions turn into another Champ Spawn zerg where one guild basically drives away everyone else? You more than anyone else is aware of how damaging it can be.

    I agree with some of the other posters. The changes Draconi is putting forward are great to help getting the Atl Factions event going and give an initial boost to reviving Factions, but in the long term, a careful review will need to be done so we dont just have a quick fix that will only rekindle interest temporarily then have us see Factions get deserted again.
     
  18. Sheri_UO

    Sheri_UO Guest

    It would be about the same as a 5 man guild trying to do champ spawns. As it was everyone would join the same faction anyway.

    Maybe guilds shouldent be allowed in factions at all for this exact reason, i mean people tend to go the easy way and join the most powerfull guilds so why would factions be any different. What skill is there in joining a massive guild to smash smaller ones day after day. I hope they make a change like this to bring more "skill" based play into the game.

    Im sure alot of guild members would be lost without voice chat or 50 people to help them gank 3 guys, any vet would be happy if it became more skill and less mob based.

    And yes i am a solo player, you dont need a massive guild to be good at uo.
     
  19. <blockquote><hr>

    Please consider this...
    1) Massive guilds will own factions and i think its a bad idea. Community is good but everyone joining the same guild is bad.

    2) reduce the stat loss timer. Factions totaly suck because of this and people have asked sence it began to lower this.


    Thanks.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I think we need time (maybe 2-3 months) to see the effect of these upcoming changes before any further changes are made.

    At the present time, I would fight tooth and nail to keep the 20 minute skill loss period after you die in factions and keep the "no beneficial acts" rule that prevents nonfaction characters from aiding faction characters. I've played in both dominant factions and underdog factions and I firmly believe that the skill loss period is good for everyone because it forces players to work as a team, spend time strategizing, and be creative in their tactics. I think the "no beneficial acts" rule helps to make sure that the people that are in factions take it seriously. I certainly haven't found it to be an obstacle to my enjoyment of the game. I hunt in Trammel with my faction characters and seldom worry about the fact that they're pretty much on their own if they run into trouble.

    I will be very very disappointed if modifications to factions lead to a situation where underdog factions just don't stand a chance and the number of people you can bring in is always the deciding factor. The way things stand now, yes there are not very many people participating in factions. However, the people that are in it now are pretty dedicated to it and I think truly enjoy the strategizing, the plotting, the planning, the underhandedness, in addition to the PvP. (Note: By underhandedness, I'm not talking about using hacks and exploits. I'm talking about doing things like putting 45 traps in front of your base to keep one lowly opposing faction out. 45 traps you say? Well, you can get that many when you put out 15 traps for your faction and 15 each for two of the other opposing factions. It may not be terribly practical for your own guys at times, but it sure does make things interesting and oh my does it make a trap remover's heart race....)
     
  20. Guest

    Guest Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    Maybe guilds shouldent be allowed in factions at all for this exact reason, i mean people tend to go the easy way and join the most powerfull guilds so why would factions be any different. What skill is there in joining a massive guild to smash smaller ones day after day. I hope they make a change like this to bring more "skill" based play into the game.

    [/ QUOTE ]
    When factions was introduced going guildless in PVP was very common. Today it is rare to see a player not in a PVP guild. Almost no 1 on 1 combat takes place anymore, it revolves entirely around guilds So preventing guilds from joining factions? A very bad idea.

    However, I don't like the change for quitting from 7 to 3 days. That will definitely encourage people to switch factions more often.

    I just went over the faction statistics real quickly and there are 8 shards with no one in factions. That is nearly 33% of all shards.
     
  21. Sheri_UO

    Sheri_UO Guest

    Your talking about Order/chaos. Back then most faction players followed like sheep the strongest guilds that joined factions.

    Now what were going to have is the same 1 or 2 guilds (say monoply) who own the champ spawns on each shard to own factions to. WRONG.

    Its like you almost have to join a massive guild just to advance you guy past 100 these days. Some people do prefer smaller guilds, what chance will they have? Will a solo player have any chance?



    ..
     
  22. <blockquote><hr>

    It would be about the same as a 5 man guild trying to do champ spawns. As it was everyone would join the same faction anyway.

    Maybe guilds shouldent be allowed in factions at all for this exact reason, i mean people tend to go the easy way and join the most powerfull guilds so why would factions be any different. What skill is there in joining a massive guild to smash smaller ones day after day. I hope they make a change like this to bring more "skill" based play into the game.

    Im sure alot of guild members would be lost without voice chat or 50 people to help them gank 3 guys, any vet would be happy if it became more skill and less mob based.

    And yes i am a solo player, you dont need a massive guild to be good at uo.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Sheri, if more people join factions, I think it will be a bit harder to be a lone wolf in factions. I'm not saying it won't happen, because on a day to day basis, a lot of what does happen in factions is done by the thieves and they often function very well on their own without a guild backing them up.
     
  23. Sheri_UO

    Sheri_UO Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    <blockquote><hr>

    I just went over the faction statistics real quickly and there are 8 shards with no one in factions. That is nearly 33% of all shards.

    [/ QUOTE ]


    One reason for that and one only. Nobody likes stat-loss.

    Forever

    Joining factions is useless when you can make a red, reguardless of what pixel crack factions might offer people. People pvp to pvp and allowing the same massive guilds to control it shouldent be allowed.
    ...
     
  24. Cowgoesmoo

    Cowgoesmoo Guest

    Maybe stat loss is being applied to the wrong group?

    Maybe NON faction players should be suffering from stat loss when killed by another player (or their pet) and the Faction players shouldn't, or have it to a significantly lesser extent, when killed by a fellow factioner.

    Still leaves room for the PKer and the PvPer play styles.
    PKing shouldn't be easy.
    While PvP should be for fun.
     
  25. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Scrap factions, bring back Abyss!

    /uselessfantasy
     
  26. Guest

    Guest Guest

    here is what will happen, big guild joins factions, smaller guilds try to hide from them by joining same faction, 3 days later killing spree ensues because big guild jumped factions and slaughters smaller guilds trying to hide from them,

    I don't know how to type evil laugh and make it seem evil , but I would do that here if I could.
     
  27. Guest

    Guest Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    Scrap factions, bring back Abyss!

    /uselessfantasy

    [/ QUOTE ]I agree. Instead of fixing factions... it should be dismantled and it's best features &amp; functions rolled into the guild/alliance system. Where it should have been all along.

    Just my 2 pesos.
     
  28. <blockquote><hr>


    Turn off load balancing; factions can grow to any size


    [/ QUOTE ]

    Good for the faction event, but wait till everybody returns to their own shards and there's a 500 strong ZERG in a single faction. (Except Siege [​IMG]).

    <blockquote><hr>


    Allow multiple characters on the same faction, from the same account


    [/ QUOTE ]

    If they made it so one character in stat on that account puts all characters in stat, then fine. If they didn't, see above, but multiply it by 5 (or 6 or 7...whatever the account character limit is). (Except Siege [​IMG]).

    <blockquote><hr>


    Reduce quit time from 7 to 3 days


    [/ QUOTE ]

    This one is fine...

    <blockquote><hr>


    Fix stairs for ghosts (should resolve issues with the SL base)


    [/ QUOTE ]

    This is like the PBD issue...it took them soooo long to fix it. Why should we be thanking them and all impressed?
     
  29. <blockquote><hr>

    As JC posted in another thread, these initial changes are structural, and aimed at enabling better participation in factions.

    The following changes are slated for Pub 52:
    <ul>[*]Turn off load balancing; factions can grow to any size[*]Allow multiple characters on the same faction, from the same account[*]Reduce quit time from 7 to 3 days[*]Fix stairs for ghosts (should resolve issues with the SL base)[/list]
    Further publishes will then focus on gameplay bugs, and then enhancements

    [/ QUOTE ]


    Draconi, I'm very very curious....Why not allow Faction characters to be healed and rezzed outside of Felucca, by other players? They can't fight outside Felucca, so why not let them be rezzed/healed there?

    Also....Are these the changes that crashed servers? Or are those the other changes, that you're not yet telling us about, that did so?

    -Galen's player
     
  30. Guest

    Guest Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    Allow multiple characters on the same faction, from the same account.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    This is crap.

    Stat loss is a reality in factions. This makes it so that you just log onto another char and continue playing. As mentioned above, if this is the case, all faction chars on that account go into stat loss.

    It also helps it make it more of a zerg. Makes it hard for a small guild to defeat a larger one. Stat loss is the equalizer. It gives you a chance to kill some folks, get them into stat loss and try accomplsih everything you need in 20 minutes.

    One of the things that appealed to me was the scpecialized templates that are used for factions (1 char per account) even if you have 3 accounts you still had to pick and choose the skills for the template. This change negates that.

    The other changes I don't mind as much. I can't imagine why you would allow this change unless you are trying to make factions a zerg, like all the rest of UO.
    Making things where you need lots of people to accomplish a goal doesn't build community. Perhaps that wasn't something that was learned from the ML expansion.

    My .02,
    Q
     
  31. Voodoo Bad Mojo

    Voodoo Bad Mojo Lore Master
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend 4H

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2004
    Messages:
    1,166
    Likes Received:
    504
    i play factions every night.
    i play it on a couple shards.

    im in a VERY small guild.

    the only thing i see these changes doing is totally killing my play and the small guilds that i gravitate too.

    why..... like everyone else is saying.
    the Zerg army.

    whats keeping them out now?
    having to specialize your toons for factions and only being allowed 1 toon.
    if your guild needed a thief, then one poor sap would make one and then he couldnt fight.
    remove traps, one poor (very poor) sap would make one and would loose that account to fight with.
    now, who cares.
    chuck in all 7 of your toons, now you can do it all.
    have a tamer in there, a couple warriors, couple mages, a mule and a trap remover.

    all i see these changes doing is killing factions in the long term.
    what SHOULD have been done..... make the reward WORTH the risk for players to come in.
    fix the faction crafting.
    add some more perks too it.

    to listen to what one person who dosnt even play factions says you should do... then then DO it.... well.... thats just a slap in the face to we loyal people who have been doing factions for years.

    what i see here a month after pub.
    the big pvp guild of any given shard runs factions.
    no one else in.

    so instead of having 33% of shards active, your gonna have none.
     
  32. Dr. Moreau

    Dr. Moreau Guest

    It would be nice to use diffrent mounts for difrent faction. A horse of a diffrent color is kinda boring lol. Like say ostards for minax or say Hyrues for COM that would be a great idea to the game. Now that we have so many rides to chose from they could have a diffrent mount with same colors for each faction. JUST my thoughts [​IMG]
     
  33. [​IMG]erk ...load balancing off ?

    welllll ... okay ... but ...if your going with more than one per account ?
    flush the stones first ... and "inactive" for a month ... puts in the shorter "kick/exit" automatically
    per char ...

    still see quite a few "tactical" problems down the road with that ...
    but ... okay ...

    I'd have a 1 month mile mark set out to be a KNOWN "check/assess" before leaving it in ...
    aka "plan b"
     
  34. <blockquote><hr>

    Maybe stat loss is being applied to the wrong group?

    Maybe NON faction players should be suffering from stat loss when killed by another player (or their pet) and the Faction players shouldn't, or have it to a significantly lesser extent, when killed by a fellow factioner.

    Still leaves room for the PKer and the PvPer play styles.
    PKing shouldn't be easy.
    While PvP should be for fun.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Regarding statloss and making factions more popular:

    20 Min stat loss is way too long to be fun for the average player. Sure, people who very rarely die, this doesnt matter. But removing 20 mins of gaming time from an average player is too long. Factions should not be for an elite group of players with great connection and high end skill... It should also be appealing for the average player...

    I understand that some kind temporary statloss is required for factions, cose its different in terms on defending/raiding strongholds.

    No statloss for non-faction blues or reds appeal the majority of players and the rewards at the moment are equally good. As being in action has disadvantages, the rewards should be better at that end.

    A halved duration (10 mins) of statloss for factioneers, would make it more fun to the average player.

    A change to statloss and new rewards for being factioneer will make all kinds of people join faction again...
     
  35. <blockquote><hr>

    <blockquote><hr>

    Maybe stat loss is being applied to the wrong group?

    Maybe NON faction players should be suffering from stat loss when killed by another player (or their pet) and the Faction players shouldn't, or have it to a significantly lesser extent, when killed by a fellow factioner.

    Still leaves room for the PKer and the PvPer play styles.
    PKing shouldn't be easy.
    While PvP should be for fun.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Regarding statloss and making factions more popular:

    20 Min stat loss is way too long to be fun for the average player. Sure, people who very rarely die, this doesnt matter. But removing 20 mins of gaming time from an average player is too long. Factions should not be for an elite group of players with great connection and high end skill... It should also be appealing for the average player...

    I understand that some kind temporary statloss is required for factions, cose its different in terms on defending/raiding strongholds.

    No statloss for non-faction blues or reds appeal the majority of players and the rewards at the moment are equally good. As being in action has disadvantages, the rewards should be better at that end.

    A halved duration (10 mins) of statloss for factioneers, would make it more fun to the average player.

    A change to statloss and new rewards for being factioneer will make all kinds of people join faction again...

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Twenty minutes goes by pretty fast. I usually run around as a ghost for a few minutes to see what's going on with the enemy. Then I take a real life break, come back and find a rez, restock and catch up with my guildmates on what's going on. I noticed the other night that my corpse was still around too by the end of the 20 minutes.

    My characters are in a very small guild and are in what I suppose you'd call the "rogue class." They aren't in superior suits and they get killed regularly. It really is no big deal getting through the skill loss period. The only biggie is not doing anything stupid with pets during that time if the character that died is a tamer. I know a lot of people with dexxers and mages who continue to play while in skill loss, especially when their faction is in guarding mode. When you're in raiding mode, I think you tend more towards taking a twenty minute break, especially if the majority of your team went down together. That time can be very valuable for coming up with another plan for a successful raid, and if your enemy is smart, they also use that time to shore up their defenses and maybe get in some quick breaks themselves.

    The skill loss period shouldn't be a deterrent for folks. I certainly have never considered it a loss of 20 minutes of gaming time because I'm still involved in the game, and yes maybe even affecting the outcome of a battle by collecting critical information or helping to come up with a brilliant "Plan B", during most of that time. I believe the skill loss period also influences people towards better teamwork and tactics and helps weed out the "cowboys" who don't want to work together as a group.
     
  36. Guest

    Guest Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    As JC posted in another thread, these initial changes are structural, and aimed at enabling better participation in factions.

    The following changes are slated for Pub 52:
    <ul>[*]Turn off load balancing; factions can grow to any size[*]Allow multiple characters on the same faction, from the same account[*]Reduce quit time from 7 to 3 days[*]Fix stairs for ghosts (should resolve issues with the SL base)[/list]
    Further publishes will then focus on gameplay bugs, and then enhancements

    [/ QUOTE ]

    OMG finally the faction quit time is reduced! i like it lol.
     
  37. <blockquote><hr>

    IMO you should add damage increase for your chars on champions and harrowers based on how many towns your current faction is controlling. Aswell as faction only gear that can be bought for silver.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I always thought one should go in such a direction. obviously blessed items are no longer an incentive since AoS. So any reward should have something to do with additional properties and with the controlled towns.


    But as before AoS, factions should involve crafters, thieves and maybe other classes of characters.

    This is why I think faction crafters should be able to imbue items with one property. Each controlled town would have a definite property (eg 10 lrc for Magincia, MR1 for Moonglow, etc...). In order to imbue an item you should be in the faction controlling the city and imbue it in a shop in that city.
     
  38. Guest

    Guest Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    A halved duration (10 mins) of statloss for factioneers, would make it more fun to the average player

    [/ QUOTE ]

    It doesn't need to be halved. Part of factions is dealing with stat loss. It is not 20 minutes of lost play. (perhaps if you are a tamer, but that is an exception).

    If you go down, you do a little scouting, you get rezzed, you re-equip and then you continue to fight and help your guild members. There are lots of things that can be done while your in stat loss.

    If you think your non-functional in stat loss, you aren't. If that is truly the case, you need to adjust your template or break out the jewels from the bank.

    Bottom line is - Being is statloss should not stop your game play.

    Q
     
  39. Sakkarah

    Sakkarah UO Legend
    VIP Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2004
    Messages:
    1,332
    Likes Received:
    11
    <blockquote><hr>

    Bottom line is - Being is statloss should not stop your game play.

    [/ QUOTE ]
    But it does for a lot of people and their very purpose was to do just that, keep people out of the fight for a while.

    I have very mixed feelings about the whole stats loss business. I didn't like it during my first venture in Factions years ago, and I still dont like it now that I've just rejoined. Maybe it wouldn't annoy me as much if it wasn't so long.

    I guess it all depends on how you view Factions. If you are all about winning and wiping out the other guys, then I can see where stats loss become attractive. But if you're more about having long lasting large scale battles, then stats loss become a nuisance.

    On Atlantic, we've had a lot of big fights that began over a champ then ended up being drawn out for a couple hours, long after the champ got killed and the scroll taken out to safety. If one guild ends up wiping out the other(s), it's not uncommon for one of them to rez/gate out one of the defeated so they can regroup and come back for round 2 sooner. If everyone takes 20 mins just to be able to come back to the fight, you start losing people and before you know it, there isn't enough left to have a big brawl worth mentionning.

    I rather concede victory to a rival cuz he spanked me a bunch of times during 1 full hour of intense and fun battle than cuz I'm annoyed at being in stats loss again after having already been benched for 40 mins out of the past hour cuz I died twice before.
     
  40. <blockquote><hr>

    <blockquote><hr>

    IMO you should add damage increase for your chars on champions and harrowers based on how many towns your current faction is controlling. Aswell as faction only gear that can be bought for silver.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I always thought one should go in such a direction. obviously blessed items are no longer an incentive since AoS. So any reward should have something to do with additional properties and with the controlled towns.

    But as before AoS, factions should involve crafters, thieves and maybe other classes of characters.

    This is why I think faction crafters should be able to imbue items with one property. Each controlled town would have a definite property (eg 10 lrc for Magincia, MR1 for Moonglow, etc...). In order to imbue an item you should be in the faction controlling the city and imbue it in a shop in that city.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Playing in factions is fun today without these types of rewards. For me, the rewards are (1) having a great time with a good group of friends and (2) facing a new and unpredictable situation every day. Even if we don't capture or corrupt the sigils, I still log off at night with a smile on my face, knowing that the next time maybe we will and if we don't, we still gave it our best shot.

    While it may be true that there are not a lot of crafters in factions today outside of Siege (tinkers are the primary faction crafters), there are plenty of other types of characters. Thieves are always needed and since only 80 stealing skill is required, they come in a diversity of templates. There are also tamers, some of whom may not actually even get involved in many battles but can be helpful for hunting monsters in Fel to earn silver. Other tamers definitely do get involved in the battles and also come in a diversity of templates. There are also plenty of fighting characters of all types.
     
  41. <blockquote><hr>

    <blockquote><hr>

    Bottom line is - Being is statloss should not stop your game play.

    [/ QUOTE ]
    But it does for a lot of people and their very purpose was to do just that, keep people out of the fight for a while.

    I have very mixed feelings about the whole stats loss business. I didn't like it during my first venture in Factions years ago, and I still dont like it now that I've just rejoined. Maybe it wouldn't annoy me as much if it wasn't so long.

    I guess it all depends on how you view Factions. If you are all about winning and wiping out the other guys, then I can see where stats loss become attractive. But if you're more about having long lasting large scale battles, then stats loss become a nuisance.

    On Atlantic, we've had a lot of big fights that began over a champ then ended up being drawn out for a couple hours, long after the champ got killed and the scroll taken out to safety. If one guild ends up wiping out the other(s), it's not uncommon for one of them to rez/gate out one of the defeated so they can regroup and come back for round 2 sooner. If everyone takes 20 mins just to be able to come back to the fight, you start losing people and before you know it, there isn't enough left to have a big brawl worth mentionning.

    I rather concede victory to a rival cuz he spanked me a bunch of times during 1 full hour of intense and fun battle than cuz I'm annoyed at being in stats loss again after having already been benched for 40 mins out of the past hour cuz I died twice before.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I hear what you're saying, but don't forget that it takes 10 hours to corrupt a sigil. Usually the total guarding time is longer than that though because you seldom get all 8 sigils at once, so they don't all corrupt at once either. Also, if a thief manages to get in your base and steal one long enough to reset it (doesn't even have to get out of the base), then you start a new 10 hour period to corrupt that sigil.

    So with that kind of a time frame for trying to raid to get the sigils back, you aren't going to be all done for the day just because you grabbed the sigils in one big mighty battle. It might take two or three days to get everything corrupted.

    And, again, skill loss can be a powerful incentive for people to watch out for each other to prevent as many deaths as possible.
     
  42. chitrani

    chitrani Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    As JC posted in another thread, these initial changes are structural, and aimed at enabling better participation in factions.

    The following changes are slated for Pub 52:
    <ul>[*]Turn off load balancing; factions can grow to any size[*]Allow multiple characters on the same faction, from the same account[*]Reduce quit time from 7 to 3 days[*]Fix stairs for ghosts (should resolve issues with the SL base)[/list]
    Further publishes will then focus on gameplay bugs, and then enhancements

    [/ QUOTE ]

    *whoot whoot !*

    That so rocks !

    *dances her happy dance*

    I might be able to talk some people into playing factions with me now ! YAY !

    I'm currently playing on one of those shards who has NO one in factions, lol. I've been getting a character ready to take over the world, but no one would play with me because they would be stuck in it for a week if they didn't like it.

    Now, I might be able to convince them to try it, if they only have to wait three days to quit.

    Besides, a week was WAY too long if you're trying to get a character out who accidentally joined factions because her guild did, AND you can't play at an invasion because no one can heal you, or Rez you. The invasion could be OVER before you get her out and get to help defend the world !!

    Thanks a ton Draconi !

    And thanks JC for starting an event that will give folks a chance to test out something they might not have been able to otherwise.

    Chitrani (looking forward to the Factions event)
     
  43. Guest

    Guest Guest

    I like that you are attacking the problems a little at a time. Thanks!
     
  44. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Sakkarah,

    I already addressed you post in the line above where you quoted me.
    ----
    If you think your non-functional in stat loss, you aren't. If that is truly the case, you need to adjust your template or break out the jewels from the bank.
    ----

    Stat loss has to do with character, heart and motivation. If you accept stat loss as a defeat, then you are defeated and out of the game for 20 minutes. Perhaps a template needs to be adjusted, or equipment changed or perhaps some added jewelry for the task that you have stored in the bank.

    Factions is about tactics, teamwork and what you can accomplish together. Stat loss is what lets a small numbers compete against a larger force. Factions, because of its limits, forces you to think of different options and tactics. You can be effective in stat loss. (Granted, not as effective as you were but tasks can still be accomplished).

    Since you are returning to factions, and you have seen some of the situations you and your guild gets in, what changes could you make so you were still effective in stat loss? I'm sure there is something, even if it is just holding sig that has been stolen to reset it.

    Stat loss is part of what makes factions a challenge. If everyone would accept it as a challenge it wouldn't be an issue. Factions don't need to be easier! Factions need a few minor tweaks and to have the existing issues that have never worked fixed. Stat loss, isn't one of the things that need to be fixed.

    That's why I disagree with allowing more than 1 char per account into factions. This just circumvents stat loss. The only way more than one char per account should be allowed into factions is if, every faction char on that account also enters stat loss.

    As a last note, factions can be a war of attrition. Perhaps you didn't get all the towns last night. I would also consider it a victory if we could reset a few key sigs and make them hold them for another 10 hours. Factions, is a lot about perception and attitude.

    Q
     
  45. <blockquote><hr>

    <blockquote><hr>

    <blockquote><hr>

    I just went over the faction statistics real quickly and there are 8 shards with no one in factions. That is nearly 33% of all shards.

    [/ QUOTE ]


    One reason for that and one only. Nobody likes stat-loss.

    Forever

    Joining factions is useless when you can make a red, regardless of what pixel crack factions might offer people. People pvp to pvp and allowing the same massive guilds to control it shouldent be allowed.
    ...

    [/ QUOTE ]

    If you haven't noticed...it's not only factions that are devoid of players. The fact of the matter is that poor management and poor maintenance of this game have dug it so deep in the gutter that nobody wants to play anymore. There are probably more active players on those things we dare not speak of than regular UO. Those remaining here are either moderately active of inactive waiting for a miracle that's never coming.

    Plan and simple: UO chose the item based path years ago, failed miserably at it, and will never recover because they will never admit it. The game will probably never die, but it will never be good again either. I know for me factions was the one thing that I was here for, but these changes will just lean it more towards the ZERG populations.

    I know WoW is the devil in these forums, but it has millions of subscribers (of which I am not one) for a reason. It has the full support of Blizzard, whereas UO is being pushed to the wayside by EA. You don't think so? Let's see how long it takes them to fix cheating.

    I know I'm not holding my breath...nor am I paying subscription fees to wait on results that will never come.
     
  46. <blockquote><hr>



    Playing in factions is fun today without these types of rewards. For me, the rewards are (1) having a great time with a good group of friends and (2) facing a new and unpredictable situation every day. Even if we don't capture or corrupt the sigils, I still log off at night with a smile on my face, knowing that the next time maybe we will and if we don't, we still gave it our best shot.



    [/ QUOTE ]

    True, but being in faction involves some drawbacks. I always thought that factions require a critical amount of factionners in order to be fun. Under that amount it is boring as there is too few action. This is where rewards play a role. When factions were initally launched a lot of players joined being attracted by those rewards.

    I am convinced that without rewards the actual faction system is doomed. You may see occasional bursts here and there on some shards, but on a long term you won't have enough people to make it really working.

    Look at Atlantic, one of the most populated shard : why is it that one need a player organized event to make it active?
     
  47. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Why not just have 2 factions instead of 4?

    Lets face it, if one faction is going to get way out of balance, and its obvious UO does not have the numbers to support all 4 factions, we may as well eliminate 2 factions, and have some kind of horde vs. alliance type of thing.
     
  48. Guest

    Guest Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    As JC posted in another thread, these initial changes are structural, and aimed at enabling better participation in factions.

    The following changes are slated for Pub 52:
    <ul>[*]Turn off load balancing; factions can grow to any size[*]Allow multiple characters on the same faction, from the same account[*]Reduce quit time from 7 to 3 days[*]Fix stairs for ghosts (should resolve issues with the SL base)[/list]
    Further publishes will then focus on gameplay bugs, and then enhancements

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Load balancing and stairs are good fixes (people will naturally balance sides if there is reason to join), and the 3 day change, but multiple chars on the same faction...i dont know. Personally, I think you should only be able to play one char in any faction at one time.
     
  49. Imho PvP is lot more intense nowdays then PreAoS, and it means more dying. And that makes Statloss more crusial then before.

    Because of this making PK is so much more popular then making factioneer. If factioneers have statloss, red players should have it too.

    I think 20 mins is pretty much. But of course, you can play statlossed char.. So dunno.

    My main point is that playing red should be atleast as "hard" as playing factioneer.
     
  50. 20 mins stat loss for faction deaths is way to long in todays pvp.

    0 mins stat loss for red deaths is too short.


    Somethings must be done to balance this out.