I know this will probably sound dumb, but I'm going to ask anyway. If you're a small, unallied guild, is there any point to participating in VvV if the most active PvP guilds on your shard that have joined VvV usually roll with larger numbers in VvV than your guild? Is it even possible to get any points if that is the situation you consistently find yourselves in during VvV battles? I guess I'm kind of confused between some stuff I'm hearing about how on some shards some guilds are able to get the progress bar to halfway full in their favor within 1 or 2 minutes after a battle starts and something Promathia explained last week when I asked about a message I kept seeing on TC1 saying a town was unoccupied during a battle even though I saw people running around. He said, "It says its unoccupied because no single guild outnumbers the other, thus claiming points for being in the battle zone AKA you cancel each other out. It still shows you the top 3 guilds on the VvV gump, and if you were to kill your opponents and claim guild superiority in the zone, it would then begin to announce your guild is claiming the territory." http://stratics.com/community/threads/uo-com-publish-86-3-on-tc1.321386/page-5#post-2433643 So if you know you will be consistently outnumbered, should you even get into VvV? Sorry it's a dumb question. I'm sure there are probably a million ways to answer it, but I'm just wondering if the reality is that if you're severely outnumbered you really shouldn't even bother. Thanks for any constructive thoughts people might have on the issue.