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Embrace old school UO

Discussion in 'UHall' started by Goldberg-Chessy, Mar 22, 2013.

  1. Goldberg-Chessy

    Goldberg-Chessy Crazed Zealot
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    If UO is to have any future it has to market and embrace its old school game play and culture.

    Show new gamers that its about gameplay, not silly graphics.

    I love UO and truly believe that this is the way to go.

    Come on devs. stop trying to ruin UO with crappy new graphics and start working on fixing old school mechanics.
     
    Lord Nabin, Piotr, Njjj and 10 others like this.
  2. Winker

    Winker Babbling Loonie
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    Yup I agree 100%, Graphics is not what makes a good game, Its game play!
     
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  3. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
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    Sorry but Graphics is what gets folk to even LOOK at your product. If they won't even look at your game they surely are not going to pay to play it.

    Also without a new player experience training in place NO ONE is going to figure out how to play. I haven't the patience to lead newbs around by the hand... Heck new players haven't even got a clue that they have a secure bank box... Because NOTHING tells them that.
     
  4. Deaol

    Deaol Certifiable
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    Devs need to have a look at one of the many "Free Ways" of playing and embracing the OLD UO and take some tips from those servers.

    People really wonder why NEW Players do not come to OSI shards?.. why would they when they can play for free on servers that have 1000s of active players. No brainier really.
     
  5. Lord Lew

    Lord Lew Lore Keeper
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    Funny, I see new players often, and yes I mean new as in first time playing. For the record, I've never set foot on a free shard, don't see the need.
     
  6. Uvtha

    Uvtha Grand Poobah
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    Generally I agree with you, but I think you are creating a false dichotomy. A game can have appealing graphics AND good gameplay.
     
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  7. Winker

    Winker Babbling Loonie
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    Its like Deaol says, UO is still a very popular game, Just not the OSI/EA shards. I personaly love the CC graphics and see nothing wrong with them. I play on a free shard that has more players than my home EA shard of Europa. I dont favour the Free to Play idea, but you got to wonder why the Free shards are populated and the EA/OSI shards are de-populating. Its not anything to do with the graphics.
     
  8. Ender

    Ender Crazed Zealot
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    UO just isn't quite worth the price to most people anymore when you can play games with much higher playercounts and more active communities for the same price or even lower.


    Also the whole "bringing in people that want old-school gameplay" and whatnot doesn't quite work because the whole item system and as a result an entire half of the game (PvP) is too damned complicated now.
     
  9. Pinco

    Pinco UOEC Modder
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    your theory will works ONLY if UO is free to play.
    if I have to pay 12€/month, I want something decent to see AND with a good gameplay...
     
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  10. Tanivar

    Tanivar Crazed Zealot
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    If EA would let the world know that UO still exists and about all it strengths that most modern games don't even have, and present UO old style graphics being just due to it's having lasted 15 years with all the content added over those 15 years, there would be gamers who are getting burned out on the simple fancy graphic monster whackers who might stop in and discover all the content that UO has that no game they've tried before even comes close to. UO has play options to suit many types of gamers, from Farmville fans to FPS fans. Grandma who wants to grow plants, deco a house, and fight an occasional mongbat, to gradeschoolers who want to be the baddest bada$$ in the game.

    If only EA would do it.
     
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  11. Pawain

    Pawain Crazed Zealot
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    Sorry to tell you folks, UO graphics is still old school. I really hope people are not staying because of the "silly graphics".
     
  12. Tanivar

    Tanivar Crazed Zealot
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    I'm still here due to all of the content, play options, and particularly the crafting. All I require of a game graphics-wise is that they are clean. I don't care whether they are simple drawings or state-of-art masterpiece works of art, all they have to be is clean.
     
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  13. cazador

    cazador Crazed Zealot
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    Can't embrace "old school UO" because the only old school about it is the graphics..the game becomes more and more care bear every expansion/publish just like WOW and the other "modern MMO's"
     
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  14. Dermott of LS

    Dermott of LS UOEC Modder
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    ...

    Again with the good graphics and good gameplay are (somehow) mutually exclusive.

    I want someone to tell me WHY UO should be stuck with outdated graphics and resolution. I want to know how updating UO's graphics somehow changes the gameplay, that somehow, UO will lose depth because I can see clearer, more detailed graphics at a higher resolution than 800x600. Do they remove the depth of various skills when they up the graphics? Maybe we lose a the ability to make certain items or mine certain ores. Do certain weapons stop working or spells if they're given updated graphics?

    The mindset that UO is disallowed an update in graphics because it already has deep gameplay confuses me.
     
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  15. Luvmylace

    Luvmylace Sage
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    I don't understand ,why we have so many threads on the same old topic .You all know there are 2 choices ,OLD UO as is or reconstruct a whole game . A new engine . A new format. A a new UO and lose everything you have and start over on a new game that may or may not provide the same level of play we have now
    new Tech has new constraints.
     
  16. Flagg

    Flagg Sage

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    When it comes to " How to bring more people to UO?" I firmly believe this is the only vaguely realistic option for Mythic to pick.
    ...Emphasis on vaguely, I'm guessing game is coded in such way F2P would be very difficult to implement. Transaction itself would require significant Development push, PR, advertising..and various other things EA doesn't seem to be interested in giving to UO.

    ..All this is a shame; UO could be an excellent F2P game.
     
    #16 Flagg, Mar 23, 2013
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2013
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  17. Pinco

    Pinco UOEC Modder
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    every thing that worth it requires some hard work, but people nowday just want to make money without work...

    just watch simple free games like farmville 2, it's a pretty simple game, but provides every week 1 or more side quests and special rewards. They gain a LOT of money with all the extra contents for sale, and we are speaking about a software house that have a very low budget...
    UO nowdays is based on EM events that IMHO are not the right way, because if I want to play at 3 am and enjoy an event I can't since there must be an EM to run an event in that moment... a system like that works for dnd if you play with friends not for an online game, but that's what's we are paying for... a long event 2-3 times a year or a lot of small events dnd style IF you login when the EM is online.
    What else we have?
    - grinding: became boring after a while
    - social: is a malus to play with strangers because they burn your drop chances and reduces your loot
    - pvp: everything is pvp and dirty talking nowdays, because is pvp or boring :D

    To conclude: this game has HUGE potential, but they keep ignoring that and now look at me... I've compared UO to farmville, and farmville even looks better, what a shame! :/
     
  18. Dermott of LS

    Dermott of LS UOEC Modder
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    ...

    No we don't. UO is basically a two piece system... Client and Server. Upgrades can be done to each one all the time. All the Client is to us is the graphical front end to access the content of the game (which is on the Server). Because of this, the Client can be upgraded at any time to use new graphics and/or a new UI. Granted that's stating everything much more easily than it is done as it DOES take a significant amount of time to update a client. Secondly, the Server side of UO has been updated occasionally as well, both in terms of hardware used and in terms of the databases used on the back end to handle higher amounts of information as technology allows.

    That's the big difference between a persistent game like UO and a stand-alone game like Diablo or Civilization. Civilization is basically on Civ 5 because they are updating the game itself in terms of graphics and interface. But since the original Civ was not made in the same setup as a persistent game (and furthermore was made during the DOS era and before being Online was common much less constant), you have to get the sequels. A game like Diablo has an ending. The sequel(s) continue the story while updating the graphics, interface, and gameplay to keep the series fresh.

    UO is completely online. Each piece can be updated at will without having to restart the game and has for over 15 years. UO doesn't have an "ending" to a storyline, it's persistent. Thus the need for a "new game" is not there. All that is needed is enough of an investment in time and manpower to update what already exists.

    True persistent MMOGs would never have an actual "sequel" because they never end and are forever upgradeable.
     
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  19. Viper09

    Viper09 Grand Poobah
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    Graphics indeed do not make the game. However it is very hard to draw in new people and keep them with extremely outdated graphics, particularly when there is a monthly fee to play.
     
    #19 Viper09, Mar 23, 2013
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2013
  20. Dermott of LS

    Dermott of LS UOEC Modder
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    ...

    Graphics are not THE only thing, but they ARE an important part of the equation. I would even go as far to say that if they were NOT important, people would not have made the big stink they did when the 3d model for Daemons replaced the original model for a time in the CC.
     
  21. Tanivar

    Tanivar Crazed Zealot
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    Are you building up to joke about hearing voices that aren't there? If so your dragging the build up long past the yawning stage. Give us the punchline or let it go.
     
  22. Gospel

    Gospel Seasoned Veteran
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    This makes absolutely no sense to me, yet it is still the most intelligent thing I've ever seen you post. /clap
     
  23. Goldberg-Chessy

    Goldberg-Chessy Crazed Zealot
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    Obviously many of us still think UO is more then decent to see and damn near all of us know it is the best gameplay.

    Whats your point again?

    Eye candy got your tongue?
     
  24. Pinco

    Pinco UOEC Modder
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    the game play is good, but an online game should provide continuous events to keep you entertained other than the plain world where you can do whatever you like... EM events are like playing dnd with friends, you must be there at the right time or you miss it so it doesn't count because not everyone can be bounded to the EM working time...

    About the graphic, probably you are blind or you lived in a box for the latest 10 years, but something like that can be achieved in a flash game (that will have also vector graphics so it will be even better...). IMHO with the current graphic the game cannot cost more than 5€/month (and I'm generous), paying 12 is really too much especially during this times when people can barely reach the end of the month with their salary :|

    So if you grow money on the trees good for you, but be respectful for everyone else that DO NOT have such trees :p
     
  25. Eaerendil

    Eaerendil Younger than Kelmo, but also in the way...
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    I am still here because of 2D... I am intellecutally not able to Play 3D... Playing Computergames since 1989 and I always failed when playing 3D... Thats why I played the old Baldurs Gate-Games: 2D at it´s best...
     
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  26. Pinco

    Pinco UOEC Modder
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    ehm... EC has only the terrain in 3d, the rest is just 2d graphics :p
     
  27. Eaerendil

    Eaerendil Younger than Kelmo, but also in the way...
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    Err, sorry, Pinco - you are right. I like EC, too. I use both Clients for different purposes. But if I had to decide, I would stick to CC with a larger, zoomable game window. I just wanted to say, that I like the way UO is designed atm. Clearer now? ;)

    Btw: I ADORE YOUR WORK!!!
     
  28. Tanivar

    Tanivar Crazed Zealot
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    People have made the comment in the past that they switched to the EC because their monitors didn't give a good imagine unless they were run at the monitors default resolution setting and the CC game window was to small at that setting. My monitors default is 1920x1080 and the CC window is way to small at that setting but will show as good an image at 1360x768 which means the CC's 800x600 game window works fine on it. How many people would shift back to the CC if the DEVs should turn up a way to enlarge the CC game window to a size that worked better on large screen monitors that only work well at their high default screen size setting? Might be a fair number. Hopefully some company who wants to sell classic old games from the CRT monitor days will figure out how to make those old games work on the high resolution monitors we have these days, the UO Devs hear of it, and the method will work with the CC. Would be great. :)
     
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  29. Eaerendil

    Eaerendil Younger than Kelmo, but also in the way...
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    Fantastic idea
     
  30. Meat Elemental

    Meat Elemental Journeyman
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    I wouldn't switch to cc the resolution is only one of the things ec is better at, too many others for me too list.


    Sent from my Galaxy Note 2
     
  31. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
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    The biggest problem with UO and getting new players IS UO.

    Lets face it most people who play online games do it for the community.... they WANT to be lead around by the nose when playing..... They don't play games like UO because honestly they can't think for themselves or image what to do on their own. They require the game to have a set path for them.

    Grind X till you get to level Y then get B armor so you can grind W till you hit N...... etc...

    They totally do NOT understand that you can create a Ninja name it "a rabbit" and just RP at the Bank in Luna never gaining a single skill from the moment you create your character. Never needing one stitch of armor...... Get a couple of friends to do the same bump up their Ninja skill and name themselves "a cat" and "a dog" and you can have fun for hours messing with people at the bank. It's a concept completely lost on most gamers.

    I've always maintained that if your bored in UO it's only because you lack imagination and friends. However you can always explore another shard and try making new friends just try some new skills.

    But again these concepts are lost on most gamers. They want some sort of "end game" play. They want to reach level 98 warrior panda ninja and then they are bored until the next expansion to level 110....
     
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  32. Tanivar

    Tanivar Crazed Zealot
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    All to right on target sadly. What we see as great game features a lot of people don't think are even interesting.
     
  33. Ender

    Ender Crazed Zealot
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    Even then there's still the issue of the EC just being so much more functional when you actually take the time to learn it.
     
  34. Tanivar

    Tanivar Crazed Zealot
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    Lots of bells & whistles have been added, no doubt about that.


    I'll take the time to fully learn the EC when they seriously improve it's look & feel. I learned how to get it to do what I wanted it to do so it was handy as a 2nd good macro client for when I wanted macroing beyond the bare CC, since UOA only works with one client. Only other useful feature was the screen zoom for High Seas.

    The EC's bells & whistles can't make up for it's poor look & feel. That's part of whats holding the EC back.

    The Stratics poll for the CC & EC going on right now isn't showing the usual around half using each client this time. The EC's look & feel may have worn away the fun of UO's content for some and they went back to the CC or went to another game. Somethings shifted the usual Stratics poll numbers.
     
  35. Basara

    Basara UO Forum Moderator
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    It's amazing how many of you JUST DON'T GET IT.

    You love the game play, yet expect EA to somehow "fix the graphics" to make the game more fancy.

    You don't understand that, in order to get more modern graphics, they'd have to rewrite the server code FROM THE GROUND UP, to interface with modern graphics - and in doing so, many of the elements of gameplay you so dearly love about the game will be lost in the process, because the new game engine won't work EXACTLY like the current one, no matter how hard you try.

    The greatest failing of KR (and why it was so incomplete when released) was that they were trying as hard as they could to get a 2007 graphics engine to interface with 1997 server code, and the result was SEVERE LAG - not to mention having to dumb down the number of land tile types on the servers, that made many areas much plainer, if not ugly (see the roads, and tiles in Bug Reports that STILL hadn't been fixed in the EC as of current day).

    In other words, the game would have to be budgeted as if an entirely new game, and even then the result would probably not be what you want - and the reinvented game would not be backwards compatible (other than importing existing items and characters, and even then much of that will get changed in unwanted ways - look at what KR did to home deco).
     
  36. looker118

    looker118 Adventurer

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    I played UO for a little over 3 years and then became entranced with EverQuestII. I left old fashioned, stone age graphics UO behind, I was sure, forever. I played EQII for 6 years and one morning I woke up and realized I could not face another login to it.

    In April 2011 I returned to UO. Yes, it's still old fashioned and the graphics are still stone age but I realized, at my first return login, that I was home. The combination of community and game play makes this an incredible game. If only more people knew that...
     
  37. Tanivar

    Tanivar Crazed Zealot
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    Some folks place graphics at the top of their priority list with the 2nd quality being fairly far down that list. They complain endlessly about the graphics of both clients leaving me wondering why they even bother to play the game. The way they talk UO has nothing worth advertising unless the graphics are vastly improved, somehow overlooking all the game features that many other modern monster whacker games don't even have. The features that make UO such a good game.

    Welcome back to Sosaria. :) It's a great world where you can do what you want and find something fun to do no matter what mood your in, but clearly you already know that, I'm preaching to the choir here.
     
    #37 Tanivar, Mar 25, 2013
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2013
  38. Ender

    Ender Crazed Zealot
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    Very very few people are going to want to start playing UO after seeing the graphics though. And those that don't necessarily mind may reconsider after seeing the monthly fee.
     
  39. Goldberg-Chessy

    Goldberg-Chessy Crazed Zealot
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    The graphics gang just doesnt get it. And they never will.

    They love UO and have been playing it for years all the while complaining that its dying because of lack of new graphics lol. They play it for years yet want it to drastically change.
    If they cant understand what a ridiculous paradox that is they are hopeless.

    "I love UO but I am going to continue trashing it on its own boards(in my posts & my sigs)because EA wont totally change the game I love to try & bring in a few new customers"

    That is their mantra.

    You kinda have to feel sorry for them. That kind of weird love/hate addiction has got to be nasty.