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Europa & Drachs servers location

Discussion in 'UHall' started by Lord Gandalf, Sep 18, 2015.

  1. Lord Gandalf

    Lord Gandalf Babbling Loonie
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    Whats the point in having 2 servers in one country?

    None of both servers is in the center of europe, no offense to the english people but geographically england is not the center of europe.

    Wouldnt it be a good idea to move one of those to be closer to the middle reaching ukraine, turkey, israel, lebanon and more?

    UO is very ping based game, give an opportunity to players who struggle from high ping to enjoy the game with less lag.
     
    #1 Lord Gandalf, Sep 18, 2015
    Last edited: Sep 18, 2015
  2. Captn Norrington

    Captn Norrington Trade Forum Administrator
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    Are you sure both are in England? I always heard that Europa is in England and Drachenfels is in Germany.
     
  3. CronusVl

    CronusVl Journeyman
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    I think this server was early in Germany, now both servers in Dublin, Ireland. I have identical ping to Drachenfels and Europa.
     
  4. virtualhabitat

    virtualhabitat Lore Keeper
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    But what about the poor people of Iceland? Hmmm?
    I like the Idea of locating one in Turkey. It might slow down the migratory push to the West.
    I read recently that there is a free shard now located in India.
     
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  5. Slayvite

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    Let me guess, you live closer to those countries and want a better ping time at the expense of those that live close to the server now?

    You do realise the countries you mention are also boarder Europe countries too?
    Also personally I don't like the idea of putting my server in a war zone......im just picky like that. :arr:
     
  6. Lord Gandalf

    Lord Gandalf Babbling Loonie
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    Lol warzone? Haha people talk none sence, whats the point in having them both in the exact same spot? Answer that if u want instead of bullying
     
  7. Slayvite

    Slayvite Certifiable
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    Bullying? Lol if you call that bullying I think you belong in WoW and not UO.
    Europa is Ireland,
    Drachenfels is Germany. (unless it changed while I was away)
    About a 1000 miles between the two. Also if you want Central Europe then it's Germany or Austria your looking for.

    Nothing wrong with the placements as is, I played Europa from Oklahoma and Dubai with very good ping.
    I'd say if you got bad ping it's more likely your provider using back routes to save costs.
    A lot of Eastern Europe is still lacking in the Internet infrastructure stakes and just cant compete with established Western Europe.

    And if that's bullying......here's a tissue and a dodi....:sad3::sad2:
     
  8. Captn Norrington

    Captn Norrington Trade Forum Administrator
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    What's the point of having Atlantic, Chesapeake, and Catskills all located on the eastern part of the United States? Or having Napa Valley, Pacific, Baja and Sonoma located on the western part of the United States? Plus Origin, Legends, Lake Superior, Lake Austin and Great Lakes for the middle of the United States.

    That is 12 shards for one country. I see what you mean, but the way you said it makes it seem like this is something different than the rest of UO....it is not. It's just the way UO is :)
     
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  9. Thrakkar

    Thrakkar Slightly Crazed
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    Cost reason. Why would a company have two data centers in europe? Pointless...

    Second, bandwidth & infrastructure is way more important than just geographical location.
    Back in 1999 my ping on the Pacific Shard was far superior than my ping for Drachenfels, although I'm living in europe.
    So just because the target server is closer to your geograpical location, doesn't necessarily mean that you get a better/faster/more relaible connection.
    Our current european servers really perform good. Moving them could just make it worse. It would be best to not touch them.
     
  10. DJAd

    DJAd Stratics Legend
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    What is the point in having 2 (pretty dead) servers these days! I would vote for a Drachs + Europa merger anyday.
     
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  11. Theron

    Theron Sage

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    Same reason as always i guess...peoples castles and homes in general.
     
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  12. Thrakkar

    Thrakkar Slightly Crazed
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    Would that mean that I would have 14 char slots on the merged shard?
    Or would 7 of my chars be deleted?
    What about houses, which occupy the same spot? Would one get deleted?
    I think you really didn't think this trough...
    But it's never goint to happen anyways, as stated multiple times already by the devs
     
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  13. DJAd

    DJAd Stratics Legend
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    I know, and its a shame (in my opinion). I would sacrifice my UO house to have a fuller shard any day of the week.
     
  14. Lord Gandalf

    Lord Gandalf Babbling Loonie
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    Drachs or europa should be moved to germany or ukraine.
    They can keep one in Ireland.
    End of discussion
     
  15. Eaerendil

    Eaerendil Younger than Kelmo, but also in the way...
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    Oh, please. Stop that silly merging discussion. Had that before... Many times. And it has always been shut down by the moderator in the end...

    We have a genuine Drachenfels-identity and our shard is not dead. End of discussion.

    So, you wanna know where our server is (Drachs, I mean)? I know it... Hehehe...

    Here are the options:

    o In a wine-cellar at the river Rhine
    o In a Stasi-jail in East-Berlin
    o Deep under the Obersalzberg
    o Below the stage of an Octoberfest-tent
    o On the top of the Bergfried of the Marksburg
    o Under my bed
     
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  16. Petra Fyde

    Petra Fyde Peerless Chatterbox
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    Last I heard they were both in Dortmund - but I don't keep track of moves. If someone says they're in Dublin, I have no knowledge whether that's right or wrong.
     
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  17. Lord Gandalf

    Lord Gandalf Babbling Loonie
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    [​IMG]

    As u can see, there both in dublin
     
  18. Lord Obsidian

    Lord Obsidian Journeyman
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    Since december 2012 Drachenfels and Europa are hosted at Amazon Web Services center in Ireland. Before then, they were both in Dortmund Germany for a couple of years.
    One viable alternative to bring them geographically closer to the center of europe would be the AWS center in Frankfurt, although this would only result in a theoretical latency gain of about 10 to 15ms for people living in the further east part of europe.
    Sorry to say, but it would make little sense for the majority of players to move them (or even one of them) to a country with a bad or still underdeveloped network infrastructure.
     
  19. THP

    THP Stratics Legend
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    Indeed that would make the most obvious sense... but.... we cant talk of it...no no no.....but yes 2 half dead servers would equal one decently full one
     
  20. THP

    THP Stratics Legend
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    Luna is the only real issue...there must be 3 dozen empty castle spots on drachs and +100 empty keep spots ...no castles free on europa but many many empty keep spots ...but common sense never prevails
     
  21. Vermin

    Vermin Adventurer

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    Just because you think it's a good idea to merge shards, doesn't make it "common sense". In this instance, the evidence points to it being the exact opposite of common sense.

    a. merging shards is never going to be a simple process from a technical stand point
    b. there will always be some sort of compromise required from players
    c. many players don't like compromise, and some will quit
    d. the number that quit is likely much higher than the number of players who are currently "waiting in the wings" to subscribe to UO the day that shards are merged

    If people really dislike the population level of their shard, they have the ability to move through transfer tokens. If it is a general consensus that being in a higher populated shard is significantly better, then eventually the majority of the population will move to the highest populated shard in their area. Much like they have with Atlantic. Others prefer quieter shards or their traditional "home" and won't move.

    Hosting servers on places like Amazon is pretty damn cheap these days (and you can easily throttle the amount available to a particular application depending on demand) and there appear to be very limited staff dedicated to supporting each server (paid gms etc), so it is unlikely to be a massive financial saving doing shard mergers. Which makes the one real "pay-off" being improving the enjoyment of those players who like to play in higher population shards, while upsetting many who like the status-quo.

    Doesn't really seem to be "common sense" to me.
     
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  22. Vor

    Vor Grand Inquisitor
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    Only real issue to you, maybe. Plenty of folks on Europa, and I assume Drachs too, have a history with their guild houses and towns.
     
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  23. Slayvite

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    I play Europa, have never done a shard transfer or made a char on another shard. Never will.
    When Europa closes, so does my time in UO.

    I'm sure most feel the same way about their home shard too, not like the new breed of shard tourists that we have now that are ruining the economy of smaller shards for their own benefit.
    Capitalism at its "finest".
     
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  24. Theron

    Theron Sage

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    I think it might be interesting to know how each shard economy works, because I'm on Europa and frequently have no idea of what's a desirable item or not. Sold a 10 charge 100% runic tool the other day at action in game and it barely got sold for 30 million which i thought was the normal price for these...well not on Europa, just on Atlantic. I frequently want to buy something no one is selling and that's also annoying. Maybe because it's only worth selling to Atlantic?
     
  25. Eaerendil

    Eaerendil Younger than Kelmo, but also in the way...
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    Folks, you are discussing issues which (for most of you) are not your problem. I am playing Drachenfels 99,9 % of my time and there is absolutely nothing we need. Especially, ideas and suggestions from people who do not know our community and do not belong to us. Drachenfels has a great community, a large guild-alliance, events almost every weekend and there is friendship and tradition on our shard. Nobody cares for Luna, that place has never been important in the last 6-7 years. We are no capitalist flagship. We are a community. Try to get a good castle-spot on Trammel, and you will see. And by the way: real estate and business, prices for items and so on is not everything...

    So, why don´t you simply care for your own shards and leave us alone with your wonderful suggestions? Obviously, nobody needs them...
     
    #25 Eaerendil, Sep 20, 2015
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2015
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  26. THP

    THP Stratics Legend
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    history ,guilds, housing , etc etc etc and thats why we will continue with 27 shards [ 28 plus test shard...some folks actually do play test shard only- dont ask]....till the lights are turned out....many shards are dead , many are treading water..... a few are doing ok....ksara... this is how it will be...its not worth even trying to talk logic....so it will be as it always is....[end of my input on what seems to be a very very delicate issue to some]....

    [end]
     
  27. Eaerendil

    Eaerendil Younger than Kelmo, but also in the way...
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    Sir, you know that I really like you. But even you should know that there is not only ONE approach to logic and that common sense sometimes lies in the eye of the beholder. Your perspective is not relevant for other people and you are not affected by the issue. So, I have to say, that your comments are somewhat arrogant, implying that everybody who does not share your very point of view is "illogical".

    That is not true - and your thoughts are not the yardstick for me, for us - and for most Drachenfelsians. Call them illocigal.

    Ever thought about the question why people do not ALL move to the same place where there is prosperity and many other people? Why people stay in their towns, in their countries, in their home?

    Call them illogical.

    I think, you are simply over-generalizing your own perspecive and that is - I beg your pardon - very far away from common sense and logic.

    Thank you!
     
  28. Eaerendil

    Eaerendil Younger than Kelmo, but also in the way...
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    And by the way: economical logic is not the only form of logic.

    And this thread is not about merging. Only about server locations.

    Everybody might simply care about their own businesses and take it easy that there is diversity of interests and lifestyles. I would never want to play on a crowded shard. Never.
     
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  29. Piotr

    Piotr Stratic's Finest
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    Amen!
     
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  30. OREOGL

    OREOGL Babbling Loonie
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    When running a business, economical logic is certainly the best logic.

    It's fine if you want to belong to a small community, just don't expect broadsword to feel the same way.
     
  31. Eaerendil

    Eaerendil Younger than Kelmo, but also in the way...
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    Just concentrate on the topic of this thread, ok? And keep your logic for yourself ;-)
     
  32. Drowy

    Drowy Seasoned Veteran
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    Well we need some more pvp, but that might just be me. :D
     
  33. Gilmour

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    Shards can never merge cause of the most wonderful feature in UO: housing.. no point discussing it... and yes, EU servers was in Germany for a couple of years until they went to the cloud.

    You should rather complain to the connection application you using for not having a server point closer than London :)
     
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  34. OREOGL

    OREOGL Babbling Loonie
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    You went way off course already.

    Pot meet kettle.
     
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  35. Poo

    Poo The Grandest of the PooBah’s
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    your pancakes about pinging between 100-118ms????!!!???!??!??!

    some of us have been pinging more then double (triple - quadruple and higher!) then that.... for 18 years.
    so you're not getting any sympathy from me brother.

    adapt and overcome or wither and die.
     
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  36. THP

    THP Stratics Legend
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    it does effect me....it would effect me but id be happy to forgo a little change to have a fuller shard....iam a europa player at heart..my home is on europa..ive played europa forever.

    everyone as there own view on the subject...so u have your ...i have mine... the next person as his/hers...nobody is right...nobody is wrong

    mesanna as already said shard mergers will never happen...so its a pointless discussion

    and the main reason they wont happen is not history...not housing...its'' people'' greedy people/ greedy guilds that farm the smaller/empty shards... un-opposed.... then transfer the booty to there fuller shard .....they kicked such a stink up in the early talk of merging days that thus above was stated

    IT WILL NEVER HAPPEN...quote Mesanna.....

    Have a great and lkucky day now...all of you!!!
     
  37. Lord Gandalf

    Lord Gandalf Babbling Loonie
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    Ur name explains everything! :D so no need to argue with u. Everyone realizes the massive difference between 120 and 30-60ping.

    And to those who went off topic this post has nothing to do with shard merging.
     
  38. Poo

    Poo The Grandest of the PooBah’s
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    my name explains everything?
    wow what a witty thought provoking retort.
    i can see the thought and craftsmanship that went into that, flavored with a subtle hint of.... what is that i sense..... a little bit of small pixil syndrome?

    as stated above physical location of servers is a moot point in this day and age.
    if you think your connection is bad then chances are its your ISP.

    have you done a trace route yet?
     
  39. Lord Gandalf

    Lord Gandalf Babbling Loonie
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    Check lebanon on map, there is no way i can get a better ping from here... I used to have a way better ping when server used to be in germany. All im saying is that they should put them in two different locations. Like, whats the point in having 2 med-low populated servers in the same location. Move one to germany, Sorted!

    [​IMG]

    A lot of countries like slovania, bulgaria, greece and italy will benefit from this fact, even belarus and estonia
     
  40. Lord Gandalf

    Lord Gandalf Babbling Loonie
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    @Mesanna any plans of server relocation for latency improvement in the future?

    Gandalf of europa