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Faction Fighting In Tram Rulesets?

Discussion in 'UHall' started by Flutter, Jun 24, 2009.

?

For or Against Faction Fighting in Trammel Rulesets?

Poll closed Sep 22, 2009.
  1. For, If you're going to wear the gear, you should be willing to fight the fights anywhere.

    84.1%
  2. Against, keel it in Fel if I want to fight other players I will go there!

    15.9%
Thread Status:
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  1. Flutter

    Flutter Always Present
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    How many wouldn't mind fighting "worldwide" if you are in factions?
    (this means being able to be stolen from as well as attacked if you're in factions)
     
  2. WildWobble

    WildWobble Sage
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    This is what factions need! If ya want the power be prepared to defend yourself to use it. Will also clean up the bank of all the trash talking faction players if they want to trash talk they get killed for being so rude sounds great to me. I run 2 faction characters and would welcome this change.
     
  3. Ender

    Ender Crazed Zealot
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    Makes perfect sense to have faction fighting everywhere. You and a person from an opposing faction fight in one land but ina nother you're perfectly happy leaving them alone? lolwut
     
  4. Dermott of LS

    Dermott of LS UOEC Modder
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    ...

    Either open it up across all facets or restrict Faction characters to Fel where it is active.

    "Hiding out" a PvP system character in a non-PvP facet is not exactly in the spirit of the system.
     
  5. Viper09

    Viper09 Grand Poobah
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    I have to agree with this given the whole point/reward system that was introduced a while back. People join, find an easy way to get points for the rewards, and hide in trammel just to use them with no risk.

    Edit: Now if they made it so you couldn't wear the faction gear outside of fel...meh.
     
  6. EnigmaMaitreya

    EnigmaMaitreya Crazed Zealot
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    Ah the daily turn Trammel into Felluca Poll/Thread.

    Yes .... Yes ... Yes every week you (a metaphor) say it isn't any such thing.

    Bottom line is you want to PvP in Trammel, period, and all the scaming in the world can not white wash the pure plain simple point of the Turn Trammel into Felluca Polls/threads is always the same -> "I WANT TO PvP IN TRAMMEL".

    You would under NO circumstance, as in NEVER suggest to PREVENT a PvP enabled Character to ONLY EXIST IN Felluca. NEVER will you suggest that. And that is proof positive of the POINT OF THE POLLS / THREADS.
     
  7. Nh'bdy

    Nh'bdy Guest

    No gears, no tearz.
     
  8. GalenKnighthawke

    GalenKnighthawke Grand Poobah
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    I've gone back and forth about this over the years.

    If I answer the poll I'll just have changed my mind by the time I log out, so I just won't answer it.

    There's lots of arguments for and against this.

    That usually means I default to "leave as is."

    -Galen's player
     
  9. GalenKnighthawke

    GalenKnighthawke Grand Poobah
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    Just have to note that this is available through guild wars.

    So if you want to fight Factions in Trammel? Feel free to war your opponents and have an all-out, map-wide conflict.

    -Galen's player
     
  10. Whinemaker

    Whinemaker Guest

    Just curious... what's the main reason Faction chars can't fight in Trammel/Ilshenar/Malas/Tokuno again?
     
  11. Dermott of LS

    Dermott of LS UOEC Modder
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    ...

    Enigma... there already IS PvP in Trammel, there just is NOT non-consentual PvP.
     
  12. Ender

    Ender Crazed Zealot
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    And Factions in Trammel would be consentual PvP.
     
  13. EnigmaMaitreya

    EnigmaMaitreya Crazed Zealot
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    :) Really?

    And on that note would things like

    "It is a slippery slope"

    "We, shall get what we want one step/item at a time"

    ETC let you sleep better at night knowing that perhaps I knew about Consensual PvP? To short circuit the suspense, yes I knew it was there. Yes IT SHOULD NEVER HAVE BEEN ALLOWED TO BE THERE as that was a SEVERE NAIL IN THE FELLUCA RULE SETS COFFIN.

    The pretend PvPr's/Tweeners should have been equired to PUT UP OR SHUT UP. Your either into the Felluca Rule Set OR your into the Trammel Rule Set but you WILL NOT be in both. There should be NO hybridization of the two rule sets.

    And all the change would be is a 100% saturation of the Luna Bank boxed area to distract, grief etc all those that chose to LEAVE the Felluca Rule Set for the Trammel Rule Set. To have it FORCED DOWN THEIR THROATS, YET AGAIN. Now then watch the rebuttal, "They have the choice to LEAVE LUNA". Get the IRONY of that? Yes the Trammel people have the choice to LEAVE their meeting places, their places of transactions, their places of SOCIALIZATIONS, because people CHOSE TO USE THE FELLUCA RULE SET TO GRIEF THEM. What IRONY.

    Know what has the information you passed on have to do with the "NEED" to make Trammel into Felucca. An action that exceeds stupidity. I mean Felucca is deserted. Shall we pretend this is ... by accident? Shall we pretend this is "ABSOLUTELY NOT TRUE. That in fact Felucca has 99.9% of the UO population PvPing all the time"?

    By all means, turn Trammel into Felluca and watch the Shards fall.

    And for the record, one would think it 100% obvious that EVERY FELLUCA enabled action that is allowed in TRAMMEL is one more NAIL IN FELLUCA RULE SET'S COFFIN.

    I will repeat another suggestion, let every one have 1 Felluca House per shard.

    It would be worth buying UO to move all forms of PvP to PvP only normal shards such that the constant little clever scamers, that monopolize their brain cell(s?) with clever little scams for turning Trammel into Felluca and not a single synaptic firing on how to make Felluca functional. Would it not occur to .... well some one that the reason they NEVER offer any thoughts on trying to improve Felluca, that DOES NOT ALTER OR PUNISH TRAMMEL, is that they don't give a rats rear end about Felluca. Just 100% about how can I "TEACH ALL THEM TRAMMIES HOW TO BE A MAN. HOWE CAN I CHANGE THE TRAMMIES PLAY STYLE TO MY SUPERIOR PLAY STYLE".
     
  14. Dermott of LS

    Dermott of LS UOEC Modder
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    ...

    Look, any time that the "force Fel into Tram" crowd posts such ideas, I'm going to stand against them. This is NOT one of those ideas, nor is it a "slippery slope" iun any way unless you're one of the people exploiting the Faction system for the Faction Arties for your otherwise Trammel based character. If that's the case, then I have to disagree with your stance. If not, then either of the options (restrict to Fel or open up in all facets) will NOT be an issue to people who are not in Factions.

    As a player who recognizes the spirit behind the split facets/rulesets, Factions should be active wherever the characters are allowed. That's the whole point of Factions. It's not an anti-Trammel system, it fits just fine (Trammel as stated is NOT non-PvP, it's consentual PvP which is exactly what Factions are).

    The only reason I bring up restriction in Fel is because spreading out PvP systems territorially makes the system MUCH LESS interactive which is again against the whole idea of the system in the first place.

    So my first choice is restrict the characters to Fel because of the above.

    The second choice is to allow in Trammel based facets with the reasoning as stated above that Faction characters should not be able to exploit the system to bypass the PvP aspect for the rewards of a PvP system.
     
  15. EnigmaMaitreya

    EnigmaMaitreya Crazed Zealot
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    If you can PROVE your statement to be true I will concede.

    Other wise your simply stateing YOUR opinion based on YOUR self serving interpretation.

    Good to see your VOTE is so cheep and easy to buy.

    You want to sell the SPIRIT of Felluca / Trammel down the toilet, period. That is your statements net effect as you ELEVATE the SPIRIT of PvP / PvM over the SPIRIT of the two Facets. You ELEVATE the rights of some to GRIEF others, when IN FACT a choice was given to ALL. And ALL CHOSE or one could say ALL MADE THEIR BED'S.

    Now YOU don't like YOUR BED and you desperately want to make those that made the other choice's bed uncomfortable for THEM.

    Now if you are not the YOU then you might CHOOSE to consider I am not specifically responding to you, rather I might be responding to a GROUP.

    I advocate for the SPIRIT OF THE CHOICE MADE having the highest priority.

    I advocate for PEOPLE TO HAVE THE RIGHT TO PLAY THE GAME THE WAY THEY WANT. That the Powers that BE POWERS facilitate the MULTIPLE PLAYSTYLES in such a way that NO ONE GROUP CAN GRIEF OR ADVERSELY AFFECT ANOTHER.

    I feel very comfortable in asserting that the ORIGNAL CHOICES MADE, were overwhelming made based on a choice of PvP (AKA Felluca Rule Set) OR PvM (AKA Trammel Rule Set). People should be compelled to respect those choices.
     
  16. Dermott of LS

    Dermott of LS UOEC Modder
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    ...

    Factions do not bring nonconsentual PvP into Trammel, thus no "slippery slope". Is there an argument about spreading the system thin in terms of terrain vs players... sure, but no more than that.

    I've posted against Fel rule ideas coming into Trammel facets (i.e. turning Ilsh or Doom into Fel rules) and I've posted against Trammel issues creeping into Fel (i.e. instanced corpses).

    And actually I'm stating what I THINK would be the most appropriate options for Factions based on the way things are in game now. I do not involve myself in Factions, but I do see a portion of the system that can be exploited (legally) that violates the spirtit of the factions system if not the rules of UO. That's something I think that should be changed either one way or another.

    I think if you have a PvP system then people involved should always be open to PvP regardless of facet. Again, beginning to sound like a broken record but that's because you're ignoring the fact that I've put two options on the table, BUT either that means you restrict faction members to Fel or open Faction combat globally.

    The system components would still be based in Fel and true Faction players would be STUPID to fight all the time in Tram while their cities were being raided (or giving up the benefits of raiding cities themselves).
     
  17. Tina Small

    Tina Small Stratics Legend
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    I'm not voting because you don't have an option that covers what I really want: Delete the faction arties and keep faction fighting where it belongs, in Fel. If you want to fight in Tram, fight your guild mates or declare war on another guild.
     
  18. EnigmaMaitreya

    EnigmaMaitreya Crazed Zealot
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    There is most certainly a "Slippery Slope" in enabling yet another PvP system in Trammel. That is by its very action the definition of the "Slippery Slope" (aka one more PvP system enabled in Trammel - we slid down this slipper slope a little further).

    Much better to enable this, "You enter Factions, you can NOT GO TO TRAMMEL". That if you EXIT Factions, you have a 1 MONTH COOL DOWN period before you can go to Trammel.

    That is ... of course ... IF ONE IS SO CONSUMED WITH OTHERS EXPLOITING A SYSTEM, others wise it as I assert, it is 100% pure plain simple GRIEF THE TRAMMIES.

    Make no Mistake, I would be 100% behind this, "If one Guild declares WAR on one or more other Guilds AND one or more of those Guilds accept, then the WARING GUILD members will be transported to Felluca and have NO ACCESS to Trammel for 1 month AFTER the CESSATION OF WAR"

    I repeat there was an "Original Choice Made" I was there, I was active on the boards, no one should be deceived into thinking it was anything BUT A CHOICE OF PLAYSTYLES, Felluca Rule Set vs Trammel Rule Set.

    Those that chose Trammel did so NOT soly because they did NOT want to PvP. Majoritivly they did NOT want to be EXPOSED to the juvenile delinquents that monopolized (past tense?) PvP, with their TRASH TALK, their INSULTS, their ABILITY TO FORCE THEM TO LEAVE.

    These people CHOSE Trammel to GET AWAY from the others and I assert yet again, People should be compelled to respect that choice.
     
  19. Ailish

    Ailish Lore Master
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    Enigma, why dont you take your hate somewhere else? That is all you are doing, is spewing your hate of a system (PvP) that has been with UO longer than any single player. If you hate it, dont do it. Do you hate seeing to guildies spar in Tram? I bet you do!

    Tram is NOT not PvP, and was never intended to be such. It is CONSENSUAL PvP only, and that is exactly what Factions are, is consensual PvP.

    Also, your worry that others are obsessed over someone elses exploiting that does not affect them, you are wrong when it comes to factions. A whole guild of Tram-based "factioneers" that are exploiting the system to get points and arties without actually participating in the system DO have an impact on the factioneers that are actually playing the system. It causes the point-based requirements for rank to be skewed, it causes the percentage-rank-availability to be skewed, and it can also impact the sigils if the fake factioneers are using the theft of sigils as their means for getting points.
     
  20. EnigmaMaitreya

    EnigmaMaitreya Crazed Zealot
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    The above is the only thing of value in your post and it was enough to say all that needed to be known of you. You are one that wants ones cake and be able to eat it as well.

    You might want to consider the .... *caugh* logic of your argument.

    And for your Information, UO PvP and My Player are the same age, SO YOU ARE DEAD WRONG, UO PvP IS NOT OLDER THAN ME.

    You might also want to bone up on what Hatred means, but then why would you, you know all there is to know about the person that wrote a message you read on a screen that YOU KNOW NOTHING ABOUT :)

    Same logic you use for "Trammel is NOT PvP but Trammel IS PvP" :)
     
  21. Whinemaker

    Whinemaker Guest

    Forget about PvP being consensual or not...

    The real question is, why can people just
    1) join a random faction,
    2) buy some silver,
    3) immediately have access to a beefed up version of the Fey Leggings, Kasa of the Raj-in, Rune Beetle Carapace, and Stormgrip,
    4) then go back to Trammel and stay there without having to ever participate in faction again.
    Well, that is until they need to have their gears replaced, then go back to step 2.

    All I see is minimal risk, high and easy reward, and no responsibilities involved.

    I see the new faction artifects as a means to level the playing field a bit for players who want to try PvP but don't have the big money to spend on gears (btw, New York Yankees, Real Madrid, Manchester United, FU all), so I don't think they should be deleted without mercy, however perhaps the conditions under which such items can be used/equipped need to be reviewed.

    If faction fighting is being prevented in Trammel just for the sake of the faction crafters, then may be the easy fix is to make faction items unequip-able in Trammel?
     
  22. Ailish

    Ailish Lore Master
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    Actually, to start with PvP in UO DOES pre-date any player except Richard Garriott - It was an existing concept BEFORE the game went into Beta.

    As for you ASSumption about me, well, you know what they say ... I enjoy PvP and PvM. I enjoy them both in Fel unless I am FORCED to go to Tram to participate (ToT, Doom, Ilsh Peerless, etc). I really do not give a hoot if Tram is rigid non-PvP, simply was pointing out that is has NEVER been such, nor, was it intended to be such.

    Factions - remember, that is what this thread is about it factions? - you are choosing to use your personal issues with PvP to ignore the actual issue at hand. I quit playing factions after the new arties came out and the rampant misuse of the system (not to mention the new craptastic timers) essentially ruined the system. Since the Dev's are NOT going to go for Tina's suggestion of removing the new arties, the LEAST they could do it force those abusing the system to put up or leave. For the purpose of THIS POLL, the option of "lock them in Fel forever, even if they like to enjoy both aspects of the game, including those ONLY AVAILABLE in Tram" is not an option in said poll, the debate SHOULD include the options that WERE given.

    Also, quit claiming your exceptional longevity in the game. You left this game for YEARS, so you are no better than any other couple-year player. Everytime you turn around you are comparing (negatively, I might add) UO to Everquest. I assure you, some of us would NOT miss you if you went back there ...
     
  23. UOKaiser

    UOKaiser Guest

    The point is mute. Imbuing should make most the items obsolite. So those who joined factions just for them will leave. Factions and silver should be dead again in no time.
     
  24. kelmo

    kelmo Old and in the way
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    *chuckles* You know how I feel, Flutter. Kill 'em all! Let Mythic sort 'em out.
     
  25. EnigmaMaitreya

    EnigmaMaitreya Crazed Zealot
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    That would be an answer, but from my perspective it is not the desirable answer.

    If one wants to PvP then one should get ones ... Rear End to Felluca and PvP.

    If there needs to be organized PvP (Order vs Chaos (is it still active and is it still called that), Factions etc) then so be it, but have them in Felluca and for the character that joined them prevent them from going back to Trammel for no less than 30 days.

    Felluca should be what it Spirit was set up to be, the PvP Rule Set. There should not be this Multiple Personalty Disorder complex that seems to be rampant in UO. A character should be PvP or that character should be PvM. It should NOT be both, from a Rule Set perspective. Said more clearly, you log a PvP character on, then it should be because your there to engage the PvP Rule Set. If you log the PvM character in, then your there to engage the PvM Rule Set. You should NOT be trying to force UO to facilitate BOTH Rule Sets in the same character.

    I use Rule Set to distinguish the difference between Play Styles as a Generalization vs the reality that a PvP player does PvM, but that player is in the PvP Rule Set Mode.
     
  26. *blinks*

    Excuse me, but...whatever are you going on about?

    You might do well to do a smidgin more research before you get all lathered up and hurl accusations about like parade candy. *smiles*
     
  27. kelmo

    kelmo Old and in the way
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    *blinks* I don't get either, Dor.
     
  28. Sweeney

    Sweeney Guest

    There is nothing worse than Trammy's in faction gear.
     
  29. Snakeman

    Snakeman UO Forum Moderator
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    Made that suggestion before, it went over like a f*rt in chuch. And in all reality they should drop once in tram/ish/malas for over 3 min's. They were made for faction fighting to give people the incentive to faction fight & should be used in Fel where factions is based, no where else. I have a factions char & I do not use 1 item of Factions, I enjoy the fun of being able to fight in Fel & the peace & solitude of just goofing off on the same char in Tram/ish/malas. I don't want to have to worry about some punk Ash coming up as I am gathering regs, sitting chatting at the bank with friends, or on a wizz break & getting cheap shotted. ya, lots of fun in that. You want tram fighting, bring back the Old Order Chaos but keep Factions in Fel as it has been since it was introduced.
     
  30. Keep it in Fel. If I wanted to deal with the **** talking kiddies I'd go to Fel. And no, I don't have any faction chars or items.
     
  31. Alezi

    Alezi Lore Keeper
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    TL;DR

    Enigma is a carebear Trammie who's clearly fearing for his faction artifacts ;>

    Faction PvP in Trammel would be perfectly consentual as factioned players made a knowing choice when joining factions.
     
  32. Podolak

    Podolak Crazed Zealot
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    I am completely for opening up factions to all facets. No one is forced to join factions, I think the risk should follow the player everywhere. It is ridiculous to be able to get awesome faction arties with zero risk.

    Before the TOTIII event I was doing my pvm'ing in fel. I don't mind using faction arties in a trammel rule sets but it would be a much better system if the pvp followed to those rule sets as well.

    However, the one caveat is non-faction characters being able to heal faction players in trammel. I like it when my faction player can get a rez by anyone when I am in trammel. I do stupid things and die, it would kind of suck if I couldn't get a rez. Maybe they should allow rezzing and not healing?

    If a faction player died in trammel to a npc who cares if a non-faction player rezzes? And if a faction player dies in trammel to a faction player, even if he is rezzed by a non-faction he still has stat loss.

    Just my 2gp.
     
  33. Kaleb

    Kaleb Lore Master
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    Hahha this person always flys off the handle in a closed minded psycho way if you mention PvP and tram in the same line fact is she wont read or comprehend what the thread is about just rant about it.

    I do feel if you join a faction you should be ready to fight anywhere joining a faction would be like consent for pvp in tram rulesets just as a guild war. Nothing is more pathetic than a non pvper decked out in faction gear,horses bank sitting and talkin trash.
     
  34. EnigmaMaitreya

    EnigmaMaitreya Crazed Zealot
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    If Felluca is deserted why do you insist that PvP must be allowed in Trammel?

    It seems to me that you would like to have a system that some how enables both Rule Sets to co-exist in the same environment, to take advantage of both Rule Sets simultaneously.

    As a characterization:

    I want to PvP people that I do not like, that annoy me, that I need to teach a lesson to. I want the PROTECTION of the Trammel Rule Set to allow me reduce the consequence of PvP, to PROTECT ME from being gratuitously PK'd.

    History has demonstrated that the dominant personality characteristic in a PvP environment is an individual that (in game) has no comprehension of people's .... rights.

    Let us say it differently, there are two groups of PvP people.

    Those that ... have a sense of Honor, respect, ethics etc.

    Those that .... are Gang Bangers or should we say Gang Gankers.

    The dominant PvP group has always been the Gang Gankers, Hackers, Cheaters etc.

    It is this group that those that chose Trammel wanted to be distanced from, NOT because they PvP'd (well they didn't want to be PK'd or participate in PvP) but because they didn't want to be part of OBSCENE TRASH TALKING, Hacking, Cheating, Gang Gankers. Now when you say "Oh jee wimp turn on the Filters", then consider HOW CYNICAL you have become. It is the ATTITUDE, it is the compulsive need to be abusive, it is the compulsive need to try to get to the PERSON BEHIND THE SCREEN.

    There is NO GROUP or UO Team Rules, ToS, GM's etc that can enact a REAL POLICE action against destructive people like this. They can get Credit Card number for a dime a dozen. They can open Trial accounts and resume their griefing almost as soon as they were banned. What this facilitates is the serial killer that enjoys being a murder with zero REAL consequences. How about this, you get a Murder Count, you get killed by a NON Murder Count Player, then your character is erased with all of its possessions. You know, the REAL LIFE aspect they always love to throw in to justify their actions. Enable EXECUTIONS of Murderer's :)

    Let us also say, for the record, what a total JOKE PvP IS IN FELLUCA. It certainly is a number of things but the most CONSPICUOUS THING IT IS NOT IS Person vs Person. Hacks, Cheats, The Many vs 1, Items ... all those things yes that is PvP IN FELLUCA.

    PvP in Felluca is PKING a Miner, PKing their Pack Horses/Llamas/Blue Beetle, Camping the corpse to PK OVER AND OVER AND OVER, to Tell them what a wimp they are, to tell them they should leave UO and go to some baby place and then come here and WHINE ABOUT HOW THEY CAN NOT TOLERATE GREATER DRAGONS IN THE GAME.

    PvP in UO (sans SP) is most certainly NOT about Player vs Player.
     
  35. Lynk

    Lynk Grand Poobah
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    I read everyone's posts except for Enigmas. I even read his first post, realized there was no real value his long-winded posts, and moved on.

    Faction fighting needs to be extended to Trammel.

    1.) Reward of using items currently, with no risk.

    2.) By joining factions, they consented to PvP.
     
  36. Kellgory

    Kellgory Certifiable
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    Either way doesn't bother me a whole lot. Trammies wearing faction gear...so what, as long as there not jacking with the points and effecting those that PVP. The only major problem I see would be having stealthers following people around and PKing them when they bought things off of vendors. I guess you could always use a non-faction char to buy everything.
     
  37. Draxous

    Draxous Grand Poobah
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    I find the number of trammie twinks who aren't PvPers, yet are weighing in on a PvP discussion... amusing.

    :thumbsup:

    and no... board PvP does not make you a 'pvper'
     
  38. Factions shouldn't exist in Trammel. Factions aren't recognized as Trammel is under the protection of "Lord British", so this protection would extend to blue faction players in Trammel. Just as the Empress of Tokuno wouldn't recognize factions either. It would be pretty inconsistent to have faction fighting allowed in Trammel.

    Best compromise, you can't use/equip faction items in Trammel, it would just squawk that the player must be in Feluccia to use the item (Lord British's protection has the undesired effect of muting the faction item's power). This would keep the consistency of protection in Trammel rulesets, and limit the spoils of Factions to Feluccia only. I would go so far as to limit warhorses, and faction resources to Feluccia too. Also maybe take a faction point reduction pencentage as tribute to cross into Trammel for amnesty.
     
  39. Kellgory

    Kellgory Certifiable
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    I would rather have them change it so that the same restrictions are placed on faction chars in Tram as they are placed on chars in Fel, in that no beneficial acts can be performed except by another faction member. Maybe even change it so that you can be put into stat in Tram by slayer type not just by a monster, so that if your Minax and get killed by any Demon, Fey, or Reptile class monster you go into stat.
     
  40. ColterDC

    ColterDC Visitor

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    Take my advice......... Nothing this person says is ever worth reading.

    [​IMG]
     
  41. Phaen Grey

    Phaen Grey Lore Master
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    I have to agree with all who said joining a faction is consent to pvp, wearing the faction gear should mean you are a ready target to any other faction on any facet. It was a choice to join so you could get the gear, defending it is part of the game.
     
  42. Ender

    Ender Crazed Zealot
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    It really IS this simple guys. There's absolutely no logical reason to object to this.
     
  43. Fluffi

    Fluffi Slightly Crazed
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    I have a question for those who voted against this proposal.

    Why did you vote that way?


    If you are not a Faction member: Flutters' proposal will have no effect on your gameplay in any way.
    If you are a Faction member: You have consented to take part in a PvP aspect of UO; why should you be given a bolt-hole, (other than a private house), to which you can run?


    Please note the absence of terms like "Trammie Carebears" and "Obscene, trash-talking PKs" in this post.

    I am genuinely curious as to your reasoning.
     
  44. Farsight

    Farsight Crazed Zealot
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    This ^

    All true.
     
  45. Kellgory

    Kellgory Certifiable
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    I voted no for several reasons. The first I listed in my previous post and that is it opens the door for people to form groups of blue stealth chars that all they do is follow other faction chars around in hopes that they buy something and then kill them. The other problem is that reds can't come to Tram to join the fun, so those guilds that have the majority of their faction chars as reds would be at a disadvantage when it came to fighting in Tram. Maybe its time to let reds travel everywhere or at least faction chars that are red...hmm that would be an incentive to have more people join factions. I'm not opposed to allowing faction fighting in Tram, I'm just against them doing it in a half-a$$ed manor and causing more problems. Not that they would ever do that.
     
  46. Simple, even though I participate in factions, I also like to participate in events/guild meetings/just hanging out in Trammel without needing to be 'on guard' at all times. Factions is fun, but sometimes I get burnt-out on the monotomy of the politics & egos, or I just want to take a break. When I step into Felucca, I fully expect PVP. When I'm in Trammel, I can focus on other things instead.

    I mentioned my stance on faction-related items and such earlier in the thread.
     
  47. Podolak

    Podolak Crazed Zealot
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    Also, for the record...

    If we can't get faction fighting in trammel ruleset facets I am OK with no faction arties allowed to be used in trammel rulesets.

    I am opposed to disallowing faction players to trammel though. I PVM in trammel for events like TOT or something EM related. Also, I do role play (though not much lately) and sometimes one of my faction characters may be involved in a plot.

    As far as my decision to open up trammel rulesets to pvp because I want to "gank the trammies" well...that is so far off. I mix my pvm with pvp to make things more interesting, which is why I generally pvm in fel. Honestly, I am more of a fel "pvmer" than a pvper. I haven't actually attacked another player, red, blue or orange in ages. My last red just became blue yesterday. I like the chance of pvp in UO which is why I play fel and why I am in factions. What I do not like is people who join factions, upset the point system and only use the items in trammel with no consequences.
     
  48. It Lives

    It Lives Lore Master
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    I want uber gear from factions to pvm with.:wall: keep that **** in fel, were the is "real danger".:next: Ha ha
     
  49. Alezi

    Alezi Lore Keeper
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    This. It would either 1) Force Trammies to quit factions or 2) Force them to group up - fighting the gankers.

    Besides, most faction PvPers can't even get to Trammel/Malas/Tokuno as they're red 8)
     
  50. Flutter

    Flutter Always Present
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    Wow you'd think I was asking for the gate to be dropped and it be a PK free for all....
    I am talking about consentual PvP between factions on all facets, I am not talking about allowing people who do not wish to participate to be forced to.
     
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