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faction point decay

Discussion in 'UHall' started by catfish, Apr 30, 2012.

  1. catfish

    catfish Guest

    "Faction score now decays at a rate of 1% (rounded down) of score per day. Scores of 99 or below will have a scaling chance to decay 1 point per day. The closer the score is to 0 the smaller the chance is of having point decay."

    Im not sure about anyone else, but ive lost 1 point per day for 15-20 days in a row. i started at 37 points and am now around 17. i may have died once. At this rate all of my faction chars will have 0 points in a couple of more weeks, and thats without dieing.

    I think they need to revisit the "scaling chance to decay". on the shard im playing it is virtually impossible to get more than a couple of points per day because of so few factioners and the chances of recently killed.
     
  2. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Grand Poobah
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    2 problems I see with all the decays, not just Factions.
    #1 The casual player really gets the shaft.
    #2 People have no clue as to how many points that are being lost when it comes to the Virtues and Town Loyalty.

    Turn off all point decay.
    Give # value to Town and Virtue points
     
  3. Don't Tread on Me

    Don't Tread on Me Lore Keeper
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    I hate point decay... but I think they made the right move... but they should keep the "rounded down" part completely. if you have less than 100 points, you don't lose any unless you die. At least then you can have a good base. I am only working with one faction guy to keep points cause I can't possibly keep multiples up high enough to be worthwhile.
     
  4. Airhaun

    Airhaun Seasoned Veteran
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    Dear Devs,

    If you're going to keep the current faction point system then will you please remove all faction Artifacts (except rank 1)? I'm beginning to feel like a horse... and that carrot dangling inches from my nose just out of reach looks mighty tasty!

    Love Always,

    Airhaun
     
  5. Flutter

    Flutter Always Present
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    If you search my posts I've been trying to convey that there is an issue since the first few days of this change.
     
  6. Don't Tread on Me

    Don't Tread on Me Lore Keeper
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    I know. I've been seeing them. I got one guy who can't ride his faction horse anymore cause I don't play with him a lot. That's not right. The decay, more than anything, is all wrong. That's the easiest fix. The bugged chars, etc, well, I don't know about that, I just hear about it, but the under 100 decay should be fixed asap, imo.
     
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  7. Don't Tread on Me

    Don't Tread on Me Lore Keeper
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    plus i can't help but enjoy your sig :)
     
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  8. Bob the Merchant

    Bob the Merchant Adventurer

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    You mean I actually have to log in to keep my rank? THAT'S ABSURD!
     
  9. archite666

    archite666 Guest

    Bob has a personal vendetta against factioneers. One day we hope that will see that he is a minority and that he will not stop us from fighting for change.

    Fix faction rank!
     
  10. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Grand Poobah
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    Bob I am sorry but on this decay part I am with them 100%.

    Until all this decay started UO was for casual and hard-core players alike, not anymore. Things happen in real life where we have to take time out (death in the family or we get deployed) from UO or we just get burned out and we need a break. If we are not logged in then why should any points decay? We keep our accounts open so we do not lose our homes or our Vet reward counter and when we log back in now we find out that we have lost everything we have worked hard to get.

    UO is becoming a game for the hard-core power gamers with a constant grind just to maintain our chars. ranks/loyalty/virtue that in the long run will hurt UO because we will lose our casual players.
     
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  11. Mirt

    Mirt Certifiable
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    If the points don't decay then the ranks will not move. How would you feel if the points got extreme again and instead of ever going down to wear anything you had to compete with someone with 1000s of points? Thats why the decay is necessary. If you leave word of what you did is going to drop your not manning your post. You will have to work your way back up just like it will with everything. Now maybe more casual players will not be in factions but when someone wants to join factions they are not stacked up against insanely well stocked players that they can never hope to gain rank. The decay is the way to keep the system open to those that want to get into it. If you want more people in your options are capping the points at something low or having them decay meaning you need to constantly be in it. Currently factions has been used to try and get around what it is really for. Now they are doing things to bring it back more in line with what was intended. I know that hurts as it is a nerf to many play styles, but its already been done now is the time to move forward. What needs to be looked at right now is bugged chars and an attempt to work out if the decay is bugged or if the rate is far to steep. If its bugged it needs to be fixed and then the rates can be looked at.
     
  12. Picus at the office

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    Decay all that you want but fix the issues for smaller shards. Yes it is possible to get and maintain rank on ATL if you log in every night and get a few kills but try it on Napa where you can't cycle the other factions because everyone lost the use of thier stuff on day one thus making 30 people whom just wnated to fight have to rebuild everything. To this date no one in any faction on my home shard has been able to maintain a high rank at all, HOW ON EARTH CAN THIS BE?

    I've now rebuilt suits for two of my guys using all this reforging stuff but there isn't anyone out there anymore, this change cleared fel out in one failed swoop and we still see nothing from our beloved Dev team. Thank goodness we are all paying for this level of service, if they just posted something then there would be no reason to have threads like this. My two year old is more direct in her ways than this group of bumbling fools.
     
  13. Petra Fyde

    Petra Fyde Peerless Chatterbox
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    There is an anomaly in point decay in that 2 chars with the same number of points can lose a different amount over the same time period.
    Flutter has let Jeff know about this via twitter.
     
  14. I'm surprised there isn't a huge market for pre-made imbued faction suits on Luna vendors. I realize that everyone tweaks their armor for the "perfect" suit for their play style, but it seems that a starter faction suit would be a big hit. I haven't really looked for those in Luna, but when I have gone vendor shopping I didn't see anything like this.
     
  15. Mirt

    Mirt Certifiable
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    Suits tend to be custom anymore. But those of us that have offered to help suit folks up have not heard anything at all. At least I haven't.
     
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  16. Yeah, I've seen your offers (and others') and thought that was very nice and generous. I understand the desire for customization, but you can make a suit using imbuing to do darn near anything that an artifact suit can do, which would be a good place to start until you get your Faction Rank and Arties.
     
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  17. Goldberg-Chessy

    Goldberg-Chessy Crazed Zealot
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    In the last 15-20 days not one of your characters has gotten 1 kill?

    Thats ridiculous no matter what shard you play. Why are you even participating in factions WITH MULTIPLE CHARS if you are unable to kill anyone in 2 weeks?

    Bottom line folks is that based upon original concept and damn near everyones opinion even on these boards, factions are for serious pvpers.
    Serious pvpers do not have issues getting points and holding points no matter how tweaked the system is.

    So who is really doing all the whining about faction arties/points?
     
  18. Mirt

    Mirt Certifiable
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    I agree. But that being said there are so many things required that you tend to have to build custom suits each time. While you can get away with stock suits for pvm the demands are a bit higher for pvp. Well at least they have been but that might somewhat be starting to change with the arties out of reach of most players.
     
  19. Goldberg-Chessy

    Goldberg-Chessy Crazed Zealot
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    I am sorry but factions were created as a large-scale serious pvp system.
    It sucks for players on smaller shards but I seriously doubt that they can be made to work on all shards without messing up their intended purpose.

    If someone from a small shard wants to specifically play factions that badly why dont they just take the time and effort(what UO is all about btw)to make a faction char on a busy shard.

    No offense Picus but if the recent change emptied an entire facet on your shard I have to laugh. It sounds like you are unable to take advantage of what sounds like a nice and level playing field.
    Do you not have 1 crafter or imbuer on your entire shard?
    It is possible to compete and play any system correctly without faction gear folks.

    One thing I will say that all the faction points/arty posts have shown is that when the candy is taken away the children will cry.
     
  20. Don't Tread on Me

    Don't Tread on Me Lore Keeper
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    Decay is necessary, true. And I pretty much agree with everything you're saying up there. Buuuuuut decay below 100 points is detrimental. As I posted earlier, the decay system they put in place is pretty good imo EXCEPT for the 1 point decay for <100 point holders. Let the <100 keep a base amount of points. When you have 10 points and you lose 1 a day, that's 10% of your points which is crazy! The devs should stay with their rule of 1% decay a day, rounded down, no exceptions. Then once you reach 99 points, you don't decay. Simple. It's actually less code...
     
  21. Don't Tread on Me

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    yes, the offers from Mirt and others are very nice to help people out. I, for one, have a 120 imbuer and have the ability (after farming the needed resources) to imbue about anything. But, imbuing has its limits and they are in the HCI, DCI, FC, FCR departments. From what I notice, most faction players use faction arties to give the needed amount of those items. Everything else is just candy etc etc. I would never go ask another player for arties to complete my suit, those are their arties that they worked for. If I don't get them from factions, then I have to work around it. Yeah, I don't like it, yeah, my suit isn't up to snuff (dexxers hurt me pretty bad right now), but I'll get the needed points eventually to get my stuff back on track, and when I do I'll be able to field a second character, then a third, etc etc etc.

    i don't really know much about reforging because i definately don't have any runic anythings, but I hear it does good stuff and can work around some of these faction arty issues. of course, I am pretty sure that I won't be able to participate too much in that. I am going to try to get the saw runics for a -15 bok. those are sweeeeeeet!
     
  22. Mirt

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    Maybe its less code. Its been broken so long I have no idea how ugly the factions code is. I do know I am glad not to be a programmer. I do think that losing a point when your at 10 is a bit much. I think it would be better though to have decay kick in at 50. One of the goals is to keep the points low as opposed to what happened last time with them going insane. I don't think we should ever allow anyone with a large number of points to avoid decay as that will encourage point holders and thats not good for anyone in the long run the same kind of explioting of the system that was endemic before will occur. Its a sad thing but if you leave for a bit your going to have to come back to a new suit which is probably what would happen if your gone for an extended period of time anyway.
     
  23. Don't Tread on Me

    Don't Tread on Me Lore Keeper
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    50 would work. Something needs to be in place so that you don't 0 out. Decay should get slower when you have minimal points, not faster. I think the 1% will keep points pretty low though. Definately aren't going to skyrocket to the millions again. They'll be reasonable. Though the bugged 100000 point holders are going to have to get worked down, but hopefully the 1% is hitting them and they're losing what, 1000 a day. Once those holders are worked down the point system should regulate a little better. Hopefully
     
  24. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Grand Poobah
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    First of all, THANK YOU for not locking this thread.

    This post should really be titled POINT DECAY RATE because what ever they did to Factions they also did to the Virtues.

    #1 I am not sure how the Faction Ranks really works now and if someone would like to give a basic break down it would be nice. Yes it was broke but IMHO they went a little overboard fixing it. When you could see a lot of blues sitting at Luna bank all wearing lvl 10 faction items then something was wrong.

    #2 It looks like they put the same decay rate on the Virtues, not sure why but they did. Left for almost 4 months due to RL needs and lost 2 Knight lvls on my Tamer, Valor and Honor. Went and killed Shadow Wisps (less then 2 hrs) and was at Knight lvl, LOL. I gain Honor as I play UO killing Swoop for items to unravel and it has taken forever to reach just to reach 4th dot of follower. I understand that they raised Virtue gains because of the decay rate but some gain a lot faster than others and if Factions are the same way than how are people ever going to make lvl 10 and maintain that lvl.

    #3 Why is it that anybody needs to contact Jeff via Twitter to get him on this. I am sorry but UO has 2 major forums and he really need to assign some one to read these and report to him and then get back and post on here. Keeping us in the dark is not good for UO if they want it to grow, we are not mushrooms. Also not assigning someone to look at these forums IMHO shows a total lack of caring for the very people that, if it wernt for us, UO would not even be here for him to even have a job.
     
  25. Mirt

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    It sure doesn't hurt this post how mature everyone has been. It also doesn't hurt that I belive a bunch of us all know each other from Chesy.
     
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  26. Picus at the office

    Picus at the office Certifiable
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    So it's ok for the main shard you play but for the rest of us we are screwed? Of course there are still people in factions on Napa but no one can maintain rank. If I and others wish to play in factions and attempt to stat or be placed in stat why on earth should we on Napa, Baja, Pac, Origin, Sonoma etc be left on the outs while a select few reap the benifits of this screwed system?
     
  27. Don't Tread on Me

    Don't Tread on Me Lore Keeper
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    Faction ranks now (supposedly) work like this: Every member of the faction is put in order from most points to least points. 10% with the most, lvl 10, next 10% lvl9, etc etc etc. So I am in minax, I am competing against all my faction (guild) members for rank. Oh, and any other point holders that other factions might have in my faction. So yes, before, it was pretty easy to get lvl10 and yes, there were tons of sitters at the bank etc etc. Now, it's very tough to get and pretty impossible to maintain. On Chessy, jrede talks about it... his guild (LD) is the best (unfortunately for us) on the shard and wins most of the fights. Yet, they don't have a single lvl 10 member (this was a week or so ago, but still, when I kill LD guys, I usually get 3-7 points from them, which means they have 30-70 points). You can get 70 kill points from corrupting sigils and owning towns every 3 days (total for the shard, so that might split between the factions). So, every 3 days there is a net gain of 70 kill points per shard (max, it can be less if there is sigil fighting going on). Oh, and when you kill someone in another faction, you get 10% of their kill points added to your total. I guess we should all start targeting the lvl10 dudes. HAHA!!!! Forget tactics, go for points, right... um

    I don't think that we're going to have a lot of people maintaining lvl10 for long periods. Some will, but most will be relegated to the middle ranks. I guess that's what was intended in the first place.... I don't really agree, but whatever.

    I thought they did have a guy whose job was reading boards. I know I saw that somewhere. It was a while ago though. I sure hope they do...
     
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  28. Mirt

    Mirt Certifiable
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    They read the boards if your on here enough you can see them reading things. That being said if you want to talk to someone you send them something not yell and hope that they hear it. Jeff Twitters so if you want him your best bet is to twitter him. Mesanna seems to check her email almost like its a religous experience so thats the best way to get a hold of her. If you want a fast responce and to know for sure they got it Twitter Jeff or email Mesanna.
     
  29. archite666

    archite666 Guest

    Make the system noncompetitive.

    Have a set number of points you need to achieve each rank.

    Then add another way to get kill points besides theifs and killing factioneers. Something in fel, iv suggested before, have faction monsters give points. This will keep trammies from using the gear and allow anyone regardless of population to get rank 10.
     
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  30. Don't Tread on Me

    Don't Tread on Me Lore Keeper
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    I agree. Though making the faction monsters harder would probably be necessary. But upgraded monsters at, say, 1 kp per kill would put the "grind" on rank and arties for the people who say it's free, but at the same time makes them attainable for everyone who puts in the effort. But the effort isn't something ridiculous, it's measured and available for those who dare (really?) to venture into fel. I do say that 7-10 ranks should be fairly high numbers, at least 9&10 just to make it an accomplishment etc etc. Not millions or anything, but something that means something. I think decay should still be active, but with your plan, you can fairly simply get rank back that you need. I like it.
     
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  31. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Grand Poobah
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    Don't Tread on Me TY for the answer. To bad Factions were not on the same system like Fame and Karma. So many points give you a lvl and the more points you get the higher the lvl. It should not be based on only so many people can be lvl10. If you put in the time then you should be able to get to lvl10 no matter how many people are there.

    Fix all decay rates.
    Fix the way points are made.
    Allow anybody/everybody that puts in the work to gain lvls, not just a select few.
    Show number values for all Factions/Loyalty/Vertues.
    UO give us a Community Rep.
     
  32. Mirt

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    Of course if you add in the monsters for kill points what is the value of even having faction arties? Clearly your interested in pvm then and the arties can be gotten in pvm.
     
  33. catfish

    catfish Guest


    come on goldberg, i thought you were brighter than that. You need to read the entire post before you make a bozo assumption like that. i said, 'it is virtually impossible to get more than a couple of points per day because of so few factioners and the chances of recently killed'

    i will translate for you. I kill more than i die - probably 3-1 ratio. but there are so few pvpers on my shard, i too often get 0 points from them because i have killed them recently. and if i go 2-3 days without playing, ive lost 2-3 points. thats really hard to get back on the smaller shards.


    the original intent of my post was to simply say that decay rate is much more than they stated in the release notes. i really dont care if they fix it. i have already altered all of my suits to be faction arty free. pain in the !@#$, but not impossible by any stretch.
     
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  34. archite666

    archite666 Guest

    It would be much faster and would involved pvp. These spots are not in tram. Remember faction monsters only spawn in fel and opposing factioneers would obviously check the spots. Meaning you better know how to defend yourself or risk losing a chunk of what you farmed.

    Its perfect.
     
  35. Mirt

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    No its really not. Its still pvm if faction artifacts are for those that pvp and only pvp then saying I should be able to get points by killing monsters means that its not about pvp at all its about easy arties and not having to do what everyone else does to get them.
     
  36. Tina Small

    Tina Small Stratics Legend
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  37. Berethrain

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    No thanks. This would skew the faction system and reaks of abuse.


    Faction is a pvp system, not a pvm system.
     
  38. kelmo

    kelmo Old and in the way
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    There is no way all factioneers should be level 10. The system was broken from the beginning and doubly broken on Siege. I am sorry it took this long to fix it. I really am. It almost killed Siege. I would rather do away with factions all together than see it come back as it was.
     
  39. archite666

    archite666 Guest

    So campaign to keep the fix off siege, but its a fine system. We are campaigning for prodo shards.
     
  40. LordDrago

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    With faction points for monster kills, I have a feeling that faction artifacts in trammel will remain the way it was.
     
  41. Mirt

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    Actually it would grow. Still of course the argument now for the arties is that pvpers don't want to pvm. If you want to pvm get the arties the normal way.
     
  42. Rupert Avery

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    this was a tweet from jeff
     
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  43. Picus at the office

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    Thanks for the tweet info. It's better than nothing but it would be best to get some back and forth with the team.
     
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  44. Don't Tread on Me

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    Abuse.... probably. But everything having to do with faction arties is ALREADY a pvm problem. You don't go out and kill hundreds of players to get enough silver for faction arties... you farm faction monsters and buy them. With a change, you could farm faction monsters to achieve kill points. Though, thinking about some of these posts, I think that there should be a limit on the amount of point you get from monsters. Maybe can't get above lvl7 or something like that. But at least you could grind it out and get some good basics but still need to pvp (or farm off point holders like everyone does anyways) to get the high end items.
     
  45. kelmo

    kelmo Old and in the way
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    You very well know that is not likely. The last time time someone spouted off about factions on Siege the silver price went X5... and Siege folk can not even insure the stuff.
     
  46. Mirt

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    My only question is if factions is to be a pvm system why should there even be arties. It seems like its giving some folks an edge that is not in any way deserved when they could get them through pvm. I think if you want kill point farming from monsters then the arties should be done aways with.
     
  47. Berethrain

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    • Factions, Virtue, and City Loyality points will not decay if you log in daily anytime after maintenance.
    • Except to the rule is faction points will decay if they are over a hundred regardless if you log in or not.
    • Faction points that were not scaled correctly have been addressed
     
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  48. Berethrain

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    Farming silver has nothing to do with getting points. Though killing a player should yield a lot more silver than a monster.​

    You're trying to turn the Factions PVP system into more of a PVM system so people can still get faction gear with little to no effort.​

    You might as well just get rid of factions.​


     
  49. kelmo

    kelmo Old and in the way
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    In my opinion... if you defeat a faction opponent, that armor should turn back into lootable silver.
     
  50. Mirt

    Mirt Certifiable
    Stratics Veteran

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    Thats an interesting idea. Get killed and loose some of your suit. If they do this I think that stat should be reduced though.