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Forum Updates and stuff

Discussion in 'UHall' started by _zigzag_, Jul 29, 2008.

  1. _zigzag_

    _zigzag_ Sage
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    Hey everyone...wanted to let you know what the plan is for the professions forums and the rest of the forums in general, and hear any constructive input or thoughts you have.

    As you have no doubt noticed, the KR forum and the UO Player Memorial forum are back.

    The plan for the rest of the forums at this point is as follows:
    • The White Stag Inn - This forum will become home to not only great player fiction it's known for, but also will encompass UO Community Center, UO Heartwood Elves, UO Human's Sanctuary, and UO Orc Fort. Basically, all RP-related forums have been condensed in to The White Stag Inn.

    • The Professions Forums will be regrouped as follows:

      • UO Bard - Musicianship, Discordance, Peacemaking, Provocation
      • UO Botany & Nutrition - Alchemy, Cooking, Gardening, Taste Identification
      • UO Craftsman - Blacksmithing, Mining, Tinkering, Arms Lore, Tailor, Carpentry, Lumberjacking, Bowcraft/Fletching
      • UO Rogue - Detect Hidden, Hiding, Poisoning, Snooping, Stealing, Stealth
      • UO Spellcaster - Magery, Necromancy, Spellweaving, Eval Intel, Resist Spells, Meditation, Spirit Speak, Inscription
      • UO Tamer - Animal Taming, Animal Lore,Veterinary, Herding
      • UO Thief - Thieves forum
      • UO Vagabond - Forensics, Begging, Camping, Tracking
      • UO Warrior - Chivalry, Ninjitsu, Bushido, Healing, Anatomy, Wrestling, (Disarming), Archery, Fencing, Macefighting, Swordsmanship, Tactics, Focus, Parry
      • UO Treasure Hunters - Fishing, Cartography, Lock Picking, Item Identification


    I should have this completed within 48 hours....going to start on it now :)
    I'll update here as I make progress.

    UPDATES:

    The White Stag Inn - This forum will become home to not only great player fiction it's known for, but also will encompass UO Community Center, UO Heartwood Elves, UO Human's Sanctuary, and UO Orc Fort. Basically, all RP-related forums have been condensed in to The White Stag Inn. --DONE

    UO Players Corner - Threads from the old UO Players Q&A forum imported, stickies included. --DONE

    UHall - 2000 plus threads and surviving stickies imported. --DONE

    UO Homes & Castles - Threads and stickies imported --DONE

    All Shard Forums - Threads and stickies imported --DONE

    UO Factions - Threads and stickies imported --DONE


    UO SnR - Threads and stickies imported --DONE

    More updates, and some changes.

    Forums created:

    • UO Bard - Musicianship, Discordance, Peacemaking, and Provocation skills

    • UO Beggar - Haven't finalized skills for this forum...but a wave of sentiment came over me when I went to combine this forum. I wanted to rethink this one some.

    • UO Botany & Nutrition - Alchemy, Cooking, Gardening, and Taste Identification skills

    • UO Craftsman - Blacksmithing, Mining, Tinkering, Arms Lore, Tailor, Carpentry, Lumberjacking, and Bowcraft/Fletching skills

    • UO Rogue - Detect Hidden, Hiding, Poisoning, Snooping, Stealing, and Stealth skills

    • UO Spellcaster - Magery, Necromancy, Spellweaving, Eval Intel, Resist Spells, Meditation, Spirit Speak, and Inscription skills

    • UO Tamer - Animal Taming, Animal Lore, and Veterinary skills* Herding may not live here as originally planned.

    • UO Thief - The old Thieves forum is here, and may inherit some additional skills.

    • UO Vagabond - Forensics, Camping, and Tracking skills - Rethinking the name on this one.
    • UO Warrior - Chivalry, Ninjitsu, Bushido, Healing, Anatomy, Wrestling, (Disarming), Archery, Fencing, Macefighting, Swordsmanship, Tactics, Focus, Parry
    • UO Treasure Hunters - Fishing, Cartography, Lock Picking, Item Identification and Remove Trap skills
     
  2. jelinidas

    jelinidas Guest

    The Professions Forums will be regrouped as follows:
    UO Bard - Musicianship, Discordance, Peacemaking, Provocation
    UO Botany & Nutrition - Alchemy, Cooking, Gardening, Taste Identification
    UO Craftsman - Blacksmithing, Mining, Tinkering, Arms Lore, Tailor, Carpentry, Lumberjacking, Bowcraft/Fletching
    UO Rogue - Detect Hidden, Hiding, Poisoning, Snooping, Stealing, Stealth
    UO Spellcaster - Magery, Necromancy, Spellweaving, Eval Intel, Resist Spells, Meditation, Spirit Speak, Inscription
    UO Tamer - Animal Taming, Animal Lore,Veterinary, Herding
    UO Thief - Thieves forum
    UO Vagabond - Forensics, Begging, Camping, Tracking
    UO Warrior - Chivalry, Ninjitsu, Bushido, Healing, Anatomy, Wrestling, (Disarming), Archery, Fencing, Macefighting, Swordsmanship, Tactics, Focus, Parry
    UO Treasure Hunters - Fishing, Cartography, Lock Picking, Item Identification


    Why all the lumping? Kinda like the trade forums that I think suck now. Why do I have to wade through useless crap to find what Im looking for? I personally think you need to rethink all this. If its a cost savings idea, and Im sure it is, I would gladly pay to view them all separately. Just my usual 2cents.
     
  3. _zigzag_

    _zigzag_ Sage
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    Cost has nothing to do with this.

    The reason is mainly so we have related information in one place and not in multiple forums. Remember how unused some of the old professions forums were? Stuff was getting posted elsewhere because it related to more than one professions - now we have them grouped.
     
  4. Basara

    Basara UO Forum Moderator
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    While not in on the decision, I think I can speak for a lot of the logic...

    I'll go case by case...

    Not Mergers (were like this before)
    1. UO Bard - Musicianship, Discordance, Peacemaking, Provocation
    2. UO Thief - (PvP) Thieves forum
    3. UO Tamer - Animal Taming, Animal Lore,Veterinary, Herding

    Areas with lots of overlap
    4. UO Craftsman - Blacksmithing, Mining, Tinkering, Arms Lore, Tailor, Carpentry, Lumberjacking, Bowcraft/Fletching
    Consider that there was a lot of overlap - especially with Arms Lore's new abilities - between these, and most crafter players have multiple crafting skills from the list. The biggest issue will be creating a FAQ directory as the main sticky, as the sheer number of existing FAQs would take up the entire page, preventing non-stickies from showing rolleyes:

    5. UO Botany & Nutrition - Alchemy, Cooking, Gardening, Taste Identification.
    With the items that now actively spawn ingredients, and the new seeds mentioned at the San Diego Town Hall, these will be more closely tied to each other than before.

    6. UO Rogue - Detect Hidden, Hiding, Poisoning, Snooping, Stealing (crates/Doom), Stealth (and I would guess remove Traps as well, right zigzag?).
    This profession didn't really HAVE a forum of its own before. The PvP thieves attacked any attempt to put the non-PvP thieving in their forum, directing them to the Rares forum. Similarly, there was no designated place to look for Stealth/Hiding advice. Detect Hidden was often lumped in with the Treasure Hunters (from its SP use in removing traps - most non-SP-ruleset T-hunters use TK or just trigger the trap and hope to live).
    On the other hand, I would probably suggest that Snooping be grouped with the PvP Thief forum. Poisoning, while rogue-ish, I'm not sure where I'd put it, as it's not a perfect fit with Thief, Rogue, Warrior, Alchemy or Magery. I guess Rogue is as good a place as any.

    7. UO Spellcaster - Magery, Necromancy, Spellweaving, Eval Intel, Resist Spells, Meditation, Spirit Speak, Inscription
    A lot of overlap here as well... The only real issue I see is that Necromancy comes in both Spellcaster & Warrior template variations, and has a fairly even split of spells for both sides (and its basic template is quasi-warrior, since inception, though the weapon skill changed along the way)

    8. UO Vagabond - Forensics, Begging, Camping, Tracking
    Personally, I'd have reused the "Adventurer" forum title for this - or better yet, used "Ranger". "Vagabond" makes it sound like someone plays Rifts (a paper & dice RPG) a lot.

    9. UO Warrior - Chivalry, Ninjitsu, Bushido, Healing, Anatomy, Wrestling, (Disarming), Archery, Fencing, Macefighting, Swordsmanship, Tactics, Focus, Parry
    Another obvious merger, and another one that will need serious FAQ surgery to actually allow room to post (but see Necromancy comments for Spellcaster).

    10. UO Treasure Hunters - Fishing, Cartography, Lock Picking, Item Identification
    A good choice for merger, once people get used to it - though some of the elements from Rogue might be better off in here.
     
  5. Basara

    Basara UO Forum Moderator
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    Before I forget - Existing "profession" forums that fall between the cracks...

    "Adventurer" = What will become of this? White Stag (As "adventurer" is more of a RP style than profession)
    "Assassin" & "Murderer" = I would assume these become part of Thief or Rogue? OR should we have a separate forum for the two (combined), and have the poisoning stuff there instead of Rogue?
    "Merchant" = what part of the trade forums will this be merged into?
     
  6. Spellbound

    Spellbound Lore Keeper
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    Are you adding more of old UHall posts, or is that done?
     
  7. _zigzag_

    _zigzag_ Sage
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    Combine the stickies :p Also, FAQ's and whatnot should be a LINK in the forum and the actual info maybe on um...what was that page...oh yeah...uo.stratics.com :D



    The thought was to put Remove Trap with the Treasure Hunters group (I inadvertently left it off the list).


    Sounds like a forum naming contest is in order! :D

    We can redo forum names no problem, and if we find we need to RE-group some of these, that's doable too. :)
     
  8. _zigzag_

    _zigzag_ Sage
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    Many of the old old OLD forums you mentioned will be sort of archived; that is, they will be available for reading but closed to posting. They will not be merged with any of the current forums.
     
  9. _zigzag_

    _zigzag_ Sage
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    UHall posts.....Uhall posts.....oooooh yeah :D

    Let's see.....Uhall-Showing threads 1 to 20 of 2265
    *click*
    Showing threads 1 to 20 of 4825...


    Like that? hehe
     
  10. Spellbound

    Spellbound Lore Keeper
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    Cool, thank you!
     
  11. _zigzag_

    _zigzag_ Sage
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    No no...thank you guys for your patience! :bowdown:
     
  12. Oriana

    Oriana Babbling Loonie
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    Ziggy is da man!!!
     
  13. Miri of Sonoma

    Miri of Sonoma Lore Keeper
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    I didnt see any mention of the guild forums. Are they going to be recovered too?
     
  14. _zigzag_

    _zigzag_ Sage
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    Yes. Last update I had was that the data for the Guild Forums was recovered, but still needed sorting.

    Part of the hold-up with the return of the Guild Forums is setting up the access for Guild Forum Mods. See... right now if I Mod someone...they get all the forums. Then I make 'em work...just ask any of the UO Mods...I'm pretty mean :)

    I really hope to have a solution to this very soon...not soon as in never...or soon as in maybe...soon as in now I know what we need and will make it work.
     
  15. Miri of Sonoma

    Miri of Sonoma Lore Keeper
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    Yay! :) Thank you Zigzag.
     
  16. Hey Boss? Can I go home now? I haven't had a thing to eat in days!
     
  17. _zigzag_

    _zigzag_ Sage
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    *tosses T a power bar*

    Now...back to the salt mines! ;)
     
  18. Basara

    Basara UO Forum Moderator
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    Actually, in his case, it's back to the Uranium mines.....
     
  19. Gee thanks ... must be my glowing personality? :twak:

    For those who don't know ... I have worked in the IT Department of a nuclear plant for over 20 years of my 35 year computing history.
     
  20. Magdalene

    Magdalene Stratics Legend
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    Can the old Profession Forums Moderators please report to the Staff Forums for reassignment of duties?
    Thank you!
     
  21. Salty Pete

    Salty Pete Guest

    *shakes fist at the UO vagabond forum*

    Forensics, Camping and Tracking have no business being tied to the honorable profession of the beggar. Camping and tracking are RANGER skills. Forensics is detective. If anything Forensics should be lumped into PvP theefs if you must lump it into anything.

    Begging is a stand alone profession. All other professions are the ultimate evil.
     
  22. jelinidas

    jelinidas Guest

    The lumping is the ultimate evil. All we ask is WHY?
     
  23. I agree. The UO Beggar's forum was quite unique. :)

    I'm also having a bit of difficulty with some of the other mergers. It seems to me that it was much easier to swiftly find information (and specifically-experienced feedback) in those forums devoted to one area of expertise.

    If it's at all possible to not merge so many into so few, I would vote for that. I fear that otherwise, character, community and clarity will be lost, in the name of efficiency. Rather like shopping at WalMart, instead of yer neighborhood Mom & Pop store. ;-)

    That's my two cents, anyway.

    P.S. The above is certainly not intended to imply that your efforts are unappreciated. Hearty thanks for all that you have managed to restore thus far. You guys rock!
     
  24. Basara

    Basara UO Forum Moderator
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    Actually, as a moderator of two of the forums, and reader of the remainder, I feel there won't be any size issues at all, once we consolidate the FAQs.
    1. LJ & Carpentry rarely had more than a couple posts a week before; its FAQs were also obscenely out of date, in terms of crafting & training.
    2. Fletching as a crafting skill was often left in limbo, with questions popping up in both the Archer & Carpenter forums. LJ is also relevant to Fletching.
    3. Arms lore never needed a forum of its own. It IS, however, relevant to all the crafting skills above. In fact, in the process of creating some stuff for Players Corner and the Smith Forum, I effectively created a FAQ that covered it for all of these skills.
    4. Only 3 forums were really active prior to the "Big Oops"; miner, smith, and tailor. Combining these would only insure decent traffic, not overload.

    I forsee only the following needs:
    a. Updated FAQs for Carpentry, Fletching, and Tailor and Tinker. (Smith & miner were redone by me, completely from scratch, 4-6 weeks before the accident, as well as a FAQ on Arms Lore that I included data for the other skills in). LJ data would be replicated in both the Carpentry & Fletching FAQs.
    b. A single training FAQ for all the skills



    Did you miss the UO Thief forum in zigzag's list that is for the town/PvP Thieves? He already had that covered in the original post. The question is will the crates tolerate the stealers coming in to their forum for training data, not the other way around.
     
  25. Shelleybean

    Shelleybean Certifiable
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    I deleted my post. Sorry to even have bothered.
     
  26. Fink

    Fink Guest



    Speaking as a Shepherd, I'd rather see Herding in the Vagabond section; it being a "niche skill" like the others in that group. It's also more often seen in templates with those skills than tamer builds.

    As a profession, Herding has about as much to do with Taming as Begging does with Stealing. A Beggar isn't a Thief, and a Shepherd isn't a Tamer. It's all in whether you ask or you take.

    Just my feeling on it. :talktothehand:
     
  27. _zigzag_

    _zigzag_ Sage
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    I read it :)

    Thank you....everyone...for your input here....it IS important, and I do read what is posted. ;)


    And yeah...I know we're all tired of the wait for the professions forums to return, and I am aware some aren't happy with the new grouping.
    One thing I would ask everyone is to remember we can tweak stuff MUCH easier now, so if we find this isn't working we will have options :)
     
  28. _zigzag_

    _zigzag_ Sage
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    Cool....makes sense, too.
     
  29. give a new ETA for profession forums to return I NEED MY KNOWLEDGE BASE. either that or get stratics updated to current patch info and do it in the next 24 hours. your choice is simple give me an eta hehe
     
  30. _zigzag_

    _zigzag_ Sage
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    Now see...I can appreciate that!

    NEW ETA on the professions forums is 24 hours!! :D
     
  31. Nylan

    Nylan Adventurer
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    So do we have a new ETA for the rest of the forums to be back?
    Please
     
  32. _zigzag_

    _zigzag_ Sage
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    The Professions Forums will be making their return today. I'm working on them now and will have them live this afternoon. :)
     
  33. Lady_Rachel

    Lady_Rachel Lore Keeper
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  34. Nok

    Nok Lore Master
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    Great to hear *zigzag*! :)
     
  35. Arrgh

    Arrgh Sage
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    Today! Woohoo! :danceb: :danceb:
     
  36. Nylan

    Nylan Adventurer
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    Great, can't wait:thumbsup:
     
  37. _zigzag_

    _zigzag_ Sage
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    I'm running behind...but finishing them up yet before I sleep :D

    I do have some created, but they are hidden from you guys yet :D
    We are making progress, I promise!
     
  38. Arrgh

    Arrgh Sage
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    Thanks for working so diligently Zigzag
     
  39. Basara

    Basara UO Forum Moderator
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    I will chime in and say I'm fairly well on the way in editing the stickies on the Craftsman forum (all the major crafting skills as one forum). Some of them have to be totally reconfigured (due to coding differences), and there were TWENTY-FIVE stickies on the combined forum when I got there!

    There's a bit less than that now. I Made a couple new stickies, then in those made lists of links to the older, obselete, stickies that need updates, and unstickied them.

    So, for example, if you need a Carpentry FAQ, you go into the FAQ list Sticky, then click the link inside it for Carpentry (or tinker, or smith, or tailor, etc.).

    If I hadn't handled it this way, it would have taken one of those old-mac-style taller-than-wide monitors (or a wide-screen monitor rotated 90 degrees) to see past the stickies....
     
  40. ZIGZAG i need my info wheres it at?
     
  41. _zigzag_

    _zigzag_ Sage
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    It lives...almost :D
     

  42. Alright mr man lets get this done.... i feel so lost without my guides.
     
  43. _zigzag_

    _zigzag_ Sage
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    Updated my original post last night....

    Yes a UO Beggar forum was created...no you cant post in any of them yet...and yes there will be some renamimg and a bit of skill regrouping.

    I will entertain serious (and relevant) suggestions.
     
  44. Oriana

    Oriana Babbling Loonie
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    just a thought on the Vagabond....Move camping to Beggars...most beggars do.....and REname Vagabond to UO detective?
    posted a couple places to remind Zig

    Ori
     
  45. Hopefully, these are serious and relevant suggestions :)

    I am still having a bit of trouble with a couple of the massively condensed categories, to wit:
    As a longtime Grandmaster Blacksmith, Miner, Tailor, Fletcher and Lumberjack (on various characters), I fail to see what, say...Tailoring and Smithing have in common (aside from them both being crafts, of course) If I am urgently seeking information on Tailoring, I utterly cringe at the notion of having to wade through Blacksmithing to find it - and vice versa. Those two skills are entirely unrelated, by my lights.

    I can see lumping Carpentry, Lumberjack and Fletching together, as at least they share wood. *grins* Also, Blacksmith and Miner (as well as the traditional Arms Lore) with each other, as they share rocks in th' head. :p Tinkering, I know nothing about. Tailoring is rather stand-alone. Ohhhh...except that tinkers make sewing kits. Hmm.

    ANYway, I feel that you should break UO Craftsman down into a minimum of two fora (if not further).

    As pertains to UO Warrior, I am probably in the minority here, as an Elder Archer (on one character), and Grandmaster+ MELEE Warrior on all others - NONE of whom have mana, employ Special Moves, or have anything whatosever to do with any sort of chivalrous-bushido-ninja crap...err, stuff.

    Perhaps you could reserve one forum for all of that spellcasting-fighter gooblety-gook, and another for us honest, old school warriors? :)

    Say, for instance,
    UO Warrior with Wrestling, (Disarming), Archery, Fencing, Macefighting, Swordsmanship, Tactics, Focus, Parry

    and

    UO Special Forces (or mana fighters - heh) with Chivalry, Ninjitsu, Bushido

    and

    UO Healer, with Anatomy and Healing

    I'm still not entirely happy with lumping Archery into any of the above, but I can live with it - as long as I don't have to rub shoulders with mangy spellcasters! *grins and skeedaddles*
     
  46. Salty Pete

    Salty Pete Guest

    /hi5

    You are the man!

    UO Beggar baby! Woo!
     
  47. Basara

    Basara UO Forum Moderator
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    Strange, I see the exact opposite.

    In terms of game play, Smith & tailor are the MOST alike skills.

    Both have BODs
    Both craft Armor, and have the exact same properties for the armor crafted by them (unlike Carpenter, which can have some funky properties from Heartwood, let alone the HP regen from bloodwood)
    Both Benefit from Arms Lore
    Both have runics that can routinely create decent items (frankly, I've only seen junk from the fletching & carp runics)

    Even historically, most metal armor had cloth & leather parts integral to them, to hold them together and pad the user - and many forms of leather armor had metal fixtures (the extreme being stuff that isn't in UO, like brigandine, splinted/banded armor and metal-studded/spiked armor)

    And in the process of putting together the smith FAQ, I've had to deal with TONS of overlap between Tailor & Smith. More overlap between the two than either skill, with any of the other craft-related skills.

    Hell, I just spent an hour earlier today, adapting a FAQ piece I originally wrote for tailors as a guide on Players Center, to fit into the Smith FAQ - mostly in replacing tailor terminology with smith terms, and clarifying the language. No other two skills have that much commonality.

    I do think the warrior forums might have a bit more of a case for division, but I'm not sure of the places where to draw the line. So many characters have 2 of the 4 potential "magic" support skills (ninjitsu, bushido, Chivalry, and necromancy - yes, remember that standard necros start out with melee skills and armor, and have since introduced in AoS).
     
  48. I dunno...I Grandmastered Tailoring (the first time) in '98, and then Blacksmithing in early '99.

    I have played both (and many others) continuously since then (including the whole BOD thing), and still fail to see any correlation between the two.

    Maybe it's because I've never run a 'mule'...but to me, they are entirely different to work skills and create with.
     
  49. _zigzag_

    _zigzag_ Sage
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