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Hard cap to DCI

Discussion in 'UHall' started by drawn, Dec 10, 2008.

  1. drawn

    drawn Journeyman
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    I would like to see a hard cap of 45 DCI implemented. With the new faction items its not hard to get to 60+ DCI. Either cap it at 45 DCI or allow HCI to stack higher that 45.
     
  2. WarUltima

    WarUltima Babbling Loonie
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    I think you are mistaken something. HCI and DCI are actually EQUAL in anyway possible. Cap for both HCI and DCI are both at 45. You can go over 45 dci to nullify effect of hit lower defense, while you can go over 45 hci to nullify the effect of hit lower attack. I dont understand what you are trying to accomplish.
     
  3. rareitem

    rareitem Journeyman
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    bet he runs an archer and he doesnt like missing hits :)
    with the laag I have if I didnt have extra DCI I would have closed my account long time ago.
     
  4. drawn

    drawn Journeyman
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    thats what i thought but not the case-

    120 melee with 45 HCI vs 120 melee with 60+ DCI less than 25% hit rate

    Lowered DCI to 45 and it was around 50% hit rate

    Tried it with a few friends over the last few weeks, started tests with 45 DCI and then to 60+ DCI, then other days started out with 60 DCI (to adjust for RNG) same results.

    Maybe something for the devs to take a look at? If not capping DCI to a HARD 45, or allow HCI to stack the same way and a check on total HCI?
     
  5. drawn

    drawn Journeyman
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    hehe- i have 3 chars that I play and one is a necro mage with 60+ DCI, a sampire that is unkillable (even in pvp - though he cant kill anyone either :p) and yes an archer:eek: It just seems that the code is off a bit.
     
  6. Speedy Orkit

    Speedy Orkit Grand Inquisitor
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    This post is all BS. You don't know what you're talking about. It's a random number generator, do that test for around 100k hits and let me know the findings.
     
  7. drawn

    drawn Journeyman
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    ty for being a complete troll :loser: RNG does not factor into DCI/HCI checks btw :scholar:
     
  8. Splup

    Splup Guest

    You tried it for how long with your friends? We tried this with approx 720 hits (15 mins with 1,25sek swing) and there was no difference at all.
     
  9. Splup

    Splup Guest

    We also tried for 20 or 15 mins (Can't remember which) with 1,25 sek swing difference between 45DCI and 70 DCI, attacker using HLD. Difference wasnt really remarkable, If I remember correctly it was 14 hits less.

    We were using one program which counts hits in every test so they are pretty realiable.
     
  10. Chaosy

    Chaosy Guest

    I'm going to have to agree with Speedy Orkit.

    It's easy enough to hit someone with only 45 DCI. You're pretty much REQUIRED to have 60+ DCI on a suit these days just to not get hit to where you can actually get spells off as a mage. Dexers are extremely powerful. If you're crying about not being able to hit someone to kill them, you either don't have the right items or you're not playing your character correctly.

    HCI + HLD > DCI.
     
  11. Salty Pete

    Salty Pete Guest

    Yeah, no. It does. The RNG factors into all hit/miss equations.
     
  12. drawn

    drawn Journeyman
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    taking HLD out of the equation- notice i did not state HLD-

    With Parry/DCI/HCI/Wep Skill/anat+eval calculations, it is a formula, not a random number generated like a % for example like hit lightning 47%. That means that 47% of the time lightning will hit or RNG says that 53% of the time it won't. That's RNG. NOT an individual check for DCI and then a check on parry and then a check on wep skill...


    *edit* found the FORMULA

    The formula for Chance to hit is...
    Hit Chance% = ( ( [Attacker's Combat Ability + 20] * [100% + Attacker's Hit Chance Increase] ) divided by
    ( [Defender's Combat Ability + 20] * [100% + Defender's Defense Chance Increase] * 2 ) ) * 100
    Minimum hit Chance% is 2% at all times.

    If DCI is capped at 45%, then my attacker's chance to hit should be...
    =[(120 + 20) * (1 + .45)] / ([(120 + 20) * (1 + .45) * 2]) * 100
    =(140 * 1.45) / (140 * 1.45) * 2 * 100
    =203 / 406 * 100
    =50% chance to hit. So I should hit the defender 50% of the time.

    NOW if DCI is raised to 60....

    = 203 / 448 * 100

    = 45% chance to hit

    Please show me RNG in here btw.....

    So please, unless you know for certain how the code works please do not troll.

    THANKS!
     
  13. Radun

    Radun Guest

    durrrr everything that can either hit or miss is dependent on the RNG btw
     
  14. Salty Pete

    Salty Pete Guest

    Do you see all of the % symbols in your tirade? There is your RNG.
     
  15. Radun

    Radun Guest

    dear troll, it's a % CHANCE to hit... whenever it's a CHANCE to go either way, hit or miss, the RNG factors into that. the only way the RNG wouldn't factor in is if it was made so that if you have higher hci than their dci you always hit, if you have higher dci than their hci you always defend... but it doesn't work that way. each time you swing, all the calculations are performed... the formulas you showed are to determine the PERCENT CHANCE that the action will go one way or another. the PERCENT CHANCE is a variable that is used by the RNG.
    also...
    HCI and DCI are both capped at 45, so... your extra example of having 60 dci is irrelevant unless the person is hit with HLD, in which case his dci would be debuffed to 35dci, temporarily.
    and it's not 3 individual calculations for hci/dci, combat skill, then parry... it's one calculation that factors in hci/dci + combat skill, then a seperate one for parry.

    lol, you're welcome
     
  16. drawn

    drawn Journeyman
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    #1. 100% = 1 (no rng there)

    #2. hit chance % = answer to the formula lol

    what you FAIL to realize is that DCI is a hard # increase, not a %. It is 45 DCI not 45% DCI. That's why the formula is 100 (which is equal to a true numerical value of 1) PLUS the defender's DCI.

    My point is (and I could be wrong) that somewhere along these recent patches that the DCI cap against NON HLD attacks was taken off and allowed to reach different values.

    Now we can start another thread discussing RNG and the ridiculous formula with the variables that go into RNG, however in this case I think we can all see that there is no RNG involved.
     
  17. Salty Pete

    Salty Pete Guest

    The only person failing to realize something here is you. The % chance to hit IS the RNG.

    50% chance to hit does not mean that you hit every other swing. It means that over the course of time your character should hit as many times as it misses. You can literally have stretches where a character hits every single time for x number of swings. The flip side of that you will miss x number of swings in a row. When you hit a few of the bad stretches in a row it seems like something is wrong, some aspect of the game MUST be broken or changed...

    No, it's really just you having a bad run of random numbers.
     
  18. Anakena

    Anakena Seasoned Veteran
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    You forgot to factor the parry from JaT.
     
  19. WarUltima

    WarUltima Babbling Loonie
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    Sorry OP but I have to say this, yes if there is a chance to hit or miss... RNG is indeed a factor. Yes you probably missed or target sometimes but sometimes you get a few hits in a row. Unless your hit chance is 100% then RNG is NOT a factor here but then human JoAT parry has a small chance that they can still parry your attack even if you have 100% chance to hit, and then RNG is factored in their parry chance here also.

    All in all I think the attacker with HLD still has an edge here. Since HLA is used much less in combat especially if you are complaining about not being able to hit the mages.

    I dont have 120 weapon skill and I sometimes dont have 45hci and yes I miss a lot of times but I sometimes still do hit someone with max dci w/120 wep skill many hits in a row... IF RNG is in my favor.

    Out of personal experience, I do feel that its harder to hit 45hci vs 60dci but then I didnt have the time to test out 1000+ swings to prove it. :blushing:
     
  20. Radun

    Radun Guest

    look at any item with that property and you will see the % symbol. +45% hci means: your normal % chance to hit + 45%.
    if your chance to hit someone before hci/dci is 50%, and you have a 15% hci advantage over their dci, your final % chance to hit them will be 65%... (50% + 15%).

    50% chance to hit does not mean "you will hit them 1/2 the time"... it means that each time you swing, there's a 50% chance that the hit will land. it's the RNG which determines which side of that 50:50 coin each swing will land on.
    what this means is, if you have a 95% chance to hit someone (120skill vs 120skill, 45hci vs 0dci), you will actually probably miss them less than 5% of the time, over a short period... which is because it's the RNG that determines which side of that 95:5 coin each swing will land on.
     
  21. peanutbutter

    peanutbutter Guest

    yes. 45 is cap for both.

    also, here's the way it works (or used to work) (may be different now)

    you get 3 rolls to defend:

    1) check your weapon skill against attacker's weapon skill
    pass
    2) check your DCI against attacker's HCI
    pass
    3) check parry

    is that still how it works?
     
  22. Radun

    Radun Guest

    no... it's just:

    check for 'attacker's combat skill & hci' vs 'defender's combat skill & dci'
    pass
    check for chance to parry

    p.s. ... I see a lot of people saying 60dci to nullify HLD, and that's not accurate. HLD = -25dci... 45DCI = 70dci - 25dci

    60dci would still leave you at 35dci when under the effect of HLD.
     
  23. How about we max it at 100%???? lol...

    But it is good as is... no changes need to be made :\