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Here is an ROT system which will actually work from someone who actually plays UO.

Discussion in 'UO Siege Perilous' started by MoonglowMerchant, Sep 9, 2008.

  1. Ok,

    For those who don't know, here is the current system.

    70-80--5 minutes between gains, 3.6 points per day
    80-98--10 minutes between gains, 2 points per day
    98-120--15 minutes between gains, 2 points per day


    Here is the new system.

    70-80--5 minutes between gains, 5 points per day
    80-90--8 minutes between gains, 4 points per day
    90-100--12 minutes between gains, 3 points per day
    100-110--15 minutes between gains, 3 points per day
    110-120--15 minutes between gains, 2 points per day


    Ok, lets compare the two systems.

    In the "old" RoT, assuming you start a new character and get all your gains every day, it takes about 90 days (3 months) to make a 7X GM character. It takes about 135 days (4.5 months) to make a 6 X 120 character.

    In the "new" RoT assuming you start a new character and get all your gains every day, it takes about 55 days (1.5 months) to make a 7X GM character. It takes about 97 days (3 months) to make a 6 X 120 character.

    So, you save 1.5 months going from zero to 7X GM and 1.5 months going from zero to 6 X 120.

    If you are training one skill from zero to 120, the "old" system requires 23 days if you are maxxing your gains each day. The "new" system requires 16 days if you max your gains.

    The overall reduction in days spent training is an improvement whether you are talking about 7 skills or just one.

    Now, lets talk about the time it takes each day to get all your gains.

    If you are training 6 or 7 skills, it isn't that bad. It never takes more than one hour of playing under the "old" system or under the "new" system to get all your gains for the day if you are training a new character.

    THE PROBLEM IS THE HUGE AMOUNT OF TRAINING TIME EACH DAY TO GET ALL YOUR GAINS IF YOU ARE ONLY TRAINING ONE SKILL.

    Why would someone train just one skill? Well, maybe EA introduces a new skill like bushido or spellweaving and you want to add it to your template. Maybe EA nerfs a skill and you no longer want it. In either case, here are the daily requirements to get max gains when training just one skill.

    Under the "old", it would take 3 hours of training each day to max your gains on a skill between 70 and 80. Under the "new" system, it will take more than 4 hours of training each day to max your gains between 70 and 80.

    Under the "old" system, it would take 3 hours and 20 mins each day to max your gains between 80 and 90. Under the "new" system, it will take more than 5 hours to get your daily gains between 80 and 90.

    It gets worse.

    Under the "new" system, it will take 6 hours each day to get all your gains on one skill between 90 and 100. It will take SEVEN AND A HALF HOURS each day to get all your gains between 100 and 110. Finally, it will take 5 hours to get all your gains each day between 110 and 120.

    So, what is the solution?

    I am going to fix this. I am doing it for the players of Siege and the dedicated staff at EA (I just need you to code it).

    As I explain the solution, keep two things in mind. One, daily caps are in place to prevent people from gaining skills too quickly. Two, training a single skill under RoT requires a ridiculous amount of time each day.

    Alright, here is the fix.

    Leave the "new" caps in place.

    70-80 5 points per day
    80-90 4 points per day
    90-110 3 points per day
    110-120 2 points per day

    However, instead of having the delay timer determined by skill level, have it determined by the number of skills in RoT.

    The basic rule is 1 minute between gains for each skill in RoT. So, if I am training only one skill in RoT, I get a gain every minute. If I am training 7 skills in RoT, I get a gain in each skill every 7 minutes. This is the same no matter how high my skills are in RoT.

    Here is an example.

    I start a new 7X character and work all my skills to 70. It is my first day in RoT. I log in and immediately get 7 gains. 7 minutes later, I get another 7 gains and so on. It will take 42 minutes to get all my gains for the day. This is very similar to the "new" RoT. Under the "new" RoT, it would take 30 minutes.

    The big difference is in training a single skill. Instead of 4 hours to get my gains each day from 70 to 80, it will take 50 minutes.

    From 80 to 90 instead of 5 hours to max my gains on a single skill, it will take 40 minutes. Daily required training times will be reduced all the way up to 20 minutes for 2 points from 110 to 120.

    You can play with the interval between gains. If one minute is too fast, make it two minutes.

    The point is that by scaling gains to the number of skills trained rather than skill level, you will equalize the time spent in game to train a new character raising 6 or 7 skills and an established character training one.

    Caps are still in place to prevent powergamers from going 0 to 120 in a day or a week. You still have to log on each day to get your gains. Training time for new characters will be relatively unaffected.

    What this system does is allow people to train one or two skills in RoT without having to be on-line for 5 to 7 hours each day.

    You are welcome.

    :)
     
  2. kendalldcfan

    kendalldcfan Guest

    When does the next day start? Sounds stupid ok is a day training from 7am today until 7am tomorrow or does the wait time start 24 hours after first or last skill gain for today. If I gain my alotted points tonight from 7pm to 8pm, when will I be able to gain again. In old days you could say "powerhour" is there any way to know now when you are able to gain?
     
  3. Vortex

    Vortex Slightly Crazed
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    Good solution.
     
  4. CroakerTnT

    CroakerTnT Guest

    I like it.

    Did you also post it on U.Smell?
     
  5. Tjalle

    Tjalle Grand Inquisitor
    Professional Stratics Veteran Campaign Supporter Gilfane

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    Looks interesting. One question though.

    Let´s say you have a 6x120 char and want to switch skill A for skill B. You soulstone skill A and start to train skill B. Now, when you hit RoT at 70 and since you have 5 other skills in RoT (at 120) will it be 6 mins between gains?
     
  6. Kat

    Kat Crazed Zealot
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    Just be respectful when you post your suggestions, please.
     
  7. I try.

    Frustration some times gets the better of me.

    If you think this idea could work, go post about it in UHall. It is on page 2 now.
     
  8. Hoffs

    Hoffs Gilfane Keeper of the Hall
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    For one thing it is going to make them have to do extra coding. But secondly, I think it is needlessly complicated, just like the present system.

    As far as I am concerned, ROT stops someone from just coming to Siege and macroing up a character in a couple of days. However, I see no reason why there should be a huge delay between gains, just a limit to the amount you can gain each day. Personally I would favour reducing all gains to two minutes across the board.
     
  9. OldAsTheHills

    OldAsTheHills Lore Master
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    It sounds like you want to remove the simulation activity associated with that skill gain.

    I trump you method with this idea: Every 24hrs, a set time of the server daily timer,
    each player gains x skill points and it able through a gump to distribute as you want.
    This will take you about 30 seconds to do each day. X points is determined by the formula
    based on obtained total skill points.

    Fortunately, the developers see that inside game activities should occur while you gain
    skill points. So, this will never happen on their watch!
    I see no reason for them to shorting your time to gain.

    *stares*
    Yahaxithonix
     
  10. Hoffs

    Hoffs Gilfane Keeper of the Hall
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    I almost added in the original post, and will state it here instead then, that letting them get their gains out the way relatively quickly will let them get out and play the game properly if they have time.
     
  11. The reason for shortening the time between gains is that especially with higher daily caps, it will take obscene amounts of time to max out daily gains.

    Since they based their re-design of RoT under the assumption that people would max out their daily gains, it is a real problem.

    i.e. If you can't max out your daily gains, then speeding up character creation through higher caps is completely ineffective.
     
  12. I'd be ok with that too Hoffs. The thing is, unless you make it perfectly clear to them by demonstrating data, they aren't going to be inclined to make any changes at all.

    Simply telling them the delay should be two minutes won't get them to move.
     
  13. Trep

    Trep Guest

    if this is what you want to suggest to the devs you need to either multiply the gains by 2 or cut the time in half

    as proven time and time again...the devs will always half ass a solution. so either dont bother or make sure a half assed version of your solution is what you really want....
     
  14. Only skills above 70 with their arrows turned up will count as RoT skills.

    Please go here and comment.

    http://vboards.stratics.com/showthread.php?t=100639
     
  15. Tjalle

    Tjalle Grand Inquisitor
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    Wouldn´t it be easy to get around your idea then? One could just lock the other skills to have it not count as in RoT when training multiple skills in RoT.

    Lock all but one skill, gain in that. Lock it and unlock another and gain in that and so on...

    Not that I see anything wrong in getting shorter timers by doing that but if it worked that way it would kinda make your idea (and don´t take this the wrong way :p) useless...

    Then they could just put in 2 minute timers instead no matter how many skills you have in RoT and keep the caps.

    I hope you understand what I mean with this.
     
  16. That is a really good point. The shorter timer on individual skills does encourage "cheating" doesn't it?

    You could choose to build in safeguards to prevent that but it might just be easier to have shorter timers with the caps.

    The difficulty with even a two minute timer is it would still take one hour and forty minutes to get all your gains from 70-80 and one hour and twenty minutes to get all your gains from 80-90. The times would drop as the daily cap goes down.

    You know though, that sounds somewhat reasonable. I was originally thinking that training (one skill, two skills or seven skills) ought to take at most 2 hours. A blanket two minutes between skills would do that.

    It would be a little longer per day than what I originally proposed but certainly simpler.
     
  17. Tjalle

    Tjalle Grand Inquisitor
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    Aye, 1 hour and 40 minutes is a reasonable time to gain 5 skill points I think. Plus with a 2 minute timer one would keep playing that char for 1 h and 40 mins and have fun instead of logging in, gain, set egg timer and log out.

    Like Hoffs said, keep skill caps (although I would like to see them a little higher) but there´s no need for long timers in between the gains...
     
  18. Turtle

    Turtle Guest

    Who cares?