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High Resolution Artwork.

Discussion in 'UHall' started by Goodmann, Nov 15, 2015.

  1. Goodmann

    Goodmann Babbling Loonie
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    I think this is a must to revive UO or to get new players/people to come back to the game. I know they stated it would be to much work for there current 1 artist to render UO's items because there are to many. We have a pretty dedicated player base of which I am sure some people would help with rendering items if they are given the tools and taught how. Treat it like a Beta and allow players to help on a test shard then things can be finalized by the Devs. This way you could potentially have 100's of helpers compared to one lonely artist. They could add a little incentive for testers?? Only reason I thought if this was bc of logging into the EC and reminded me how bad that thing looks............... There has to be some kind of solution to get the High Res Artwork back on track. This was one of the top things people wanted and it's just not gonna happen unless we find a solution. Any thoughts?
     
  2. Angel of Sonoma

    Angel of Sonoma Certifiable
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    this is a fantastic idea. i've seen what the player base is capable of doing with uo's artwork. imagine the progress that could be made if we divide and conquer.
     
  3. Uvtha

    Uvtha Grand Poobah
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    First of all, they can't accept volunteer work, they could get sued. It happened before, I'm sure some other old timers remember. :(

    Secondly I think the tools and teaching are a drawing tablet and an art degree. Most of the work would have to be done by hand, obviously, which is something that the average joe gamer simply doesn't have the skills to do. I assume the process is blowing the art up, then touching it up freehand like @Saphireena did in that once famous HD art thread of hers. It's tedious, skilled work, and I really doubt that the few people qualified (most likely active professional artists) to do it would be thrilled about doing it for free, in their free time, especially on such a massive scale.

    I just don't think its possible without hiring a team simply to do the update. Even then it could take many months. Just can't see it happening.
     
  4. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
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    I'm willing to bet there are more playing UO than you might think. Especially if you include those who are already doing or have done such things for Free Shards.

    If they opened things up to where we could submit tiles and art for say even $0.25 each they would probably get 1,000X more done than they could with just their one artist. And if they gave him the final say in what was allowed I'm fairly certain they could get it done quickly and easily. Problem is there are over 60K items and tiles and that doesn't include all the animations and body art That's just static tiles mostly. And at a low $0.25 that would be 15k or more spent to update the art. Not to mention the hours that it would take Onifrk to look over test and approve it all.


    Oh and I thought I'd just add they actually DO stuff like this in EQ's Landmark. People there do the work of the DEV's for EQNext FOR FREE. What do they "Get" for their hard work? A stupid in-game trophy in Landmark. And I know other games do it as well.

    I could see a bunch of really nice additions coming to UO if they opened it up to such things. Infact if they really wanted to generate an income they ought to do things that Free Shards offer... things like removing the foundation of your home so it move fluidly on all sides... This also allows you to put doors in to other sides of your house. And many other features that can be added for fees. These things could be done by the PEC or even GM's. Just saying.
     
    #4 MalagAste, Nov 15, 2015
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2015
  5. HoneythornGump

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    If they aren't going to upgrade the graphics to high resolution then give us access to the KR artwork for #$%@$ sake.

    How the (expletive) does a game go from high resolution to low resolution?

    Absolutely horrible decision making from Calvin Crowner and 2D "Jurassic" Mesanna.

    Then 5 years of empty promises on how they are going to upgrade the artwork....:lie:

    This Dev Team since Mesaana can't get any more short sighted. :twak:

    The introduction of shard shields on her watch is proof enough of that.

    Absolutely no vision of trying to propel the game forward into the future,or focus on attracting new players.
     
  6. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
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    While I understand some of what she's doing and I do know that she LOVES UO as much as any of us... I do agree it is an epic fail to give up on doing a High Rez art update... It's a nail in the coffin for UO for a lot of folk.

    I can't even get most any of my friends to even look at UO since they just laugh at the Graphics and won't even give it a try and I'm not alone.

    Sure there are some Jurassics out there who like the outdated look.... but most gamers now have good machines and good monitors and UO looks like hell on them.


    But let me add this to @Mesanna for @Onifrk The level of quality on graphics has had a SIGNIFICANT decline. I ask that he go back and look at the art from the beginning of UO through SE. The level of detail is AMAZING. Look at the chests of drawers, the beds and cots, look at the metal chest, walls everything... and then look at the level of detail on things like SA and beyond. Something happened and it ain't pretty. The sundial while nice pales in comparison to things... I went tile by tile though much of the art recently and some of the stuff in there for the ruins of SA look like cartoon drawings compared to some of the wonderful tiles of old rubble. The wood in the SE looks rich and good except for one set... which looks like weathered beaten wood... doesn't have the polish the others do.... Look at the new housetiles and how "flat" many of them look in comparison to the tiles of old. They look too "perfect"... and lack any depth. Much like I said about the new Flowered dress..... it lacks any definition.... there is no stiching.... no shadowing.... it looks like someone painted it onto the paperdoll and overlaid a flower pattern on it.... and it looks like CRAP. Look at how HORRIBLE the robe looks on a Gargoyle.. check the difference between a regular "robe" and the Gargish Fancy robe. One has definition and detail the other looks like a gray burlap bag...
     
    #6 MalagAste, Nov 15, 2015
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2015
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  7. HoneythornGump

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    I don't doubt her love for UO, I'll give her credit there...

    Ultimately though Mesanna made the decision to cater to the Jurassics, to placate and appease those who like those horrid Classic Client graphics from 1997. This decision comes at a price, because by doing so your sacrificing any chance UO has at a future, and as you aptly put it "a nail in the coffin".

    Support of the classic client and the low resolution graphics is UO's mortal wound. Mesanna made the decision to do that...

    It's also Mesanna's decision to put the classic client on the download client screen. Anyone trying UO for the first time should not be doing so on the Classic Client. I understand the need to keep the client available to the Jurassics who like the outdated look, and will never change regardless of what client and graphics are implemented, however that client should be hidden away somewhere, and any new players trying UO should do so on the EC client.

    Sorry that's just my opinion. I don't meant to turn this into a client war thread, but any mention of graphics and improving the art and it becomes inevitable.

    The classic client, and it's outdated graphics are UO's mortal wound, and contiued support of it is why UO is in the sorry shape it's in.

    Also, if the resources aren't there to improve the graphics that still does not explain why the KR art is still not available to those who want something better than we have now.
     
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  8. Kei

    Kei Knight of Kingdom of God
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    I think CC looks better than EC. I mean look at the paperdoll on EC, it looks plain ugly and the Hiryu looks like a lizard.

    Its the one thing why I do not want to use EC.
     
  9. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
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    In some ways yes..... however in many ways the EC looks far better and richer...

    The EC Female isn't too bad.... though she still looks somewhat dike... not nearly as bad as before. The Male paperdoll however still looks like he is trying to take a squat in the woods or something it's horrible and he's scrawny looking and has dunlap disease.... which is why you think it's nasty.

    Personally I have gotten over that for the usefulness I get from the client.

    As for the Hiryu yes it's an eyesore.... poor thing looks like a plucked chicken IMO. But again... won't kill the game for me. I really like the way the ground looks and many of the roads and cobblestones... I also am rather fond of the Fire Beetle. Dragons however make me sad. They have lost the variety of having 2 colors and are much smaller and such.
     
  10. Tanivar

    Tanivar Crazed Zealot
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    If it's clearly stated in the documentation that your volunteer work becomes the property of UO's owner with their having all rights to it to use and alter as they please, on what grounds can they be sued? You chose to create the graphics and sent it to them through the volunteer system, you have no further rights to it.
     
  11. Dot_Warner

    Dot_Warner Babbling Loonie
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    The BLATANT LIE of a High Res art update died a slow and painfully tortuous death along with a great deal of Broadsword's credibility.

    I wouldn't waste hold my breath hoping for a player-assisted art update either. Pigs will dance ballet, recite Shakespeare and colonize the moon first.

    And no, "bitter" doesn't even begin to cover it.
     
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  12. Hannes Erich

    Hannes Erich Seasoned Veteran
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    Wait, who said we're never going to see the high res art update?

    I'm just asking, because there have been a couple times over the years when I saw @Mesanna or another dev answering questions on the forum, so I asked about the high res art update, and whoosh, silence. To be fair, though, as devs they can't hang around the forum all day, and they might not have seen my question.

    I remember the day I read Mesanna's post on the UO website about the art update, I was so happy. There are few UO-related updates that could have made me happier.

    Can anyone point to where she said they abandoned this project? This has been a mystery to me for years now. Why did they bring it up and then never talk about it again? :confused2:

    :link:

    P.S. The stuff @Saphireena did was so amazing. I remember that thread very well.
     
  13. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
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    They have said it a few times now... Just don't want to burst your bubble of illusion or break your pipe dream... but they have said it at least a couple of times now. I think once in that crap video about stuff where they announced all sorts of stuff including Eodon... sort of hinted at.... and another time at a Meet and Greet don't recall which one...

    Honestly I agree with Dot... And I too am extremely disappointed and irritated about it. "IF" there were a decent UO alternative that had good RP and was a SANDBOX in a true sense of the world like UO is I'd have already left for greener pastures. But no such game exists... So here I am. Though at present I'm becoming less and less active by the month and since Eodon wasn't that great and I'm not at all looking forward to the new Vet rewards my mind again turns to wondering if what I pay every month in fees is really worth it anymore...

    The only pipe dream still gasping for breath around here is a revamp of pets and something better than the account "Mis" Management system we have now and hopefully an in-game store. But I'm not holding my breath for any of that either... and I'm having SERIOUS doubts that the Pet Revamp will be anything anyone actually wants or had any idea's about. I rather have the feeling it'll leave more of that bitter taste in the mouth like a bad pill that you got stuck and it won't go down.... Kinda like their idea that adding 4 or 5 extra pets slots was all that marvelous... Tamers NEED more slots. 2 or 4 is more like a kick in the head than a real boost.
     
  14. Dot_Warner

    Dot_Warner Babbling Loonie
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    A High Res Art Update has been dangled at us since KR was beaten and shamed into the EC.

    Calvin promised it, then Mesanna promised it multiple times. We even got one example post of redone castle ties...which IMHO were pretty horrid. We were always told it was being worked on and that it would take time. A few times it was even hinted at being nearly complete, only to have "something some up" to delay it. Twice we were told that a new process was going to be used to automatically upsize and clean the CC assets, only to then find out that something happened - and then that eventually the process was scrapped as being "to hard" or that the results were "unacceptable." (That was long after we had been told the results were awesome, mind you.) Of course to get these updates out of the devs it was like pulling teeth, so I'm going to assume they were mostly fabrications to begin with.

    We get that UO is being done on less than a shoestring budget, probably less that a flip-flop strap budget even, but a graphical update is about the only thing that will keep UO viable past 20 years. Nostalgia gamers barely keep the lights on.
     
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  15. Ossy

    Ossy Adventurer

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    I like the look of the classic client, it's why I came back. There's a charm to it. I've never liked the look of the EC and tried it out again when came back.

    I don't do any other gaming and won't ever, so having to upgrade my computer to play a game is a reason to not play that game.

    But that's just me.
     
  16. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Grand Poobah
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    If I remember right that was all in the last volunteer program and the state of Calif. said to bad so sad you are screwed EA pay them. Easy fix would be to make a contest with the clause that all submissions become the property of UO and give out awards/rewards/gifts to all peoples drawings that UO plans to use.
     
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  17. Angel of Sonoma

    Angel of Sonoma Certifiable
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    this is a concern of mine too. as of late we are finding more and more nerfs that were never asked for (or needed in my opinion) and done in a vacuum. to rub salt into the wound, the devs fail to give any explanation. i dread the thought of the harm they could do during a pet revamp.

    back on topic... i am sure BS could devise some non-liable method for players to submit art. it might even convince me to switch to the EC.
     
  18. Smoot

    Smoot Grand Poobah
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    i would have to argue the opposite. by introducing the EC, a cheap mimic of modern games, time was taken away from updating the classic client, or replacing it with the same graphics/feel/look but with updated ui and hi res art.

    they should have figured out that most people play UO for the "classic" feel. they should have replaced the old CC with a new, updated CC and not wasted resources on the failed attempts at other clients that just dont look like UO.
     
  19. Thrakkar

    Thrakkar Slightly Crazed
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    All due respect for your idea, but this is not going to work.

    There's a huge difference between people who get something taught and people with acutal experience. And if you don't have the latter, people will produce more work for the devs instead of doing the work for them.
    Besides, different people have different styles. Artwork wouldn't look like it is from one single mold, but rather some patchwork art.
    Also, who is going to pay for those tools? Those can become quite expensive...
    The QA, to have a defined test cases and a defined QA process is something completely different than people testing out stuff on the TC.

    I just can't see, how this could work out.

    For me the boat has sailed. I already accepted, that High-Res art isn't coming anymore...
     
  20. Smoot

    Smoot Grand Poobah
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    she said it wasnt working out when asked at a few in-game meet and greets.
     
  21. whiterabbit

    whiterabbit Stratics Legend
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    AND FLY
     
  22. Uvtha

    Uvtha Grand Poobah
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    Yeah, they should have gone the route saphireena did instead of KR. Ah well. Zero chance they sink money into a client art upgrade ever again.
     
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  23. Ossy

    Ossy Adventurer

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    I've played Final Fantasy, World of Warcraft, Dungeons & Dragons, Lord of the Rings, Guild Wars and a couple others through the years. I keep coming back to UO, which was my first and favorite.

    UO shouldn't try to emulate the other games, even if they are more successful. UO should be it's own and unique thing because there isn't another MMO out there that is like it.

    I was a little disappointed to come back and see how much reliance there is on "builds" (templates) and having the right equipment and stats. Made me think I was back playing WoW.

    Could the graphics be updated in the CC? Sure, but I don't want it to have the graphics like a WoW or LotR.

    Celebrate UO's uniqueness.
     
  24. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Grand Poobah
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    AMEN

    I have said it a million times and now 1,000,001
    Give me the ECUI with the CC graphics and I will switch in a heart beat. Please do not try to tell me that the EC graphics are the same, they are a bastardization of the original and who drew the new MOBs to replace th old ones for the EC should be shot.
     
  25. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
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    Actually it wasn't cheap but they hired the cheapest artists they could find I swear ... and tried to pass crayola and colored pencil drawings as "new art" in KR and most of us balked. Had they kept the "look" of UO and not tried to completely redo all the art into something strange... KR would have been the improvement folk were looking for.

    KR had tons of things that the EC doesn't and it fails in comparison. Granted I agree that "some" of the KR art was good... mostly just the fact that colored plants kept their stems GREEN as they should but just the "flowers" were colored. Which was a HUGE improvement over the current methods of coloring which is to dip the entire thing in paint..... which looks like crap. I know good art can be done. If you look at the new Kings Collection take a close look at dying the painting of the Unicorn... or horse whatever it is. Only the Unicorn/Horse dyes. Not the whole frelling painting. Whoever designed that gets an A++. It irritates me to no end that anything you color in the game has to be dumped in a paint bucket and you can't dye only proper parts of an item. It's like the old beds... they dye wonderfully... And many of the old Chairs dye properly where only the "pads" of the chair dye not the entire freaking object. More things should be this way.

    I'm sorry @Smoot if you accept half ass jobs. But for me I guess I'm rather picky. Which is why I've never upgraded more than one of my accounts to the Gothic and Rustic housing sets. Not only did they lack proper doors but they lacked matching floor tiles as well as proper roofing tiles to match... making them in my opinion Incomplete. And if they think I'm going to pay good money for something that is incomplete they have another thing coming. Sadly the EC was INCOMPLETE now they did let Pinco try to fix it's gross inadequacies..... but then they put it on an outdated version of the client and sent the EC back to the dark ages. Not to mention they stripped 90% of the usefulness out of it. Thankfully Pinco has done a wonderful job of filling in the gaps with his UI. God forbid he should decide to quit updating it and it should go the way of the dodo like UOAutomap.... and UOAssist has in a way.

    The old CC is extremely code flawed and honestly ought to be scrapped. Should have been brought up to speed with modern computers and systems ages ago... we aren't still using Win98 anymore... And the worst thing about the CC is that it allows the use of dozens of readily available illegal 3rd party programs and has more holes than a sieve.
     
  26. Goodmann

    Goodmann Babbling Loonie
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    MalagAste-"And the worst thing about the CC is that it allows the use of dozens of readily available illegal 3rd party programs and has more holes than a sieve."

    There are dozens of readily available 3rd party programs in the EC so that's not really a valid point.
     
  27. cazador

    cazador Crazed Zealot
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    She will never EVER EVER realize and accept this. It's more of a refusal for reality. Not worth the post counts arguing this even though I can link at least 4 myself..


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  28. Fridgster

    Fridgster Lore Master
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    So im guessing you believe said users wont simply design software/cheats/hacks for the ec? There is one true way to stop cheating. Software like punkbuster. We all know how well that was accepted when it was originally suggested.
     
  29. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
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    The reason it wasn't accepted was that it allowed them to pretty much get into your computer... like opening a big door to the world and saying come ..... poke about on my computer and check out my files take my private information and sell it.
     
  30. cazador

    cazador Crazed Zealot
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    You don't even need punk buster to battle the third party apps. Free shards literally have all but blocked them or just made using the "hack" type functions useless completely. It's one of a few things happening. Our devs are incompetent which I don't think it is, the code is so ancient that they can't fix it, or they just don't really care enough to. It's def one of those three things though..100%


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
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  31. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
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    Which I find sad... along with the fact that it's been SEVERAL years since the EC was introduced and I still have to see missing squares all along the coastlines.

    To me it feels like no one cares how crappy the game looks in either client.
     
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  32. cazador

    cazador Crazed Zealot
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    Well here's the thing. Messana likes to say the client use is at 50/50 but playing the game and talking to people it's more like 60/40 70/30 classic I've EC. But the issue is if they come out and say that. The people that are playing the EC will have complete assurance and know nothing is ever happening to improve the EC. I personally like the ECUI it's just the graphics are horrendous. It hurts your eyes it's filled with bugs. If the killed the CC I would just quit no questions asked. Not because i wanted to it's just unless the EC has an option for CC graphics. I.e. Fields/containers/ and such..it's just too ugly and clunky to play. I really with the would start a Kickstarter to hire a new dev and make it perfectly clear what he's there for. To combine to two clients with the same UI and you have the option of CC or EC on startup. I'd gladly donate then.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  33. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
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    You are not alone. I am willing to be a bunch of folk would give to something of that nature just as I'm sure that many would give money to get the graphics updated.
     
  34. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Grand Poobah
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    The sad part is that there are programs out there that would replace UOA and we can't use them but the EC does the same stuff and more, go figure. I guess UO wants us to cheat by using the EC.
     
  35. Goodmann

    Goodmann Babbling Loonie
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    UOA is a joke, complete Joke and EA still supports Tugsoft?There are things much better with the same functions that actually work but not legal
    I have always wondered who owns Tugsoft? How many millions did that guy make from UOA, I know personally I have bought about 20+ UOA codes throughout the years. The dress macro in UOA is legit HAHAHAHA
     
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  36. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Grand Poobah
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    There were things that UOA could do but UO deemed them as a cheat so they were taken out but they are allowed with the EC, LOL. The other program that is like UOA has them but is illegal to use, go figure. As stated before if you want to cheat use EC, UO allows it, LMAO. Not sure what connection Tug has/had with UO but at the time it was great and saved a lot of key strokes. The only thing I use UOA for is filling BODs only
     
  37. MalagAste

    MalagAste Belaern d'Zhaunil
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    As I recall there is only one thing UOA does that the EC can't do and that is auto stack all the freaking yarn from the spinning wheel... Why in the heck it doesn't just stack in the first place is BEYOND me.
     
  38. cazador

    cazador Crazed Zealot
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    Not to burst your bubble or anything...but the EC isn't bringing in droves of players with its Nintendo 64 graphics...nostalgia is what keeps this game kicking lol


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  39. Uvtha

    Uvtha Grand Poobah
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    If we are talking just a look test... the EC will fail just as hard. The EC looks like a mess. It's an akward mix of two distinctly different art styles, both of which are very dated. The CC, obviously dated, but at least in appearance it is cohesive.

    Most people don't like retro games. When you can play modern games with the same perspective like diablo 3, any version of UO is going to look pretty old and bad.
     
  40. It Lives

    It Lives Lore Master
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    Leave it alone I say! The only good things that have come from any of the alternate clients has been some of the menu systems adapted to the cc.

    The " art " that bled thru to the CC from Kingdom Reborn and the EC is horrible. Now if they would just make a decent ingame mapping system like uoam, that would be worth pursuing!
     
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