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Hoping we can set up a buyback system

Discussion in 'UO Siege Perilous' started by Ginsu's, Oct 10, 2012.

  1. Ginsu's

    Ginsu's Seasoned Veteran
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    I am hoping we can set up a buyback system. That should be easy to follow, and make everyone happy. .
    Because even the PK’s and the PvP players need to make money. . .

    Having a 2 Part, with 4-Tear, set up. And bonus .
    This just means, 2-Parts are Mage suits or fighter suits. . 4-Tear are prices. Junk, Low, Medium, High. . and Bonus are arties, faction gear or cove – shame loot.. ..

    Mage suit buyback. .
    JUNK: a junk suit is something like full resist with LRC MR-1… This kind of suit is not worth the time to place on a vendor. .

    LOW: a low level suit would be full resist, LRC MR1, LMC1-4, with skill on the jewelry this suit is something for training in. .

    MEDIUM: this suit has full resist, LRC, MR2, LMC 4-7.. jewelry with 2-1 and with low SDI 5 and under.. or with skills on them. . this suit is something for farming or champ bosses. .
    HIGH: well pretty much anything that’s better then the medium level. for farming or champ bosses or PvP. .

    Fighter suit buyback . .
    JUNK: a junk suit is something like full resist with MR1 … This kind of suit is not worth the time to place on a vendor. .

    LOW: a low level suit would be like full resist, HPI 1-4 MR1, HPR1, with skill on the jewelry this suit is something for training in. .

    MEDIUM: this suit has full resist, HPI 4-7 MR2, HPR1, SI 1-4 or SR 1 jewelry with HCI and with low DI 15 and under.. or with skills on them. . this suit is something for farming or champ bosses. .
    HIGH: well pretty much anything that’s better then the medium level. for farming or champ bosses or PvP.

    For the Bonus..
    Arties, faction gear or cove – shame loot
    I think you should add 10k to the suit price for each piece

    NOW I NEED YOUR HELP
    if I forgot something please say something.. siege is the best shard because we can set it up the way we want it to be. So what kinda price are you willing to pay to get your suit back.
    not how much you would sell it for but how much will you buy it back for…
    and please remember not everyone is rich on this shard.
    If we can work something out maybe we can have it posted on the board with the prices…
    So put your thinking caps on. And lets have a good talk about this.
    thank you
     
    #1 Ginsu's, Oct 10, 2012
    Last edited: Oct 10, 2012
  2. Tjalle

    Tjalle Grand Inquisitor
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    Do a set 200K every time someone wants to buy back his/her stuff, be it just one piece of jewelry/armour or a full artie suit. 200K.
    That way the looter doesn´t have to decide himself at what "level" the suit is. Only loot and listen for a buyback in GC.

    Multiple looters might mess that up though.

    And those that don´t want to spend 200K on their stuff can buy a new suit from vendors. Those usually cost less than 200K.

    My thoughts for now...
     
  3. Heavenless

    Heavenless Journeyman

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    Or just run a naked ninja stealth lamer and throw bolas (all kill!)
     
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  4. Ginsu's

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    I do like your thoughts about having a set price for all the armor.
    Thank you for your help. This is a good start.
    So If a pk-pvp kills you, the fight might last say 2 minutes. So for about 5 minutes of work they can make about ½Mil.
    That would be a good payday for them.
    I think the price might be to high, but that is just me.
    and this is why i think getting a price set for buybacks will be a good thing
     
    #4 Ginsu's, Oct 10, 2012
    Last edited: Oct 10, 2012
  5. Shh!

    Shh! Lore Master
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    This never ends well...
     
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  6. Ginsu's

    Ginsu's Seasoned Veteran
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    Well at least i am trying to help.
    sorry to hear you feel this way :(

    I would like you guys not to dryloot, but I can, see how it helps when you do Loot. it keeps prices low on siege.
    I am just trying to put gold in your hands and save us time in making a suit, so some of us can get back in the fight faster.
     
    #6 Ginsu's, Oct 10, 2012
    Last edited: Oct 10, 2012
  7. Shh!

    Shh! Lore Master
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    It's not how I "feel", it's fact. I know what you're trying to do but it has been tried before. It always ends with something like, "Well, your guildmate didn't sell my guildmate his suit back so I'm not selling yours back." Not everyone will participate and that always causes problems.
     
  8. Screws

    Screws Adventurer

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    I'd keep in mind that buybacks are a favor to the person who was killed. If you're not being a cock about getting killed then they are normally 1/2, or less, of the suit's material cost if you were to go out and buy the mats and recraft the suit. Most people are reasonable, just have a good attitude and every once in a while you'll just get your suit back for free.
     
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  9. FrejaSP

    FrejaSP Queen of The Outlaws
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    I know, I don't PvP alot and I do not do faction, but I had been here for long.

    I did understand, the buy back, when there was name on the faction gear and only the owner could use it, but are the names not gone now?

    How much people get looted always depent on:
    1. Their reputation
    2. Their guildtag
    3. How nice their loot is, how much the killer need it
    4. Will the dead guy re-entre the fight as soon he get his gear from his body or will he wait to he get invited gack in the fight (get attacked again)
    5. The killer/killer guilds looting rules
    6. If looting is used to stop a fight and stop the enemies to come back to fast

    I had seen, if a player/guild is known for looting very little, maybe only loot bag, potions, arrows and in the past , regs, many will go easy on them too.
    On the other hand, if someone is known to loot alot, they will most times find them self heavy looted.

    About buy back, is that not some kind of respect thing and the buy back price will depent # 1-3?

    In all this years I had been here, I had been looted very little, even when I was with J-D and UDL tag over my head.

    I really don't think you can set up rules for buy back other than maybe between 2 warring guilds.

    But as I rarely PvP now, I may be wrong
     
  10. Ginsu's

    Ginsu's Seasoned Veteran
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    Maybe these are some of the reasons. why most of the players went to Atlantic...
    I know it is hard to have buybacks. sometimes more then one player may loot you..
    or the player that killed you, was killed by another player and was looted.
    how about marking your gear with your name and a price you are willing to pay for that one piece of your gear..
    now for the player that said, you didn't sell my friends gear back so I'm not selling to you. to me it just sounds childish but it is what it is..
    this is not going to be a perfect system but it's a start
     
  11. Kael

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    Agreed...people play nice for awhile and then some butt head screws it up and everyone gets bitter :(
     
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  12. Rumpy

    Rumpy Slightly Crazed
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    I thought you didn't like buybacks?
     
  13. Rumpy

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    I don't see this happening.

    I know for a fact if I die, its all gone. I don't care though :)

    I stopped selling peoples stuff back when people declined me mine.
     
  14. TheDrAJ

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    Sounds like insurance only more expensive.
     
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  15. Tjalle

    Tjalle Grand Inquisitor
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    I don´t.
    Just helping Ginsu out here with a suggestion.

    Personally I´d prefer to see people accepting that if they get looted, their stuff is gone.
     
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  16. Nico666

    Nico666 Adventurer

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    Good point!
     
  17. Kael

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    The buyback system was one that I hated when I was in factions. It wasn't that I didn't mind getting my gear back it was more the entitlement that I had to get mine back...else somebody else didn't get theirs back. Fight's ended while everone bitched back and forth at each other. Kinda why I like the older era's of UO. Lose your crap and just go replace it and get back into the fight!
     
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  18. chise2

    chise2 Sage
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    Yeah I agree and donlt get me wrong yeah I have and do buy my stuffback when the offer is there. But in general yeah I think it would be better if people got used to just losing their stuff. This buyback thing we have going on really is like a form of insurance on Siege and I donlt think that is a good thing. Having to replace your suits is a good thing. Gives you a reason to keep going out farming to get more supplies/gear and keeps the crafters and course imbuers in business. And really just because you die to someone doesn;t mean you will lose everything. Yes some people dryloot not all do though. And those that do typically get the same treatment right back.
     
  19. Monolith

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    I commend you for trying to set a price for "buy backs". Hope things works out well which will definitely assist in growing the PVP playstyle. Yes.....most went to Atlantic because paying over a mil for suits was little crazy. The high buy back price caused more players to play stealther or naked tamers.

    The big issue with buy back now is items that are not faction items. The buy back only worked for faction items that were linked to the player.
     
  20. Monolith

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    I agree with you to a certain point.......some players only has one account with minimal Soul Stones and not able to farm to replace their suits. Back in the day I was making more gold selling suits back at 200K to 250K depending on the items. Easy making a mil a day or even more selling suits back.
     
  21. Sprago

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    Sell backs dont work
    this is what i do
    if its something ill use i use it
    if its something a guildmember can use they use it
    if its not usable by a me or a guildmate then it get placed on a vendor for a reasonalbe price but at this point its usable by anyone
    if its evil dyed sometimes i sell back but this armor i dont like to sell back if they wouldnt have evil dyed they could have killed me or a guild mate to get it back
    PVP shouldnt be about making money and thats what buybacks promote
    we have more then enough crafters on this shard lets use them
     
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  22. Kael

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    If armor was hero/evil dyed even if there wasn't a sell back there would always be the chance one could loot their armor back :danceb:
     
  23. Sprago

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    how if i cant wear it how they gonna loot it back you dont really think i just care armor around with me do you
     
  24. Kael

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    well..let me put it so you can understand. If people don't hero/evil dye their armor. Then once it's looted from a body...the looter may wear that piece and lose it later to another looter. What was mine, is yours ... soon to be anothers :)

    You evil/hero dye it and it gets looted it either gets tossed in a chest somewhere and forgotten about, perhaps sold on a vendor to a limited number of buyers or perhaps gets unraveled.
     
  25. Monolith

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    The only issue with this is that some players like to PVP and not farm or craft for months to make another suit. I got it.....this shard is more than just PVP, but PVP still and will always attract players. Hence why everyone went to Atlantic.

    If you want to attract players and maintain the players on Siege, then everyone must be willing to sustain all types of players.

    I totally agree with items that are usuable by others........I would definitely loot and keep items to use for myself. Back in the day when Sakey and all of us was still playing Siege and honoring the "buy back" agreement, everyong sold back all faction items and items that was evil dyed and was'nt able to be used by the person looting. When a certain player messed that up......thats pretty much when the population started declining and everyone jumped ship to Atlantic.
     
  26. Bo Bo

    Bo Bo Lore Keeper
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    nothing works, ****** bags ruin it, cause they get off on spoilin good times.
    basically if you arent new to the shard and you dont have the resources to equip yourself you suck.
    bo just gives the **** back anymore, even to the real ****** bags. Whats the point of keepin your ****, if youre a vet and you want something just make it or buy it.
    Bo cant figure out why people are hording gold and or gear?? they gonna shut this **** down soon anyways why not wear the goods and live a little longer.

    just be the better turd and hope that you get it when its your turn to die. Cause unlike righty everyone dies.
     
    #26 Bo Bo, Oct 11, 2012
    Last edited: Oct 11, 2012
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  27. Ginsu's

    Ginsu's Seasoned Veteran
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    well thank you guys, and thank you for keeping it civilized,
    the best thing about this shard is also the worst.
    well I gave this my best shot.
    maybe I'll go back to monster bashing and let some of you guys, kill the rest of siege off.
    and out of the ashes a new siege will be born. One with all 8 virtues with Honor, Compassion at the top.
    and no I have not gave up yet.
    and when I do start winning fights. I will not dishonor the battle, by looting.
    unless it is a BIG IDOC ... then i will put the gear on a vendor for free.

    thank you BO i like your post,
    you are an honorable player. I bow my head to you.
    [​IMG]
     
  28. Rumpy

    Rumpy Slightly Crazed
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    So your saying people cried about losing suits and went to play other servers? Buy backs didn't exist years ago and shouldn't exist now.
     
  29. Rumpy

    Rumpy Slightly Crazed
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    This conversation is ridiculous.

    THERE SHOULD BE NO BUYBACKS PERIOD

    Back in the day, people died. They lost it all. There was no such thing as BUYBACKS. Hell, I remember people losing PBDed items and not getting them back or that was the only RARE Chance of having a BUYBACK.

    Why is everyone crying when they lose their suits? With imbuing, you can craft suits and jewelry for under 300k a suit like I did. They aren't **** suits either, full 70s, 40 LMC, Max DCI, 6 MR, +HP. Cost maybe 300k to make a suit like that, who cares if I die and lose it. Everytime I died, I never got offered a buyback. I asked 1-2 times, got told to go F myself. So why would I bother selling people their crap back? I don't care who you are. The only time I've done it is when people in my guild have asked nicely for me to sell stuff back. Even then, I didn't want to!


    If you don't wanna lose your crap, go buy GM Suits of Barbed Armor & Regs. You lose 5k at each death. Or run the 12k LRC suits, or spend 20k and run all 70s 100% LRC suits. Deal with it. 90% of the stuff people are crying about is all crafted anyways and easily replaced, but people are lazy. When I kill someone, if I can't use it, I give it to guildies or I unravel it for ingreds. If its faction artifacts, they hit the trash can.

    This is Siege an all you people do is make it really pricey insurance.
     
  30. Rumpy

    Rumpy Slightly Crazed
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    RISK vs. Reward
     
  31. Rothen

    Rothen Guest

    I always just walk away if I get PK'ed and never ask for a buyback. I'd rather they struggle getting out of the dungeon I happened to be in and get killed by another mob, heh. And that has happened, btw. Hopefully, in their next life, they get more Christmas presents as kids, and don't feel the need to steal from others anymore.... :D
     
  32. Kael

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    That was just part of it. They also got pissed by ganks, having pvp tamers in the mdist of faction fights, unattended silver farmers, stealthers, and perhaps the most important...no one on to fight without waiting for hours

    Mainly it was just that hard core pvpers wanted to fight and not have to worry about putting together another suit or two. Me I wear pretty ****ty armor so couldnt really care lol
     
    #32 Kael, Oct 11, 2012
    Last edited: Oct 11, 2012
  33. chise2

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    I think the problem with the current buyback system as well its that is basically promotes more greed then the way things were years back when nothing was sold back. It encourages people to loot armor that is junk and they would never use to get some money for it. And like I said before yeah in the past some people would take it all. But plenty of people just took what they needed or just looted to disarm someone for that particular fight *took regs maybe a couple pieces of armor and potions that sort of thing* But things would be better I think if we just did away with buybacks period. You lose your stuff you lose your stuff. And besides if you are nice to people and donlt loot heavy you might find that you donlt lose that much when you die in pvp.
     
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  34. FrejaSP

    FrejaSP Queen of The Outlaws
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    Don't walk away, show your ghost. Very few PK's want all your loot. Some will rez you, some will tell you to rez and come back and pick up the left over.
    Very few PK's will rez kill you, unless you try to access your loot before they are done. Exception is, if the killers are camping a IDOC or something like that.
    Also, most of the PK's we have is not just out to get your loot, they enjoy the killing part too and like when someone is willing to fight back.
     
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  35. FrejaSP

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    I agree, buy back rules will only make it worse and be a pain.
    Sometimes players may lose an item they care about, and ask the killer nicely if they can buy it back but in most cases, the rule is, don't carry anything around, you can't affort to lose.
    I too, like to see more business to the crafters. After last Idoc, i think I sold 10 imbued suits and several skill jewelty.
    Buy back will have same bad effect on crafting as Item Insurance and this stupid old factions items with names had.
    We may also see some of the killers loot on vendors to a fair price, not all vendors I see sell Tina Tink suits and jewelry is my vendors :p

    I also agree, the loot belong to the killer, it's then up to him to be nice if he like/respect his victim and loot light or to use/sell it or to trash it all if he disrespect him/her
     
  36. PuckOfPacific

    PuckOfPacific Journeyman

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    I think we should all just carry scissors.

    Oh, and Bliss is/has been cool about buybacks, But I didn't complain when i died with my pricey suit. I wasn't prepared for the ambush and told bliss it was well played. Maybe some of you are better then Bliss, and Bliss isn't a threat. But to me all Red's were/are threats. BuyBack is cool, but shouldn't be expected. IF you DIE, YOU should expect that: A: your ish just became there ish(or a friend of there's), or 2: they just scissored your ish. Or #D if you don't Whine, maybe you will get your ish back for free or at a cost. The only thing you should expect when you go out into the woods are trees, not compassion.

    I vote for scissors though!
     
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  37. Shh!

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    I really like your A), 2), D) examples :)
     
  38. GarthGrey

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    Ginsu, i still have 4 pieces of your suit (crimmy, Haephestus, Shroud of Condemned, and Protector of the Battle Mage, and i think crafted legs ?) that you can have back. If that's what this threads really about. Bliss has/had the rest. We we're going to offer you the buyback but you rage logged too quick. :)
     
    #38 GarthGrey, Oct 13, 2012
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2012
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  39. Ginsu's

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    No that is ok..
    I am trying to learn PvP so I can play with you guys on my faction player. (Gibbs).
    I have been killed about 30 time and got back about 5 suits ..
    I feel like I should just put suits on vendor for free and have less stress.
    you guys are not looking to PvP . but just loot as much as you can.
    I guess I thought PvP was more Honorable. was thing PvP was more about fighting.
    but after reading this thread. I see I'm way off.
     
    #39 Ginsu's, Oct 13, 2012
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2012
  40. Kael

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    It's more to the victor goes the spoils atmosphere in pvp. You will find many players will rez and not loot...others will do neither. You really can't coordinate a buy back policy because not every player will follow it.

    Best option is be fair with the gear you loot and offer reasonable buy backs or trades and you will find most treat you with the same respect.
     
  41. chise2

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    Ok I am sorry but you just got offered you stuff back and your still complaining? In factions people tend to loot heavy I have noticed. Trust me when we die in a faction fight we typically get our whole suits looted as well and depending on who we were fighting may not get it back. But yes Kael is right.
     
  42. Sprago

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    lets all just goto atlantic so we can insure our stuff. Or remember this is siege and stuff gets looted.
    THERE IS NOTHING UNHONORABLE ABOUT LOOTING
    ask the pvp'ers in the shard we all looose our gear from time to time, Its no big deal get res'ed get another suit and come back and try again.

    This is the problem we need more people crafting/farming materials and armor sell what ya dont need and use the rest
     
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  43. Rumpy

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    While I may not like Sprago a whole lot, I have to agree with him.
     
  44. Ginsu's

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    well there is less then 10 of you guys left.
    soon there will be none. have fun killing the same old players tell there gone.
    LOL and you blame the crafters, because there not making suits.
    The PvP people need to take the blame.
    Everyone that use to played or move to other shard can't be all wrong.
    I was just trying to fix the problem. but less then 10 more to go. :banana:
     
  45. Rumpy

    Rumpy Slightly Crazed
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    Do you ever stop whinning?

    I'm pretty sure those who PvP provide their own items. I don't even have a crafter, just an imbuer and I make my own crap. You just seem to be pissy cause you lost your stuff so many times. Heres Pro Tip #33: Stop sucking.
     
  46. Monolith

    Monolith Sage
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    With the Siege population dwindling, PVPers didn't have nor want to spend countless hours/weeks it took to farm ingredients or silver for another suit. Siege players know the "Risk vs Rewards"........but there is a difference when the population of Siege equals to 20 players with less than 1/3 being vets. The players still left on Siege needs to come to an understanding and figure out what you want Siege to be. You want Siege to be 2/3 crafters and farmers with 1/3 PVPers. Me.....I thought this should reverse. (I could be wrong)

    Yes......when Siege was in its prime with PVPers and Crafters, there wasn't much issues with losing items. Little different now

    Bottome Line: I don't disagree with you nor Sprago, I have the upmost respect for Sprago (a true friend)......Siege is unique. My opinion, there just needs to be a compromise to grow Siege or the population will continue to dwindle.
     
    #46 Monolith, Oct 14, 2012
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2012
  47. chise2

    chise2 Sage
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    I agree there should be compromise. But like I said and others I believe have said buybacks donlt help the situation. They only encourage greed they only contribute to the problem. The best thing someone can do is loot lightly and only take what they will actually use or just loot to disarm.
     
    #47 chise2, Oct 14, 2012
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2012
  48. chise2

    chise2 Sage
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    I think the big problem now is people have gotten to used to having it easy on Siege. I mean we brag about this being the vet shard but then we whine and cry when we lose our stuff. I have seen people ***** even when the pk loots lightly! Things worked well in years past and sure that may have been partially because of the higher population..but I think there was also an understanding we seem to have lost about what Siege is. Limited buybacks are ok..but setting a standard of you always get your stuff back if you pay the right price isn;t a good thing I donlt think. Ultimately like I have said before it seems to lead to greedness and more looting..it hurts crafting and well its pretty much like insurance. Really though donlt carry what you can;t lose. And sure there will be those that can afford to carry better then others.But guess what? thats how its always been.
     
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  49. Kael

    Kael Certifiable
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    Agreed....I recall when I started playing UO in general the saying was don't carry what you can't easily replace in Fel

    While I whole heartily agree that the spoils belong to the victor. I think people need to look though at who and what they loot. Newer players to the shard have great difficulty competing with established players here that not only have unlimited gold, armor and weapons but also most skills soulstoned and ready to be used for the next new gimp template. Perhaps as a general rule pk's should look to their own future by light looting newer players as to not drive them off, merely whet their appetite to stick around, progress their skills and look towards revenge.
     
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  50. chise2

    chise2 Sage
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    Yep thats why I said in another post I think it is best to loot lightly and only take what you need to disarm a person or what you will actually use. I typically do not touch new players stuff. I mean most of them donlt have anything I want anyway.