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How to fix the economy.. (New Currency)

Discussion in 'UHall' started by imported_Velvathos, Apr 27, 2008.

  1. People are getting way too much gold and getting it way too fast. In real life, the United States federal reserve prints money out of thin air and causes the de-valuation of the dollar, this is what makes the cost of living go up, with nothing to back up the dollar either... Gold has no value, thus, the cost of living in UO has gone up, this is what we call a inflation, or a depression.. A good start, would be to add in new currency into Ultima Online such as Copper and Silver(not faction silver.) To back up all the gold.. Convert all existing gold in the game into copper, 100 copper would turn into 1 silver, and a 100 silver would = 1 gold... The currency, copper, would also be the only loot found on monsters, the high end ones would be the one with around 20 silver or so.. So gold needs to be harder to come by.. I think there should be some kind of credit system with money also, money ledgers of some sort, rather than carrying it around in our bags and throwing it in our bank..
     
  2. Guest

    Guest Guest

    How would that fix the economy, exactly?
    A person with 1,000,000 gold ends up with 100 gold.
    A person with 100,000,000 gold ends up with 10,000 gold.
    An item that sold for 30,000,000 gold will sell for 3,000 gold.

    Making a denomination harder to come by isn't going to fix anything.
     
  3. If gold isn't harder to get, the devs should at least try to make it go away.
    We need means to make players spend gold in-game, and not on vendors, because that gold only changes hands.
     
  4. Dean478

    Dean478 Seasoned Veteran
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    How to fix the economy? Return to The Second Age. Monsters don't ALL drop gold. If they do, it's mosty bugger all. Players can be good and evil, meaning items are easily lost.

    REMOVE INSURANCE REMOVE GOLD SENDING BAGS and all these other stupid itemised additions.

    The game was designed very cleverly back in the day. Then too many peopel tried to change it to suit other games without actually considering the foundation the game was sitting on.

    It's going to be very hard to fix now.
     
  5. Guest

    Guest Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    How to fix the economy? Return to The Second Age. Monsters don't ALL drop gold. If they do, it's mosty bugger all. Players can be good and evil, meaning items are easily lost.

    REMOVE INSURANCE REMOVE GOLD SENDING BAGS and all these other stupid itemised additions.

    The game was designed very cleverly back in the day. Then too many peopel tried to change it to suit other games without actually considering the foundation the game was sitting on.

    It's going to be very hard to fix now.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    There are alot of things from old school UO which wouldn't work today. For instance, selling 10 of each reagent wouldn't fly. Back then, UO was the only show in town. We all put up with the lag and the warts because it was new and exciting. Going back to that time won't solve anything. It will just drive everyone away when they realize just how far UO has come. It's the natural order of gaming that it's exciting at first, but then you get saturated with playing it. It's a wonder, really, that UO has lasted nearly 11 years. I know of no other game out there which has held my attention like this.
     
  6. Theo_GL

    Theo_GL Grand Poobah
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    <blockquote><hr>


    In real life, the United States federal reserve prints money out of thin air and causes the de-valuation of the dollar,


    [/ QUOTE ]

    O RLY?


    To fix the UO economy you need more 'gold sinks' since monsters essentially 'print' money at unlimited rates in the game.

    You need ways for gold to leave the game at approx the same pace. The problem is insurnace and the other gold sinks don't suck it up fast enough.

    Switching to a diff currency - doesn't fix the economy. There is too much exploiting.

    Lets say 100 gold becomes 1 silver and you remove gold.

    Ok, so what does a reagent cost? 1 silver? that used to be 100 gold so Reagents just had a huge cost increase.

    Anyone who stocked up on reagents before the *change* could now make a killing selling them for what used to be 100gp each.

    As long as you have low priced items in the economy, you will have a hard time 'coloring up' your currencies.

    I think the Dev's thought about doing this with the rat coins -but then backed off when they realized it wouldn't have the intended effect and there was too many ways to exploit the system. so now, rat coins are just trde in's.
     
  7. Dean478

    Dean478 Seasoned Veteran
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    <blockquote><hr>

    <blockquote><hr>

    How to fix the economy? Return to The Second Age. Monsters don't ALL drop gold. If they do, it's mosty bugger all. Players can be good and evil, meaning items are easily lost.

    REMOVE INSURANCE REMOVE GOLD SENDING BAGS and all these other stupid itemised additions.

    The game was designed very cleverly back in the day. Then too many peopel tried to change it to suit other games without actually considering the foundation the game was sitting on.

    It's going to be very hard to fix now.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    There are alot of things from old school UO which wouldn't work today. For instance, selling 10 of each reagent wouldn't fly.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Don't have to return to all the old aspects. but a lot of them made far more sense than they do today. Everyone is a mage these days. There is no-one without the skill.

    <blockquote><hr>


    Back then, UO was the only show in town. We all put up with the lag and the warts because it was new and exciting. Going back to that time won't solve anything.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Why wouldn't it? The audience has become so small over the years. UO has evolved to be just like everythign else compared to it's earlier days. Why pay for something that received a graphical update just recently which was supposed to do the same job as another expansion nearly 8 years ago?

    <blockquote><hr>


    It will just drive everyone away when they realize just how far UO has come. It's the natural order of gaming that it's exciting at first, but then you get saturated with playing it. It's a wonder, really, that UO has lasted nearly 11 years. I know of no other game out there which has held my attention like this.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Look at the audience now though. We are a niche. UO used to be appeal to such a wider audience. So many things that made it unique have been removed and so many additions have been added to emulate other games.
     
  8. Guest

    Guest Guest

    I'd like a logical loot system where all monsters didn't just drop gold. Beasts would drop different qualities of meat and flesh which could be sold to chefs, cooks and tanners, humanoid monsters drop a free gems or a few bits of coin but then you can collect trophies from them be it heads, ears whatever and turn them into guards. Demons and their kin would drop demonic runes or other worldly items which could be sold to mages for demonic research or what have you.

    To me, spiders, elementals, dragons, etc. dropping massive amounts of gold doesn't make sense. Also the sheer amount of different items they drop as well.
     
  9. Dean478

    Dean478 Seasoned Veteran
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    <blockquote><hr>

    I'd like a logical loot system where all monsters didn't just drop gold. Beasts would drop different qualities of meat and flesh which could be sold to chefs, cooks and tanners, humanoid monsters drop a free gems or a few bits of coin but then you can collect trophies from them be it heads, ears whatever and turn them into guards. Demons and their kin would drop demonic runes or other worldly items which could be sold to mages for demonic research or what have you.

    To me, spiders, elementals, dragons, etc. dropping massive amounts of gold doesn't make sense. Also the sheer amount of different items they drop as well.

    [/ QUOTE ]


    That's similar to how it used to be. Killing a skeleton didn't give much gold at all. You usually got a peice of armour, a mace or sword (depending on the skeleton) and maybe a gem if you're lucky. It was mostly realistic items. The things they actually had in their graphical representation.

    You'd then make money by selling those old weapons to a smith (either to another player, an NPC vendor or smelting it for metal).
     
  10. Guest

    Guest Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    <blockquote><hr>

    I'd like a logical loot system where all monsters didn't just drop gold. Beasts would drop different qualities of meat and flesh which could be sold to chefs, cooks and tanners, humanoid monsters drop a free gems or a few bits of coin but then you can collect trophies from them be it heads, ears whatever and turn them into guards. Demons and their kin would drop demonic runes or other worldly items which could be sold to mages for demonic research or what have you.

    To me, spiders, elementals, dragons, etc. dropping massive amounts of gold doesn't make sense. Also the sheer amount of different items they drop as well.

    [/ QUOTE ]


    That's similar to how it used to be. Killing a skeleton didn't give much gold at all. You usually got a peice of armour, a mace or sword (depending on the skeleton) and maybe a gem if you're lucky. It was mostly realistic items. The things they actually had in their graphical representation.

    You'd then make money by selling those old weapons to a smith (either to another player, an NPC vendor or smelting it for metal).

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Yep I remember those days quite fondly. I also remember all the barrels and chests in the dungeons would have metal weapons and armor which I would hoard and smelt. [​IMG]
     
  11. Guest

    Guest Guest

    I remember when you didn't have to poke around in the ichor and sludge of the insides of liches but instead you got a backpack!

    A staff, crystal ball, some other crap that generally made it feel like loot.

    Now its just

    RANDOM SCROLL
    RANDOM REGS
    GOLD
    RANDOM WEAPON

    And lets face it, gone are the days when people actually found a use for that stuff. Before runics, before AoS actually, people would keep anything above GM and - with no insurance - youd only use the stuff that was better, but not super rare, in case you lost it.

    If you think about it, you could probably knock a 0 off every existing gold amount in the game without really harming too much. Slightly lower higher end monster loot a bit or slightly beef up lower end creatures. Someone with 1 mil has now got 100k, but so also has the 1 billion rares guy now got only 100 mil (only, lol).

    Prices on vendors will adjust accordingly, but the end result is that NPC goods seem more expensive and it is now worth saving gems, which have gone up in value. Since it would be a global change to every gold pile and cheque in the game, nobody loses out and items and wealth all keeps its relative value.

    Hell i'd say knock 2 0's off. Why Not.
     
  12. Lord_Asterix

    Lord_Asterix Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    People are getting way too much gold and getting it way too fast. In real life, the United States federal reserve prints money out of thin air and causes the de-valuation of the dollar, this is what makes the cost of living go up, with nothing to back up the dollar either... Gold has no value, thus, the cost of living in UO has gone up, this is what we call a inflation, or a depression.. A good start, would be to add in new currency into Ultima Online such as Copper and Silver(not faction silver.) To back up all the gold.. Convert all existing gold in the game into copper, 100 copper would turn into 1 silver, and a 100 silver would = 1 gold... The currency, copper, would also be the only loot found on monsters, the high end ones would be the one with around 20 silver or so.. So gold needs to be harder to come by.. I think there should be some kind of credit system with money also, money ledgers of some sort, rather than carrying it around in our bags and throwing it in our bank..

    [/ QUOTE ]
    Horrible idea - fixes nothing
     
  13. Belmarduk

    Belmarduk Guest

    Ehm how about more Goldsinks?
    Not stupid Goldsinks ! - Goldsinks that have a proper meaning
     
  14. A proper gold sink would be item repairs from NPC's that don't lower your durability when you get the item repaired, it could cost more, like 500, just to repair it and the more damaged the item is the more gold it can cost.. How much you wanna bet people would use item repairs from NPC's more than looking for a smith or a repair deed to buy?
     
  15. "How much you wanna bet people would use item repairs from NPC's more than looking for a smith or a repair deed to buy? "

    How much you wanna bet most people would just use their legendary crafters to do their own repairs?
     
  16. For new players, NPC repairs would come in handy..
     
  17. Which do you think a new player would choose?

    A player made repair deed that costs 50gp...

    or...

    Paying an NPC 500gp...


    My bet's with the 50gp, especially considering they're going to be changing armor as they get better pieces much more than a player that's been around a while.

    Then they'll go to the anti virtue dungeons &amp; farm their skills there and as they do get the pieces to the self repair 5 artie armor so won't need repairs at all.....
     
  18. Dean478

    Dean478 Seasoned Veteran
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    <blockquote><hr>

    For new players, NPC repairs would come in handy..

    [/ QUOTE ]

    What, encouraging a single-player approach to a multiplayer game?

    There used to be a time when players had to actively seek a blacksmith to get repairs. That was the idea, to encourage interaction.
     
  19. <blockquote><hr>

    <blockquote><hr>

    For new players, NPC repairs would come in handy..

    [/ QUOTE ]

    What, encouraging a single-player approach to a multiplayer game?

    There used to be a time when players had to actively seek a blacksmith to get repairs. That was the idea, to encourage interaction.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Ok, but they should at least make it so you can get items repaired through the trade window...
     
  20. Guest

    Guest Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    Horrible idea - fixes nothing

    [/ QUOTE ]
    Not strictly true.

    It fixes all those 125 million+ purchases so that you can do it in one simple, hassle free, risk free transaction, without a broker.

    Knock a zero or two off and that 800 mill Luna house is now 80 million or even 8 million. So it does fix something.
     
  21. Dean478

    Dean478 Seasoned Veteran
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    <blockquote><hr>

    <blockquote><hr>

    <blockquote><hr>

    For new players, NPC repairs would come in handy..

    [/ QUOTE ]

    What, encouraging a single-player approach to a multiplayer game?

    There used to be a time when players had to actively seek a blacksmith to get repairs. That was the idea, to encourage interaction.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Ok, but they should at least make it so you can get items repaired through the trade window...

    [/ QUOTE ]


    Ultima has always tried to impliment logical and realistic (don't confuse with reality) based mechanics. You can't just repair in thin air. Youd need to be next to an anvil and have some smithing tools available in order to physically repair something.
     
  22. xxEvolusxx

    xxEvolusxx Guest

    We could always cause a Great Depression in Ultima. Maybe the Blackrock infects all monsters and they stop spawning gold and other supplies. Then everyone buys up whatever, and this depression lasts until prices are down to reasonable rates.
     
  23. <blockquote><hr>

    Ehm how about more Goldsinks?
    Not stupid Goldsinks ! - Goldsinks that have a proper meaning

    [/ QUOTE ]
    It's not hard. LRC cap, increase of NPC prices.
    Currently a mongbat (one shot) gives 30 gold coins while a reagent costs 2 or 3 gc and you don't need more than 4 reagents at a time. It's even worth it to hunt mongbats with flamestrikes...


    The only gold sinks now are the collections. Unfortunately lots of their rewards target a population of players who don't need any gold sink. House decorators aren't bringing too much gold in the system, last time I checked.

    Sell alacrity scrolls working for any skill at a NPC and you have a gold sink.
    Make consummable almost obligatory for hunting and you have a gold sink.

    But just a note : that won't please all the players.

    Oh and make gold a value in the status bar and it won't be duped anymore.
     
  24. DrDolittle

    DrDolittle Journeyman
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    <blockquote><hr>

    People are getting way too much gold and getting it way too fast.

    [/ QUOTE ]No, the problem is that cheaters have been allowed to run amok for years and the UO “economy” is awash in counterfeit gold.
     
  25. Setnaffa

    Setnaffa Certifiable
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    Your idea does not address the economy; it just makes it easier to organize your gold.

    Here's my idea for adjusting the economy in a positive way (I won't say it "fixes" the economy):

    1) Reduce all gold by 99.9% (1,000gps = 1gp) rounding off to nearest full gp (any gold stacks below 500 gold disappear).
    2) Add feature to vendors to allow the owner to auto re-set all prices to .1% of what they previously were (rounding up).
    3) Leave pricing the same for all basic items on NPC Vendors, but reduce the price for all resources, lootables, and non-basic items (i.e. Shadow Iron Shields), which will also fluctuate based on supply/demand. Any items bought from NPC Vendors before the change could only be sold back for 1/1000th the original value (to stop folks from buying tons of NPC stuff before the change then sell it back after).
    4) Either remove loot gold or reduce it to just a trickle (1-10 gps) on everything except Level 5 Fame Creatures (Balrons, Ancient Wyrms), Bosses (mini and full) and Champions. Another option would be to start all creatures with 0 gold. The longer they go without being killed, the more gold they have. The rate of increase would be based on Fame or difficulty.
    5) Remove or greatly reduce gold earned from turning in BODs.
    6) Leave housing prices high.

    Item 3 stops players from exploiting vendors for gold and also keeps mundane items relatively high.

    Items 4 and 5 make gold much harder to accumulate, thus gold value stays high. If there are other ways to easily accumulate gold, they should also be made harder (such as buying cloth, cutting it into bandages, then selling the bandages to a healer at a profit).

    Item 4 would also get rid of scripting Gold Farmers.

    Something else they should implement is global NPC vendor pricing. Right now on Napa, you can buy ingots for 20gp each in Minoc, then sell the same ingots for 55gp in Luna. So 500 ingots can net you 17,500 gp in less than a minute. That doesn't make sense especially since we can recall or sacred journey almost anywhere we want to go. The price for any item should be the same regardless of where you buy or sell it.

    Item 6 makes housing valuable again. Sure. Someone could sell their house for the gold, but then they wouldn't have a house and wouldn't be able to afford to buy another until they save up the gold again. This could be exploited by creating trial accounts, but that could be thwarted by not allowing trial (non-paying) accounts to have houses which they are about to do.

    This isn't just about removing 0's. It's about making a gold piece worth something again. Right now, 1,000 gold isn't even worth looting.
     
  26. Guest

    Guest Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    People are getting way too much gold and getting it way too fast. In real life, the United States federal reserve prints money out of thin air and causes the de-valuation of the dollar, this is what makes the cost of living go up, with nothing to back up the dollar either... Gold has no value, thus, the cost of living in UO has gone up, this is what we call a inflation, or a depression.. A good start, would be to add in new currency into Ultima Online such as Copper and Silver(not faction silver.) To back up all the gold.. Convert all existing gold in the game into copper, 100 copper would turn into 1 silver, and a 100 silver would = 1 gold... The currency, copper, would also be the only loot found on monsters, the high end ones would be the one with around 20 silver or so.. So gold needs to be harder to come by.. I think there should be some kind of credit system with money also, money ledgers of some sort, rather than carrying it around in our bags and throwing it in our bank..

    [/ QUOTE ]Oh...you mean like WoW...but I thought you guys said WoW sucked...
     
  27. Guest

    Guest Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    I'd like a logical loot system where all monsters didn't just drop gold. Beasts would drop different qualities of meat and flesh which could be sold to chefs, cooks and tanners, humanoid monsters drop a free gems or a few bits of coin but then you can collect trophies from them be it heads, ears whatever and turn them into guards. Demons and their kin would drop demonic runes or other worldly items which could be sold to mages for demonic research or what have you.

    To me, spiders, elementals, dragons, etc. dropping massive amounts of gold doesn't make sense. Also the sheer amount of different items they drop as well.

    [/ QUOTE ]Oh...you mean like WoW...but I thought you guys said WoW sucked...
     
  28. [/ QUOTE ]Oh...you mean like WoW...but I thought you guys said WoW sucked...

    [/ QUOTE ]

    You doubled posted, and yes, WoW is horrible.. I would recommend it to someone though over UO with the current state it is in...
     
  29. midiguru

    midiguru Guest

    Thus far not a one of the responses to this have even made any sense. Lower the value of gold, add new currency, whatever other silly ideas. This is all pointless. It doesn't fix anything and if anything gives these dupers/scripters the upper hand. So far the only thing i've seen that would do anything to effect scripting / duping is to make all gold just a numeric value in your bank not an actual "item". Maybe every player could have a bank book. This book would stay in your bank and keep track of how much money you've accumulated. To buy and item or whatever you could take a bank slip out of the book for the amount needed to buy said item from another player. This bank slip would have a tracking number on it making it impossible to dupe. If the slip was xsharded it would default to a value of 0gp no matter how much was on it. I dunno....

    All i know is making me log in one day and see all the millions i've accumulated over years of playing reduced to 100k checks or worse would be the last straw with me and UO. I'm sorry but someone who's played this game for 5-10 years SHOULD have more than someone who has only played for a a few months or years. I know that most new players feel they are owed something but the reality is that they are not....
     
  30. <blockquote><hr>



    [/ QUOTE ]Oh...you mean like WoW...but I thought you guys said WoW sucked...

    [/ QUOTE ]

    You doubled posted, and yes, WoW is horrible.. I would recommend it to someone though over UO with the current state it is in...

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Then go play WoW and leave UO alone.


    Just for the record, none of your ideas will work. The simple fact of the matter is that as long as you can get gold from monsters, there is an unlimited amount of gold that can be introduced into the economy. It's like having a printing press in your house so you could print $100 bills whenever you started to run low on cash.
     
  31. Guest

    Guest Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    How would that fix the economy, exactly?
    A person with 1,000,000 gold ends up with 100 gold.
    A person with 100,000,000 gold ends up with 10,000 gold.
    An item that sold for 30,000,000 gold will sell for 3,000 gold.

    Making a denomination harder to come by isn't going to fix anything.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Doesn't really fix anything, just makes the sums traded for stuff sound less ridiculous. "Million" shouldn't be a term in common usage in a world like Ultima.

    I'd like to see this denomination approach to revising existing wealth, along with a practical solution to the gushing gold-faucets currently ingame. Reduce loot/bods/et al to zero coins, bring back monster-specific loot, item decay, etc etc.. there've been a ton of good ideas on gold sinks over the years but we have to turn off the gold faucets too.
     
  32. xxEvolusxx

    xxEvolusxx Guest

    Maybe we could look at how America introduced the dollar, and try to do that. Then again, it may be too late to change anything at that extreme of a nature.
     
  33. the 4th man

    the 4th man Lore Master
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    Back up currency will not stop the flow of gold into the game. Players have untold millions because they buy it from outside sources. Go to trade forums, check out some of the offers on extreme rares.
     
  34. ChWalker

    ChWalker Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    Oh and make gold a value in the status bar and it won't be duped anymore.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I think this would be a good idea. If gold was never a physical item in the game then it could never be duped. This wouldn't instantly fix the ecconomy as there is already a lot of gold out there but since it could no longer be duped the gold in game wold slowly go down. Gold could still be farmed and people could still get a lot of it but that is harder to do and takes longer then duping.

    There would need to be a way to transfer gold between chars that didn't involve any physical items. Maybe both players would have to go to the banker and talk to him and he would make the transfer. If a player is selling something to another player then there can be brokers for people that don't have vendors set up.

    This shouldn't be to hard to set up as some of the mechanics of it are already in the game.
     
  35. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Monsters in Trammel should drop half as much gold as they do now. In Fel it should stay the same because of risk vs. reward.

    No gold should drop when a champ dies or on corpses at champ spawns.

    Devs need to constantly investigate people with large sums of gold.
     
  36. Guest

    Guest Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    <blockquote><hr>

    Oh and make gold a value in the status bar and it won't be duped anymore.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I think this would be a good idea. If gold was never a physical item in the game then it could never be duped. This wouldn't instantly fix the ecconomy as there is already a lot of gold out there but since it could no longer be duped the gold in game wold slowly go down. Gold could still be farmed and people could still get a lot of it but that is harder to do and takes longer then duping.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I think it's a good idea too because then people with insanely large sums of gold could be taxed. Would be a great gold dump.
     
  37. <blockquote><hr>

    <blockquote><hr>

    Oh and make gold a value in the status bar and it won't be duped anymore.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I think this would be a good idea. If gold was never a physical item in the game then it could never be duped. This wouldn't instantly fix the ecconomy as there is already a lot of gold out there but since it could no longer be duped the gold in game wold slowly go down. Gold could still be farmed and people could still get a lot of it but that is harder to do and takes longer then duping.

    There would need to be a way to transfer gold between chars that didn't involve any physical items. Maybe both players would have to go to the banker and talk to him and he would make the transfer. If a player is selling something to another player then there can be brokers for people that don't have vendors set up.

    This shouldn't be to hard to set up as some of the mechanics of it are already in the game.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Or... We could do this..

    http://ooc-guild.game-host.org/pix/news/auctioneer_gollem.jpg

    The only feature I ever agreed with upon WoW... At this point I don't see why not, what with Luna and tools like SearchUO and FindUO. Its very hard for a new player to sell his things.. Or we can get rid of the vendors and have players manually sell their things..

    I don't like how this game is being controlled by the rich and powerful, which is what it has come down to in game, and that is not right..
     
  38. Setnaffa

    Setnaffa Certifiable
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    <blockquote><hr>

    Thus far not a one of the responses to this have even made any sense. Lower the value of gold, add new currency, whatever other silly ideas. This is all pointless. It doesn't fix anything and if anything gives these dupers/scripters the upper hand. So far the only thing i've seen that would do anything to effect scripting / duping is to make all gold just a numeric value in your bank not an actual "item". Maybe every player could have a bank book. This book would stay in your bank and keep track of how much money you've accumulated. To buy and item or whatever you could take a bank slip out of the book for the amount needed to buy said item from another player. This bank slip would have a tracking number on it making it impossible to dupe. If the slip was xsharded it would default to a value of 0gp no matter how much was on it. I dunno....

    All i know is making me log in one day and see all the millions i've accumulated over years of playing reduced to 100k checks or worse would be the last straw with me and UO. I'm sorry but someone who's played this game for 5-10 years SHOULD have more than someone who has only played for a a few months or years. I know that most new players feel they are owed something but the reality is that they are not....

    [/ QUOTE ]You honestly think making gold only a number in a bank book would stop duping? All it would do would be to make it easier.

    If you actually read my proposal all the way through you would have seen that your millions in gold had the same value as they did before; only the number of zero's would change. Would it really matter to you if you only had 10K gold as long as the 10K bought the same as 10 million bought before the change?
     
  39. <blockquote><hr>

    <blockquote><hr>

    Thus far not a one of the responses to this have even made any sense. Lower the value of gold, add new currency, whatever other silly ideas. This is all pointless. It doesn't fix anything and if anything gives these dupers/scripters the upper hand. So far the only thing i've seen that would do anything to effect scripting / duping is to make all gold just a numeric value in your bank not an actual "item". Maybe every player could have a bank book. This book would stay in your bank and keep track of how much money you've accumulated. To buy and item or whatever you could take a bank slip out of the book for the amount needed to buy said item from another player. This bank slip would have a tracking number on it making it impossible to dupe. If the slip was xsharded it would default to a value of 0gp no matter how much was on it. I dunno....

    All i know is making me log in one day and see all the millions i've accumulated over years of playing reduced to 100k checks or worse would be the last straw with me and UO. I'm sorry but someone who's played this game for 5-10 years SHOULD have more than someone who has only played for a a few months or years. I know that most new players feel they are owed something but the reality is that they are not....

    [/ QUOTE ]You honestly think making gold only a number in a bank book would stop duping? All it would do would be to make it easier.

    If you actually read my proposal all the way through you would have seen that your millions in gold had the same value as they did before; only the number of zero's would change. Would it really matter to you if you only had 10K gold as long as the 10K bought the same as 10 million bought before the change?

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Well if a item worth 10 million gold and all the gold in the game converts to the copper currency, then that item would probabley worth 10 million copper.. Gold wise, it would be worth, 10k or less... That would make it seem less ridiculous though like a post above me said, "Million" shouldn't be a term in common usage in a world like Ultima.. And really, nobody is losing anything, it just makes it sound less tedious to work for your items...

    I also agree with ChWalker of physically removing gold from the game, I don't agree with the book thing though.. No more dropping gold on the ground or in the bank, there would be a gold, silver and copper symbols telling you how much you have, it would be weightless, and physically, it would never move, trading it could still work the same if they made a few changes.. This probabley would stop duping and help the economy..
     
  40. "I think it's a good idea too because then people with insanely large sums of gold could be taxed."

    As soon as you start dumping a percentage of your own gold in the trash can, then you can discuss taxing. Go ahead and get the revolution started. Talk to your friends and have them do the same thing.

    Then your friends can each tell 2 friends.

    Then they can tell 2 friends.

    And so on...

    And so on...


    Until the time when you're willing to voluntarily dump your own gold in the trash can, you shouldn't be trying to push taxes on others.

    All taxes would do is piss people off.
     
  41. "I don't like how this game is being controlled by the rich and powerful"

    Where's the Waaaaaaaaahmbulance when you need it.....


    The game isn't controlled by anyone but EA/Mythic.

    You don't even play it, so what's it matter to you?

    Go back to grinding your levels in WoW.
     
  42. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Although I also disagree with taxation, I think it's unfair to claim that wildly skewed wealth distributions don't have some negative effects on the game. Whenever people get on a risk-reward high horse, merchants tend to be completely ignored. The physics of economics rewards productivity, not fun, so gold (in all its myriad ways of being acquired) is where the boundary between "playing the game" and "working the game" gets blurred, especially as people max out what their most-enjoyed playstyle can reward them with.

    I've always been a fan of multiple currencies in different cultures of the world (even allowing any stackable to be designated as a currency a vendor will accept to let people create their own economies). I've even been a fan of removing cheques to put a lower cap on total gold accumulation. However, I realize that gold accumulation is the endgame for a lot of people and a pretty radical thing to tinker with.
     
  43. Theo_GL

    Theo_GL Grand Poobah
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

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    <blockquote><hr>


    Would it really matter to you if you only had 10K gold as long as the 10K bought the same as 10 million bought before the change?


    [/ QUOTE ]

    Sorry Setnaffa - I love ya but your idea won't work.

    You can only divide stuff down by the lowest common denominator. You cannot reduce things by a factor of 10 or 100 or whatever.

    IE - Item on vendor costing 100,000 becomes 1,000 and your gold in bank that was 1,000,000 becomes 10,000.

    Why? Because the lowest common denominator is around 3gp -the cost of a reg.

    Assume before the change you have 1,000,000 gold.
    After the change you should have (divide by 100) 10,000 gold.

    Well, what if I use the 1,000,000 gold to but 333,333 bloodmoss at 3gp or whatever.

    Well, after the change - how much bloodmoss do I have? 333,333

    Now, the price of bloodmoss should drop by 100 - but it was only at 3gp. The lowest it can go is 1gp.

    So I now have 333,333 gold worth of bloodmoss - not 10,000.

    And if you say 'well, then take all resources and divide by 100' that hardly seems fair since I still need to put 10 shields in a bod that takes 200 ingots (heater shields) that I already mined up. Are you going to take my 200 ingots and make them 2 ingots? Then I can't fill that same bod that I can fill before the change. You just ripped me off.

    The only way to really help with the prices of things - is leave everything the way it is with gold but introduce platinum where 1 platinum = 100k gold or something. So then you could convert 1million gold into 10 platinum. A jackals collar goes for 50 platinum etc.

    That way you can 'fix' the high cost stuff but then when you go to buy regs- they still cost 3gp and you can always convert platinum to gold and back and forth.

    That is the only viable option. Any sort of 'divide by 100' is flawed in the value/amount of resources players hold.
     
  44. Guest

    Guest Guest

    ...


    Monsters in Trammel should drop half as much gold as they do now. In Fel it should stay the same because of risk vs. reward.


    Two problems with this statement:

    1. Any given Monster is the SAME risk/toughness be it located in Trammel, Fel, Ilshenar, Malas, or Tokuno. Therefore the rewards should be intrinsic to that monster's toughness, not due to possible outside influences. Doubled ANYTHING in Fel was done to entice people who left the facet back to it under the false premise of "risk vs reward". Fel drops, resources or otherwise should be reverted back to be in lone with other facets.

    2. Fel spawn rates are different than Trammel's. If I recall correctly, the spawn rate is a bit faster and Fels pawns more higher end creatures in general thus intrinsically raising the amount of gold gained in the facet (not to mention champ spawn spawn rates and levels).

    If you're going to nerf gold drops, it should be GLOBALLY DONE in every facet.
     
  45. Guest

    Guest Guest

    ...

    Players have untold millions because they buy it from outside sources

    There is no such thing as an "outside source" for gold in UO. All gold in UO is created... IN UO.

    The closest you can come to this is duped gold which is an accusation that should not be lightly made and should be something reported to the Devs for investigation.
     
  46. Guest

    Guest Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    Making a denomination harder to come by isn't going to fix anything.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    You then lower the amount of currency available off of monsters, and that solve the inflation problem. In a virtual game its just an issue of ease of use. Its easier to deal with 10k than 10mill.
     
  47. Guest

    Guest Guest

    The only part that is really correct is the thread subject. A new currency is what is needed. Not a reduction of the current gold system. A new system that is controlled better. The problem being that gold is not worth what it used to be because of the sheer amount of it. A new system would help with that in the long run. In the short run a new system would be hampered by existing gold for a short while as those with untold billions of gold(duped or otherwise) would just buy the new currency so long as gold retained it's value.

    If, for example, a new land opened and new currency existed there that could only be spent there then this would be a direction to work toward the end goal. There has to be a place for this currency to go however. The problems in the past are that players are the movers of gold and not npc merchants or game mechanics. If an NPC sold artifacts gold would leave the game. We have none of these mechanisms and therefore gold only changes hands. Those with large sums are able to control certain parts of the market at times.

    All this doesn't take into account cheaters as everything cannot.
     
  48. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Hail: "Read my lips, NEW TAXES". You pay to keep pets in a stable, you pay to keep your vendor from quitting on ya, you pay insurance to keep your valueable items, so why don't you have to pay Taxes? House Tax, determined by a combination of the size, facet, and location of the house.

    You can add some sort of Faction Taxes, Guild Taxes, Non_alighned Taxes for those who are not part of any guild or faction, and so on.

    I mean, How many of US actually need more gold? There is almost as much gold left on a dead creature as there is taken off a dead creature. That alone proves the point. Also, when was the last time any of us, ran over to that Berserker corps, and said, 'Oh Yea, look at all this left on the corps". And took as much as we could until almost overloaded, and went to the blacksmith to sell it all?

    just saying.................
     
  49. Guest

    Guest Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    Oh and make gold a value in the status bar and it won't be duped anymore.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    That's actually a good idea. It's one of the reasons why many MMORPGs do it these days and from the games I've played who handle money like this, currency duping problems aren't much of an issue compared to UO's.
     
  50. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Nope. Its been done to death. Changing currency does nothing. The economy is fine. There is nothing to spend the gold on. We need that and thats all.