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Huge Duper Debate on Origin Forums

Discussion in 'UO Rares Collector' started by originian, Nov 4, 2007.

  1. originian

    originian Guest

    huge Debate going on the Origin Forum. A admitted duper finally got his story out implementing alot of rares collectors from this forum. Names edited of course. Comments and thoughts would be great

    Dupers Story
     
  2. Tomas_Bryce

    Tomas_Bryce Rares Collector Extraordinaire | Rares Fest Host
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    A lot of rare collectors from this forum? Are you sure about that?

    Most people here already know who cooperated with dupers. It is not that hard to figure it out.

    Anyways his post is bs. He is whining about how he got caught and others did not. That is for us, who do not cheat, to whine. NOT HIM. Furthermore, I am not so happy with Larisa's portrayal of him as some reformed samartian now. She has absolutely no proof of it. I bet he is still as much of a cheater as he was back then and he would dupe in a second if he could.
     
  3. He shows no remorse until after he is caught.

    He whines that others were not punished.

    He gets back at EA for not hiring him 5 years later by duping and is now playing "by the book" after they ban him.


    Puh-lease.

    He is breaking the rules by even logging in.
     
  4. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Once a cheater/hacker/duper/scammer always a cheater/hacker/duper/scammer. There is no UO 'Jesus' that can save you.
     
  5. Eh.. I dont believe in the "once a (whatever) always a (whatever)" mindset.

    Its just a lazy way of not looking at the facts.

    While it might be true in a lot of cases, I base my opinion on the lack of remorse, the whining and the fact that he is currently playing.
     
  6. Guest

    Guest Guest

    This is interesting and very much unsurprising. Those who think some (but definately not all) rares collectors/traders havent been involved in duping are naive, stupid or both.

    In the weeks after the changeling bug came out, i got 5 icqs and 3 PMs (from accounts who had no posts) asking if I wanted to know how to do it for a price, and 3 icqs asking me if i knew how to do it.
    Did I know the specifics? No. Did I know how it worked? Yes. I even had someone attempt to icq me the exact file of the script in question. I didn't accept it because I didn't want to do anything like this, but the fact of the matter is it was so readily available.
    One of said ICQers offered to sell me it for 25mil, and then another told me he had the item dupe for sale for 250mil. I didn't accept it (otherwise i would be much richer than I am now) but it was there. He said if I accepted it, i could be made part of his "team" and his special duper for Oceania.
    He even explained to me because in one post I had mentioned I had 400mil to spend and nothing to spend it on, he thought i might just be interested.

    If people want to take this as an admission of guilt, you miss the point. I didn't accept it, I told him where to go, and I didnt say anything about it again, except for PMing Wilki with his icq. Pming wilki seemed the only idea at the time, and I didnt get a response, so I assumed either it was ignored or just lost in the shuffle.

    I will say again. I DID NOT accept it, but i was offered it all.
     
  7. Tomas_Bryce

    Tomas_Bryce Rares Collector Extraordinaire | Rares Fest Host
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    <blockquote><hr>

    Those who think some (but definately not all) rares collectors/traders havent been involved in duping are naive, stupid or both.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Yes. I also know quite a few tamers who were involved in changeling dupe. Also few pvp'ers and some tailors. Towards the tail end of the bug, there were like 30 people just on my shard trying to make some gold. There were also like 500 or so normal people who did not care that they were dupes and were happy to give their gold away. Oh and they knew about it too. I would be spamming right next to them while they handed over their gold.

    Maybe I should go post in the tamers forum about how some tamers were involved in duping.
     
  8. Nails Warstein

    Nails Warstein Rares Festival Silent Auctioneer
    Professional Governor Stratics Veteran Alumni Stratics Legend Campaign Patron Ultima Broker

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    As a victim of all sorts of scams, dupes, and account hacks... I can't sincerely fault anyone, but myself for taking such a financial risk on a game. Those players who choose to take advantage of other players do so like a Nigerian Internet Thief from a distance with no personal knowledge of their victims. I can only imagine it is far easier to steal from someone without having to look them in their eyes over a gun barrel as you rob their grocery store. Yet unlike the Nigerians, I imagine most of these thieves don't have starving families to feed, and could easily make a decent living on their own.

    No instead they take the easy road rather than the high road. They want the quick buck for that new souped up computer. Somehow they can sleep more soundly a night not worrying whether or not a Father spent his last dime on rares rather than buying baby formula for his crying son. They can laugh amongst their friends without a care in the world while a paraplegic who can't leave his house very easily just spent a large sum of money on a game rather than paying for a new evasive operation to help him walk again. Yeah these players can pay for a nice new car or put a down payment on their 2500 square foot house rather than think about the wife who's husband just left her because of her $5000 credit card debt spent on rares or gold they can't afford or even sell back for a profit. I bet who ever benefits off these innocent victims does so without conscience and guilt. He never has to see his victims struggle from paycheck to paycheck to pay their rent or health insurance coverage. They are no more real to him than a paperdoll of computer pixels in a game that is only a means to an end.

    These victims are not alone. All of Ultima has suffered at the hands of these MMORPG terrorists. Since every single one of us has had to deal with the effect their crimes which have greatly impacted the Ultima economy at large. At first thought, many would blame the UO staff for this decline, but I say to you they are the greatest victims of all when you take into account this one simple fact. Consider the company Microsoft, it makes trillions of dollars in gross earnings, and yet even they can't fix their products on time before viral damage is inflicted on hundreds of thousands of their own customers. What would make any of us think EA could do better? All the hard working developers get beat up because they couldn't do enough to outwit all the security breaches which exists in nearly every software program ever made while also being expect to fix game play bugs, make improvements, design new enticing content and graphics. Heck they even have to make changes to accommodate new computer software like Windows Vista. It is no wonder that UO goes through so many growing pains to please us.

    Instead of laying any more blame and complaining about every single game mechanic that irritates us... What we should be doing is asking ourselves if we truly love to play this game, what can we do to prevent scammers, hackers, and dupers in the future? Because in the end, our actions will either benefit us or ruin us all.
     
  9. Guest

    Guest Guest

    i have said it before but i will mention it again...

    It is totally impossible to ban any person for life from playing UO [full stop]
     
  10. Johnny_Five

    Johnny_Five Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    Once a cheater/hacker/duper/scammer always a cheater/hacker/duper/scammer. There is no UO 'Jesus' that can save you.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    thats not even remotely true, back in the day [prelbr] i was a scammer &amp; all around Dbag, but i stopped caring enough to constantly make new chars &amp; scam ppl &amp; started playing the game. i mean the last scam i did involved a vanq/sup accurate spear &amp; an invuln plate helm, lol.

    so dont label ppl as scammers for life bc they once did such a thing, just be more careful when dealing with them...
     
  11. Larisa

    Larisa Reporting Manager
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    No I don't have proof...all I have is what he told me and what I see almost every day...which is him fighting in Magincia Trammel with the rest of us.

    I believe that there is hope for ANYONE to reform, and stop their evil ways...and actually get better...why is that so hard for people to digest?

    Yes he messed up, yes he screwed over alot of people, yes he ruined the rare's economy along with the games economy....but does that mean that he's NEVER going to change? That he hasn't already and is trying REALLY hard to prove to people that he HAS changed?

    Do we ALWAYS burn people at the stake for making mistakes without even TRYING to give them the benifit of the doubt?

    This whole "Once a cheater, always a cheater" crap is for the birds....that might be true for SOME but not ALL.

    I am neither defending him or accusing him....but I beleive everyone deserves a second chance, don't you?
     
  12. Ryna

    Ryna Sage
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    <blockquote><hr>

    but I beleive everyone deserves a second chance, don't you?

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Second chance? Sure.

    I don't think this guy is on his second chance, however.

    His second chance was when he duped the first thing, and then decided to do it again. He had a chance to do reform every time he duped, but didn't stop until he was caught.

    Another chance? No thanks.
     
  13. mdacc#one

    mdacc#one Guest

    These types of posts just creates mass hysteria. I seriously doubt someone would just sit by the moongate and start blabbing his wrong doings. If he did he is trying to get attention or just some small time doggy dupper who made couple of hundred mil and now wants to brag about it. This game has been clean as its ever been since AOS. Mythic took over and replaced or fired all the GMs (corrupted ones included). Nothing has been out of the ordinary, no vendor selling repeated rares.

    Now iam not talking about scripting, which is different and thats a whole differnt can of worm.
     
  14. Larisa

    Larisa Reporting Manager
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    From what I got in talking to him..he's not trying to brag about it...

    I think the main reason he wanted this article written is one, to try to understand why, out of all the people involved, he was the ONLY one that got punished for it. (2 VERY well-known rare's collectors paid him 100 Mil EACH to dupe for their shard so THEY could profit from it.)

    And two...IF the claims of him sending E-Mails and calling EA demanding they delete his houses full of dupes...why they didn't?

    Again these are claims....BUT....I think those were the main points he was trying to get across.

    "yes I messed up but I wasn't the only one, yet I was the only one to get punished for it, and why didn't EA take my advice and delete my stuff so noone else could get it"
     
  15. Guest

    Guest Guest

    To me, glorifying a duper's story and even giving him a minute of anyone's time is an insult to the rest of us who decided to play it legit and not dupe.

    Why does a duper deserve ANYTHING from us whether it be sympathy, forgiveness, or whatever. I personally find it insulting that stratics even allows the post an autobiography of a self admitted duper getting banned and "changing his ways". I don't care how long a known duper shows himself sitting at a moongate chatting. Who hasn't heard of multiclienting? I've known plenty people who do wrong things yet RP as a good samaritan. In the end, people who duped view this game as a quick way to get money. Simple as that, it's not a power trip, psychological disorder, or low self-esteem. It all boils down to these people not wanting to earn an honest dollar and would rather spend their time and effort cheating the system at the expense of everyone else just to fulfill their get rich quick scheme.

    To me anyone who has EVER duped should deserve whatever bad things occur to them and I would hope it to occur 10 fold. They ruined this game for the rest of us and don't deserve an ounce of sympathy whether they choose to pose as a reformed criminal or not. I'm not arguing people can't change, I'm arguing it's an insult to everyone here that one would post such a thing on stratics and glorify the person's action in doing so.

    If they decided to come back and play I think they're a complete moron for even admitting they are that duper. IF they were truly remorseful and wanted to be legit they wouldn't even associate themselves with their former identity. They'd simply play the game for fun, start anew and turn over a new leaf. Crying about getting banned while the rest of his duper associates remain profiting is a load of sht and quite frankly should be treated as such.
     
  16. Tomas_Bryce

    Tomas_Bryce Rares Collector Extraordinaire | Rares Fest Host
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    <blockquote><hr>


    Do we ALWAYS burn people at the stake for making mistakes without even TRYING to give them the benifit of the doubt?


    [/ QUOTE ]

    Tell him to donate the money he has made from duping. Then maybe we can talk about not burning him on stake. I am sorry but I strongly disagree with your message and your method, even if well intended.
     
  17. Guest

    Guest Guest

    i do have to agree with most here...it just seems to me that if he wasnt cought when he was he would still be doing it now.
    And the whole thing of him trying to contact EA to get his castle deleted seemed more of making surre noone else profits from his actions other them him.

    I dont like to juge people and he may seems a nice guy and all but you just do not know who is behind that keyboard unless you know him in real life...
    and thats how they are ...they dont care about the bad things they do ...since they only have to hide beihind a little character.

    i agree with Ryna if he is that regretfull ...donate the 150k $$ ....or maybe someone that knows him should call the IRS [​IMG]