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I'll make it simple, here's what they should do.

Discussion in 'UHall' started by KLOMP, Feb 3, 2013.

?

Well?

  1. I vote for the devloper-proposed Publish 81.

    4 vote(s)
    14.8%
  2. I vote for Klomp's version.

    3 vote(s)
    11.1%
  3. I vote for my own version which I will now make a long-winded post about.

    4 vote(s)
    14.8%
  4. Pancakes!

    16 vote(s)
    59.3%
  1. KLOMP

    KLOMP Sage

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    So the proposed Publish 81 is pretty much undeniably a game-murdering disaster that doesn't actually give anyone more gear options. (Bye bye, every dexer suit!) Here's what they should do instead.

    1) Make all armor medable, remove the mage armor property from the game.

    2) Balance the base resists on all armor types, including dragon armor.

    3) Remove the special properties from wood, or add special properties to metal and leather.

    4) Make the slowest weapon speed 3.5 and scale down from there, normalizing damage as appropriate.

    5) Pick a common special movie (concussion or crushing maybe) and buff it until it's competitive with armor ignore.

    6) Something, something, PVP. I don't know, I'm a carebear. Implement the couple of PVP tweaks from the proposed publish that weren't universally hated I guess. Go slow with it though.

    Ta-da! Now everyone can run around in a dragonscale suit waving a halberd or whatever and not feel like an idiot, but nobody has to throw their suit away! At least a few weapons that don't have armor ignore are useful, but people don't have to throw out all their leafblades!

    "But Klomp, you have made all armor materials basically the same!"

    Yeah, I did, what up? The people wearing the armor just wanna look how they wanna look, and the people making the armor aren't exactly crying that crafting isn't complex enough. Let anyone hurting for crafting complexity devote themselves to documenting how the crap reforging works.
     
    Kelly O'Brian and HP_Zoro_HP like this.
  2. Maximus of Lck

    Maximus of Lck Adventurer
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    I don't agree that all armor should be equal. Plate should obviously offer more protection than chain or leather or (lol) "cloth" armor.

    There is no reason a mage should run around in full plate armor, which could happen if all armors were equal. Each type of armor should have its strengths and weaknesses. The character can then choose which armor type best suits his playstyle.
     
  3. GalenKnighthawke

    GalenKnighthawke Grand Poobah
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    I have an alternative proposal that involves Stamina damage. I posted about it elsewhere.

    There is a common thread in all of our objections to this proposal: Somehow they went from making all forms of armor useable to making major changes in how in-game combat works. This was not what we asked for and indeed would be a bad idea to implement. Most of us think there are things to do to make all forms of armor useable that would not change how combat is conducted. The idea in this thread is one, my ideas are another. Obviously I like my idea better but this idea is better than what's on the table now.

    Keep in mind that thus far I'm only talking about armor; I haven't even thought about the weapons yet.

    -Galen's player

    PS: Cloth armor was actually pretty effective IRL. The problem was that it got cut easy so it only protected you like once. Hence throwing stuff on top of it. Additional protection of course, but also it protected your cloth armor from being cut to ribbons, thus enabling your cloth armor to protect you for far longer.

    As to wizards wearing metal armor, one of the legends of Charlemagne's knights makes it clear that that knight was also a wizard who as his mount rode an ethereal demon. (No I'm not kidding; he could dispel it with magic, and thus dismount, and when he wanted to remount he would cast the appropriate spell and it would appear between his legs. Sound familiar?) The stories do not suggest he wore different armor from the other Knights.
     
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  4. Shakkara

    Shakkara Slightly Crazed
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    Here's mine:

    Damage is now dealt to a random specific location (head, arms, legs, hands, torso, neck)

    Introduce a FLAT location-based damage absorption based on armor type:
    0 Leather / Leafstuff / Cloth
    2 Studded / Bone / Hide
    4 Ringmail, Chainmail / Yellow Dragon Armor (default - arties count as yellow), Samurai Platemail, Stone Armor, Wood
    6 Platemail / Colored Dragon Armor / Gargoyle Plate
    +1 when shield equipped

    Bleed and poison etc are unaffected.

    Meditation effectiveness is now calculated based on the parts that are equipped (so having a single piece of chain equipped no longer breaks ALL med but reduces it percentually)
    In the tradition of HalfMed, Studded / Bone / Hide are reduce mana gain from meditation by 33% and no longer prevent active meditation

    Using a form is no longer possible when platemail-level armor is worn.

    Increase 2h weapon base damage, multiply all property intensities by 1.5, allow 1 additional property to be rolled or imbued on them

    Armor Ignore PVP cap is now scaled based on weapon speed and increased significantly for slower weapons
    Everything not armor ignore or feint is made less sucky to be a valid choice
    Hands off popular weapons, modify unpopular weapons to be a valid choice

    Agapite, Verite, Valorite, Barbed, Dragon Scale (excluding yellow), Bloodwood, Heartwood, Frostwood -> All 17 base resists OR 15 and some property, adds a property on weapons
    Gold, Oak, Spined, Gold Scales -> 12 base resists and 40 Luck
    Horned, Dull Coper, Shadow Iron, Copper, Bronze, Yew, Ash -> 15 base resists on armor, damage type changes on weapons

    Inherent set bonus for Colored Dragon Armor: If full set worn, approperiate resist cap +5, all other resist caps -5. Not cumulative with elfie energy cap boost.
    Yellow Dragon Armor: +2 to all caps

    Heartwood runic tool can now give 5 max properties.

    Smelting metal now always succeeds (but still requires skill to work the metal)

    Bushido no longer ****s up shield parry, it just buffs 2h parry.

    Chivalry can now be used to gain luck from perfection (not the damage bonus)
     
  5. Uvtha

    Uvtha Grand Poobah
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    Heres what I would do:

    1) Simple. Balance resists. Leave leather where it is, and boost upward. Functionally giving heavy armor more imbuing weight. This change only effects any item created post update.
    2) Apply parry bonus to heavy armors. Studded/hide +1 per piece, Chain/Bone/Ring +2% per piece, Plate 3% per. Max the bonus to +10%. Nice bonus, not overpowered, allows you flexibility in what type you wear. Most of all makes sense. Blows bounce off heavy armor.
    3) Give metal and leather bonuses like wood. This is year and years and years overdue.
    4) Give 2 handed weapons a free +25% damage mod. Allow all 2 handed weapons to have the balanced mod.
    5) Balance out specials. Don't dramatically alter anything, and don't change the specials things have, just boost the things that are useless. We all know what specials are currently pointless, so I wont list them.

    I think you do this everything makes more sense, no current suits or tactics are negated, and heavy armor and 2 handed weapons seem a bit more like an option you would actually consider.
     
  6. Zosimus

    Zosimus Grand Inquisitor
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    Eh I will add even though it wont matter or make any changes.

    Remove the weight restrictions on all armor.

    Make mage property on all armor but it''s not counted as a property on imbuing weight.

    Plate gives better resists and then go down the line till you get to cloth. Dont have to be much difference but it should be noticable when it comes to resist.

    Keep resists on armor but add stats to armor by small percentage which still does not like 2% to 5% max for any stat.

    Crappy ideas with not much sleep ( 2 hours) so yeah I may not be thinking clearly :p
     
  7. Gameboy

    Gameboy Sage
    Stratics Veteran UWF

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    I don't think all armor should be medable. Being able to mediate in plate just doesn't sound right to me. But if it's for the good of the game I'd roll with it. I love pancakes btw.
     
    #7 Gameboy, Feb 3, 2013
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2013
  8. PwnySlaystation

    PwnySlaystation Lore Keeper
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    Why not just adjust the theory cap stats on the type of amour?

    For instance - leather armour is med able thus you could in theory increase mana with it much higher than you could at stamina.

    And on plate mail you could imbue upto say 10 stamina invrease on each piece but only 3 mana inc. and the other way for leathe(10 mana inc 3 stam inc), then increase base speed of ranged weapons (and maybe ignore weapons?)so you can't gimp disarm ignore from distance and give some other specials a buff.

    Or am I talking crap?
     
  9. cazador

    cazador Crazed Zealot
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    Everyone wants an easy button..geez ADAPT folks how many million dollar suits have you had? I had my Val crafted blessed short spear pre-AOS and it was INSANE paid millions for it! One patch turned it to trash my umpteen million dollar 100 lrc sdi mr lmc suit trashed by imbuing ..my millions of dollar imbuing suit overshadowed by reforging..guess what it seems to be a ridiculous cycle..it's ok tho ONE word "ADAPT"!!
     
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  10. Gameboy

    Gameboy Sage
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    I don't know what this says about me but I will never pay millions of gold for armor or weapons. Maybe it's me not understanding how that stats and caps and everything works together. I work on my skills and though I do not hunt the biggest baddest mobs in the game I am content. I don't even know if you have to be a hardcore player to use or know that a million gold suite does. But if a new player saw armor going for millions of gold I think it would be kind of daunting. I ♥ this game I really do, and spending millions or billions is something I know I will never be doing, not because I would not what the items, but because I'm just not going to farm the gold :)
     
    Mitzlplik_LS likes this.
  11. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Grand Poobah
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    And with this Pub you will be rebuilding all your suits again.
     
  12. cazador

    cazador Crazed Zealot
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    I am aware..am I happy about that..not really but having them set it back I doubt will happen all we can do it continue to get it pushed not to nerf the current suits completely but enhance the ones that aren't used..so far I think the devs have missed the point hopefully that is remedied soon..
     
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  13. Maximus of Lck

    Maximus of Lck Adventurer
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    I can't wait to do this. I've made more money imbuing suits for people than any other way in this game. I'm currently stockpiling huge quantities of imbuing materials for the upcoming influx of orders.
     
  14. Mitzlplik_LS

    Mitzlplik_LS Journeyman
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    All I`m missing is the syrup :eyes:
     
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  15. Gameboy

    Gameboy Sage
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    I say UO road trip to IHOP :)
     
  16. Madrid

    Madrid Slightly Crazed
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    How come Pancakes are on the list but Cinnamon Rolls aren't?

    I vote Cinnamon Rolls!
     
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  17. Viper09

    Viper09 Grand Poobah
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    Any publish that will involve a revamp of armor (be it a well received revamp or not) will result in rebuilding some (or all) of our suits. I have no doubt that armor needs some significant tweaking; plate should inherently be among the strongest armor. Regardless though, an armor revamp will happen sooner or later, so it is our hope that we can provide enough feedback about how we would like it to be so that they will alter it in our favor.

    I prefer something that is simple yet still retains some complexity. All armor should not be equal but should follow a simple enough scale similar to what Shakkara was proposing, but still being affected by the different materials that go into crafting it.
     
    #17 Viper09, Feb 5, 2013
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2013
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  18. chise2

    chise2 Sage
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend Arrr & Yarr Pirates!

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    I agree though ideally an armor revamp wouldn;t outright make peoples suits worthless. Ideally people should feel like there is advantages to changing their armor. But they shouldn;t feel forced to their current suits should still work as well. I mean I donlt mind completely rebuilding suits but then again I play on Siege and donlt have a uber maxed out suit that I payed 100 mil plus on.
     
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  19. Viper09

    Viper09 Grand Poobah
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    I wouldn't expect that everyone will have to rebuild all their suits, however it might depend on how the suit was initially constructed (and depending on how the armor revamp will ultimately go of course).
     
  20. Lord Nabin

    Lord Nabin High Council Sage - Greater Sosaria
    Professional Premium Stratics Veteran Supporter Glorious Lord ACW

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    Pancakes are simple.

    Just remember to have a large variety of toppings and syrup.

    Its very difficult to make every single person happy but, with the above pancake plan we should be good to go. :grouphug:
     
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  21. ShadowTrauma

    ShadowTrauma Seasoned Veteran
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    I think your, Viper09's, and Shakkara's views are fairly reasonable in my opinion, and hit upon some great points.
    • The Armor system should not be overly complex. Ideally all information should be transparent and visible on the armor pieces.
    • All armor should not be equal and instead confer some advantages or disadvantages, making choices more important.
    • When making large alterations to a game system it would make sense to leave a stable base (leather armor), so the players (who mostly use leather at this time) do not feel forced to make a change.
    I think the last point is where most people have the greatest issue: Granted stamina damage is pretty extreme in this publish currently and most likely needs some adjustment, but had leather armor acted closer to how it does on live, there would potentially be less issues with some of the changes.
     
    #21 ShadowTrauma, Feb 5, 2013
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2013
  22. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Grand Poobah
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    With the current set up it looks like every Warrior type (PvP/PvM) will be going over to Non-Med Plate to hopefully lessen the Stamina loss. Keep in mind that every piece only has a %20 chance to lessen this loss so you better hope the RNG loves you big time. LOL Also keep in mind that even if you resist a spell you can still take Stamina loss from the spell. And also you do not need to take any loss to Hit Points and you still take Stamina loss. So the bottom line is no matter what a Warrior does he/she is still gonna take Stamina loss as it currently stands. Oh almost forgat we also loose our passive mana regen because Mage Armor acts like leather. Guess UO can't understand that Plate with the Mage Armor mod is still Plate. The playerbase wanted varity and UO just took it away. Spell casters and Tamers should love this PUB, thier suits should be just fine.
     
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