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Imbuing Gains

Discussion in 'UHall' started by Mark Trail, Aug 14, 2009.

  1. Mark Trail

    Mark Trail Journeyman
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    Most players on Retribution set 120 imbuing before they try it out and post their comments. But this is a hard skill that you can't power-game because every recipe needs a special ingredient. You can unravel loot up to about 29 skill then you have to imbue things to gain. Everything needs either a rare gem or a peerless ingredient.

    Here are the cheapest recipes I found:

    Area Cold: Magical Residue, Diamond, Dark Sapphire

    Dispel: Magical Residue, Amber , Blight

    The most expensive recipes are skill bonuses costing a relic fragment, Star Sapphire, and Eye of Travesty.

    Imagine working poisoning or lockpicking but it costs you 50K for every attempt. Or use GGS and take 3 years to reach 120 imbuing.
     
  2. Zodia

    Zodia Guest

    I agree. Unfortunately the nerf-whiners are winning on the beta board, and Imbuing is heading towards uselessness.
     
  3. Ender

    Ender Crazed Zealot
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    Yeah. It's eventually going to be what the poor people use for mid-end stuff, and the rich people will just keep on getting runic-crafted stuff :/
     
  4. Coppelia

    Coppelia Guest

    Is that a joke? Oo
     
  5. Amber Moon

    Amber Moon Seasoned Veteran
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    Sad to hear such a major content system will be out of reach of casual players.

    Gotta say though, I kinda suspected as much when they mentioned 'special' ingredients.

    :( :( :(

    On the bright side, perhaps its 100 skill points I don't have to tie up on my crafter.
     
  6. Setnaffa

    Setnaffa Certifiable
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    If you start a new character with 50 Imbuing, then GGS it the rest of the way (keeping your total skill points below 350):

    50.0 – 54.9: GGS every 27 minutes, so 22 hours and 3 minutes
    55.0 – 59.9: every 33 minutes, so 27.5 hours
    60.0 – 64.9: every 55 minutes, so 45 hours and 50 minutes
    65.0 – 69.9: every 1.3 hours, so 65 hours
    70.0 – 74.9: every 1.9 hours, so 95 hours
    75.0 – 79.9: every 2.4 hours, so 120 hours
    80.0 – 84.9: each 3.0 hours, 150 hours
    85.0 – 89.9: each 3.8 hours, 190 hours
    90.0 – 94.9: each 4.6 hours, 230 hours
    95.0 – 99.9: each 5.6 hours, 280 hours
    100.0 – 104.9: each 6.6 hours, 330 hours
    105.0 – 109.9: each 7.8 hours, 390 hours
    110.0 – 114.9: each 9.0 hours, 450 hours
    115.0 – 120.0: each 10.3 hours, 515 hours

    By my count that would take 2,910 hours and 23 minutes (121 days 12 hours and 23 minutes) to go from 0 to 120 Imbuing! You could be a legendary imbuer by the middle of January! :D
     
  7. Ailish

    Ailish Lore Master
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  8. Mark Trail

    Mark Trail Journeyman
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    Thanks very much Setnaffa for the timing. That took a lot of work. With taking breaks for RL it still looks to me like 3 years to 120 using GGS.

    And also AIlish, thanks for the link, I didn't know about that one. Looks like maybe this can be powergamed after all.
     
  9. Myna

    Myna Guest

    well, maybe its better that it isnt so easy to reach 120.

    at the end the whole shard would run around with uber stuff very fast.

    i am not sure if imbuing is good for the game when it is easy to make uber stuff when a lot player reached 100 or 120.

    at least it will encourage scripters to mine/lumber/fish gems ... they will be in high demand

    i really dont know what to think about imbuing yet
     
  10. blueturtle

    blueturtle Lore Keeper
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    imbuing's going to be good to finish off avg suits, all of my suits are much better than you can get with imbuing stuff, so val hammers will still be in demand, but what i do like about imbuing is the jewelry no more looking for that ring/brac with the skill you want and hci/dci/ep, etc.
     
  11. Wilki

    Wilki Guest

    We're still working on imbuing, and have gotten some good feedback that we're taking into consideration now.

    What helps us the most is constructive criticism, so if you've got an opinion, even a negative one, please post it with the reasons behind it.

    Don't assume what you're playing with today is the final version. We're looking at improvement in several areas.
     
  12. MissEcho

    MissEcho Slightly Crazed
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    Not having a shot a you :) but the thing I find funny about that statement is before the cheating, duping and scripting of val hammers 99% of players would NEVER have even seen one and even if they did they couldn't afford one.

    It shows how low we have sunk with 'acceptance' of the rampant cheating in UO when the thought of crafting anything with a val hammer becomes the 'norm' don't you think? Found this funny when in beta and people were saying 'but with a val hammer I can get xyz mods' etc as if Val hammers were now the 'norm'.

    I guess they are given how many 'dupes' are floating around and the willingness of players to buy them.
     
  13. Fink

    Fink Guest

    Making Imbuing extremely hard or prohibitively expensive to gain doesn't balance it vs the uber stuff it can produce, it just delays the inevitable. Whether it be one month from now or one year before everyone has skilled up, you have to look at that as an eventuality and not a rarity. Trying to squeeze some extra mileage out of the gains system isn't a substitute making a sustainable craft system.

    Making Imbuing reasonable to fund/gain will make it a more acceptable, accessible addition. It will allow the casual player, or less-connected person, to participate on some level. As it stands it seems you have to be sponsored by a major guild, or have unlimited funds or hours to devote to it. The independent or small-guild crafter will be sorely disadvantaged.
     
  14. RedDaTeef

    RedDaTeef Guest

    Make this skill super hard to gain!

    Make it cost ALOT to learn it!!

    Make the reagents VERY expensive!!

    or this skill will be out of control!!;)
     
  15. Ender

    Ender Crazed Zealot
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    Or just keep it the way it is now, so average players can actually have a chance against the rich players item-wise.



    OH GEE LOOK AT THAT, LOGIC
     
  16. ElRay

    ElRay Guest

    You have a chance against rich players, its called "GO OUT AND DO WHAT THEY DID TO GET RICH"

    Youre welcome.
     
  17. Ender

    Ender Crazed Zealot
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    Script/dupe/buy from script/dupers? No thanks. And yes, I know there are legit rich people. There are also a lot that aren't.
     
  18. Zodia

    Zodia Guest

    Please do not give in to the NERF IMBUING whiners.

    They are testing it on a Test Shard where they have unlimited resources and can just type in "1200" to set their skill to Legendary.

    On a regular shard, with regular constraints, imbuing will be very difficult to make many of these powerful weapons/armor/jewels that people are showing as examples. Resources are limited, 120 imbue scrolls will be few and far between, and it will not be like on the test shard.

    If anything, make the ingredients a little more rare, but please do not nerf it so that it is useless just to please people that were against imbuing from the start. Most of them are PvPers who hold their precious "balanced" characters over adding anything fun and new to the game.
    They will adapt. We always have.
     
  19. popps

    popps Always Present
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    That's the problem with a game too heavily based on items........

    Besides, since large wealth only is in the hands of few, this will only be a tool for some to gain extra power versus a vaster majority of players.

    Not good, not right, not correct, IMHO.

    At the very least they should have made Peerless ingredients available in treasure chests besides on Peerless bosses.
     
  20. popps

    popps Always Present
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    LOL !!!

    As if Powerscrolls on a regular shard where not a monopoly of few, limited guilds......

    It has been impossible for ordinary players to get a 120 Magery or a 120 Eval Int for a long time imagine what is going to happen for 120 Imbuing.

    This is going to only make very few players uberpowerfull and a whole lot very frustrated and upset.

    To my opinion, this is poor design.

    Issuing new content without dealing FIRST with the problems attaining the game, for example 120 powerscrolls kept hostage by a few guilds, only creates problems to the game and damages it.

    They should have made Peerless ingredients also spawn in treasure chests AND done changes to Powerscrolls so that NOONE can keep them hostage of a few guilds.

    All paying customers should be able to hunt for their powerscrolls if they wished so but it has NOT BEEN SUCH for YEARS now.
     
  21. Petra Fyde

    Petra Fyde Peerless Chatterbox
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    This is incorrect. Check the table Ailisha created: http://uo.stratics.com/php-bin/show_content.php?content=31013

    only if you're trying to imbue at 90% intensity or over do you need rare ingredients, and peerless aren't needed at all.

    You will be able to train most of the way with normal bought from jewellers or mugged from monsters gems, if you choose the right recipes in terms of residue, essence or relic fragment.

    As a very small experiment yesterday I unravelled some of the least popular minor artifacts.
    Arctic death dealer yielded 1 relic fragment
    Cavorting Club yielded 2 essence
    Knight's kiss yielded 1 essence.
    nox rangers xbow yielded 1 relic fragment
    wrath of the dryad yielded 1 essence
    luna lance yielded 1 relic fragment
    bone smasher yielded 2 enchanted essence
    righteous anger yielded 2 enchanted essence
    blade dancer yielded 1 relic fragment.

    I somehow see a lot more level 6 maps being dug shortly
     
  22. popps

    popps Always Present
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    Alright, thank you for the positive attitude.

    I will bite.

    In order to make Inbuing accessable to ALL players, who are all paying subscribers, and not just those who have more wealth and more time at hand to play the game, I think at least 2 changes are VERY important.

    Number One.

    We all know that Powerscroll Champ spawns are hunts limited to most players. It has been like this for YEARS and anyone can say anything they may want but the bottom line is, that average players simply do NOT have access to powerscrolls unless they buy them.
    This, because they are precluded from hunting them since a few Guilds hold them hostage in a Monopoly.
    It has been like this forvever, for example, for skills like 120 Magery and 120 Evaluate Intelligence.

    I can only imagine what is going to happen with 120 Imbuing.

    If you want ALL your paying subscribers to play with this skill then you MUST make chances to how Powerscrolls spawn and make it so that finally, ALL players can hunt for them.

    And no, it is not like that now. In reality, a WHOLE LOT of players don't have a chance to hunt for Legendary scrolls and they have not been able for YEARS.

    Number Two

    Peerless Ingredients need to also spawn in Treasure chests, not only on Peerless.
    A whole lot of players were left out from making scrappers just because of peerless ingredients being limited to peerless hunts.

    Allow them to spawn at least also in level 6 treasure chests if you really want all players to experience imbuing.

    That's how I see it.
     
  23. Petra Fyde

    Petra Fyde Peerless Chatterbox
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    Have you read any of the posts on imbuing recently? you do not need peerless ingredients to imbue.

    The table of ingredients has been posted twice in this thread, you might like to take the trouble to actually read it before complaining further.
     
  24. popps

    popps Always Present
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    Well, I read for example that Eye of the Travesty is required in some cases.

    Even if it is not considered a Peerless ingredient it still has to do with Peerless....
    Are there other Peerless "parts" required for the higher level imbuing ?

    What I meant is have whatever ingredient is needed also spawn in level 6 treasure chests.....
     
  25. Petra Fyde

    Petra Fyde Peerless Chatterbox
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    Eye of travesty is not listed on that table. What is it used for? Are you sure the information you have is current?

    Some people who thought they were very clever released information that was covered by NDA, that information is totally in error and completely out of date.

    The OP quotes it as being needed for skill bonuses. I imbued an item with +15 magery yesterday, it cost me relic fragments, star sapphires and turquoise.
     
  26. MissEcho

    MissEcho Slightly Crazed
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    You need to actually KNOW what you are talking about and make sure you have even it partly right before you complain.

    The 120 imbuing powerscroll is available by doing a quest, as are the 115 and 110 scrolls. ANY player can do the quest, it does not involve any fighting or pvp just the provision of 50 residue (110), 50 essence (110) or 50 frags (120)


    Peerless ingredients are NOT used in imbuing, read the table already supplied.
     
  27. Silverbird

    Silverbird Slightly Crazed
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    *sigh* ... Ppl prefer to complain instead of informing themselves or even worse instead of listening to those who know better.

    Imbuing is a crafting skill. Do crafting related powerscrolls drop at champion spawns yet? No ----> Dont worry about not beeing able to get a 120 imbuing scroll due to some of your shards issues with champion spawns.

    There are already training methods that dont require any of the more expensive ingredients. 'Only' 1 residue ,1 normal gem and 1 imbuable magical item is needed for a chance for a gain. (Or it least it was the last time, I had time to look for.) With the high difficulty for high end imbuing you're going to imbue for skilling around sweet gaining difficultys all the way up to 120.

    You might want to read about the open beta clarifications again, too.l It is stated that especially imbuing is not finished and that the devs are awaiting more feedback about. So its somewhat senseless to discuss about the possible costs or time needed for training up imbuing to 120.
    Btw does anyone remember how hard/expensive/time consuming it was, to train up blacksmith to legendary? It took me really long to finally get that powerscroll. Not to mention all the time needed for mining the needed ingots (for the bods for the ps and the training.) I dont think, that 120 imbuing will anyhow come close to that.
     
  28. popps

    popps Always Present
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    Do you happen to have a link to such Table ?

    I checked UOHerald and Stratics but I must have not been good at searching because I found none.

    Thanks.
     
  29. Petra Fyde

    Petra Fyde Peerless Chatterbox
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    You didn't look very far. It's been linked to twice in this thread, once by Ailish, who provided it, and once by me.
     
  30. popps

    popps Always Present
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    Sorry, overlooked those messages.

    The scripters will have a field trip with imbuing......

    High Intensity Ingredients come from either chopping wood or mining and who mines or chops the most ??

    I really, but REALLY hope that Stygian Abyss has some way to detect scripters because I see the upcoming changes as imbuing as a scripter's paradise.....
     
  31. Shadefox

    Shadefox Certifiable
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    why oh why should everything be so easy?
    Why shouldent people that invest alot of time and effort into a game, be able to have 1 or 2 skills that us casuals dont get that easy?
    Why isnt there a skill left, that when done,would actually feel likehes an achievment, rather than, oh, there it is 120! on to the next!

    Is it a race?
    I do understand you get more power and riches from 120, but shouldent the hardworkers be rewarded?

    Whats the use of it anyways if everyone and their mother gets 120 in a blast? do that inforce trading anymore than the broken state it is at today?

    I seriously think that envy of the "real life no carers" that can play as much they wanna, is making UO go into easy mode, and the challenge withing the game slowly gets taken away from us, becasue everyone ennvy other that worked hard to get a skill done, and wanna be able to do the same in less amount of work or time or dedication....

    2 cents up.
     
  32. thelust6

    thelust6 Guest

    Hm interesting, are there any plans to allow Mysticism and Imbuing Scrolls of Transedence drop at champion spawns? x
     
  33. Petra Fyde

    Petra Fyde Peerless Chatterbox
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    Before you dismiss the skill as un-doable, weed out the inaccurate negative comments and look at what is really needed to train the skill. A lot of what is being posted today is totally wrong.
     
  34. thelust6

    thelust6 Guest

    :thumbsup:I must say I downloaded the SA client last night and had a blast in Ter Mur! The new land, graphcial content, hotbar, GUI layout thoroughly impressed me(gargolyes to of course" :)), I love the new creature additions, in scope that big looking four legged bull? like creature with horns on it's back with fur, few different names (I've completley forgotton it's name, at work at the moment!) would love it be a mountable :p Unsure if it has any specials, it took up two control slots )) x
     
  35. popps

    popps Always Present
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    Perhaps make it for an environment with more players all geared up and skilled to the same evened out field which would make it for a more challenging PvP environment ?

    If only a few have the wealth and the time to hoarde the best items, they simply dominate the PvP arena over all others.

    If instead more and more players are able to make it to high end gear/items this means that PvP will be more challenging for all since matches to one's own high end template will be much more common.

    End result would be a much more challenging PvP environment.




    Envy ?

    This has got nothing to do with envy, at least for me. Only a desire to see this game be a way more challenging PvP environment and not simply yet another game where a few who either have the wealth or the time can dominate over many more players.......
     
  36. Amber Moon

    Amber Moon Seasoned Veteran
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    I wish I could Petra.. but honestly I don't have enough information since there is no real guide yet. What makes a residue, or relic, or essence? How high can I train on residues without the additional mining/fishing/lumberjacking components? If I add those in how high can I train? How many attempts are required for a skill gain?

    If I only attempt a couple high end items in the next year or so, that would be fine with me. Playing 6 to 10 hours a week and not having a huge pot of gold in the bank, will I ever see the high end of this skill?

    If the system ends up used mostly by high end high time players like the top runics now, thats fine with me too. Lots of things to entertain me in the game. I do have to say though, I never felt like any of the other crafting skills was so unapproachable. I hope I am wrong.
     
  37. This has got to be the most ignorant statement I've ever seen here on Stratics. A person that plays 5 hours a day will ALWAYS be on a higher level than someone that only plays 5 hours a week. If the game is changed so that they're equal then you may as well go look for a new game because this one won't be worth playing anymore.

    Before you continue with all of your pancakes and moaning, why don't you actually go and test some of this stuff? You know nothing about what you're talking about, and are arguing about stuff that's not even in SA anymore.


    /start sarcasm

    Oh man, that pro football player shouldn't have his millions or his houses and cars. I play football at the park on the weekends so I should have exactly what he has. I demand that it be made so. Gold coins should fall from heaven, and everyone should have a Lamborghini parked in their garage.

    /end sarcasm


    Life ain't fair. Get over it. Those that put in the time get the rewards for it.
     
  38. This skill isn't going to be one you can just powergame up to 120, which is a good thing. It's going to be one that a crafter that's earned that 120 skill will be well paid for their time, expense, and effort.
     
  39. Amber Moon

    Amber Moon Seasoned Veteran
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    heh, no problem. Powergame? I am still working to finish 100 lumberjack after 10 years of subscription. Is that anti-powergame enough for ya? :p
     
  40. Heh, it took me 3 yrs to bring myself to finish off the last 5.0 points of LJ'ing myself. :thumbsup:
     
  41. Myna

    Myna Guest

    well i think the skill will be out of control sooner or later, its to powerful, it doesnt matter if it happens this year or in 2 years, but one time player will have the skill.

    i would like to see imbuing just for jewels or stuff you cant make with a runic, at least make an item destroyable while imbuing, like enchantment
     
  42. Myna

    Myna Guest

    why cant it be powergamed?

    the wealthy player can just buy the amount of ingredients he needs... the miner lumberjack fisherman scripters will deliver tons of gems etc.
     
  43. Even a wealthy player will find it difficult to find everything they would need to powergame it, and would find that the cost of doing so will put a huge dent in even the biggest bank account. To make it simple, it's cost prohibitive, even for a rich player.
     
  44. popps

    popps Always Present
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    "Worth playing" ??

    And what is that supposed to mean if I may ask ?

    The way I see it, this is a game, only a game which is a tool to spend time unused in real life and relax.

    I think this tool would be a better tool if players would more often meet their challenge in the game.

    For this to happen, I think, it is necessary to bring all players to the same level and not have a gap between them widen be it because some have more wealth or more time to spend playing the game.

    A more challenging PvP environment needs PvPers on equal footing, IMHO, and the more the better.



    Again, this is only a game.
    I do not see how professional sport players can be mixed up with average game players.

    It is like oil and water, they do not mix.

    So, professional sport uses an arena and average sport players use an entire other.

    Ultima Online, last I knew, is only and just a game........
     
  45. popps

    popps Always Present
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    From what I read the top ingredients for the very high end imbuing will come from chopping wood and mining ore.

    And aren't maybe scripters those who mine and chop the most ?

    As I see it, these changes will be a blessing for scripters.........

    It is so sad, but really sad.
     
  46. popps

    popps Always Present
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    And what about scripters ?

    Will they also have such a hard time to come by all of the ingredients they need ?
     
  47. Fink

    Fink Guest

    Does anyone (up to date with the latest on Imbuing) know..

    Can you still take a mid/top-end item and imbue (and re-imbue) a minimal mod to it for gains? From what I heard it was a far cheaper method than taking a low-end piece and Imbuing a top-end mod to it. I heard there was some debate over this as to whether it should be allowed or not, or that it was something they were looking to change. What's the status now?
     
  48. Fizzleton

    Fizzleton Journeyman
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    well again u will have some sort of crafting that will support scripters. and unlike those ML-recepies where only some were really interesting (still laughing about "inventions" like a blight gripped longbow etc) eg the mined gems will get real power, when u look at how imbuing is designed atm.

    Suggestions?

    First: Make things break during imbuing. Just like enhancing does. Break chance scales with the intensity of the item, like enhancing.

    Second: Generate a deed: For one month of subscription, each account gets one "assured imbuing deed", which means that u can imbue an item for certain, without the chance of breaking it.

    What it does: Powergamers/scripters and casual players are treated the same; casual players can focus on the rare items that will become extraordinary powerful with imbuing while the "power fraction" will have to take higher risk for their mass-imbuing. By this you get, depending on the break chance, a fair trade-off where casuals don't have to stay away pi++ed because they just can't compete with the shere time power of powergamers/scripters.
     
  49. Myna

    Myna Guest

    when i see what players pay for low mod jewels (millions) in luna while outside luna nobody would pay 5k for it .... then i think some players just have to much gold and they buy everything no matter what it costs

    buying gems and other ingredients will be peanuts.

    everybody will start to unravel items becasue you can do that with low skills .... i bet the market will be flooded with gems relics etc. and i bet the prices for them drop ...
     
  50. Myna

    Myna Guest

    yea, i second this

    why can you break items while enhancing which dont give uber attributes but not with imbuing?

    make items break while imbuing and make items not break or nerf the chance to break for enhancing or make both have a chance to break items