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Imbuing - Leurocian

Discussion in 'UHall' started by Jhym, Sep 2, 2008.

  1. Jhym

    Jhym Guest

    Since you're discussing the Imbueing skill, maybe a few initial suggestions?

    Do NOT make it direct linked to any of the other crafter skills (ie arms-lore, tinkering, smithing.) Instead, if anything, link it to other magery skills. Thus, if you have high magery/eval int/resist/necro/weaving/etc, you get potential bonuses in use of the skill. (perhaps chance to imbue, or cost, or power of the results.)

    If you link it to other craft skills you get the standard "whaaa, my craft template can't fit it" arguments. This way, you're going down a separate track and charting totally new territory.

    If you wanted it even more interesting, have various enhancements be linked to ANY skill. For instance, fighters might have better chances to add weapons (di, hci, dci), shieldsmen and resisters might have better chances to add resists, magery skills for magery items and overall additions, barding for bardic skills, etc etc.

    This makes it a more rounded skill that could be added to any template to build particular items, rather than you add it to your mage or you add it to your crafter.

    Also, it should be attributable to ANY item. If I want to add odd abilities to my earrings, why can't I? If I want my bookshelves to have inscription +10, (even though it doesn't do anything), why not? Make it a general Imbuing ability of any item, not tied to specific types of crafts or even item types.

    The Imbue materials should be expensive, but not out of range of normal folks. So I should be able to dungeon hop many of the current dungeons and facets and have little trouble picking up many of the items I need. There should be VERY FEW "peerless" level things, and only for specific very powerful abilities that you (the devs) want violently rare.

    I will have to think about it some more, but off the cuff that's what I'm thinking about it right now...

    Plus even though there's this push to be transparent on numbers and info, I actually have never minded a bit of mystery, where we have to think and put together what's going on (after all, that's why stratics is here actually.)

    So don't just put out all combos and numbers in beta -- let us have to work out the specifics ourselves. You can always add in the "tables" later if we can't figure out anything.
     
  2. Nexus

    Nexus Site Support
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    Does it matter when you have Soul stones if it's linked or not? Seriously I have 2 mules that swap skills back and forth for crafting the same will happen with imbuing regardless.
     
  3. Maplestone

    Maplestone Crazed Zealot
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    I'm confused ... if you tie it to non-crafting skills, doesn't that mean even more overcrowding on crafting templates? Or is that what you want?
     
  4. Dermott of LS

    Dermott of LS UOEC Modder
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    ...

    Another question for Leuro:

    When you unravel an item, will the mod pertained in the material you receive be from the item unraveled, or will it be like Enchanting in WoW where it becomes material for specific recipes?
     
  5. Like Glassblowing and Masonry, I think imbuing (as well as dual-wield which is discussed elsewhere) should be a learned offshoot of a main skill. Imbuing would fit as a subset of magery I think as would dual-wield in a melee skill.

    Any problem with that? Does not add another skill to a cramped template that I see and in a broad sense is like recipes - learned on a character with requisite skill.
     
  6. Eslake

    Eslake Guest

    But you know what they would do if they took that route. ;)
    They would spend the next 18 months(I suspect longer) giving us even more reasons to dump Spellweaving, and then make it the base skill.
     
  7. phantus

    phantus Stratics Legend
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    Absolutely F'n not. We need no more skills that require powerscrolls of a 120 nature to be viable. I have 4 120 mages too. It needs to be a standalone skill.


    Total garbage. I want a skill I can damn well use that isn't going to be taken by bod accounts and made into the perfect selling machine. All this suggests is someone that wants to make money will have an account with only these skillsets and inbueing so it can make the widest range of gear for their merchants while I can't make crap with my crafter unless I do the same.

    The skill should also be immune to soul stones as all new skills should be. Soulstones have done enough damage to the game and limited new skill being added too much already. Time to put on a bandaid for that irreversable mistake.
     
  8. Draxous

    Draxous Grand Poobah
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    I have 2 crafters and I can say right now I can fit imbuing on both characters and still be able to craft anything I want.

    ...
     
  9. Maplestone

    Maplestone Crazed Zealot
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    ew! I'd actually like to see glassblowing and masonry either become full skills or be turned into recipes. I don't like them as skills without skill points - it breaks the sense of consistency.
     
  10. Mazulat

    Mazulat Journeyman
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    I honestly believe it needs to be a stand alone like arms-lore. You can craft without arms-lore, but you can do more with it. Same for imbue, but used in the same way stealth is to hiding: You must have 50-85 in a crafting skill to learn it or use it on items of that particular type. ( wood=carpenter metal=blacksmith leather/cloth=tailor ect). That will prevent alot of the auto runners from building uber-item machines.

    Its a great skill but it is a crafter skill, not a skill for the 120'd out mages that just need a way to make some extra gp when they aren't farming. That's why crafter templates are always tight and always will be. There is a reason for it. You want to make high end items..then you need to devote the neccesary skill points to doing it. Want to be able to make EVERYTHING? Make 2 crafters. Don't go for the easy button. We've had enough of that and it never fix's anything. UO wasn't founded on easy...it was tough to gm and it was tough to keep it...as it should be. Make it another quick easy skill to make leet gear and all we do is dig the bigger hole.

    *puts on flame retardant jumpsuit* Crafters aren't supposed to be easy!!
     
  11. they are not skills!
    you dont train them in anyway, shape or form
    you cant have them on their own,
    you NEED alchemy for glass-blowing, you dont need points in glass-blowing to make things you need alchemy
    you NEED carpentry for masonry, you dont need points in masonry to make things you need carpentry
    they are pretty much recipes already since all you do is read a book bought from a npc for ~10k
     
  12. Maplestone

    Maplestone Crazed Zealot
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    Then why are they listed as skills in the play guide?
     
  13. just because they are listed in the skills section does not make them so, a truer definition of them would be additions or an extension. true they are listed in with the skills but that is the most logical place to put them, since they are dependant on the skills you need to GM for them to have a use.

    you dont have a glass-blowing skill to make any of the items it goes by your GM alchemy skill
    from the playguide,
    the exact same is true for masonry.

    if you wanted them as separate skills in their own right then the same would have to be true for granite mining and sand mining as they are both offshoots of mining that are learnt from a book.
    And why not have jewel crafting as a separate skill too since tinkering isnt a profession that makes rings and bracelets in real life
     
  14. Jhym

    Jhym Guest

    By "Tying" I mean that Imbueing different attributes can be improved by more than just one or two skills, but ALL skills can improve SOMETHING. Think how Tactics improves all weapon skills (but in reverse.)
     
  15. Teeshy

    Teeshy Guest

    There's a game called dofus - silly little, level grindy flash game, nice waste of time when you want something different =P

    Anyways, they have what is kinda "grand mastery" skills - when you get to 100 in jeweller for example, you can become a jewel mage. And as a jewel mage, you can add properties to existing items. The more you add, the more chance you have of completely cocking it up and destroying the item.

    The way you add properties is by using "runes" A different rune for each property. And to get runes, you have to crush items. For example, you want to add agility, you crush an item that has +agility on it, if it was +3 agility for example, you "crush" the item (losing the item in the process) and gain between 0 and 3 agility runes.

    Anyway, point of the previous - I'm kinda guessing that imbuing is going to work a similar way? We will destroy current items, to get magical material to add to other items?

    I'd like that anyway, if there was tailor imbuing, and blacksmith imbuing, but they didn't cost me skill points =P I don't have room for skills on either of my crafters. And I'd also like if the chance of success was quite low, makes things harder, more exciting when they work ;)
     
  16. Jhym

    Jhym Guest

    I kinda see it as it's own skill set. That's why I like the idea of most other skills affecting it, with it being usable by many types of characters (not JUST crafters.)

    You might recall in stories that yes, there are Blacksmiths that make legendary items, but there are also Mages and Warriors that do so as well.

    Keep in mind we're talking about adding magical properties to our items, not banging on a forge or chopping wood. Thus, any and every skill set should be able to use Imbuing to make SOMETHING.

    As for glass/stone working -- I would ONLY accept them as separate skills if we had major amounts of new stone and glass items to make. Currently there are not enough items to justify them as their own skillsets.
     
  17. Jhym

    Jhym Guest

    No reason to be rude about it, just debate bud.

    Yes, it would be a standalone skill, didn't mean to imply it wouldn't. I was saying that other skills should improve it; whether it's exceptional additions or additional properties as we get with inscription and magery.

    As for connecting other skills, why in the world would you want it restricted so only crafters can use it if you supposedly don't want people using the skill for "money machines"? I would want it usable on any template without restrictions -- plus we're talking 100 points, which people are not going to be able to flip around between characters in twenty seconds IF various templates are required to build different types of useful magic items.

    The question I'd ask is why in the world would you want another un-linked, simplistic skill that will be GM'd within 40 hours by scripters to make all the perfect money-maker things they want?
     
  18. Hunters' Moon

    Hunters' Moon Grand Inquisitor
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    OK so we will have imbueing added to the game soon. Thats wonderful! I have questions though. If I may....

    1) Will we be able to (disenchant) items for certain qualities(mods)? I.E. I got a heavy,slow swing speed war mace with 50% hit lightning as loot and I want to take the hit lightning off of that war mace(destroying the item in the process) and add it to a much faster hitting weapon,such as a dagger with a 2 sec swing speed and 30%SSI?

    2)Just a thought on how taming can come into play here. What if we could take a newly tamed pet and "disenchant" it for its best quality (Kinda like what was seen FF8 and FF9).
    Dragons: fire resistance and hit fireball. WW's: Cold resistance and hit mindblast/harm.
     
  19. Harlequin

    Harlequin Babbling Loonie
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    I like this idea. I think there was another post on this suggestion as well, about extracting a property and storing it on a runestone/focal stones (the process will destroy the original item), then infusing the property into another item.


    I only played FF8 and I remember GFs, but I have no idea what is meant by "disenchant". Are saying having chars mounted on pets add a bonus to their resistances/stats? Or stripping the pet of it's resistances to add it to your own?
     
  20. And as an offshoot I think Imbuing is appropriate. Looking over some of the responses, I would like to back off my original thought to tie it on Magery only.

    Imbuing - offshoot attribute/subskill to almost any craft-type skill plus Magery. Tinker, Carpenter, Blacksmith, Tailor, Alchemy, Inscription can all benefit from something to make their items special. Call it enchanting if you want but it is a magical alteration of the properties of an item, thus the Magery hook right off.

    So what could be imbued with special properties? Ummm, armor with extra protection for a duration via spell - permanent via enhancement, Weaponry with an extra SSI, DI or HCI for example - permanent or duration. What if a smoke bomb now could be imbued with an area paralytic like Paralyze spell? Spellbooks could grant an INT boost to a mage over the current cap.

    How could this be done? Magical castings of spells learned from recipe scrolls, books or other methods. Some may require resources to complete - the mining gems, blackrock (a use?), pearls, standard gems. <shrug>

    My thoughts as I now run off to just bug the bejeebers outta management.
     
  21. Hunters' Moon

    Hunters' Moon Grand Inquisitor
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    In FF8 you could turn beasts you fought into cards. Get enough of them and you could get some pretty good items."Disenchanting" a pet would be the same as disenchanting a weapon but you would take an atribute from the pet to enhance some piece of armor or weapon. Dragon-some fire resist to armor and maybe 20-30% hit fireball/magic arrow to a weapon.
     
  22. Violence

    Violence Lore Keeper
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    Dual Wield in UO ain't happening. Or am I missing some official announcement?

    Other than that they already said they INTEND for templates to get MORE CRAMPED. :sad4: Right?
     
  23. Eslake

    Eslake Guest

    Based on what was said at the TH, Imbuing won't work the way most seem to think.

    It didn't sound like you could take a 50% hit lightning weapon and unravel it for that property to put on something else.

    She said that unraveling an item would produce ingredients. So my impression was that it will function much like Enchanting does in WoW.

    Sort of like this ---
    A dagger with 5% hci might produce the Lowest ingredient, a dull clump.
    A 20% SSI dagger with 10 HCI and 10 DI might give a shiny clod.

    And then to Add 15% HCI might require 10 dull clumps and 3 shiny clods.


    It is a good system overall. Items of no real value become ingredients that can produce imbues of Very Little value, but more than the items unraveled.
    And at the high end, you need to destroy numerous Powerful items to get ingredients to produce 1 very good imbue.

    Skilling up will entail unraveling those junk items we've been complaining about for so long, and imbuing more junk items with the Low-end ingredients.
    (and of course, unraveling that imbued junk too)


    But have no doubts, they are not going to allow Multiple imbues on a single item. ;)
     
  24. Hunters' Moon

    Hunters' Moon Grand Inquisitor
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    I like that idea overall but I hope that the Devs don't do a copy/paste job from what WoW devs have done.


    I think they should allow multiple enchantments on items(with a cap of course) for no other reason but to add customization to our armor and weapons.
     
  25. Teeshy

    Teeshy Guest

    I don't know WoW at all, so no idea how it work there =)

    But I don't think they need a real "cap" with multiple enchantments, if there's a greater and greater chance each time you try to add more to an item that you totally cock it up and break the item completely. Put some risk into it. =)
     
  26. Xanthril of LA

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    I have not been able to keep up with what was said at TH last weekend, but I def like this idea of imbuing. They should keep the imbuing within some limits, such as if you are trying to imbue a ring that already has four properties, then you can only add one more property. But if the ring has three properties to begin with then you can add two more, with each one increasing the chance of losing the item. I truly hope that the chance at failure is somewhat lower than enhancing armor or weapons. My legendary smith with a +60 hammer will fail nearly everytime I really want to enhance something. My legendary tailor will fail like ten to twelve times in a row -- just happened last time I was trying to enhance some things. Its very streaky. I hope imbuing isn't as bad in those regards but there should be some risk to the endeavor.
     
  27. Winker

    Winker Babbling Loonie
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    i just hope that the imbuing Crafting Kit is not as rare as a Val hammer
     
  28. Hunters' Moon

    Hunters' Moon Grand Inquisitor
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    In WoW the enchantment (Imbueing) skill is limited. In WoW if you wish to enchant an item with a certain modifier,any previous player-placed modifier is removed from the item. I hope the UO Devs give us more latitude with the imbueing skill,and to allow us to customize our weapons and armor to a certain extent.
     
  29. Hunters' Moon

    Hunters' Moon Grand Inquisitor
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    I have played since the time BoD's were first introduced and I have never gotten an LBoD that has a val hammer as a possible reward. I would like to think that the Devs would take the oppertunity here to do a complete overhaul of the crafting system.