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Insurance Removal/Item Break/No POF, and other "solutions"..

Discussion in 'UHall' started by Violence, Sep 13, 2008.

  1. Violence

    Violence Lore Keeper
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    Thank you but please stop offering them.

    It's about time, we get what you're trying to say and simply disagree- well at least from what the polls show and if you'd pass the idea around in the game you'd get more of the same results. In fact results don't matter either, it's a matter of you trying to cramp a play-style you don't enjoy and never will. No reason to do this.

    So you may move this post to SnR or delete it or call it a troll, but honestly I'm starting to see those polls and posts as trolls instead.

    It's time we leave this subject alone. It's become more annoying than Archery posts, Tamer posts, SA posts and twice as ridiculous considering the reactions such threads incite.
     
  2. S!ckLoveR says it like it is, and speaks for the overwhelming majority of UO PvPers. If any of these 'solutions' are ever implemented, the majority of PvPers would quit UO.
     
  3. Wenchkin

    Wenchkin Babbling Loonie
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    Well, if you don't like the thread title, you don't have to read the posts. Do you?

    BTW, while you guys could threaten to quit because you don't like to see Fel more risky, there are plenty of players who quit for the opposite reason when it became suit & gold v suit & gold. Your opinion is no less important than theirs was, you've just had the good fortune that you got what you want all these years. You may quit, they may return.

    But please, this is UO. Where Tram is pretty much king. The chances that EA would make Fel more risky are slim to nil. It's like fixing thieves lol. Stop looking so worried, chances are we'll have group hugs becoming mandatory within 6 months in Fel. And players like myself will only tolerate so much Tram in Fel before we leave you alone. Something to look forward to :D

    Wenchy
     
  4. Kith Kanan

    Kith Kanan Guest

    Well not posting in them could make it look to the dev's that we dont care or that we agree , and we dont want that , but having to keep posting that if u dont like insurance then you can go play siege gets a bit tirresom.. but I'll keep doing it...
     
  5. EnigmaMaitreya

    EnigmaMaitreya Crazed Zealot
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    Let me give you an alternate .... version of how things work.

    A thread is created. This thread is magically blessed and every one stays on topic and offers views on the subject, problems, solutions etc.

    The Dev Team reads this magical thread and gain insight and perceptions they did not have.

    The QUANTITY of posters/posts HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH THEIR CHOICES.

    Now in a different (or is it the current reality) Alternate explanation of how things work.

    People keep on regurgitating the same old issues, solutions, pro's and con's.

    The very issue becomes one of pure unadulterated PAIN for everyone.

    The Dev Team stops listening, wont even participate, gains the perception that the posting population is nothing but a bunch of spoiled, whiny cry baby, children that do NOT KNOW HOW TO COMMUNICATE.

    In another thread some one said "They may Nerf .... just to shut people up". Is that the criteria we want them to use when they think changing the game? To SHUT PEOPLE UP?

    Do you really think the admins of boards and the Dev Team are that .... what ever, that they would advocate, support, encourage Recommendations to the Game based on WHO RANTS THE LOUDEST, MOST OBNOXIOUS?
     
  6. Kith Kanan

    Kith Kanan Guest

    my 10 years of playing UO says : who the hell knows , the Dev's pull of nerfs and silly stuff that no one wants , that look absurd to everybody , and over look the most blatantly cheats and stuff in need of tweaking , so for all we know they may use a dice to decide what gets nerfed , but I'm not gonna take any chances :)
     
  7. EnigmaMaitreya

    EnigmaMaitreya Crazed Zealot
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    :) Yes it sure does seem that way doesn't it.

    And not that it matters at all, I Played UO from the Day it went Live to about 8 months after Trammel went Live, then came back in the spring of this year. That I argued with Designer Dragon, Had Hamburgers at his house, was on the same page with him on most everything but one mortal flaw. A flaw that would eventually cause me to leave UO for EQ. That Hackers, Exploiters, Cheats were able to be controlled to be the Evil that would be the KEY to Activating the UO Community. Rather that the Evil should be players like The Scoundrel Ricco, Winchkin etc. People that could understand that the "Evil" had to be Role Played and tempered with the understanding that there is a Line that can not be crossed. That the UO team be a force of Nature, NOT TO BE SEEN, NOT TO BE HEARD. Rather to BE FELT and that means dealing with, Bugs, Hacks, Cheats, Exploits and Violations of the RoC. That the UO Team SHOULD NOT be this God being PO'd at Tammers and Nerfing the crap out of them and This Other God Loves Tamers and is Makeing them stronger AT THE SAME TIME, well heck EVER.

    BUT

    We each bring things to the table that we feel are, in varying degrees, important to the game. We present our case in the most logical and compelling manner possible.

    Or idea is greeted as

    Totally ignored

    Perverted to No Recognition to the original Idea

    Ridiculed. This Ridicule may be in the form of the Idea itself or more often the person that had the idea.

    The point is, that we all think our thoughts are valid when we post them, otherwise why would be post them? To be cynical, rude, demeaning, trolling etc?

    BUT

    We each should accept that we do NOT have all the pieces to the puzzle of UO.

    While our idea may be the best ever and the Dev's totally agree, the very code base of UO may prevent any action being taken.

    While our idea may be the best ever and the Dev's totally agree, there may not be any monetary/financial gain to offset the expense of construction and implementation.

    While our idea may be the best ever and the Dev's ... agree, the action may alienate the majority of the player base.

    While our idea may be the best ever and the Dev's ... agree, the action may KILL some minority of the player base.

    The point is our Brilliant Idea have far more ways to die than to live.

    If we continue to pay our UO TAX DOLLARS (AKA Subscription Fee) perhaps it would be better to just assume the best when it comes to the Dev Team. That they have more pieces of the puzzle than we do. That they do the best they can to improve the Entertainment Value for as many people as they can. To understand they are Human Beings, complete with Families, Bad Hair Days and Flash's of absolute Brilliance (The Eureka Moment). That given the age of UO, the Code Base etc, that there are far more ways for them to Fail than to Succeed.

    *Shrug*

    Why pay your Tax Dollars if you assume the opposite of the above?
     
  8. Wenchkin

    Wenchkin Babbling Loonie
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    I'm wondering how funny it might be if we all picked that solution. Lots of folks leave production shard Fel and move to Siege. Siege population grows which is great. Production shards then become even emptier. In other words, you can keep suggesting we clear off, but it's akin to cutting your own nose off to spite your face. If Fel players go to Siege for more risk, it'll be harder finding PvP action on a production shard. So, correct me if I'm wrong, but it won't help Fel if we do move to Siege.

    Wenchy
     
  9. Radun

    Radun Guest

    GO TO SIE..ge.. ..oh, uh, ...nevermind
     
  10. EnigmaMaitreya

    EnigmaMaitreya Crazed Zealot
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    *Shrug*

    Actually, that could (may very well) produce a Lose/Lose scenario.

    Traditionally want happens when Cultures Clash/Meet, is the smaller (in this context) of the two tends to be dismantled and assimilated by the larger. This is rarely a smooth or pretty process.

    One could envision this scenario.

    The Felucans, oh say 95% of them go to SP. Let us say the total numbers from all shards puts oh lets say 15 Feluccans to one SP. It is quite likely the numerous Feluccans will impose their Culture, by force, on the SP players. The SP players will feel betrayed, bitter, resentful of the Newbe Feluccans.

    The 5% of the Feluccans that stayed, will feel betrayed and bitter. This will manifest itself against the Feluccans that left and the UO Team. The physical manifestation will be against the Trammel Players. Which now out number the Feluccans so badly, that their voice will simply not be heard. Which of course will escalate the bad feelings of the 5% Feluccans that stayd.

    In my opinion, the only way such a merger could work, is very very slowly. Just a very few people at a time makes the move. It may take a year or more for everyone to get there.
     
  11. TheScoundrelRico

    TheScoundrelRico Stratics Legend
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    No thank you...la
     
  12. Kith Kanan

    Kith Kanan Guest


    dont try to make it sound like all Fel players agree with you , I got 6 houses , 5 of em are within one screen ( more or less ) and within a 10 sec dash of Yew Fel gate , and not many of the players i play with would like insurance removed , do an ingame poll you had to take before being able to log in , and see how many players would like insurence removed , i bet it will be less than 5% ............
     
  13. Nexus

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    That might be true that it's less than 5% but it doesn't make them any more right or wrong than the 95% that agree otherwise. If removal of insurance is decided to be the best way to accomplish things like PvP balance, and cracking down on Uber Templates that run 800+ skill points thanks to gear , and giving the Thief Class a purpose again, then it's the best solution. Ultimately it's up to the Dev Team to decide that not us players.
     
  14. Ailish

    Ailish Lore Master
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    I understand your sentiment that you are tired of it and like it the way it is, but this is NOT true of all people in Fel. I don't wish for insurance/blessed items to be removed (tho I would cope just fine), but I do think Item Decay should be returned and PoF should be removed or restricted (something can only be fortified so much before it is saturated, like BoS).

    Everyone IS entitled to their opinions and suggestions. If you dislike them, state clearly why not and move on.
     
  15. Wenchkin

    Wenchkin Babbling Loonie
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    Did I say anyone agreed with me? Nope. Just stated quite simply that if we all followed the "go to siege" instruction, there would be fewer of us on the prod shards for you guys to play with.

    And I wouldn't expect any Yew gater to support a removal of insurance. A player who fights in and around guardzone is hardly keen on risk, are they? LOL.

    Wenchy
     
  16. Once you can tell me where and how I'll be able to replace the sword that took several months worth of time and nearly 400 runic hammers to make we can talk about it.

    Until that time, PoF and repairs need to stay exactly where they are.
     
  17. Wenchkin

    Wenchkin Babbling Loonie
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    The only player I'll attempt to predict is myself, and even then that's iffy lol. We can't predict how players will react or how many are in each place. I don't think all players hit Siege with the same atttitude and expectations. But I just wouldn't try and drive players from a shard when it's hardly teeming with players. That's all I was saying. That and let's try and fix our problems on production shards rather than sideline players or exclude them. It just doesn't make sense to me to divide Fel players into camps. We all love the same game, let's try and make it better not segregated...

    I honestly think if the pro-risk players are completely ignored, what is currently Fel will be so sanitised that even fewer people will play there. There's a delicate balance between fun and boring, and Fel is much duller than it once was :) But hey, maybe folks like me will just quit outright and not move to Siege. If neither Fel or Siege appeal you're not going to Tram, you'll just quit. Which REALLY isn't good for UO.

    Wenchy
     
  18. Belmarduk

    Belmarduk Guest

    Welcome to carebear - online.
    Why not make it that one can never die and that gold and items only needs to be harvested of trees ?
     
  19. Nexus

    Nexus Site Support
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    So true so true.....
     
  20. Violence

    Violence Lore Keeper
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    What I'm saying is that whatever could be achieved by running polls and posting threads with variations of the same ideas.. has been achieved. Or not.

    I know I can ignore those threads. You could have ignored this one.

    Just understand I'm not saying you should stop "because you will never get it your way". Just because it has become relentless repetition and there seems to be no wide acceptance of your views.

    And for conversation's sake, indeed in the past things where 'accomplished' by players whining and EA giving in.. without a doubt. So I'm afraid it might happen again but that's no more the main reason I created this thread...

    In the end just do as you please. Who knows what might happen.
     
  21. Ailish

    Ailish Lore Master
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    So ... you would rather have a godly sword than an active community and healthy economy? Way to be a team player. I never said repairs should be removed, I said PoF should be removed or restricted. I would be happy with restricted.

    Do you really think I don't have amazing gear that would hurt me to lose? I do. I have items that are very important to my template (such as Legs of Bane and Rune Beetle Carapace, Armor of Fortune and Hat of Magi). You don't NEED that goldy sword that took you several months to get anymore than a Sword of Vanquishing used to be needed.
     
  22. ShadowJack

    ShadowJack Guest

    nice items should be a side bonus, not the main focus of the game, esp in fel
     
  23. Nexus

    Nexus Site Support
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    How quickly do topics get buried on forums? Especially unpopular one's even if the ideas might have some merit? Continuing the debate back and forth not only ensures it maintains a prominent position (first 2 pages) but further fleshes out the discussion so that flaws and benefits of and idea are expressed and if it's considered or interest is taken in it by a member of the Dev Team they have a ready list of concerns and desires to look over and weigh. Allowing topics to continue isn't a negative if it can benefit the game as a whole.
     
  24. Violence

    Violence Lore Keeper
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    True. Topics on what the thread's title says though seem to be flooding the forums these days!! :bored:
    And the reason still is obscure. Most of the times it's someone who doesn't even PvP that suggests changes to Fel. Anyway I think you already know such things. Personally I've said what I wanted to so I'm resting my case.

    As for healthy economies, whether the godly item matters more or how easy people like me want it I have to say this- take a look at other games.. *Cough*WOW*Cough*.. They all look quite healthy and prosperous.. "La". Especially concerning community you can look at Sims Online. Nobody loses anything and they are fine. If it had combat, it would fare finer than UO and I'm not being sarcastic.. ;Pp
     
  25. Gildar

    Gildar Babbling Loonie
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    You want the game to be one way? Voice it, and voice why.
    Don't want the game to be one way? Voice it, and voice why.
    Do so publicly, or through feedback to EA.

    Don't care enough to voice your opinion? Don't. It's likely that plenty of others share your views and will pass the idea along to EA at some point in time.

    EA is not going to pick one side or the other out of majority.
    EA is not going to pick one side or the other out of how vocal that side is.
    EA is going to do what it thinks is best for the game (part of this has to do with how the majority feels, but that isn't all of it... and the Stratics forum population doesn't represent a majority of UO's playerbase in the first place).

    Don't worry if people are vocal about a topic you disagree with. If you feel up to it, voice your disagreements (most importantly - voice why you disagree).

    If you don't feel up to it, just ignore it. Bringing attention to the topics, and attention to the fact that the topics annoy you will not make them go away. If anything, it will add to the discussion of those topics not only in the existing threads, but within the thread you start complaining about that topic... which is just going to make you more irritated most likely. Ignore what's there, and it'll eventually fade away. Eventually, the topic will re-surface, but those discussions too will fade away (before resurfacing again, etc).

    Insurance, no insurance; Item decay, no item decay; Fel, no Fel; Flying mounts, no flying mounts; shard mergers, no shard mergers; guns, no guns; Punk Buster (or equivalent), no Punk Buster (or equivalent)... and everything in between.
    Asking them to go away tends to lengthen the time each of these topics get openly discussed, not reduce.
     
  26. Ailish

    Ailish Lore Master
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    I understand your frustration with they way the threads are being approached/stated. There is one I have ignored for 3 days now.

    As for WOW and Sims ... I don't know and couldnt say. I have never played either. In fact, the only other MMOG I have played was Earth and Beyond. However, I would wager a guess that those games don't have crafting quite of the same sort that UO does, nor property randomization (the real bane of crafters, tbh).

    Having said that ... I have a feeling that our current Dev team is trying to move more away from random properties and arties being so much better than craftables (the concept of Embuing gives me this feeling) and more towards item decay (as shown by more recent artie-style items being non-PoF).
     
  27. RoycroftLS

    RoycroftLS Guest

    I agree with the OP up to a point...

    People are upset that is an imbalance in the game, and are offering solutions that would make things more equal. I'm not against making things more equal across the playerbase, but I think that these solutions are just a bandage for the underlying causes for the imbalances currently present.

    Those underlying causes being the rampant duping/scripting/exploiting in game. People seem to assume that once their change is implemented that cheaters will stop cheating. This certainly isn't the case, and as a result the suggested changes might end up hurting the average player instead of helping them.

    What good is it to introduce item breakage if the cheaters can just dupe another runic armor piece, while the average player might take months to get another item of that quality? And if cheaters have almost perfect (stat-wise) insured sets now, they must have access to a near-unlimited amount of runic kits. That means they certainly have enough runics to constantly provide far-superior equipment to the GM made armor everyone else would be wearing in a no-insurance environment.

    Fix the unchecked fraud occurring in game first, then we can talk about any successive changes that need to be made to the game.