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Jeremy: NPC vendors price bug...?

Discussion in 'UHall' started by Guest, Feb 14, 2008.

  1. Guest

    Guest Guest

    There was no mention in the latest publish notes about changes to NPC vendors, so I wonder if this is an intentional change, or just another bug?

    Usually, after a publish, NPC vendors in the town shops have their prices reset to the same basic prices, but this time they've partially reset: the buy-back prices have been reset, but the selling price (what you have to pay them, to buy an item) is unchanged from before the publish. This is most noticeable at Nix's shop in Doom (Europa)! I would have to pay 41gp to buy an arrow, but he will only pay ME 3gp per!!!

    Now, I DO hope this is a temporary bug that will be fixed soon. I rely a lot on looting corpses, and I can usually recover the cost of a golden skull this way, at the very least.
     
  2. Babble

    Babble Guest

    Might be intended to push npc vendors out of the economy?
     
  3. Kaj

    Kaj Lore Keeper
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    Or maybe to stop some scripters that only sell to NPCs? I'm sure they've tried that as well..
     
  4. MYUO

    MYUO Guest

    Yeah, it seems the npc kept their pre-patch selling prices but reset their buying prices. I AM SO GLAD IT IS NOT THE OTHER WAY AROUND. Otherwise, it will be one of the gold exploits once again!
    This should be fixed though, otherwise the npc prices can only go up.
     
  5. Setnaffa

    Setnaffa Certifiable
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    This does not happen everytime they publish. In fact, it usually does not. I don't know the parameters that require a Vendor reset, but maybe someone from EA/Mythic can enlighten us on that (sounds like a possible FoF).
     
  6. Guest

    Guest Guest

    We have to manually reset them, and we only do that if there's some bug/change to the vendors that needs them to respawn (like the Salvage bag getting added to provisioners - until the provisioners respawned, they didn't sell the bag.)
     
  7. Guest

    Guest Guest

    *waves to Jeremy* - nice to see you here but, as to my original question? IS this a bug?
     
  8. Lemondrops

    Lemondrops Guest

    Yea there is no way I'm selling arrows at 3 gold each. When the buy price is like 22+ gold on Great Lakes.

    Think I'll buy up a ton of arrows and bolts to like.. 50+ gold then put em on my vendor for 49 =P

    *Smells getting rich quick here lol* "So you want an arrow huh? Well.. how much ya have in your coin purse to pay for said arrow?" =P

    (Ps and those that can't do the math.. at first it looks like I am losing money at that price.. but that's only for the first couple of thousand. After that... it's profit. My price stays steady but my cost goes down for every 1000 arrows or so =D So the heavier the demand.. the more profit =D)

    I think I'm loving this change lol. Please say it's not a bug lol. *Poised and ready to go on a major shopping spree if this aint a bug =D*
     
  9. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Jeremy:

    The NPC Jewelers are reset and are selling gems at the reset prices (200 for diamonds, 100 for saphire etc.)

    Howevere the Tinkers and Blacksmiths are selling ingots for the "up" brice (Example 22gp each) but BUYING for 3gp.
    This is not a vendor reset, this is the first time this has ever happened.

    NPC provisioners are selling arrows and bolts the same way, selling at the bought up price, but buying for 3gp and 5gp respectivly.

    Your answer, while appreciated, did not address the question, or this issue.

    Thanks
     
  10. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Arf!
    If this is intentional, me no like [​IMG]
    My archer relies on peeps taking arrows/bolts/bandies to gauntlet and selling them to Nix, means price goes down and I'm not spending most of my time scrabbling around for gold to buy them.

    Whose gonna sell them for 3gp/5gp?
    With it like this the price Nix sells for is just gonna go up and up

    I guess I'll be playing my bard in gauntlet [​IMG]
     
  11. I tried selling ingots to an NPC and the price was stuck at 3gp too. =/
     
  12. Guest

    Guest Guest

    My Opinion: This is too specific in details to be a bug.

    Normal vendor resets require the vendors to be deleted, and new ones are placed. The vendor reset caused both buy and sell prices to be reset.

    However in this case we have the original vendors still in place, not deleted as in a normal vendor reset publish.

    More importantly, the NPC Jewelers were reset completely…BUT NOT deleted. Had this not been the case I could have made several million just buying the sold down price of 188gp for Diamonds from the same NPC, and resold them to the same NPC for 200.
    Normally I have to buy them from the NPC at 189, and take them to another NPC that is buying them for 200.
    Obviously someone on the Dev team was aware of this and made sure this was stopped.

    The reset on the NPC Tinker, Tailor, Bowyer, Weaver, Smith and Provisioner caused the purchasing of the same item from a NPC at a lower price and resale to the one purchasing from a higher price to be stopped.
    If this was just a bug, the NPC Jeweler would have been reset the same way…..this is a very specific and controlled change.

    Now, having made about 400,000 million GP in the last two years buying and selling to NPC’s, I can understand why the Dev’s would want to shut this gold flow down. It was a lot of gold coming into the economy.

    This will not stop me from making money; however the flow of money will now be from the players to the NPC’s…gold out of the economy. I will be making just as much in all likelihood, just not gold created from thin air on NPC transactions.

    I know a lot of folks are going to be pissed, and I can understand why.

    I also understand why, if this was done on purpose, the Dev’s did the change, and also why the change was not announced. If this was know in advance, I would have made around 10-20 million leveling the NPC’s in the week prior to the publish trading on margins narrower then I normally trade in. (My normal range is 10gp for the transaction per item; I go much lower when I know the vendors will be reset, or when I want to drive a competitor out)

    So, while I know this will not be the popular opinion, my hats off for closing another major gold flow. I will adjust and change my game play, and hope that this helps bring the economy in line.

    Now that the change is out, Dev’s, could you please confirm if this was intentional or a bug?

    Thanks
     
  13. Lemondrops

    Lemondrops Guest

    <blockquote><hr>


    My Opinion: This is too specific in details to be a bug.

    Normal vendor resets require the vendors to be deleted, and new ones are placed. The vendor reset caused both buy and sell prices to be reset.

    However in this case we have the original vendors still in place, not deleted as in a normal vendor reset publish.

    More importantly, the NPC Jewelers were reset completely…BUT NOT deleted. Had this not been the case I could have made several million just buying the sold down price of 188gp for Diamonds from the same NPC, and resold them to the same NPC for 200.
    Normally I have to buy them from the NPC at 189, and take them to another NPC that is buying them for 200.
    Obviously someone on the Dev team was aware of this and made sure this was stopped.

    The reset on the NPC Tinker, Tailor, Bowyer, Weaver, Smith and Provisioner caused the purchasing of the same item from a NPC at a lower price and resale to the one purchasing from a higher price to be stopped.
    If this was just a bug, the NPC Jeweler would have been reset the same way…..this is a very specific and controlled change.

    Now, having made about 400,000 million GP in the last two years buying and selling to NPC’s, I can understand why the Dev’s would want to shut this gold flow down. It was a lot of gold coming into the economy.

    This will not stop me from making money; however the flow of money will now be from the players to the NPC’s…gold out of the economy. I will be making just as much in all likelihood, just not gold created from thin air on NPC transactions.

    I know a lot of folks are going to be pissed, and I can understand why.

    I also understand why, if this was done on purpose, the Dev’s did the change, and also why the change was not announced. If this was know in advance, I would have made around 10-20 million leveling the NPC’s in the week prior to the publish trading on margins narrower then I normally trade in. (My normal range is 10gp for the transaction per item; I go much lower when I know the vendors will be reset, or when I want to drive a competitor out)

    So, while I know this will not be the popular opinion, my hats off for closing another major gold flow. I will adjust and change my game play, and hope that this helps bring the economy in line.

    Now that the change is out, Dev’s, could you please confirm if this was intentional or a bug?

    Thanks

    [/ QUOTE ]

    The original system was designed to do exactly what you described above.

    They even made a point about it.. "Players will buy from one.. and shop around for a better price to sell to another"

    Best time to do this was when vendors reset.

    Everyone goes on a mad dash to dump whatever stock they may be holding.. and.. nickle and dime the vendors in al the various locations.

    After a few weeks/months the prices stablize and then you have 'loosely' what the items are worth.

    You describing what you made equals roughly to 4 million gold a week.

    That's not alot =/

    And I'm certain you know what I'm talkin about with the nickle and diming vendors on this. Sure in that case you mentioned you could buy for 187 and sell for 200... Once... and then only 1000 units.

    After that.. you can buy for 188 and sell to the other vendor for 199... and so on. There is a diminishing return on this.

    For the above example you gave with teh price difference of 187-200 gold. You would make between those two vendors about 90,000 gold max. Then you have to either A: Wait for enough people to sell their diamonds and such or B: wait for a vendor reset with stock on hand you were holding for a rainy day. Most folks don't do this. Cause this can take months.

    At first when the system came in.. I was all over it. but the time you spent recalling around checking prices and such for ever diminishing returns made it not worthwile to me anymore. Though if I need a quick 1000 gold here and there I might take teh time to check bottle prices.

    I think what this change does now that I've looked at it a bit is hit the Lumber jack/Miner scripters. Woods for 22 gold.. there's no way on earth I would bust out my lumber jack to sell a piece of wood for 3 gold to that same vendor. And similar prices with mining.

    Though I have doubts if this is the case. If scripters were a problem.. then you would see a VERY low price on iron ingots and wood.

    *Shrug*

    The change to the jewelers is puzzling now that I went and checked them. Hell haven't seen diamonds selling for 200 in ages =D But when you buy one diamond an sell it back on Cats here in luna.. it sells for 188. Under the (supposedly) correct system.. it should sell back for 199 gold instead. (One gold up. one gold down).

    That means that the old system is either 'broken" or this is a new change to the game.

    Currently the prices really can only go up on items now. They will never come down from what I'm ... seeing? I mean who in their right mind is going sell an arrow to a vendor for 3 gold when the vendor sells them for 22+? Same with ingots. Why sell them to a vendor for 3 gold (or whatever it is) .. when I can put them up on my own house vendor for 25+ gold after a day of mining?

    Further thought I think this plays more into scripters hands with that previous example.. anyway.. rambling now.

    I'm curious myself now if this is bug or design =D
     
  14. Guest

    Guest Guest

    <blockquote><hr>


    My Opinion: This is too specific in details to be a bug.

    Normal vendor resets require the vendors to be deleted, and new ones are placed. The vendor reset caused both buy and sell prices to be reset.

    However in this case we have the original vendors still in place, not deleted as in a normal vendor reset publish.

    More importantly, the NPC Jewelers were reset completely…BUT NOT deleted. Had this not been the case I could have made several million just buying the sold down price of 188gp for Diamonds from the same NPC, and resold them to the same NPC for 200.
    Normally I have to buy them from the NPC at 189, and take them to another NPC that is buying them for 200.
    Obviously someone on the Dev team was aware of this and made sure this was stopped.

    The reset on the NPC Tinker, Tailor, Bowyer, Weaver, Smith and Provisioner caused the purchasing of the same item from a NPC at a lower price and resale to the one purchasing from a higher price to be stopped.
    If this was just a bug, the NPC Jeweler would have been reset the same way…..this is a very specific and controlled change.

    Now, having made about 400,000 million GP in the last two years buying and selling to NPC’s, I can understand why the Dev’s would want to shut this gold flow down. It was a lot of gold coming into the economy.

    This will not stop me from making money; however the flow of money will now be from the players to the NPC’s…gold out of the economy. I will be making just as much in all likelihood, just not gold created from thin air on NPC transactions.

    I know a lot of folks are going to be pissed, and I can understand why.

    I also understand why, if this was done on purpose, the Dev’s did the change, and also why the change was not announced. If this was know in advance, I would have made around 10-20 million leveling the NPC’s in the week prior to the publish trading on margins narrower then I normally trade in. (My normal range is 10gp for the transaction per item; I go much lower when I know the vendors will be reset, or when I want to drive a competitor out)

    So, while I know this will not be the popular opinion, my hats off for closing another major gold flow. I will adjust and change my game play, and hope that this helps bring the economy in line.

    Now that the change is out, Dev’s, could you please confirm if this was intentional or a bug?

    Thanks

    [/ QUOTE ]Hi! This is an intentional change designed to fix the specific issues with NPC vendors you've so eloquently summarized above.

    Fundamentally, UO is an open faucet economy. Resources and wealth are created without regard, mostly, to existing conditions. This doesn't mean that gold should be allowed to infinitely flood the economy. There are many checks and balances put in place to try to control this flow.

    However, this was an exploit, and thus we gave no warning. It may have been long standing, but the damage (not only economic) done is bad enough, let alone if it had continued.

    We recognize that many will be surprised by the shift in gameplay, which will make selling items back to NPCs less profitable. This will mostly impact those who try to buy low and sell high elsewhere. The design team will keep this in mind when designing future mechanics that involve merchants, but we're closing the gap now.

    As always, please report known exploits through Community, rather than have to risk some future visit by a GM.
     
  15. yes i think this change is tied to the recent scripters house burning. people in the past where using a unattended script to buy and sell from vendors for profit then sinking the gold into player vendors. im not sure if it was those secifc houses that were burned but i think the devs are trying to make it impossible to make money soley on npc vendors.
     
  16. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Incidentally, yes, I was dodging the question - Oceania hadn't been updated yet, and we try very hard not to tip off the scripters we are trying to squash.
     
  17. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Hi, Draconi, thanks for the explanation. However, it means that I, for one, will no longer bother with the Gauntlet. As I said, I have been relying on collecting loot from corpses there, to at least cover the cost of the trip. The slim chance of getting an arti means many days (for me) play there, so it really isn't worth my while. I speak as a "normal" player, who doesn't script. It's sad that all these supposedly anti-scripter changes recently have had the effect (for me) of reducing my gameplay options one by one. I'm not sure how many more nerfs I can take, until I have to finally just flush 7 years'-worth of fun down the drain.
    *sigh*
     
  18. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Oh yes, Draconi, I nearly forgot to mention this: I LOVE the house-burning treatment for known cheats! YAY you!
    &lt;3
     
  19. Guest

    Guest Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    Hi, Draconi, thanks for the explanation. However, it means that I, for one, will no longer bother with the Gauntlet. As I said, I have been relying on collecting loot from corpses there, to at least cover the cost of the trip. The slim chance of getting an arti means many days (for me) play there, so it really isn't worth my while. I speak as a "normal" player, who doesn't script. It's sad that all these supposedly anti-scripter changes recently have had the effect (for me) of reducing my gameplay options one by one. I'm not sure how many more nerfs I can take, until I have to finally just flush 7 years'-worth of fun down the drain.
    *sigh*

    [/ QUOTE ]

    slim chance of getting an artie? did you sleep through the publish that made people scream that arties are too easy to get now?
     
  20. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Haven't had an arti for over a week. I DO do other stuff in UO, I'm not totally 24/7 gauntletting.
     
  21. Cogniac

    Cogniac Grand Inquisitor
    Stratics Veteran

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    So, if I understand this correctly, this means that the amount for which you can sell an item to an NPC will always stay at the default price, but the price for which you can buy an item from an NPC will continue to go up, just as before?

    If this is the case, then no one will ever bother selling to NPCs to bring prices down, so the prices of items on NPCs will eventually reach a level that no one will ever again buy from them. Thus, NPCs might as well be removed entirely from the game. They will serve no purpose, as the ability to hold a conversation with them was removed long ago with localization, and now they will serve no economical purpose, either in terms of selling to or buying from.
     
  22. Guest

    Guest Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    So, if I understand this correctly, this means that the amount for which you can sell an item to an NPC will always stay at the default price, but the price for which you can buy an item from an NPC will continue to go up, just as before?

    If this is the case, then no one will ever bother selling to NPCs to bring prices down, so the prices of items on NPCs will eventually reach a level that no one will ever again buy from them. Thus, NPCs might as well be removed entirely from the game. They will serve no purpose, as the ability to hold a conversation with them was removed long ago with localization, and now they will serve no economical purpose, either in terms of selling to or buying from.

    [/ QUOTE ]
    Yep. looks that way [​IMG]
    I would also suggest that it seems pointless for higher-level monsters to drop gold at all, given that nobody loots it anymore because you can't keep popping to the bank every 5 minutes!
    What HAS this game become?
     
  23. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Actually, what the change specifically is is that the buy price won't go above a certain point, and the sell price won't go below it. It closes a particularly nasty loophole that was causing quite a few problems. The sell price can still drop, and drop all the way to where it's the same as the buy price - just not any further.
     
  24. Babble

    Babble Guest

    Not so bad that vendors get taken out of the economic system.
    You still need it for tools and such.
     
  25. Guest

    Guest Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    So, if I understand this correctly, this means that the amount for which you can sell an item to an NPC will always stay at the default price, but the price for which you can buy an item from an NPC will continue to go up, just as before?

    If this is the case, then no one will ever bother selling to NPCs to bring prices down, so the prices of items on NPCs will eventually reach a level that no one will ever again buy from them. Thus, NPCs might as well be removed entirely from the game. They will serve no purpose, as the ability to hold a conversation with them was removed long ago with localization, and now they will serve no economical purpose, either in terms of selling to or buying from.

    [/ QUOTE ]Nothing will be locked in place, but, indeed, their buyback point will never go above their base selling price.

    So your point is taken, but it's dramatic: NPC vendors also exist to sell items to players - there's still plenty of demand for things. Also, gathering items through normal gameplay and selling back to vendors won't be as profitable as it used to be, but it's still profitable. You will not be able to manipulate an individual NPC any longer. Finally, price controls should prevent problems where it'd be unreasonable to buy from NPCs; I guess they got more greedy, but they're not daft.

    Oh, and the Doom vendor and healer will be evaluated for the next publish to accommodate this change.
     
  26. Guest

    Guest Guest

    It seems that the devs are trying to make it as difficult as possible to get gold. While I have no problem with this what I do have a problem with is that the prices on player vendors are not dropping to match the difficulty of gold and resource gathering.
    Example, a crim on Cats is 20,500,000 gp and some items much higher than that. I have been playing for almost 4 years and have never even come close to acquiring that amount of gold. I cannot imagine how long it would take to come up with that kind of gold for a casual player.
     
  27. Guest

    Guest Guest

    If players don't drop their vendor prices to what the market will bear, they won't sell anything. Market forces, not us, control that system.
     
  28. Guest

    Guest Guest

    I guess we will have to wait for the player vendors to run out of gold. [​IMG]
    I would have thought that would have been done by now as several player vendors are selling items that total over 200 mil, you would think the vendor fees would would break them quickly.
     
  29. Lemondrops

    Lemondrops Guest

    I'm going on a hella buying spree I think =P

    Well I would if I didnt' smell a possible change to this.

    But I'm thinkin seriously hard about dusting off my old vendor books and going on a buying spree for bolts and arrows and jacking them up to an insane price =P

    I dont' have to worry about someone else coming in and dropping a buttload of the same items on the vendors cause.. hehe 3 gold for an arrow to drop the price from.. say 100?

    I got one vendor up to 49 gold per arrow now. Just have to start dropping runes on where to buy "Cheap" arrows =P (Ie my vendor house that's been empty for ages =D)

    I'm thinking 85 gold should be a fair price if it can go to 100 =D
     
  30. Lemondrops

    Lemondrops Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    .... The sell price can still drop, and drop all the way to where it's the same as the buy price - just not any further. ....

    [/ QUOTE ]


    That's not true. (or at least from what I'm seeing here)

    I just checked it out with bottles in Ish. at one of the gypsy camps. Sell price to the vendor dropped to 1 gold. The buy price from the vendor stayed at 5 gold.

    (I'm assuming to understand this ... if I continue to sell an unlimited number of bottles to a vendor.. the buy and sell price should both be 1.. or 5. (or other random number))
     
  31. Guest

    Guest Guest

    We're using opposite terms, I think (how confusing!) The vendor won't pay more than a specific amount for an item, nor will he offer it for less than that amount.
     
  32. While I understand what you are saying, I can't help but wonder when I see bandie prices on the Luna healer, on a lesser populated shard at 12 gp each. We haven't even hit prime playing time here.
     
  33. Lemondrops

    Lemondrops Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    We're using opposite terms, I think (how confusing!) The vendor won't pay more than a specific amount for an item, nor will he offer it for less than that amount.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Gotcha =D Yea I see that =D

    And.. probably shooting myself in the foot here.. but.. what about the gypsy spawn camps?

    Will they now be static or.. will they continue to spawn and respawn with new vendors every few hours?
     
  34. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Draconi:

    Thanks for confirming the change.

    This is probably going to be a terrific change for UO in terms of controlling the economy, especially when combined with the crackdown on scripting resource gathering.

    Thanks
     
  35. Jhym

    Jhym Guest

    I'm kinda confused about this.

    I guess maybe I don't do it like others, but I would see something at a high price in one city, and either grab some of my own materials or go pick up a few thousand in another city to make a quick profit.

    If I'm understanding the change, there's no reason for me to even look at prices any more for this differential, as I'll never even make my expenses back since the npc-buy price will never go up.

    Also, this is screwing us crafter/gatherer types in order to stop some sort of exploit. My bowyer/carpenter/lumberjack could make quite a bit of money selling arrows and bolts in most of the towns, now it will be much less.

    I suppose I'm saying if you all don't want us doing commodity trading, then put back the old system of 20 initial spawn and take out the selling/buying 500 at a time and we will have no reason to bother selling things to the npcs.
     
  36. Guest

    Guest Guest

    The price at which the vendor will buy something can vary - it's just capped.
     
  37. Jhym

    Jhym Guest

    Is it capped as a percentage of the value of the item, as a straight gold/item amount, or is it some obscure value using the phases of the moons?

    The reason I ask is there are some large ticket things that would give us a wider range of gold returns if it's a percentage.

    of course making it fully random or some formula would mean we'd have to shop around to all vendors to find good selling prices all the time.
     
  38. utilitron

    utilitron Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    If players don't drop their vendor prices to what the market will bear, they won't sell anything. Market forces, not us, control that system.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    That just the problem I am seeing!

    Unless you initiate a self-stabalizing mechanism in the buy/sell prices, players will be able to manipulate the new system to skyrocket prices of commodities...

    by buying up the commodities at NPC vendors to increase the price, and allowing a higher player-market value... With the former system, atleast the prices to sell were insentive enough to make a profit, and lower overall prices... if that sell proce flatlines, then there will be no reason to sell to NPCs, and no reasonable way to lower the prices... they will just inflate and inflate...

    Yes, people have exploited the margin between prices at vendors, but legitimate players also profited from the inflated buy prices... but those actions are what stablized price table between resets... if that "check/balance" is taken away, it needs to be replaced with a new one.
     
  39. Guest

    Guest Guest

    We can certainly keep an eye on it over the next couple of weeks. Fixing the exploit (and there was an actual nasty exploit in there too) was the priority, but if the fix has unpleasant consequences I trust y'all will tell us all about them [​IMG]
     
  40. randommatter

    randommatter Guest

    Jeremy,

    I would like to ask a few questions regarding our Shard Lake Superior. Do we have an Event Moderator? (Like a real, "Works for EA" person that does events?) I've done my share of pancakes and moaning in the Spiels and Rants section about various things... I'd like to discuss at some point... options about having players get together with an Event Mod (if there is such a person) and trying to put together some worth while events on various shards. If there is no such person, then EA needs to start hiring a few. If there is no budget, then ask the community to volunteer and screen applicants. I am sure a gaggle of people that play wouldn't mind doing it.

    Basically what I'm saying is, this game is starting to suck, not because of everything you have been doing, but because we have no active events going on (I'm not talking about huge long boring blackrock/demon invasion events either, I'm talking about short, sweet once or twice a week events/contests/what-have-you where the participants actually get something cool (doesn't have to be uber a sash or whatever) (prefereably useful).

    Please run this up the flag pole and get back with me and the rest of us. If you folks want what is left of the active community to stay, and if you want to woo (is that how you spell woo? Or is it... whooo? I'm going to go ahead with woo, but I'm ear marking it as possibly whooo &lt;grin&gt;) now where was I? Oh right "Woo" if you want to "Woo" people that have left or are inactive back to play (which you need to do because like I said it's beginning to suck because no one is on doing anything anymore) then we really need to look into some player/staff interaction on this type of level.

    Honestly, I know you guys had a great little venting session on the scripters and burning the houses, and putting it out there for everyone to see "Ooh look at what happens to scripters" but honestly it doesn't really effect most of us (who don't script) and we could kind of careless. We want to do things, I don't sit around and wonder about the economy, or the price of mandrake in fel trinsic and whether I can sell it for 2 gold more in moonglow tram. I sit around and wonder why it takes me a year to legend taming (thinking this is ********) and I sit around wondering why EA wont' let me dye my clothes or armor whatever color I want (********) and I sit around wondering why I can't ride a dragon (no not a swamp moose a dragon, again ********). But most of all I sit around thinking... wow I have nothing to do... why do I play this game again?

    Then I think... Oh yeah... I played for 10 years now (on and off) and so I have so much of my life tied up in the game I'm pathetic and don't want to piss it away by leaving. It would be better... if I could sit around and say "I can't leave this game it's LEET look what I can do!! WHOOT!! and Look on what's this? An event? A tourny? A COMPETITION!!! OH MY I'm gonna pwn some nubs!! WHOOT!!!"..

    Right now I can't say those things... It'd be cool if we had a little staff/player interaction on a shard by shard basis. I think the best way to do this is to get the guild leaders of the 10 biggest guilds on each shard together and have them assign someone to speak for them (or for them to speak for themselves) and have those people be a little council to the Event Moderator for that shard. Get those guilds participating (have a few tram events, have a few pvp related events/and competitions) do it weekly...

    This way you could guarantee some great fights for the pvp'rs weekly (with leet / neet / trophy type stuff for the winners ) and a good time for the folks of tram doing similar things.

    My two cents.
     
  41. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Randommatter, have you been to a High Council meeting lately? A Community Hunt? Last time I checked, Lake Superior had a pretty active community with a lot of things to do - even without our help.

    That's not to say we won't have other things going on - the schedule for the Scavenger Hunt should go up tomorrow - but it's enough for one threadjacking :p
     
  42. GarthGrey

    GarthGrey Crazed Zealot
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    The more players we get rid of that need "to recover the cost of anything", the better this game will be..
     
  43. GarthGrey

    GarthGrey Crazed Zealot
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    The Doom vendor should have been adjusted to simply offer a place for players to buy resources that they would normally leave and come back with. It was never meant to be a place for someone to make a fortune selling back the very items that players were buying. Someone can try to justify that what they were doing was causing the vendors price to drop so others could continue to buy while fighting, but that's a cop out BS excuse. It was greed by others. Set the stupid vendor up to sell arrows and bolts for 5 gold each, and set it to never ever change...case closed. But you won't. Instead you'll interfere with true crafters that actually gather resources, create an item, and then sell that item to Vendors for a profit. At least those of us not fortunate enough to have a freaking Luna vendor.....grrrrrrrrrrr
     
  44. Basara

    Basara UO Forum Moderator
    Moderator Professional Wiki Moderator Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend Campaign Supporter

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    Question, Garth?

    How is it greed for an PLAYER (with three accounts) that has never had as much as 20 Million gold on all 18 characters COMBINED, to be "greedy" in seeing an opportunity to make some gold while helping others out?

    Hell, the last time I did a Doom supply run, I DIDN'T HAVE ENOUGH GOLD FOR INSURANCE for any of my characters! I had literally spent myself broke on insurance in magincia, after the BoS nerf. That was THE SOLE REASON I even did it. Once I had a few checks from Nix in my bank, then I could venture out, and hope the insurance bug didn't hit because all my money was in check form. I still lost about 200k of that money before I left, and guess what - no arty to show for it.

    The only BS is coming from you - probably because you're sitting on tens of millions in your accounts and never thought of something as simple as selling to a vendor to make money. Whereas, I have to loot even the SCROLLS from my T-maps and sell them to keep in the black.

    And, saying that ammo in Doom be a fixed 5 GP, that sounds like greed on your part, not mine, in the lust for a lot of cheap arties and limitless ammo.

    While I sold some ammo (enough to knock the prices back to the HIGH 40s, and I got the arrows from rat archers &amp; changelings, the bolts from changelings) the Item I sold the most of was BANDAGES - made from the reward cloth I save, that everyone else tosses to the ground or back to the NPC in disgust.
     
  45. dude how much are you makeing on that vendor? do you have a tamer? if you cant make 100k an hour or more on a tamer then you need to look around a little.
    i mill + ten hour or les farming. did the vendor give you more than that?
     
  46. Guest

    Guest Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    Now, having made about 400,000 million GP in the last two years buying and selling to NPC’s...

    [/ QUOTE ]

    400,000 million, that would be:

    <font color=red>400,000,000,000</font color=red> or 400 billion gold by one person in two years.

    Is that right?
     
  47. Guest

    Guest Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    I guess we will have to wait for the player vendors to run out of gold. [​IMG]
    I would have thought that would have been done by now as several player vendors are selling items that total over 200 mil, you would think the vendor fees would would break them quickly.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    No, all the players do is remove the items before the fee is taken. It's taken at the same time, and you can tell what time it's going to happen. Just before the timer expires, you remove your stuff from the vendor. You pay the min, then replace the items.
     
  48. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Funny...your right, that was supposed to be 400 Million [​IMG] , or about 3.9 Million a week. Not that huge of a number.

    [​IMG]

    Now if I make that mistake on my IRS forms.......
     
  49. Theo_GL

    Theo_GL Grand Poobah
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    I give up. I really don't know what you folks are smoking.
     
  50. MYUO

    MYUO Guest

    Draconi,
    To rid of confusion, could you explain how the new rule works in the following example?
    NPC bowyer selling arrow at 15gp per and buying arrows at 3 gp per.
    When players buy the arrows, NPC's selling price will go up - (15, 16, 17 gp per...?) How about his buying price?
    When players sell the arrows, NPC's buying price will go down - (3, 2, 1 gp per...?) How about his selling price?

    What are the price caps for the buying and selling prices. Are they exactly the same, as suggested by Jeremy?