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Let's show UO we're Serious about UO cheating issues

Discussion in 'UHall' started by Guest, Jan 27, 2008.

  1. Guest

    Guest Guest

    "Cheating issues," meaning anything that breaks our UO Terms of Service and/or Rules of Conduct; anything that is unfair; anything that ultimately hurts UO & its participants.

    From Siege Perilous Forum

    Jeremy:<blockquote><hr>

    Don't protest, guys, send in feedback. ...

    [/ QUOTE ]- Please help us all by making this Cheater Awareness Week / Month by filling out the feedback form &amp; posting here to remind fellow concerned Stratics' posters to do the same.

    Potential things to put in the feedback comments:

    I dislike cheating as much as any UO issue.
    Please make cheating issues a top priority.
    Please implement a proactive GM service to thwart some cheater's efforts.
    Please sternly remove cheaters from the game; and ban them again when they return (it could be an income generator if you do it efficiently enough).
    Please enforce your rules better or change them in order to give everyone a fair chance.


    Feel free to copy / paste to help make UO a better place for all.
    As well, please help by offering better suggestions for potential comments.

    Let's show UO how much we truly detest the rule-breaking in UO.
    Let's do our best to attempt to persuade UO to improve its image.
     
  2. wanderer1origin

    wanderer1origin Lore Master
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

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    wouldnt it be better if uo gave us how they felt about cheaters dupers earlier post about one would be a good start!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
     
  3. Guest

    Guest Guest

    I will look it up in a moment but I remember someone (I think Jeremy actually) has already said the official UO EAMythic stance on cheaters is that:
    'we despise cheating / cheaters.'

    Besides, if we want them to be more active against it then maybe we should pay it forward and actively give them feedback ourselves.
    [​IMG]

    x:
    ---
    Well, about the best I could find was this post from Jeremy:<blockquote><hr>

    ... Live events, banning cheaters, fixing bugs, adding content, etc - not to mention KR, which is rather a large project - these are all things we're devoted to doing. ...

    [/ QUOTE ]
     
  4. The term "cheating issues" and "cheaters" is very ambiguous on your part. Define the terms you're using and the issues you perceive to exist in more detail.
     
  5. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Hope the paragraph added up top helps define things a bit better.
    Thx eh.
     
  6. Pushing for enforcement of all issues that violate the rules in some way is pretty much an assured way to kill the game in around a week or two.
    <blockquote><hr>

    ...or change them in order to give everyone a fair chance.

    [/ QUOTE ]
    That's maybe what you should be asking more for, in some cases, or a change to the underlying structures and causes which turn people to "cheating" in the first place.

    Dealing with cheating, I'm afraid, isn't as simple as rounding everyone up and banning them as far as UO is concerned anyway.
     
  7. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Why would it be more complex than enforcing the rules we agreed to adhere to?
    Sure some things would have a higher priority than others &amp; I would hope that would be so. But I'm not understanding how it would be such a complex undertaking to take a bigger bite out of some of the major cheating issues that are increasingly crippling UO (&amp; its income). They can ban any of us at any time and we agreed to that. They could gather proof of some of the bigger cheating issues without too much difficulty.
    What makes it complex?

    By banning the more lucrative cheaters that have generated a lot of gold / items, wouldn't we be having a significant 'gold drain', if nothing else (as long as they delete all items before dropping the cheat house)?

    Besides I'm a firm believer that more people have left UO due to cheating than there are people currently cheating in UO. We surely won't get all, probably not many of them, back; but we could see UO's image improve and perhaps see more new players interested in experiencing UO once the cheaters are dealt with significantly better.

    I felt that 'making cheating issues a top priority' was a good blanket statement that included changing any underlying structures which compels people to cheat. But I should probably add that as well.
     
  8. <blockquote><hr>

    The term "cheating issues" and "cheaters" is very ambiguous on your part. Define the terms you're using and the issues you perceive to exist in more detail.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    15Nov '06 (unsigned)
    After a month-long investigation and a thorough review of all involved, we:

    • banned more than 400 accounts,
    • deleted more than 100,000 illegally duplicated items, and
    • deleted more than one trillion in gold.

    More importantly, the bugs that allowed this particular kind of illegal duplication have been fixed. Also, duping and exploit prevention/detection systems have been in place for some time now - systems that help us to identify and eliminate cheaters.

    We take all forms of cheating extremely seriously, especially cheats that affect the in game economy and devalue the hard work of honest players. We will never stop investigating and solving these issues, and appreciate very much those of you who contribute to the fight against cheating. <font color=red>We’ve had to keep these developments quiet until we completed our investigations, but we are very proud to be able to make this announcement today.</font color=red>
    _______________________

    Archive
    Wilki_EA
    UO Legend
    We owe the UO team some credit and apologies...
    #3387015 - 11/09/06
    You are 100% right. You have no idea how hard it was to see the "The devs don't care!" posts regarding duping and not say anything at all that entire time.

    But in the future (and please feel free to refer back to this post anytime you want)...

    If we're planning on banning dupers or other types of exploiters, no matter how many people complain about how we're ignoring their questions in the FoF each week, no matter how many angry emails you send about how we suck, <font color=red>we're NOT going to talk about it ahead of time!</font color=red>

    If we would've said one single thing about this, all of the time we spent on this would've went down the drain, and there wouldn't have been a nice announcement today, because the bad guys would've scattered like roaches when the lights come on.

    No, it's far better to smash roaches in the dark.

    Then you can turn on the lights. :)

    Wilki_EA
    UO Legend

    Re: Bannings - Guilty or Innocent
    #3411971
    No one was banned for buying duped artifacts, unless they did so in mass quantities. We're ultimately responsible for the bug that allowed the dupe to occur in the first place, so it'd be pretty unfair to ban players who unwittingly bought a few artis or other high end items for personal use, etc.

    However, item sellers who bought a LOT of duped items (as in you go to their house/backpack and see a bag with a 3 dozen covetous statues, 20 hats of the magi, 15 ornies, and some "unique" event items thrown into the mix) were given no quarter. While the dupers may have exploited this bug, it was the item sellers who truly did the damage to the game. Any one of them that tries to tell you, "But I only bought items from a supplier, I didn't realize where they came from," needs to be smacked upside the head, and then tarred and feathered.

    UO is a GAME, not a freakin' business, and while we don't ban players for selling things for cash, we're not going to look very kindly on those who harm the game in doing so. And honestly, are any of these "trustworthy" brokers and item sellers with "years of UO experience" really going to tell us with a straight face that they didn't know those bags of 125 character transfer tokens and the bags full of extremely rare event items (i.e. bags with more of them than should even exist in all of UO) were duped?

    Equine Puckey!

    If those people bother to email me, they might as well call just call 976-WHAH, because that's pretty much going to be my reaction when I read their "so sad" emails.

    To this date, I've unbanned ONE player, who had ONE account banned (out of 3), where a genuine mistake was made. I've been going through the players who have emailed me so far, one by one, to see if we made a mistake somewhere else. Tonight, I got an email from a "lady" who claimed she had never exploited, and was just a nice mother of 2 who loved UO. Pfft. How about that bag of 30 each valorite hammers, barbed kits and heartwood dovetail saws we found in her house? Or the fact that the account she was trying to keep hidden from us had a bag with 124 hat of the magis in it, along with lots of other artifacts?

    To those people: DON'T BOTHER EMAILING ME! I wasn't born yesterday, I don't fall for the lame emo emails, and we're simply not going to release your account with 100's of duped items on it because you spun a really unconvincing story about how you just bought your account from your little brother/roommate/ex-girlfriend and didn't know your house was already being used to store those 500 artifacts. And yes, we DO know about your other "hidden" accounts. And no, changing your IP, using an internet cafe or using different payment methods won't help you either. We WILL find you, so you might as well just stop wasting your time and go find another game to exploit. Or, I have a better idea - how about if you go find something productive to do with your lives? That's the best idea of them all.

    And honorable players - please, STOP BUYING from the item sellers who were "out of stock" last week. These parasites wouldn't be perpetuating this fraud if no one bought their stuff in the first place.

    If any of this sounds harsh, well, I suppose it is. I love this game, and I really don't like people who try to do it harm.


    _________________________

    They KNOW what cheating means ... feel free to give specific examples IN YOUR FEED BACK AS SUGGESTED ...

    [​IMG]

    clear?
     
  9. <blockquote><hr>

    By banning the more lucrative cheaters that have generated a lot of gold / items, wouldn't we be having a significant 'gold drain', if nothing else (as long as they delete all items before dropping the cheat house)?

    [/ QUOTE ]
    See, now you're being a little more specific. This is a good thing.

    I agree that people exploiting the game mechanics and performing acts such as duping deserve to be removed from the game. I don't think anyone could form a case against that.

    However, let's now take a look at.... say using scripts to train a skill. I'm guessing this "heinous" act would also formulate part of your areas to target? See, there's an underlying issue here of there being draconian training methods in UO which make it incredibly inconvenient to train skills in a legitimate fashion. This is especially true if you've been playing the game for a number of years and don't feel like clicking that crafting gump or poison potion 100,000 times. A certain level of automation is a good thing. The problem right now is that the sheer flexibility of the 3rd party automation tools in use is being exploited.

    It is hard to draw the line. I personally am not against attended macroing, whether it be training, gathering resources or otherwise. When people start running these utilities 24/7 though is when I think the issue becomes sketchy. A method needs to be devised to encourage macroing with an underlying system to ensure it isn't being exploited. That's my view.
     
  10. HD2300

    HD2300 Certifiable
    Stratics Veteran

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    Punkbuster or whatever is being implemented in WHO.
     
  11. Guest

    Guest Guest

    I'm good with all of that.
    Training in KR is much easier.
    Training with UOAssist is not tough.

    Unattended scripting and illegal third party usage is declared cheating.
    I'm good with that.

    Underlying systems' issues (faults) and the amount of automation should be wholly included in the term 'cheating issues' and controllable/improvable by UO itself, at least by my reckoning...

    I truly feel they will get the point if the keyword 'cheating (or) cheaters' is put in a feedback comment by as many of us as possible.
     
  12. Guest

    Guest Guest

    - and we have been given no reason to consider things to have changed since those very promising statements were made.

    I mean, we have had some things appear lately that relate to cheating, sure.
    We have had the GM structure and methods change since then.
    Some Scritters will always get away; for a time.
    But we really haven't been given any reason to consider things to have changed since those very promising statements were made.

    Thx for adding them here, as well.
     
  13. Xin Law

    Xin Law Guest

    There is absolutely nothing to debate about on whether cheating is bad or good. Its common sense, its bad for everyone EXCEPT for the actual people using the cheats. You see its not just the honest/devoted players that suffer, but the individuals and what company they work for actually suffers the most. They may not suffer directly from it, but rest assured the reputation and their creditbility will be tarnished. Just think about it,

    - who wants to play another online game from the same company that simply allowed cheaters to infect, and slowly destroy and grief loyal customers, some with TEN YEARS of commitment to the point where they say 'to hell with this game, they simply dont care and are not going to do anything about it'.

    -Others leave because their accounts get hacked by these cheaters,

    -then more leave because their friend of 3-7 years just lost everything and all that can be said or done is that you are sent a memorandum in an email saying 'sorry you lost everything'. Who wants to wait for it to happen to them?

    -then more leave because only on rare occassions are cheaters punished or even caught. Hell they can admit it in game and nothing will happen.

    -Now more people leave because so many of their pals have quit, so whats the point in playing now?

    -All these pissed off and disapointed people move on to another game, and guess what they are going to say in regards to 'how was it playing UO' will not only be negative, but prolly down right nasty. Which does nothing but slash the possibilities of new players coming into UO by 80% (probably more).

    Also allowing any degree of cheating in an online video game, that customers pay money every month to play isnt just 'unfair' for the honest players its truely disgraceful. I mean most people that hack video games are freaking kids, maybe young adults, barely finished puberty, these people are manipulating the game and service you provide to better suit THEMSELVES. Also, keep in mind this 'category' or 'type' of player is someone without any integrity, which means these are the people that hack your accounts, that scam/exploit others, so dont get upset when I put both cheaters/hackers into the same category.

    As much as I hate to say this, but right now the remaining honest players are being stupified at how many cheaters are getting away with it. To us it seems like these cheaters are growing in numbers exponetially, but its not quite correct. Its the fact that more and more honest players, are simply fed up, and have quit, while a few went ahead and joined the cheaters, 'if you cant beat them join them'. Thus is why currently a good 85% percent of hardcore players, especially pvp'rs are using these cheats. and because its so vast, its not to get an edge over another player its REQUIRED if you want to even compete with them.

    Now with all that being said, if cheating in UO isnt supressed to the point where no one can pick it out. To the point to where its just a rumor, not a full blown fact, a fact that can be admitted, stated, explained, and solicited to other players IN GAME and not get punished when you use the verbal harrsment to save and send your journal log because the a-hole that just killed you casting flamestrikes on a dead run, is calling you 'STUPID' for not using this illegal software to 'enhance' your ability to play the game. That's right I talked to one of these a-holes and he told me the NAME of the program, told me HOW it speeds up the game, tells me WHERE the website is to get it, then calls me 'STUPID' for not using it. Sent the whole journal log in, and he didnt even get a 24 hour suspension, nothing came of it, not even a GM message giving him a warning or go reread the TOS. Hell the next time he killed me, I asked him if he was mad because I paged a GM and sent a journal log of you admiting to what, how, and where you get your illegal proggys and he had absolutely no freaking clue as to what I was talking about. **Note I quit UO because how the hell can someone be that damn beligerent and ****y and NOTHING happens. After about 6 months of my friends asking me to come back, I finally did, of course the same a-hole was doing the same thing, but at least Mondains Legacy Dungeons were a blast, meaning PVM was actually new and exciting enough to compensate for the BS you put up with PVP'ings.

    Now, I know for a fact that if you all really put some effort into it, instead of blowing it off, that you all could come up with something that will enable you all to prevent, stop, or catch anyone from cheating in UO. Now, to think that cheating can be reduced to ZERO %, its idiotic, but getting it down to 10-15% instead of over 80% is very possible. However, I do need to point one thing out, as for punishment goes for being caught cheating/using illegal proggys, banning their accounts is NOT the answer, the number of players cant take another hit like that, especially right now. All you need to do is either stop the way the cheaters are cheating, or find a way to detect whether they are cheating or not. Now when discovered, a warning should be administered, then on second offense supsension, and third offense termination of account. Granted it would be nice to remove this trash from the game entirely, but if they are taken out, then the game will be dead because right now the vast majority would be banned.

    I am sure it wont be easy to do this but if nothing is done soon, then UO will be just like what diablo came to be, just another POS online game, destroyed and corrupted by cheaters/hackers.
     
  14. Guest

    Guest Guest

    I copy/pasted and sent. I have a lot of thoughts on this issue, mainly about trying to help come up with ways to prevent cheating or make its use impractical in certain systems. I think there are a lot of good ideas out there, and it would be great for us to come up with different methods of dealing with cheating that we could suggest or do (game changes, or player game play changes).
     
  15. Arcus

    Arcus Grand Poobah
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

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    <blockquote><hr>

    <blockquote><hr>

    The term "cheating issues" and "cheaters" is very ambiguous on your part. Define the terms you're using and the issues you perceive to exist in more detail.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    15Nov '06 (unsigned)
    After a month-long investigation and a thorough review of all involved, we:

    • banned more than 400 accounts,
    • deleted more than 100,000 illegally duplicated items, and
    • deleted more than one trillion in gold.

    More importantly, the bugs that allowed this particular kind of illegal duplication have been fixed. Also, duping and exploit prevention/detection systems have been in place for some time now - systems that help us to identify and eliminate cheaters.

    We take all forms of cheating extremely seriously, especially cheats that affect the in game economy and devalue the hard work of honest players. We will never stop investigating and solving these issues, and appreciate very much those of you who contribute to the fight against cheating. <font color=red>We’ve had to keep these developments quiet until we completed our investigations, but we are very proud to be able to make this announcement today.</font color=red>
    _______________________

    Archive
    Wilki_EA
    UO Legend
    We owe the UO team some credit and apologies...
    #3387015 - 11/09/06
    You are 100% right. You have no idea how hard it was to see the "The devs don't care!" posts regarding duping and not say anything at all that entire time.

    But in the future (and please feel free to refer back to this post anytime you want)...

    If we're planning on banning dupers or other types of exploiters, no matter how many people complain about how we're ignoring their questions in the FoF each week, no matter how many angry emails you send about how we suck, <font color=red>we're NOT going to talk about it ahead of time!</font color=red>

    If we would've said one single thing about this, all of the time we spent on this would've went down the drain, and there wouldn't have been a nice announcement today, because the bad guys would've scattered like roaches when the lights come on.

    No, it's far better to smash roaches in the dark.

    Then you can turn on the lights. :)

    Wilki_EA
    UO Legend

    Re: Bannings - Guilty or Innocent
    #3411971
    No one was banned for buying duped artifacts, unless they did so in mass quantities. We're ultimately responsible for the bug that allowed the dupe to occur in the first place, so it'd be pretty unfair to ban players who unwittingly bought a few artis or other high end items for personal use, etc.

    However, item sellers who bought a LOT of duped items (as in you go to their house/backpack and see a bag with a 3 dozen covetous statues, 20 hats of the magi, 15 ornies, and some "unique" event items thrown into the mix) were given no quarter. While the dupers may have exploited this bug, it was the item sellers who truly did the damage to the game. Any one of them that tries to tell you, "But I only bought items from a supplier, I didn't realize where they came from," needs to be smacked upside the head, and then tarred and feathered.

    UO is a GAME, not a freakin' business, and while we don't ban players for selling things for cash, we're not going to look very kindly on those who harm the game in doing so. And honestly, are any of these "trustworthy" brokers and item sellers with "years of UO experience" really going to tell us with a straight face that they didn't know those bags of 125 character transfer tokens and the bags full of extremely rare event items (i.e. bags with more of them than should even exist in all of UO) were duped?

    Equine Puckey!

    If those people bother to email me, they might as well call just call 976-WHAH, because that's pretty much going to be my reaction when I read their "so sad" emails.

    To this date, I've unbanned ONE player, who had ONE account banned (out of 3), where a genuine mistake was made. I've been going through the players who have emailed me so far, one by one, to see if we made a mistake somewhere else. Tonight, I got an email from a "lady" who claimed she had never exploited, and was just a nice mother of 2 who loved UO. Pfft. How about that bag of 30 each valorite hammers, barbed kits and heartwood dovetail saws we found in her house? Or the fact that the account she was trying to keep hidden from us had a bag with 124 hat of the magis in it, along with lots of other artifacts?

    To those people: DON'T BOTHER EMAILING ME! I wasn't born yesterday, I don't fall for the lame emo emails, and we're simply not going to release your account with 100's of duped items on it because you spun a really unconvincing story about how you just bought your account from your little brother/roommate/ex-girlfriend and didn't know your house was already being used to store those 500 artifacts. And yes, we DO know about your other "hidden" accounts. And no, changing your IP, using an internet cafe or using different payment methods won't help you either. We WILL find you, so you might as well just stop wasting your time and go find another game to exploit. Or, I have a better idea - how about if you go find something productive to do with your lives? That's the best idea of them all.

    And honorable players - please, STOP BUYING from the item sellers who were "out of stock" last week. These parasites wouldn't be perpetuating this fraud if no one bought their stuff in the first place.

    If any of this sounds harsh, well, I suppose it is. I love this game, and I really don't like people who try to do it harm.


    _________________________

    They KNOW what cheating means ... feel free to give specific examples IN YOUR FEED BACK AS SUGGESTED ...

    [​IMG]

    clear?

    [/ QUOTE ]

    This was and IMHO still is the best show of force and enforcement in UO's history both in actions taken and response from Wilki. The best. It made me feel good reading that when he posted.

    Unfortunately, the momentum died as quickly as it started. Since then...nothing.

    I would still offer up my services as a consultant to stamp out the scripters and cheater permanently. I would gladly send my resume for review and charge NOTHING for the time spent. Id put up...
     
  16. Lord_Asterix

    Lord_Asterix Guest

    How many bloody times do I have to post about speed hacking?
     
  17. fred252

    fred252 Guest

    [quoteI would still offer up my services as a consultant to stamp out the scripters and cheater permanently. I would gladly send my resume for review and charge NOTHING for the time spent. Id put up...

    [/ QUOTE ]

    No thanks, we do not need some over-zealous maniac running around UO with his/her finger hovering over the "ban button."

    I am not talking about you specifically Arcus, just in general.
     
  18. <blockquote><hr>

    How many bloody times do I have to post about speed hacking?

    [/ QUOTE ]

    and how many times do I have to report the sameeee scriptor spamming at britain and opening gates.

    And the scriptor near my house constantly farming resources.

    only too see the same people the next day [​IMG]
     
  19. Guest

    Guest Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    I will look it up in a moment but I remember someone (I think Jeremy actually) has already said the official UO EAMythic stance on cheaters is that:
    'we despise cheating / cheaters.'

    [/ QUOTE ]
    Sure, thats EA's "official" stance.

    The true picture however is that they value the cheaters revenue too much to do anything about it. Money obviously talks louder than morals to EA.

    Its insulting that they come out with crap like this to us when they quite plainly dont give a damn about cheaters.
     
  20. Arcus

    Arcus Grand Poobah
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
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    <blockquote><hr>

    How many bloody times do I have to post about speed hacking?

    [/ QUOTE ]


    5
     
  21. <blockquote><hr>

    15Nov '06 (unsigned)
    After a month-long investigation and a thorough review of all involved, we:

    • banned more than 400 accounts,
    • deleted more than 100,000 illegally duplicated items, and
    • deleted more than one trillion in gold.

    More importantly, the bugs that allowed this particular kind of illegal duplication have been fixed. Also, duping and exploit prevention/detection systems have been in place for some time now - systems that help us to identify and eliminate cheaters.

    We take all forms of cheating extremely seriously, especially cheats that affect the in game economy and devalue the hard work of honest players. We will never stop investigating and solving these issues, and appreciate very much those of you who contribute to the fight against cheating. <font color=red>We’ve had to keep these developments quiet until we completed our investigations, but we are very proud to be able to make this announcement today.</font color=red>

    clear?

    [/ QUOTE ]

    In all honesty, that was a piss poor attempt by EA to shut people up and didn't make a lick of difference. I can name at least 5 script miners I know personally who were completely unaffected by this and they scripted in game nearly 24/7. Needless to say, they were also high end dupers who, guess what, are still at it.

    What they did was a mere fraction of what could and should have been done. Oh, and guess what? All those people they ban? Yah, most of them are back now and back to doing the same crap.

    This was just a drop in the bucket compared to the reality of it. But it sure shut people about about it for a few months.
     
  22. Fluffi

    Fluffi Slightly Crazed
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

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    RTL.


    I despise AFK cheating. I have nothing but contempt for those who collect BoDs, farm gold, or train skills while they are at work/school.
    I am just a little more ambiguous when it comes to what would be described as attended cheating, (but only in the sense that several aspects of UO are so "click-heavy", that they seem to call-out for an automation program.)

    I've been trying, on and off, to earn some runic saws. The clunky coding, and the inadequacies of the interface have made me stop trying.
    I feel I'm faced with three possible options:
    1) Keep manually completing quests, which comes with a genuine risk of RSI.
    2) Script the quest, whilst remaining alert and attended at the PC all the time.
    3) Buy the saws from someone who probably either scripted the quest or duped their saws.

    I refuse to do 1) - I can deal with "boring" stuff in a game, but I'm not prepared to suffer physical pain.
    I'm tempted to do 2) - but that runs the risk (however small) of bans and black-marks on my account, so I won't go down that road.
    This leaves me with no realistic option but 3) - I don't want to support the cheaters, but what genuine choice to I have if I want to try a bit of runic carpentry?


    The EA stance of "everybody who buys something that might be scripted/duped is just as bad a the cheaters themselves, because they are encouraging cheating" is understandable, but does not address the fact that failings in the game interface, in both 2D and KR, are the real reason that some (possibly many) people choose to cheat.
     
  23. Guest

    Guest Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    Wilki_EA
    UO Legend

    Re: Bannings - Guilty or Innocent
    #3411971
    No one was banned for buying duped artifacts, unless they did so in mass quantities. We're ultimately responsible for the bug that allowed the dupe to occur in the first place, so it'd be pretty unfair to ban players who unwittingly bought a few artis or other high end items for personal use, etc.

    However, item sellers who bought a LOT of duped items (as in you go to their house/backpack and see a bag with a 3 dozen covetous statues, 20 hats of the magi, 15 ornies, and some "unique" event items thrown into the mix) were given no quarter. While the dupers may have exploited this bug, it was the item sellers who truly did the damage to the game. Any one of them that tries to tell you, "But I only bought items from a supplier, I didn't realize where they came from," needs to be smacked upside the head, and then tarred and feathered.

    UO is a GAME, not a freakin' business, and while we don't ban players for selling things for cash, we're not going to look very kindly on those who harm the game in doing so. And honestly, are any of these "trustworthy" brokers and item sellers with "years of UO experience" really going to tell us with a straight face that they didn't know those bags of 125 character transfer tokens and the bags full of extremely rare event items (i.e. bags with more of them than should even exist in all of UO) were duped?

    Equine Puckey!

    If those people bother to email me, they might as well call just call 976-WHAH, because that's pretty much going to be my reaction when I read their "so sad" emails.

    To this date, I've unbanned ONE player, who had ONE account banned (out of 3), where a genuine mistake was made. I've been going through the players who have emailed me so far, one by one, to see if we made a mistake somewhere else. Tonight, I got an email from a "lady" who claimed she had never exploited, and was just a nice mother of 2 who loved UO. Pfft. How about that bag of 30 each valorite hammers, barbed kits and heartwood dovetail saws we found in her house? Or the fact that the account she was trying to keep hidden from us had a bag with 124 hat of the magis in it, along with lots of other artifacts?

    To those people: DON'T BOTHER EMAILING ME! I wasn't born yesterday, I don't fall for the lame emo emails, and we're simply not going to release your account with 100's of duped items on it because you spun a really unconvincing story about how you just bought your account from your little brother/roommate/ex-girlfriend and didn't know your house was already being used to store those 500 artifacts. And yes, we DO know about your other "hidden" accounts. And no, changing your IP, using an internet cafe or using different payment methods won't help you either. We WILL find you, so you might as well just stop wasting your time and go find another game to exploit. Or, I have a better idea - how about if you go find something productive to do with your lives? That's the best idea of them all.

    And honorable players - please, STOP BUYING from the item sellers who were "out of stock" last week. These parasites wouldn't be perpetuating this fraud if no one bought their stuff in the first place.

    If any of this sounds harsh, well, I suppose it is. I love this game, and I really don't like people who try to do it harm.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Thats why I loved Wilki in his old community rep position.
     
  24. I suggest this feedback:
    -&gt; eBay makes cheaters rich. Clearly state it illegal in the ToS and ban eBayers.
     
  25. I might be a "bad guy" for saying this, but as far as i care, cheat if you want as long as it doesnt directly effect how im playing.

    Play how you wanna play i dont really care, just dont ruin my game doing it.

    EG: the neon hair hack that let everyone buy neon hair for 50g was fine with me, because hey... what do i care if you have neon? you care enough to risk your account so whatever go for it if it makes you happy.

    Scripting your skills up, yeah sure whatever if you cant enjoy the low end dungeons and all the really fun bits of uo then thats your loss but i can so whatever.

    Hacking to run faster, while pvping. means i cant steal your bandies, boo [​IMG] thats not fair because i play legit and shouldnt be punished for it.
     
  26. Mordocuo

    Mordocuo Guest

    I think EA or Mythic should show us they are serious about the cheating issue, not us showing them.


    From what I have seen on these boards the players have sopken out pleanty of times about cheating.

    The only ones showing they are not serious is EA.

    It is time they put up.
     
  27. Arcus

    Arcus Grand Poobah
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
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    <blockquote><hr>

    [quoteI would still offer up my services as a consultant to stamp out the scripters and cheater permanently. I would gladly send my resume for review and charge NOTHING for the time spent. Id put up...

    [/ QUOTE ]

    No thanks, we do not need some over-zealous maniac running around UO with his/her finger hovering over the "ban button."

    I am not talking about you specifically Arcus, just in general.

    [/ QUOTE ]


    Hay genius...I'm a client / server programmer.

    Think about it . Why would someone send a resume to be a GM?
     
  28. GarthGrey

    GarthGrey Crazed Zealot
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend GoT

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    I have paged until I"m blue in the face, Blue Man Group blue....and it's done absolutely no good at all. Having an official title wouldn't change the end results imo. I wanna know why some of my emails/canned messages are from Bearkley, and some are from GM Bearkley.
     
  29. fred252

    fred252 Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    <blockquote><hr>

    [quoteI would still offer up my services as a consultant to stamp out the scripters and cheater permanently. I would gladly send my resume for review and charge NOTHING for the time spent. Id put up...

    [/ QUOTE ]

    No thanks, we do not need some over-zealous maniac running around UO with his/her finger hovering over the "ban button."

    I am not talking about you specifically Arcus, just in general.

    [/ QUOTE ]


    Hay genius...I'm a client / server programmer.

    Think about it . Why would someone send a resume to be a GM?

    [/ QUOTE ]

    *gives Arcus a cookie*

    So what?

    Oh and by the way... hay is for horses. [​IMG]
     
  30. wanderer1origin

    wanderer1origin Lore Master
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

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    lol fred i know u on who u are
     
  31. wanderer1origin

    wanderer1origin Lore Master
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

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    potbs for the win
     
  32. ATLPvPer

    ATLPvPer Journeyman
    Stratics Veteran

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    We lost so much when Wilki left. I am not sure who can replace him as far as dealing with issues and being proactive. I guess we shall see.
     
  33. Xin Law

    Xin Law Guest

    I would like to see the number of people using speedhacks to diminish. It makes no sense for someone who is on foot, to be able to out run you when your on a mount. When there is no latency issues, ping under 40, using this:

    http://www.alienware.com/product_detail_pages/Aurora_ALX/aurora_specs.aspx?SysCode=PC-AURORA-ALX-R7&amp;SubCode=SKU-DEFAULT#pdp-nav

    I dont care if they get banned, we seriously can't lose anymore players, just suspend them, mark their account, and take countermeasures in stoping whatever program they were using from working, I just want it to stop, fair-game play was one of the things I use to like most about UO, but as things are now, if you want to be able to 1 on 1. Well forget about it, your going to have to use numbers 2+ people to catch/kill one of these little devils or use the same illegal proggies their using to compete and it shouldnt be like that.


    ****This is in reference to illegal proggy users i.e. speedfreaks, NOT dupers/hackers, ANYONE caught duping should be BANNED, ANYONE caught hacking someone elses account or the game itself should be ARRESTED and PROSECUTED.****

    NOTE: The computer stated above is not mine, its my friends I got to his house just to drool on how fast that thing is.
     
  34. Nexus

    Nexus Site Support
    Administrator Professional Wiki Moderator Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend Campaign Patron

    Joined:
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    <blockquote><hr>

    [quoteI would still offer up my services as a consultant to stamp out the scripters and cheater permanently. I would gladly send my resume for review and charge NOTHING for the time spent. Id put up...

    [/ QUOTE ]

    No thanks, we do not need some over-zealous maniac running around UO with his/her finger hovering over the "ban button."

    I am not talking about you specifically Arcus, just in general.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    It's not a matter of having an over-zealous maniac running around with a ban button it's a matter of putting in solid server side code that prevents access to the data stream from illegal scripting programs. I'd rather see someone do it right once where it can't be easily gotten around than have people endlessly hunt and kill so to speak...
     
  35. Lord_Asterix

    Lord_Asterix Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    <blockquote><hr>

    [quoteI would still offer up my services as a consultant to stamp out the scripters and cheater permanently. I would gladly send my resume for review and charge NOTHING for the time spent. Id put up...

    [/ QUOTE ]

    No thanks, we do not need some over-zealous maniac running around UO with his/her finger hovering over the "ban button."

    I am not talking about you specifically Arcus, just in general.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    It's not a matter of having an over-zealous maniac running around with a ban button it's a matter of putting in solid server side code that prevents access to the data stream from illegal scripting programs. I'd rather see someone do it right once where it can't be easily gotten around than have people endlessly hunt and kill so to speak...

    [/ QUOTE ]

    WTF are you talking about? Scripting programs don't alter the data stream. It does the same thing as a programmable keyboard except allows for more complex algorithms.
     
  36. Rykus

    Rykus Guest

    True, the scripting program everyone talks about does not mess with the data being sent, it manipulates the client in memory on your PC and that's a helluvalot more complex than what a programmable keyboard is capable of. That is why it needs to be updated EVERY time there's a minor client change. It's clearly stated on their own site, go look for yourself. Putting a bazillion bit encryption on the data going to/from the server wouldn't change a thing with the way it works.

    In fact, here's the words right from their site, with the names altered to protect the innocent... [​IMG]

    <blockquote><hr>

    If UOAssist can do it, why can't [censored]?

    UOAssist and [censored] work in different ways.

    UOAssist injects itself in the network packet stream and modifies and sends network packets directly to the UO server.

    [censored] modifies, reads the clients memory and executes code in the clients memory.

    These methods give different advantages, and also different possibilities.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    So please, everyone who says something about the data stream, give it a rest unless your goal is to make UOAssist stop working. The client is the issue when it comes to that other scripting program, plain and simple.
     
  37. I agree, I worked hard on my PvP and it is sad that no matter what I do I will get killed because I will not use hacks or cheats. all you need to do is stand at yew gate and see hacks all over the place, potion chugging, aids, and speed hacks and some hack that locks up your character (no not paralized) froze. PvP I feel would be more popular if it wasn't so ridden with hackers.
     
  38. If you really want to show EA how serious we are... this is the best weapon.

    We all pick a month... and we all dont pay that month.

    We did it with the gas stations... the consumers stopped visiting one of the government gas stations, three months later the price of gas went down... but this was a community rally and it made the sales of that particular gas station drop over 70%.

    So if you want to be serious about this... pick a month... and see EA worry.

    From my side, it would be easy to talk to my game workshop partners and we have about 17 active players on different shards... average 2 accounts per player... easy to have 30 accounts frozen...

    so.. just pick a month?
     
  39. Guest

    Guest Guest

    It's people like you that call all PvPers hackers that I seriously don't think know what they're talking about.

    Alot of people are running an extra proggy to boost speed. We all know it nowadays. But I don't see it making me quit playing UO or anything. Darkfall will do that.

    It's a sad state of affairs but your common player doesn't like challenge.

    Hence why games nowadays ussually come with cheat codes standard.

    Hence why when one template becomes overpowered people mass exodus from their own template and slobber all over templates of the month.

    Hence why people use speed proggies and such.

    But I can honestly say that the worst "PvP Cheating" I've seen is someone running a script to heal for them (as a dexxer). And personally I think those "cheating" through scripts in PvP are stupid. There are to many variables in situations to script PvP.

    Using something to chug pots for you is stupid, you'll run out much to fast and waste a ton on easy cures. (EO+NOX Spam = no pots quick).

    The auto-aid though is something thats already implemented as a feature in game through the cu-sidhe form talisman for ninjitsu, so I really don't think its that bad. Although I do prefer when a dexxer heals himself (especially when they miss the key ^^).

    What it boils down to for me is that cheats in UO PvP just arent as bad as people make them out to be. They're a pain in the ass, but then again so are gimp templates. In the end they're not the end all and be all of PvP. Especially now when I can blow by these people on the KR client (to bad nobody can actually PvP on it though).

    Don't think I'm arguing FOR these things because that is not my intent.

    I just think that the lack of bug fixes, lack of content, lack of support, and getting the economy all in shape is more pressing then preventing people from running away from me faster.

    keke

    but thats just my opinion. [​IMG]

    I don't know. Maybe I just like whoopin these kids to much. It can be challenging.
     
  40. If scripts could do any of the following...then things would be unfair... wouldnt they?

    Scripts that..

    Auto attacking preset creature when nearby

    Makes list with properties of targetted player.

    Clears a path of blocking bagballs on the ground

    Drink cure potions when runing around champion spawn's , duel's , open PvP combat.

    Create a list of all non-friend players near you

    small utillity for raising elementals and controling their actions

    Uses a menu to select three monsters, then attacks them when a hotkey is pressed, with option of pathfinding.

    Allows you to dismount quickly in combat with hotkey and enable special move if defined

    Finds nearest enemy and attacks them

    Group target count-down! (ever been hit by 7 flamestrikes... now you know how)

    To make a quick escape from star room, especailly when stone walls covering moongate

    shows the percentage of health from a creature/player/npc

    Automatically Heal, Cure, and Refresh yourself with Potions and hotkeys!

    attacking targets running fast

    Trips a trapped crate whenever character is frozen.

    Target enemy and auto click them when casting spells.

    Antibola, bola on hotkey etc..

    Heal if injured, teleport to a random position and hide

    follows enemy

    follow attacks and runs from attacker

    It is launch bola ball to your enemy

    It heals , drinks pots with disarm and rearm your shield, and remount you if you are dismount..

    Automated heal/cure script, any in party!

    Scans all possible pcs and npcs, and attacks the most dangerous, using a custom priority system and selecting the nearest one.

    Quickly toggle thru all players nearby until you get the one you want set as last target.

    Prevent you from being dismounted by a bola ball.

    saves seperate targets that can be targeted at the push of a button.

    Drinks pots strength,agility and refresh.

    will re-arm either arm with weapons/shields or both.

    Dark Father Gauntlet assistant Cuts bones/ targets seeable and unseeable monsters.

    Tracks a target till it runs off the screen (18 steps).

    keeps you atleast 3 squares away from enemy

    heals, uses traped pouches to free from paralyze,
    AND as an added bonus, there is a SHADOW STRIKE option.

    Get within 6 squares of a monster, Script it will peace it and attack it with your pet(s).

    Heal and Cure as needed during PvP



    HAHA!

    "those scripters dont affect me!!!"
     
  41. Big Silence...

    the community is in shock or counting how many they are currently using?
    (speedhacking not included in the list above)
     
  42. Guest

    Guest Guest

    <blockquote><hr>

    If scripts could do any of the following...then things would be unfair... wouldnt they?

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I'm pretty sure there are scripts that do all that you listed. However things like that aren't really VIABLE for PvP. Allow me to explain.

    <blockquote><hr>

    Auto attacking preset creature when nearby

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Lets say you use this at a spawn. Suddenly you get raided. 3 people begin attacking you. You run, flagging every little monster between you and the front of the dungeon. None of its on your attackers. Guess what. You're officially [censored]. Good Game.

    <blockquote><hr>

    Makes list with properties of targetted player.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    You can do this by looking at someones suit, spend to much time looking away from your screen and guess what. You'll end up dead. Good Game.

    <blockquote><hr>

    Clears a path of blocking bagballs on the ground

    [/ QUOTE ]

    You switch weapons while the script tries to pick up and throw down a bag ball. You've just thrown down your favorite weapon and the script keeps picking up bag balls. Good Game.

    <blockquote><hr>

    Drink cure potions when runing around champion spawn's , duel's , open PvP combat.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    You chug 50 cures running over poison traps because you were to lazy to just cure yourself, so now when that nox dexxer attacks you, guess what. Good Game.

    <blockquote><hr>

    Create a list of all non-friend players near you

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I hope you don't heal an enemy. Or blow up a friend. Good Game.

    <blockquote><hr>

    small utillity for raising elementals and controling their actions

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Instead of having in game macros to control them you're pushing a button on a window other then UO. Honestly its more efficient to have a key on your keyboard to do this kind of crap. Good Game.

    <blockquote><hr>

    Uses a menu to select three monsters, then attacks them when a hotkey is pressed, with option of pathfinding.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    See #1. Good Game.

    <blockquote><hr>

    Allows you to dismount quickly in combat with hotkey and enable special move if defined

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I do that with UOA. Good Game.

    <blockquote><hr>

    Finds nearest enemy and attacks them

    [/ QUOTE ]

    This is possible with UO macros. Good Game.

    <blockquote><hr>

    Group target count-down! (ever been hit by 7 flamestrikes... now you know how)

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I imagine it would be a huge pain in the ass for a script like that to switch from offense to defense. I bet me and a group of good PvPers can do it 10X faster, and crossheal each other in between. Good Game.

    <blockquote><hr>

    To make a quick escape from star room, especailly when stone walls covering moongate

    [/ QUOTE ]

    You can record a key to do this in UOA. Good Game.

    <blockquote><hr>

    shows the percentage of health from a creature/player/npc

    [/ QUOTE ]

    We call those health bars. Good Game.

    <blockquote><hr>

    Automatically Heal, Cure, and Refresh yourself with Potions and hotkeys!

    [/ QUOTE ]

    UOA. Good Game.

    <blockquote><hr>

    attacking targets running fast

    [/ QUOTE ]

    In Game UO Macros. Good Game.

    <blockquote><hr>

    Trips a trapped crate whenever character is frozen.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    UOA key. Good game.

    <blockquote><hr>

    Target enemy and auto click them when casting spells.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    My scroll button can do that. Its called a last target macro. It's part of UO, and UOA. Good Game.

    <blockquote><hr>

    Antibola, bola on hotkey etc..

    [/ QUOTE ]

    You can do both of these on UOA. Although the anti-bola is really the only one I've seen scripted, and only by one person ever and that was tonight.

    <blockquote><hr>

    Heal if injured, teleport to a random position and hide

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I can do that through UO keys, although I do have to click a spot when I hit tele. But I don't have hiding. Good Game.

    <blockquote><hr>

    follows enemy

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I do that with the middle finger on my right hand. Good Game.

    <blockquote><hr>

    follow attacks and runs from attacker

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Middle Finger... Right Hand.... Still... Good Game.

    <blockquote><hr>

    It is launch bola ball to your enemy

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Huh? toss a bola? I've got keys to do that. One to dismount my pet (UOA), one to say "all follow me" (UO), one to use item type (bola) (UOA), and another to hop on my mount (UOA). They're all next to one another too, even my teleport to chase is next to them. Good Game.

    <blockquote><hr>

    It heals , drinks pots with disarm and rearm your shield, and remount you if you are dismount..

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I hope it can tell the difference between a riding swipe and a dismount. You need to heal your pet before you can ride it again with riding swipe, I'll bet you money it can't. I already went over pots. Good Game.

    <blockquote><hr>

    Automated heal/cure script, any in party!

    [/ QUOTE ]

    The buttons on party bars do that already.

    <blockquote><hr>

    Scans all possible pcs and npcs, and attacks the most dangerous, using a custom priority system and selecting the nearest one.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    This would have to be a massive script to be able to judge which ones are more dangerous in PvP. This would have to be a soley PvM script, and who's to say it will pick correctly for your character? Other people's characters are built to fight different ways. In the end if you're using this in a PvP situation you can refer to above. Good Game.

    <blockquote><hr>

    Quickly toggle thru all players nearby until you get the one you want set as last target.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    You can do that two ways with regular UO macros. Good Game.

    <blockquote><hr>

    Prevent you from being dismounted by a bola ball.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Didn't we cover this?

    <blockquote><hr>

    saves seperate targets that can be targeted at the push of a button.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    This is actually possible to do with UOA, but given the limited number of UOA macros you can record, I wouldn't do this when I'm fully confident in my own targeting ability. Good Game.

    <blockquote><hr>

    Drinks pots strength,agility and refresh.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I've got each of these pots on keys. UOA. Good Game.

    <blockquote><hr>

    will re-arm either arm with weapons/shields or both.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    This is possible with UOA and UO. Just a touch of a key. Good Game.

    <blockquote><hr>

    Dark Father Gauntlet assistant Cuts bones/ targets seeable and unseeable monsters.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I do this with a "use item" key and object handles, granted I miss some, but there isn't a distance check when you do it, so anyone and everyone should. Good Game.

    <blockquote><hr>

    Tracks a target till it runs off the screen (18 steps).

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Huh? Like, uses the skill tracking? I'm not sure what you're talking about here because I "track" people with my eyes.

    <blockquote><hr>

    keeps you atleast 3 squares away from enemy

    [/ QUOTE ]

    That's not far enough when you've got to cast big spells. Good Game.

    <blockquote><hr>

    heals, uses traped pouches to free from paralyze,

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I heal myself just fine. Trapped pouches are outdated. Apparently so is the script library you're looking at. especially when you could use UOA to open pouches with the "Use Once" option. Good Game.

    <blockquote><hr>

    AND as an added bonus, there is a SHADOW STRIKE option.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    o_O not sure what you're talking about here either.

    <blockquote><hr>

    Get within 6 squares of a monster, Script it will peace it and attack it with your pet(s).

    [/ QUOTE ]

    I can do that from much farther away and much faster then any stupid script. Now if I only had a bard. Meh... Good Game.

    <blockquote><hr>

    Heal and Cure as needed during PvP

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Ok look. What it all boils down to is that a person can change on the fly. That's the whole point of PvP. Scripting it simply makes you predictable and thus easily beatable.

    For instance. Someone on LS a year or two ago began using a script to auto attack people. Well, it didn't take us (MM at the time) long to notice he was attacking EVERYONE on screen, so we chased him down on archers. No need to actually attack him, he kept attacking us, even as he ran by a new person trying to get away, he'd flag them, and then they were in on the chase. He ended up in more trouble because of that script then it actually helped. It wasn't long before they stopped using it.


    <blockquote><hr>

    HAHA!

    "those scripters dont affect me!!!"

    [/ QUOTE ]

    In the end. Not really. Not in PvP.
     
  43. "You run, flagging every little monster between you and the front of the dungeon."

    - You can turn it off manually with a hotkey.

    "You can do this by looking at someone's suit, spend to much time looking away from your screen and guess what. You'll end up dead. Good Game."

    - That's why the script does it for you. LOL. Doesn't take long at all to look at that gump.

    "You switch weapons while the script tries to pick up and throw down a bag ball. You've just thrown down your favorite weapon and the script keeps picking up bag balls. Good Game."

    - False. Sorry. [​IMG] Have you ever ran a cheat in UO?

    "You chug 50 Cures running over poison traps because you were to lazy to just cure yourself, so now when that nox dexxer attacks you, guess what. Good Game."

    - Waste or not, they script making whole kegs of GCs and it keeps them safe. That's why sometimes they use a script to fill bottles on the run from the KEGS they carry. How did they get the regs?.. You know it. :p They never run out. Personally I've often looted KEGS from people. Along with 60-70 Heals and Cures and a ton of empty bottles. Been like that for AGES man.

    "I hope you don't heal an enemy. Or blow up a friend. Good Game."

    - Nope, never happens. Sorry. [​IMG]

    "Honestly its more efficient to have a key on your keyboard to do this kind of crap. Good Game."

    - Automated = faster. Preference doesn't play a role in this equation. [​IMG]

    "I do that with UOA. Good Game."

    - Yeah but the cheat comes bundled with all the above and the following extras. UOA doesn't. Plus, UOA is a cheat since it can do this. I've been a UOA user for too long and still consider this function cheating.

    "This is possible with UO macros. Good Game."

    - Well yeah, it is. Only it does it faster. Matter of speed. Plus it's all bundled as said, no harm in having extra functions.

    "I imagine it would be a huge pain in the ass for a script like that to switch from offense to defense. I bet me and a group of good PvPers can do it 10X faster, and crossheal each other in between. Good Game."

    - You don't have to switch. Pick a target, kill them. Turn it off. Job done. You don't need a group. Just 3 or 4 mages. No need to XHeal. If you need to, there's scripts for it too.

    "You can record a key to do this in UOA. Good Game."

    - Doesn't mean it's not cheating and shouldn't go away. Just like the Dismount trick.

    "We call those health bars. Good Game."

    - With numeric values and percentages? Nope.. [​IMG]

    "UOA. Good Game."

    - I dunno, there's no need for hotkeys. That's not possible for UOA. :p It's AUTO-HEAL/CURE/REFRESH. It's in coordination with the script getting potions off your keg on the run, etc etc. [​IMG]

    "My scroll button can do that. It's called a Last Target macro. It's part of UO, and UOA. Good Game."

    - Unless you can tell UOA to time it so perfectly that the miniscule amount of time from the moment the spell is ready to the moment the target cursor comes up is 0.0000000000001 or something, then scripts beat you in this again. And yes there's a difference. A VISIBLE difference.

    "Although the anti-bola is really the only one I've seen scripted, and only by one person ever and that was tonight."

    - Then you don't play on Europa? Or haven't for the last year.. Because indeed that one is becoming more rare, I guess it's too apparent.

    "I can do that through UO keys, although I do have to click a spot when I hit tele."

    - Yeh, the scripter doesn't have to click a spot. All about speed. It's preset to X tiles North/East/South/West of player etc.

    "I do that with the middle finger on my right hand."

    - The scripter though does that automatically at full run without missing a step. Even when you are stealthed. No, it's not Tracking, sorry. [​IMG] And it NEVER loses target.

    "Middle Finger... Right Hand.... Still... Good Game."

    - Again. Finger busy, mind busy. Lose speed. Can't perform too many actions if you're just a human. That's the beauty of scripts, you can perform an INSANE amount of actions all together at max speed possible for a human, actually faster. [​IMG]

    "I hope it can tell the difference between a riding swipe and a dismount. You need to heal your pet before you can ride it again with riding swipe, I'll bet you money it can't."

    - It CAN. Sorry, gimme your money now. [​IMG] Automatically too if it "sees" the pet is damaged.

    "The buttons on party bars do that already."

    - Again you fail to understand. It's automated. It's way faster than it was meant to be. You don't even have to watch the healthbars, your character is a "healing turret" okay? You get it now? Completely controllable, you can turn this off at will like the rest. Sorry boy. You're really clueless ain't you.

    "This would have to be a massive script to be able to judge which ones are more dangerous in PvP."

    - Now this is one I have yet to see too. But being massive? No. Just lots of cheats bundled together. And it's perfectly possible because of that other small extra that shows you your enemies' properties. But I won't argue over this one.

    "You can do that two ways with regular UO macros."

    - Automation. Speed. You can pay attention to other things.

    "That's not far enough when you've got to cast big spells. Good Game."

    - It's far enough if 3 mages are coordinated to FS you and you're too busy to see it coming. :p Plus it's really enough for small spells spam in Mage Vs. Mage situations. Avoid those harms running off like mad healing on the run. Fully auto.

    "I wouldn't do this when I'm fully confident in my own targeting ability."

    - Yeah, only they do it faster for sure. And without paying attention.

    "I heal myself just fine."

    - Not as fine as some lads you can see running around with In Mani and such. Trust me. :p And it's not their speed of fingers and thought.

    "I've got each of these pots on keys."

    - They don't need to press any keys. Script = takes off a shield and drinks WHENEVER the effects wear out. You don't even have to pay attention to when that happens or stop whatever else you're doing.

    "Ok look. What it all boils down to is that a person can change on the fly. That's the whole point of PvP. Scripting it simply makes you predictable and thus easily beatable."

    - I LOLed very hard. Thanks.

    "Well, it didn't take us (MM at the time) long to notice he was attacking EVERYONE on screen, so we chased him down on archers. No need to actually attack him, he kept attacking us, even as he ran by a new person trying to get away, he'd flag them, and then they were in on the chase. He ended up in more trouble because of that script then it actually helped. It wasn't long before they stopped using it. "

    - There will always be stupid cheaters. There will never be players who beat cheats in efficiency.

    "In the end. Not really. Not in PvP. "

    - In the end you missed the point.

    These functions are coordinated. The user doesn't have to be smarter than average to operate them. It's about multiple tasks happening at the same time BECAUSE UO REFUSES TO USE ACTION TIMERS ON CERTAIN THINGS. It's about speed. It's about keeping your mind off all the little things YOU WASTE TIME TO THINK ABOUT during fights, like Healing and running and chugging and and and and and PER SECOND.

    Anyway nice try. Have you ever ran a script again?
     
  44. please do something with the people who wish to interupt MY gameplay because they think they are cybercop's and have to interupt me to see if i am playing ?

    that crap is annoying , get over yourselves people
     
  45. Nixon[I-C]

    Nixon[I-C] Certifiable
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    Sorry Sicklover, but anyone running half those scripts in PvP would get screwed over. To run all those scripts at once, is time consuming and would make your performance suffer, not to mention it would clear your queues, interfere with spellcasts, and interupt macros.

    - Having a script to auto attack = Offers nothing in pvp, sorry.

    - Using a script to look at someones suit = pointless, theres so few players now, it's pretty easy to work out what who has what, how it works for them etc. It is time spent wasted, and yes it is easy to look away at the stats, but what's the point?

    - Bagball script. Yeah you are actually right here, there is a script to do this, it's pretty [censored]. However, because of the way it works, it can screw up your queues. Also it only really affects those who are reliant on using bagballs as a form of defence - which suggests they'd probably lose anyway.

    - Yeah, people may carry kegs, but not many. Auto pot chugging is easy to counter, irrespective of how much pots they have.

    - Creating lists of non-friends.. what the heck is that about? Field awareness perhaps?

    - Automated healing. AHAHA seriously. If you think that would even remotely work vs someone with half a clue, your 100% wrong. You need to queue heals, delay them, hold them and release at the perfect times, this cannot be determined by a script because it cannot handle the other variables involved.

    - UOA as a cheating tool? Right.

    - Extra functions? Sure, but cheating to do it? Sorry, I don't give a damn if your the best pvper in the world. If your cheating, you've already lost.

    - Automated targeting sucks. Period. It is combined with player handling. People make mistakes, and the automation doesn't handle it that well. I'd rather control exactly what I'm doing with targeting than let some macro do it.

    - UOA is not cheating. Get over it. These dismount scripts are pretty funny. At the start of AoS I bound words to all my spells quoting the dismount phrase, and it was pretty funny seeing people dismount all the time. The script has probably got smarter, but the players have not. Anyone dying before with this script, will die with the script, it's just a matter of time.

    - Sorry, but numeric values and percentages matter how with regards to PvP? It doesn't alter my spell choice, it doesn't alter anything in fact. I missed the whole point of it first time round when it was out years ago, and I miss the point again. Anyone with half a clue will know what spell to cast when purely based on the oppenents health bar. Knowing the oppenent is at 15% health - when I can already see this visually, matters not. Why would I care if the oppenent was at 15.67% or 18%?

    - UOA is awful for targeting, it's slower and I agree with you here, but the in game macro is perfect. Like I've already said, automation doesn't work that well in a real enviroment, because you have to cancel spells, hold spells, time spells, automation simply cannot handle that.

    - I played Europa when the anti-bola was around, and I never struggled with it. The only possible exception was perhaps Athena, but that was as much down to gear as it was the script.

    - Yes I know what programing you are speaking about with regards to tracking stealthers and such, however, very few people actually use this. It's pretty evident on the field, when we've had a stealther kicking about, and noones blinked an eye.

    - Scripted healing/casting. Sorry but I really fail to see how this would work in a real enviroment. I'll openly admit I can script, so I have a clue of what I'm speaking about, for this to be even plausible, and workable, you realise the size of code we'd be speaking here? Even then, it's incredibly unlikely everything would be covered.

    - Scripter not having to click a tile? Hah good on them, because a script will mess that up eventually. It cannot handle all the real terrain and other issues that can stop it.

    - Yes scripts are faster than humans, much faster, but that does not make them better. Scripts are essentially 'dumb' and operate in the same way over and over. Some are easier than others to outsmart, but it's entirely doable.



    A lot of these issues could be addressed with fairly simple fixes and not a great deal of effort to make scripting, not nearly that 'big' of a deal.

    I'm limited as to what I can say, to disprove most of your comments because of the RoC.

    Yes, these things exist, yes they will cause problems for your average player. Can they be beaten? Of course they can.

    Finally, the percentage of players would actually be able to run all these scripts effeciently and effectively, would not be high. The percentage that actually do, is even lower.

    Scripting to win in PvP = Loser.
     
  46. I agree with nixon...

    Scripts for the most part are easily defeatable in pvp. The more public a script is, the easier it is to defeat because a properly educated player can read the script and see what it's looking for.

    The example Nixon gave where he said the words to make the other player dismount himself is just one example. I have seen people do stuff to disable auto-healers as well.

    I also agree that only a loser uses scripts in pvp anyway [​IMG]

    It's important for players who want to be competitive in pvp to research scripts so that they can learn how to defeat all the most popular ones.
     
  47. Guest

    Guest Guest

    I had a big long thing written out to counter (just about) all your points when I realized I don't care.

    Go ahead. script away. Nothing bad could possibley go wrong.

    Great Plan.

    You can load all the scripts you want, and then we can fight and we can see which is better.
     
  48. RathofLS

    RathofLS Guest

    I really dispise cheaters in any fashion, its not ood for the game and its not good for my bank account. I play the game for the fun of it. personally cheats and in game programs other than those all are allowed to use ruin it sometimes for me.

    I really hate the teleport rail one if you want to cast and target the round recast target ground manually, I already have you dead. But rail teleporting and getting off moving shot while chugggin pots with an unbalanced bow, just does not seem possible and the speed these guys have. we tried to do it with UOA, and could not get it to work.
    Before anyone starts saying well maybe your computer is slow blah blah blah, I assure you thats not the problem.

    I am aloways hearin the develpoers say they hate cheaters and are working to catch them. Oh and we have banned XXX nubers of account. really which ones? I see the same guys today I did a year ago still cheating still doing things not possible with regualr game mechanics. the ones that I have made it a point to report each and every single time I see them doing something, heck even had one guy in my journal record saying what programs he was running while talkin to his friend telling him where to go to get them ect. (stealthed in) paged a GM. that was 4 months ago the guy is still in game, still doin the same things.

    The policy needs to change either everything is legal or it isnt. You say your banning people who are they, why cant we know? Fel is a dead land , trees are dead, its spooky. Why not place the bodys on ples along the road side so we can actually see what your doing. so everyone who is using or might use a program sees the results of their actions. Why do you guys never show up and monitor a site. We have had 15 guild member page a GM at the same site with no response.

    Im frustrated and basically pissed off over the lack of response on this issue. I dont want to see a number posted in ether, that means jack crap if we dont know who you have banned , and the nuber was 400? wow 400 let me see Im pretty sure alot of thiose had double accounts asuuming you guys actually banned all their accounts. hummm. so lets say 300 actual different people lets split that between the shards.....how many shards are there..29 30?..humm comes out to about 10 people per shard? oh wait alot of the people doing the really really nasty cheating and duping make seperate acount sunder others names, so basically you may have 5 average per shard. YOU HAVE DONE NOTHING ...and people see this No wonder cheating is so bad. IT IS YOUR FAULT. you keep using the loop hole of well the TOS says we dont owe you anything. Its amazing that this product does not follow the basic common curtsy of the marketplace.

    SO dont sit there and tell me how frustrated you are or how much you care . I would rather you just say nothing , so we all have no doubt wahat so ever that you are doing and will do nothing. Banning = less dollars and thats all your company cares about, just like alot of other companys. But this MRPG used to be special and stand out above the rest. But then again that was when thecreators wanted it to be the greatest MRPG ever. They are long gone and we are stuck with a corporation know for destroying all it touches in serch of the dollar.
     
  49. Guest

    Guest Guest

    If we fill out the feedback form on uo.com then at least we will know we tried to stop cheating in UO.

    If we don't then I guess we were too lazy to voice our opinions (~vote on the matter) to all of those in charge.

    I haven't voted with my feedback yet. [​IMG]
    I can't decide if I want to be vague about it or get into some details. Whether it should be one single feedback or a series devoted to individual issues with cheating.
    But I will send at least one message to uo.com's feedback soon because a fair playing field is quite important for overall enjoyment of any game, imho. [​IMG]
     
  50. Personally ... I go with the specific instance route ...
    1 more in the "general make it stop" column ...meh !

    1 more in the "recode water pitchers to only hold 1 fill" ...[​IMG]
    possible priority bump.

    Sure ... its gonna "compete", priority wise, with the 1 or 2 suggestions
    for attention by GMs on test shard (presence, training, enforcement)
    meh!

    BUT ... I've got my "vote in" ... in specific areas of concern To Me

    Feels more effective than a "general concern" ..
    but even ^That^ is better than pretending I could recode the whole Tamale ... but wont even offer a suggestion

    [​IMG]
    (guided by anecdotal comment here)


    Save UO - Save the cheerleaders<font color=red> ... </font color=red>(AesSedai 10/31/07)[​IMG]