1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.
  2. Greetings Guest!!

    In order to combat SPAM on the forums, all users are required to have a minimum of 2 posts before they can submit links in any post or thread.

    Dismiss Notice

Looting corpses and 100 Hiding/120 Stealth : I do NOT get it....

Discussion in 'UHall' started by popps, May 25, 2010.

  1. popps

    popps Always Present
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2004
    Messages:
    13,445
    Likes Received:
    461
    It is beyond my comprehension why, while at 100 GM Hiding and 120 Stealth level one can walk without trouble staying hidden, but not be able to loot a corpse without being revealed.

    Walking makes quite more noise so definately, IMHO, looting a corpse while being at the top hiding/stealthing level should never ever reveal from picking up the items............
     
  2. You went grey and got ganked then rage posted :lol:

    Look on it this way, how can one stealth and hide in an open field? Not all game mechanics make sense :D
     
  3. popps

    popps Always Present
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2004
    Messages:
    13,445
    Likes Received:
    461


    Not really, just found it annoying in high spawn areas not to be able to loot corpses while being hidden even when being 100 Hiding/120 Stealthing...........

    If one can walk staying all well hidden, then one should also be able to loot items off of corpses while being hidden at those top levels, I think.
     
  4. *grumbles something about it being just toooooooooo easy and would probably end in an infraction....*
     
  5. So should stealing be the same?
    Dunno why its like that, you can look in a monsters corpse while hidden but as soon as you go to pick anything up you get revealed, maybe they made it this way to stop people looting corpses back when something died anyone could loot it?
     
  6. G.v.P

    G.v.P Stratics Legend
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2004
    Messages:
    9,644
    Likes Received:
    831
    Because dragging an item from an innocent corpse results in a criminal flag. They could make it so whenever a thief loots an item from a corpse there's a check on the thief's stealing and/or snooping skill. However, even if you remained hidden while dragging items out of a corpse, people would sill be able to "see" your character, due to the way UO is currently scripted.

    Speaking of scripts, I could see someone running a loot script nonstop if you could loot while hidden.
     
  7. Wenchkin

    Wenchkin Babbling Loonie
    Stratics Veteran Alumni

    Joined:
    May 16, 2008
    Messages:
    2,779
    Likes Received:
    434
    I disagree Popps. You're concentrating on staying hidden and stashing loot, so it's perfectly reasonable that your concentration lapses for a moment when you open and loot the corpse. Or that bystanders might notice the corpse being tampered with.

    A thief gets revealed when they go to grab an item too.

    You don't think there could be any problems if players could stealth loot with zero risk? Really?

    Wenchy
     
  8. hen

    hen Certifiable
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2008
    Messages:
    1,709
    Likes Received:
    420
    If you time your hides you can loot corpses with no problems in a pvm environment.
     
  9. ARGH. I guess you are hidden but that halberd just floats up and disappears and no one notice it. Then the cutlass, the gold, that floating piece of armour no on notices clang into your bag.

    Come on.
     
  10. Tazar

    Tazar Guest

    Can you really pick up a pile of 500 or more gold coins without spilling some or knocking over part of the pile? When you grab that uber artifact wouldn't the pile of loot shift and something fall causing noise?

    Makes perfect sense to me.
     
  11. Harlequin

    Harlequin Babbling Loonie
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2008
    Messages:
    2,716
    Likes Received:
    32
    Popps, it's for balance reasons. Try to consider it from another angle - if you were looting a public corpse, then see loot disappearing from the corpse while you don't see anyone around, what would you think?

    Possibly 1 of these:
    1) That there's perhaps a stealther about that's looting the same corpse as you

    or

    2) That there's a new bug that is causing items to decay from corpses



    In case 1, what are the chances that you or some other poster will make a post to ask for stealthers to be revealed when they loot stuff, so that you know for sure the disappearing loot is due to other stealthers. And how many stealthers there are around you. And their names. Having 10 perma stealthers "ninja'ing" all the loot while being totally safe can be frustrating.

    In case 2, you or some other poster will make a post that will wrongly state that there is a new bug. And when you realize it's due to stealthers, you will make the same suggestions as point 1.



    Note: my main is a stealth mage. So even though it's immensely beneficial to me, I don't think it's a good idea to let stealthers remain hidden while looting corpses. Being able to loot stuff from the ground is good enough (think gold from champion spawn).
     
  12. R Traveler

    R Traveler Babbling Loonie
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2005
    Messages:
    2,950
    Likes Received:
    231
    at least you can view loot without revealing yourself.
     
  13. This first...
    And then this...
    With practice, you take take anything from a corpse and re-hide before you get re-targeted.
     
  14. gortman

    gortman Sage
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Dec 11, 2009
    Messages:
    630
    Likes Received:
    0
    Exactly what I was going to say. :)
     
  15. popps

    popps Always Present
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2004
    Messages:
    13,445
    Likes Received:
    461

    Well, I can understand that and I would not have a problem with getting un-hidden when the action turns one criminal (grey).

    I do question this when the revealing the looter happens also when the action involves no criminal flagging.



    Well, I would imagine this could be coded accordingly, couldn't it ?


    Well, besides the fact that soon scripting will be a thing of the past (hopefully), the corpse need be reasonably near the looter in order to pick items up.
    I am not knoweldged of scripts but can scripts get one to walk, automatically, to wherever a corpse falls ?

    And even if so, eventually one becomes overloaded. Sure, there is bag of sending or recalling out and in but it may come expensive as far as the bag of sending goes or make the script too complex and when something increases in complexity it can more easily malfunction at some point......

    But hopefully, scripting is going away from Ultima Online so........
     
  16. popps

    popps Always Present
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2004
    Messages:
    13,445
    Likes Received:
    461


    The only 2 problems I can possibly see is when this involves criminal flagging, but coding it accordingly could address this, and the other is scripting.

    But if scripting is going to be done with, finally, in Ultima Online, then it could not be problem, could it?
     
  17. Fink

    Fink Guest

    In my experience it's easier to walk silently or go unnoticed than it is to rob a corpse without arousing suspicion.

    Perhaps if you could describe the problem you're experiencing in exact detail and at length, along with any other questions that come to mind.
     
  18. Wenchkin

    Wenchkin Babbling Loonie
    Stratics Veteran Alumni

    Joined:
    May 16, 2008
    Messages:
    2,779
    Likes Received:
    434
    Well it's not a problem if you believe in free easy handouts I guess. I think that it would be very greedy and selfish of me to want the goodies for my stealthers without any risk or effort. Which is what you're asking for here.

    If stealthing was changed to not reveal you for looting, I could, for example tell a pet to guard me and sit watching TV while legally looting all the kills in complete safety.

    Or create a new character and simply scrounge off the efforts of others by trailing them and stealth looting from corpses. Especially during events when it might be laggy.

    I think that would be a very unpopular change among non stealthers and as a stealther myself I don't want or need such an easy ride either. I view stealth as a skill to help me travel safely, not one to remove the need to think, move the odd spawn or really interact with the game around me.

    Wenchy
     
  19. GarthGrey

    GarthGrey Crazed Zealot
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend GoT

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2003
    Messages:
    3,629
    Likes Received:
    1,392
    I'm gonna be hurting my own Thunter with this comment, but we can loot non dug up chests without being revealed. Wonder why ?
     
  20. dielock

    dielock Guest

    It's always been that way, get over it and figure how to get around it.
     
  21. RawHeadRex

    RawHeadRex Slightly Crazed
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2010
    Messages:
    1,324
    Likes Received:
    12
    somebody told me one can steal while hidden, wonder if that works on a corpse if anyone can verify this true.
     
  22. I just looked about 150K gold, and a dozen of the new reagents in the Abyss using just stealth to view the corpse and hiding to hide immediately afterward. In a high spawn area. Never failed once to re-hide. As long as there isn't lag (or a Renowned... found that they can instantly target) I have no issues.
     
  23. popps

    popps Always Present
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2004
    Messages:
    13,445
    Likes Received:
    461


    Well, investing 220 skill points into an ability hardly looks to me as "easy handouts"...

    I see it instead as a pay out for investing skill points in that ability.

    Sure, scripting might be a problem, but I am against scripting in the first place and I hope that with the upcoming changes we will no longer see scripting in Ultima Online.
     
  24. popps

    popps Always Present
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2004
    Messages:
    13,445
    Likes Received:
    461

    Non dug up means not yet spawned. That is, not existing yet.

    How would anyone be able to loot items from a chest which has not even spawned yet ?

    What am I missing here ?
     
  25. Rumil of Lorain

    Rumil of Lorain Journeyman
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2005
    Messages:
    169
    Likes Received:
    0
    I usually have no problem looting and hiding on my thief, but on my bard it seems as soon as I come out of hiding I am targeted, I mean it isnt a big deal I just area peace and go about my business
     
  26. maroite

    maroite Guest

    Think thats bad? Ask the devs why a human with JoAT can easily track a PC with 120 stealth/100 hiding. lol rolleyes:
     
  27. RawHeadRex

    RawHeadRex Slightly Crazed
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2010
    Messages:
    1,324
    Likes Received:
    12
    you need to adapt and put points into Track Evasion ... :lol:

    when the stealth bombers fly over the enemy, the enemy knows they are up there, they just can't aim/lock or see them... but they know they are up there.
     
  28. JC the Builder

    JC the Builder Crazed Zealot
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    May 12, 2008
    Messages:
    3,154
    Likes Received:
    708
    If you could loot while hidden it would make hunting as a tamer ridiculously easy. It is already a problem with tamers hiding and getting silver/artifacts. Being able to loot would make it completely unbalanced.
     
  29. Saunders

    Saunders Lore Keeper
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2008
    Messages:
    850
    Likes Received:
    4
    Maybe the ones that spawn in dungeons?

    Treasure hunters often train lockpicking on these, as well as looting them.
     
  30. Wenchkin

    Wenchkin Babbling Loonie
    Stratics Veteran Alumni

    Joined:
    May 16, 2008
    Messages:
    2,779
    Likes Received:
    434
    Popps I wasn't talking about scripting examples, I was talking about situations where zero risk and effort on the part of the stealther would give them free loot. I don't care if they had to "invest" some skill points for it, they're easy skills to train and with soulstones nobody has to commit to the template - I could share hide/stealth between all 7 chars on my account if I wanted. That argument doesn't wash with me at all Popps.

    I don't have stealth so I can loot, i have it to do the following:

    • Move invisibly around letal spawns to scout or just avoid spawn.
    • Evade/sneak past PKs or scout for them.
    • Searching for new pets - being able to lore potential tames. Not to mention the possibilities if I also have herding on that template.
    • Avoiding insta death by lurer, deliberate or unintentional.
    • Surviving group hunts to rez stricken members so we don't have to give up.
    • Recovering corpses when newly rezzed.
    That's just a few examples for my tamer. I haven't included my thief in that list. Stealth is more than worthwhile when it lets me do all that. Stealthing from A to B unnoticed is enough actually. I might not be able to loot corpses while hidden, but I know how to use my template to move spawn away so I can loot safely. You could do exactly the same thing if you tried.

    Stealth has saved me many millions in insurance gold, so your view that stealth should pay you back is misguided - it already has paid you back. You just want more than that.

    I have to laugh when I think what it would be like if you got your way with this though. My fisher chef would be taking more risks fishing up a normal fish in the deep sea than my stealther looting high end kills in the depths of a dungeon. But that's what you're asking for.

    Wenchy
     
  31. Der Rock

    Der Rock Guest

    i agree ,so much skillpoints invested should have more benefits ;)
     
  32. popps

    popps Always Present
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2004
    Messages:
    13,445
    Likes Received:
    461


    I thought that tamers had to maintain "line of sight" with their pets to prevent them from going wild.....

    This, especially in a high spawn area environment where the pet is under fire from multiple spawn.

    Therefore, a tamer could not just stay hidden all the time but from time to time it would be necessary to come visible to maintain the line of sight with the pet.

    Did I know wrong ?
     
  33. Dropping a piece of food on a pet to regain loyalty once every hour or so isn't going to worry a tamer much.
     
  34. Wenchkin

    Wenchkin Babbling Loonie
    Stratics Veteran Alumni

    Joined:
    May 16, 2008
    Messages:
    2,779
    Likes Received:
    434
    Exactly. Even telling the pet to guard you again - do it while the pet is targeted and fighting the spawn and hide afterwards. No risk. When you're attended as a stealther, generally death means you screwed up.

    Wenchy
     
  35. popps

    popps Always Present
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2004
    Messages:
    13,445
    Likes Received:
    461


    Sure, it works, but doesn't it get old and really annoying after having to do it a few times??

    I mean, a corpse as several items and several corpses have that times 10, times 20, times.....

    It can REALLY get old to do it over and over for each and every individual item over many corpses in a high spawn area........
     
  36. A bit of an exaggeration there. A smart person would pick and choose and only take one or two things off every corpse. If you want to grab everything off the corpse, you don't do it in a high spawn area, but would use swoops or miasma where the average loot is better and it's safer to loot everything.

    If I am going to use the hide and stealth technique, I open several corpses at once and decide ahead of time which items are worth looting before revealing myself. It's easily done, and I've only got 96 stealth and 100 hiding.
     
  37. The palmer

    The palmer Visitor

    Joined:
    May 26, 2010
    Messages:
    4
    Likes Received:
    0
    You're actually moaning that a technique that essentially has 0 risk and 100% reward is too much hastle for you?
     
  38. chuckoatl

    chuckoatl Guest

    Your already walking by monsters (through them more than likely too) that would eat your face. What more do you want?
     
  39. I can go almost anywhere in the game with my stealther, except with a bit of difficulty in a few areas with critters that do aura damage. I only lose my body if I get disconnected. I use this character to mark runes in otherwise inaccessible areas, look for dungeon steals, and sometimes just scope out the action in PvP areas... oh, and to loot corpses in high spawn area with little risk. It's well worth the 200 skill points to me.
     
  40. JC the Builder

    JC the Builder Crazed Zealot
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
    May 12, 2008
    Messages:
    3,154
    Likes Received:
    708
    I have let pets out for hours by themselves and they barely lose any loyalty. Maybe they changed it more recently.