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[Fishing] Monger Reputation

Discussion in 'UO Fishing and Treasure Hunting' started by SashaSeeks, Nov 16, 2010.

  1. SashaSeeks

    SashaSeeks Seasoned Veteran
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    I went back and reviewed, the FAQ in Uoherald about the monger reputations, and it DOES NOT WORK as posted!!!

    Prime example, I have three orders currently in my boat, for king crab. The first order called for 20, and I did not drop it off yet, as I did not have the 20 King Crab, in lieu I had dropped off another order that I could fill. Then I got a second order NOW asking for only 10 King Crab, again, I dropped off another order that I could fill, but not the ones for the kings. So now I have an order for 20 king crab, that I had gotten last night, and have added to it, an order of 10 King crab, plus misc other fishes/crabs/lobsters. So I just went and picked up another order. That is now calling for only 5 King CRAB. So my reputation has seemed to drop simply by not delivering the order before picking up another one. So first order in my boat is for 20 king, sencond order is for 10 King, and now the latest order is for only 5 King. I have not dropped a single quest since I have started in the high seas. But yet I am getting orders for only 5 Items, after I had already filled orders for 20!! So by either not accepting a quest or not delivering quest 1 before delivering quest 2 I seem to be dropping in reputatioin!!!

    How does the reputation work with the Fish Monger quests?
    • Will there be a way to view one's reputation?
    • How much is lost by dropping a quest?
    Shade:
    • You gain reputation by completing orders. The more orders you complete, the better chance that when a fishmonger has a big order, they will give the business to you. The maximum possible quantity requested for any line item is 20. The maximum number of line items is 6. This means, that the largest possible order can contain 120 fish. The rewards change with the size of the order. Some rewards are exclusive to certain order size brackets.
    • As in life, your reputation with the fishmongers is not quantifiable in a single number like a stat. If you want to see how good your reputation is, see how many big orders you have in your hold.
    • If you drop a fishmonger quest, you drop a reputation level on each of the fish in the order. If you have a quest for 10 haddock and you drop the quest, the next time a fish monger asks you for haddock you will be asked for 5. It can never go lower than 5. The quantity levels are 5, 10, 15, 20 but you start at 10. There is no other penalty, so don’t worry if you have to dump your orders to dry dock you ship. However, know that being fickle will hurt your reputation in UO as it does in life.
     
  2. Petra Fyde

    Petra Fyde Peerless Chatterbox
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    I believe you lose reputation if you speak the to the fishmonger for whom the delivery is meant before you complete it. I did that in Papua, went to talk to him and I'd forgotten to put the fish in the box. The quest he offered me was for 5 pike :(
     
  3. SashaSeeks

    SashaSeeks Seasoned Veteran
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    I don't believe that was the case Petra. I had only been going to three mongers. So had no need to speak to him. It seems that the orders need to be delivered in the order they were picked up, or else you lose reputation, if they give you another one for the same type fish/crab that is yet in your boat. Its like the mongers are saying, " you weren't able to deliver 20 king, so we will see if you can handle this order for only 10, oops you didn't deliver the 20, or the 10, so lets see if you can handle one for just 5".

    PS this would also explain, why I keep getting quests over and over again for snow or king. Because I did not have enough to fill the order before picking up another one for the same thing. Like I'm getting tested over and over on if I can fill orders for 20.
     
  4. Petra Fyde

    Petra Fyde Peerless Chatterbox
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    :( there is certainly something other than cancelling an order that can lose you reputation. I think we need some clarification. It's possible we're both right, and either scenario can be detrimental.
     
  5. SashaSeeks

    SashaSeeks Seasoned Veteran
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    Indeed, I'm with you Petra, certainly a lot more going on than what the devs are telling us.

    It seems they need to be delivered in order to keep reputation in good standing. Which would make sense in RL. Monger 1 doesn't want his fish rotting, while you side track and fill order # 2 instead. In the past I had gone to wrong monger, but at that time, I was not paying as much attention to what my orders were. So that may have explained the 5's I had gotten in the past, before I realized 5's were do to bad rep.
     
  6. Lorddog

    Lorddog Crazed Zealot
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    i had already posted what I think this is. if you have a fish at a certain level in hold then the next order will be -5 from it. regardless of who fish mongul your talking to.

    if you have a 1st quest of
    fish A 15
    fish b 15
    fish c 20

    then you go get another quest at the same time
    fish E 15
    fish A 10
    fish F 20

    then you go get another quest at the same time
    fish A 5
    fish b 10
    fish G 15

    in this case if you turned in the 3rd quest last you might get your repuation for that fish just moved to (fish A 10) since you lastly turned in a (fish A 5)

    even if that is not so the turning in of quest 3 would be a waste of time as it would not advance your rep?

    unless their code actually says that when you turn in a fish of no matter what level you get a gain of +5 to whatever your level is. in this last case it would actually benefit you as you used less fish to gain a level in a higher level (ie went from 15 to 20).

    Lorddog
     
  7. Sellingahouse

    Sellingahouse Seasoned Veteran
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    hello
    Im just getting my quest for one FM only. When you get an order for 20 the next time it goes down to 10 then next time it is 15 next time it is 20 then back to 10.

    I never get an order for 5 fish, but I only do one quest at a time. I posted this a few weeks ago in the 5 on friday about getting orders for 5 fish. When I figured it out I started doing only one quest I would get a +5 about every 15 to 20 quest. Now Im trying it with only going to one FM, the one in brit in hopes of getting the +10.
     
  8. Basara

    Basara UO Forum Moderator
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    I think that the 5/10/15/20 part of reputation is a CAP, not a given.

    if you're at the base "10", then the best you can get is a 10-count quest for that fish.

    if you're down to "5" you only get 5-counts.

    if you're at the 20-level reputation, you can still get 5, 10 or 15 count ones.

    Think of it as how a Smith under 70 skill can only get small iron normal BODs - but one over 70, while they get access to the full spread of BODs, still gets a lot of small iron normals.
     
  9. Umfufu

    Umfufu Journeyman
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    Ok ...
    Since 2 days I am doing these Quests again ...
    This time I have recorded each Quest in an Excel sheet. With what Silverbird just wrote i looked at my sheet.

    As I am doing one Quest at a time, and picking up a new Quest at each destination, I hope to avoid any confusion about or resigning or refusing a Quest.

    Because Silverbird said he uses just the one Monger I sorted my data on Pickup point, that all made no sense at all and no logic was to be found.
    Then I undid the sort and just looked at my data as I put it by Quest nr.

    The results are shocking to me ...

    It does not matter WHO you quest for ...
    Siverbird is right, per fishtype the amounts you have to fetch alternate between 10-15-20 fish, and if you Cancel OR Refuse a Quest you will get a 5 inbetween.
    But is alternates between ALL Mongers !!!

    If what I say is true I am SOOOOOO DONE with this fishing because now besides all the efforts we put in we ALSO depend on a LUCK factor on TOP of all !!

    Sorry if this is not clear ... I try to say again ...
    I did the Quests one by one, picking up a new Quest at the destination ... meaning I did all Mongers in random order and no 2 times same pickup Monger in a row.
    My sheet shows me no matter where you pick up the Quest, the number keep alternating 10-15-20 per FISH TYPE.

    Also Petra is RIGHT ... I have not CANCEL OR REFUSE a quest, but DID speak to the Monger with an EMPTY crate because I forgot to put the fish in before I ATTEMPTED to turn in the Quest, and guess ... I got the one and only 5 line direct after this failed turnin attempt.
    And it did not set me back ONE step, it set me back ALL the way, from 15 fish the line before to 5 fish the next line.
    I think this is utterly wrong to have this in the system.

    What I also feel as a super dissapointment is we looking at this ALL WRONG.
    Reputation may determine somehow how many lines you get to a certain point.
    106 skill will allow the Dungeon Fish to be included in the deliveries.
    In the end Reputaion means NOTHING !

    But basicly all boils down again to this typical UO RNG/LUCK thing with in this case for what you get in return INCREDIBLE HORRIBLE ODDS.

    Think about it ....

    first you draw from a pool from:
    1 to 6 lines
    Can we say the odds are 1 out of 6 to get a 6 liner?

    to fill out if a pool of:
    54 types of fish

    12 Crab/Lobster types
    12 Shore Fish types
    18 Deep Sea Fish types
    12 Dungeon Fish types

    All these 54 types keep alternating between the quantaties 10-15-20.
    And if you cancel or make a MISTAKE you can add a 5 to this.

    So can I say each type has a 1 out of 3 chance to be a quantaty 20 ?

    My conclusion, you have to HOPE to get a 6 liner, and HOPE that the 6 fish types the sytem picks are the higher tier ones, and then HOPE they then HAPPEN to be in the 20 quantaty rage.

    As I look at this there is absolutly nothing you, me ... we ... can do with all our hard work to EARN a 120 PS scroll.
    In the end you just have to hope & pray that one day the gods are with you and you get the "MAGICAL 6 LINER"

    There ... I feel like a complete idiot ... again ...

    Imho I will get 960 105 PS faster to bind a 120 PS then the chance of hitting the jackpot in this LOTTERY
    I did realize some luck was needed here, but until just now I never imagined it basicly all boiled down to pure luck.
    That little influeance we have is nothing compaired to the luck factor involved here.

    I leave it upto smart mathheads to do the math of the odds of getting enough points to earn a 120 PS or a 115 PS for that matter.

    I think together we finally nailed the system.
    Myself I believe all I just wrote.
    If I am right, and certainly compaired to what I gain as a 120 fisher, this could be the hardest obtainable scroll ingame.
    Prove me wrong if not.

    I wonder how the devs will fix this.

    My Sheet:

    [​IMG]

    Well ... back to Sports Fishing ...

    :heart: Umfufu
     
  10. SashaSeeks

    SashaSeeks Seasoned Veteran
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    Umfufu,
    Well I have no problem getting 6 liners, but 3 or 4 of the six lines are for stinking crabs and lobsters, but usually more towards one type, kings and snows are killing me, along with shovel lobs. I have turned in so many 6 lines, it is unreal, but all I get are baits, or books, and a lot of headaches.

    I tried doing just 3 mongers at a time, only accepting quests from them, filled the orders that I readily had stuff for, but then noticed that I started recieving orders for 5 of one type fish, where it had been twenty. I don't feel that it is right that your rep. should drop by clicking wrong monger, or forgetting to put a fish in an order, or by refusing an order. But it seems that the whole thing is whacked out no matter which way you look at it. I am tired of orders with almost 80 something crab/lobster, to get nothing but a rare book that I have tons of. I really don't see at this point, what good a 120 powerscroll is gonna do, and if it is even gonna be worth it. I mean what fun is spending your life lobstering and crabbing to turn around and do it again and again and again, with no hopes of getting anywhere.

    Basara made a comparison to BODs, but at least with bods, you don't lose reputation, (if that even means anything at this point), by not filling one. Also there are set rewards for just say a val bod. I can get a 105 ps with a 2 liner quest of junk fish, or a 105 with a 6 line, multi crab/fish quest. ON the other side, I can get anywhere from a 7 use barridcuda bait to a 60-70 use baricuda bait. I catch them all the time with no bait, as is. Yet when I use a more elusive bait, I catch nothing with it. So I so far am not seeing any great rewards for the headaches. The thing that kept me going was trying to get the "puzzle" worked out, but it seems it is all so totally random.

    I will take a peek at the spread sheet ya made later, and see if there is any kind of trend that I can see. But from the sounds of it, sounds like the only trend is the wacked out RNG. And a system with no real system behind it.
     
  11. popps

    popps Always Present
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    This one is a TOTAL and UTTER shocker to me.

    I mean, I can possibly understand that refusing to complete a quest might get one to drop reputation but merely talking to a fishmonger while the Quest is "ongling" though not yet complete ?

    This GOT TO BE a bug........

    Though, I understand why I keep getting one liner orders even though I NEVER EVER refused 1 Quest and did ALL of those that were thrown at me.

    I talk to mongers a LOT just to check if they have orders for me.

    Every port I go I talk to mongers and sometimes I talk 2 or 3 times to make sure they have no fresh orders for me.

    Just talking to them drops my reputation ???

    This is insane, IMHO.
     
  12. SashaSeeks

    SashaSeeks Seasoned Veteran
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    I hadn't been talking to the mongers, per say, but I had started refusing some quests, in order to try to work just three mongers, but it seems that simply refusing a quest, also drops your reputation. I did not cancel any, just simply refused. The sad part about this, is that the monger automatically offers you a quest, just by turning something into them.

    So it seems about the only thing you can do to keep your rep up, is to do the quests one by one, from port to port, and hope you don't accidently click on him again in the meantime, then the rest is completely up to the RNG. It still had seemed to me, that by not doing the quests in the proper sequence recieved had an affect also, but it is possible that it was the act of refusing the quests that started dropping my fishes down to 5's.
     
  13. Umfufu

    Umfufu Journeyman
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    But you see, there IS a system behind it ...
    And from I think to have figured out ... I do not like what I see AT ALL ...

    Why? ... RNG! ... it just has a too big role in this ...

    Facts we think we have:

    Fish/Crabs have points assigned to them:

    0.5 Shore Fish - Crabs/Lobsters
    1.0 Deep Sea Fish
    1.5 Dungeon Fish

    Now this all fits, I put a calculation for this in my sheet, when I got a delivery I entered the delivery in my sheet, and know in advance IF I get baits, exactly how many I will get.
    I get exactly the total number of points rounded down if it has a decimel.

    Which bait you get I can only guess it is as one suggested earlier mainly tied to your own fishing skill, maybe reputation has a little to do with it ... am not sure.

    For the loot table in general I still have a hard time figuring this out because for me it behaves very erratic.

    Clear to me is, for the low end loottable, the number of lines you get is not as important then what Quantaty & TYPE of fish you get.
    For example:

    Delivery 1:
    20 Snow Crab
    15 Blue Crab
    10 Spiney Lobster
    20 Redbelly Dream
    10 Pike
    15 Cape Cod

    Looks impressive ... these 6 lines net you 52.5 points

    Delivery 2:
    20 Bonito
    15 Infernal Tuna
    10 Orc Bass

    Only 3 lines ... 57.5 points though ...

    If you are going for 105 PS and like to collect Baits, Books & Lava gear these orders are perfectly fine.
    If you are hoping for a 110, 115 or 120 PS ... these orders are crap !

    Fish types alternate thier quantaties each time they are listed in a delivery.

    In general 10-15-20, unless something goes wrong intentionally or not, this seems to "reset" the count and you can start from 5 working your way upto the normal cycle again.

    1 to 6 lines ... 54 types of fish/crabs to fill those lines ... each of the 54 types is in it's own quantaty cycle mostly with 3 options 10-15-20.

    And seems now that some people have more often the 4th option "5" as they thought they had due to the fact it seems not only aborting an exsistig Quest but also a refuse or too early attempt to turn it in also triggers a "reset"

    What I suspect:

    Don't even think about getting any PS beyond 105 under 100 points.
    I guess each scroll has a minimum amount points needed for it to appear in the reward pool.

    I think I ... many of us ... reached max reputaion long ago ...

    Due to the 3 wannabe facts stated above I think the chances to get a 6 liner with just the right fish in it, in maybe 15 but mostly 20 quantaty is pure LUCK.
    Nothing else, all we can do is Quest our behinds off hoping one day the odds are favored to you.
    And I feel these odds are very slim.

    If I am right I can understand the "reputation hit" when aborting a quest, to prevent us from just take-abort-take quest till hit the "Magical 6 Liners" and then just do those.
    But as it is now ... for me ... it feels like a too big of a lottery.
    Doing a Quest is like buying a lot in this lottery, and as soon as you look at the crate to see the delivery ... you already know if you have a CHANCE to win or lost.

    It upto each one personally to value the Baits, Books, Lava Gear and PS, and if they think it worth it to play this lottery.

    Myself I will Quest when in the mood for it, and really do hope the "review" devs are doing on this nets a wee bit more positvie result.
    Untill this time, I am assuming I have to Quest for 960 105 PS :D

    I am wondering if anyone is smart enough to calculate my chances of getting a 6 liner with only lines of Deep Sea Fish/Dungeon Fish in only 20 quantaty?

    And exactly these orders will not even give you a chance to a 110, 80 crabs, is atleast 4 lines and nets only 40 points !!

    Any order with more then 2 lines with Shore Fish/Crabs will not net you a high lvl PS.

    :heart: Umfufu
     
  14. B_Barracuda

    B_Barracuda Guest

    very intersting!

    it is one thing to wonder how game developers can mess up a theoretically great booster so damn well (fishing, sea battles, cannons). it is yet another thing to have neither presented a fix NOR an explanation to the community for 2 months.

    i have given up on fishing quests many weeks ago, because i soon noticed that either it is yet another mindless treadmill in which case i will give up fishing altogether. or it is horribly bugged in which case i will wait until it is fixed.

    during the past weeks i been fishing whenever i felt like it, but without doing any fishmonger quests. i just stockpile the fish and i already have gathered almost 200 of each (shore, deep sea, dungeon fish). crab and lobster catching i have given up completely, since i mostly catch the useless regular crab/lobster; waste of time!

    i had some fun with MIBs though, because my house is now full with all these bottles.

    thanks for the interesting study and statistics! you must be very passionate about fishing in UO...
     
  15. pacific cruiser

    pacific cruiser Seasoned Veteran
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    wowza i was looking for anything in the new publish coming out concerning this fishing quest thing and unfortunatly i saw nothing related to fishing...It would be nice if someone higher up would come out and say something, if not adjust it so where we had goals to achieve rather then this nonsense we now have..Problem is i like fishing heheh it is rather addictive ...but he crabbing and lobstering is like having a migrain...
     
  16. popps

    popps Always Present
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  17. Lorddog

    Lorddog Crazed Zealot
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    what if in the programming it adds +5 to the fish and when you get it for having a 20 already it says 20 + 5 = over max amount, so it resets it (back to 10)
    just a simple programming mistake
     
  18. NuSair

    NuSair Babbling Loonie
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    I just got a 5 Walleye order from brit after I had just got and completed a 6 liner with 2 lobsters (35 total) 4 crab (70total) from brit.


    Explain that?

    I have not refused any orders. But, I did make a delivery to Brit on the way.

    For those that want to know, I got Giant Koi Bait for the huge order.
     
  19. SashaSeeks

    SashaSeeks Seasoned Veteran
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    NuSair, you got the order for the "5 walley" because of something you did during the last time you had an order for walley. Whether you spoke to a wrong monger, refused an order, cancelled an order, approached a monger without all your fish in the crate, whatever. There is no telling what else will drop your rep. But it was most likely something while last carrying an order for walley.

    Now for your 6 line order for crab/lobster combo, I feel for ya, that just plain sucks, and you don't get much of a reward for all that work. I have had so many 6 liners, with at least 4 of em being crab or lobster, I don't ever want to see a crustation again. But of course now I have an order for 20 shovels, which for me are like snows. Can't catch the devils.

    Love the last couple analogies.....Fishing quests = treadmill, and crabbing and lobstering = migraine!!!! How fitting those two terms seem.
     
  20. SashaSeeks

    SashaSeeks Seasoned Veteran
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  21. NuSair

    NuSair Babbling Loonie
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    I go to all the fish mongers. I speak to them a number of times each, like if I have 3 to deliver to brit, but still crabbing to fill it, I'll go ahead and turn them in.

    I guess what I am saying is that it looks like from what happened to me, is that you do lose reputation just from talking with them. I accept every one I get, I don't cancel or refuse any.
     
  22. SashaSeeks

    SashaSeeks Seasoned Veteran
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    Yep, you will lose rep from repeatly talking to monger.
     
  23. SonnPrime

    SonnPrime Guest

    Taking all the above into consideration, I filled all my remaining quests and started doing only one at a time. Well, it may just be coincidence, but on my second quest doing one at a time, I got a 105 PS from a 3 liner worth 25 points. Go figure. I am wondering if having (after the patch) more than one crate in your hold automatically prevents a PS reward?
     
  24. Basara

    Basara UO Forum Moderator
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    Except that the programmers say otherwise...

    Meaning, either it's your imagination, or it's a bug.
     
  25. SashaSeeks

    SashaSeeks Seasoned Veteran
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    Congrates on your 105 Sonnprime,
    I personally don't think switching over to the single quest at a time did it, but you never know. I just starting doing quests one at a time about two or three days ago, and since that time I have not recieved any 105 ps's. Before that I had sometimes gotten two 105 ps's in a row. It doesn't seem to matter if it is a 2-liner or a 6-liner. Seems more like the wacked out RNG than anything. My husband hasn't recieved a 105 ps since he started doing single quests either.

    For now I think we are gonna try and wait again to see if the Devs will do something this time. At least they are responding to us now.
     
  26. SashaSeeks

    SashaSeeks Seasoned Veteran
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    Yep I think it is the "Imagination Bug" He he he