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New Shame Lootsystem good for UO?

Discussion in 'UHall' started by lucitus, Nov 19, 2011.

  1. lucitus

    lucitus UOEC Modder
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    Iam skeptical regarding the new lootsystem, i would say the items are much too powerfull and the droprate is too high. By the way it makes all other dungeons, hunts, bosses and crafting useless.

    Crafting was for years very hard, then Imbuing comes in and crafters get more power again, but not all only Imbuing not the real crafting. Now with the new Shame only Lootsystem the whole systems around, Artifacts, Doom, Peerless, Runiccrafting all completly useless! Why should i go there when it is so easy to get relict fragments of out Shame?

    What is with the new sea encounters, now more useless than ever before with casting focus dropping in mass.

    The last time they touched the item system is this drastic way was with Age of Shadows, now with the massive cap increase all get screwed up.

    If this is the right decesion, iam not sure...
     
  2. Viquire

    Viquire Crazed Zealot
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    It's going to generate a lot of interest for four to six months. That is a good thing.

    How well it folds itself into existing systems is a question in my mind also. We'll have to watch and see.
     
  3. aarons6

    aarons6 Certifiable
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    i think the drops are fine.. while most of the stuff is very powerful its almost always missing something..

    mage armor, swing speed, resists.. something is always missing to be really powerful.
     
  4. Gospel

    Gospel Seasoned Veteran
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    Caps for properties on characters have not been raised, so all this system does is make putting together "perfect" suits easier and cheaper. It has been possible for a long time. Seems obvious that the new system is not pumping out non-capped stats like SDI on any equipment that can not be matched or bested by current artifacts, so it's harmless. I wish people would stop with these ridiculous posts.
     
  5. Zosimus

    Zosimus Grand Inquisitor
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    Some of it cant be repaired or POF so not all this cool new lewt is going to stay in the game when it breaks. Kind of like old UO items that has faded away back in the day :p
     
  6. Subliminator

    Subliminator Visitor

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    I haven't replaced a thing yet. So far this loot is hilariously bad. If anything this is going to die off after enough items with mediocre stats and crushing penalties get thrown away.
     
  7. CovenantX

    CovenantX Babbling Loonie
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    keep in mind, this is only the first revamp, lets hope they revamp ALL the dungeons including SE,ML & SA dungeons along with the bosses artie drops.
     
  8. Ultimaholic

    Ultimaholic Guest

    THIS.

    No matter what they do,it will never be good enough for some people.
     
  9. lucitus

    lucitus UOEC Modder
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    This is another thing, for now doing an interesting boss is more useless than before and sorry Shame is Shame, the new Shame is also not more interesting than the old, monsters with a lot of hitpoints now.

    Dont understand me wrong iam not saying the general idea behind it is bad and the work too, only how they implemented it could be better. Why they used new tinted ugly mobs instead of revamping the old monsters general in the world?

    I dont like to see all dungeons with new colored mobs, please devs if you are finished use the old models instead.
     
  10. curlybeard

    curlybeard Seasoned Veteran
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    At best I will be able to add one more nearly maxed stat to my suit. This change will likely give me months of hunting for that final perfect piece. I don't see it as unbalancing.

    The chance for some reward will keep me in the legacy dungeons. It's like the imbuing ingredients that drop in the abyss. I choose to hunt in the abyss to collect the imbuing ingredients I may need in the future. I fight the renowned wyvern for the unlikely chance that I will get insane tinker legs. This is another change that keeps me on the treadmill and paying my monthly subscription.

    The mannequins are a great compliment to the shame loot.
     
  11. Madrid

    Madrid Slightly Crazed
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    I totally agree Lucitus these items are way over the top. Who cares if they break or can't be fixed if they can be farmed in perpetuity it doesn't matter.
     
  12. Dermott of LS

    Dermott of LS UOEC Modder
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    ...

    If the monsters in PvM weren't also being very heavily tweaked (as anyone who has been to Shame can attest), then there might be an issue. As it is, the new loot accomplishes several things:

    1. It has generated new interest in the loot system (whereas before it was either ignored at worst, or used as resources for other systems).

    2. "Breaks" established suit builds and gives people reason to build new ones thanks to themed mod rolls.

    3. Allows for higher power at significant costs (And who knows, with different dungeons we may see more negative mods beyond simply -100 Luck... imagine -SSI or -DI as a "curse")

    4. Monster revamps make the classic monsters fun again as well as adding in many new versions to flesh out the system even further (Earth Elem, Greater Earth Elem, Molten Earth elem, etc). No longer are they simple one-hit pushovers, they're now a reasonable challenge that a player can set based on what level they delve down to that even when not overwhelming, at least take some effort. With that being said, I can imagine that my spot in Hyth (Level 2 room with several gargs and 2 daemons) that once I get established can let run on its own only paying attention to loot now will become pretty damn tough under the new system.

    Overall, at least short term, it's a good thing. We'll have to see how the rest of the system fleshes out.
     
  13. Subliminator

    Subliminator Visitor

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    Cluebat: Keeping people farming gear, then replacing gear, then whatever, is a good thing.
     
  14. Cerwin Vega

    Cerwin Vega Lore Keeper
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    I think the loot is fine but for as tough as some of the stuff is i think they could drop alittle more gold.
     
  15. Uvtha

    Uvtha Grand Poobah
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    Its good on one hand... a good source of relics, a good source of good gear (lots of the non cursed stuff is near artifact quality).

    On the other hand... how will they ever make an designed artifact ever again? The power levels can only go so high, and shame loot is a like 200% jump from any other monster drops prior. Doom is now officially pointless as are most artifacts.
     
  16. Gospel

    Gospel Seasoned Veteran
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    This is incorrect. A basic understanding of item properties and their caps on characters will show that the stuff coming out now is not really better than the higher end artifacts. Stop encouraging the paranoia.
     
  17. Dermott of LS

    Dermott of LS UOEC Modder
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    ...

    There are SOME items that put Arties to shame, but that's mainly going to be the Jewelry pieces because they can roll Brittle and/or Cannot be Repaired and end up with free mods because they don't have durability. There's been a bracelet posted that makes the Ornament look like throwaway trash because of this.

    Granted these are probably very few and far between and only from the top end creatures. I doubt anyone is going to be getting a bracelet like the example posted from a Mud Pie.
     
  18. aarons6

    aarons6 Certifiable
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    plus artifacts are all the same, meaning if you need more then 1 you dont have to farm 1000 random variables to get it..

    i like some of the stuff, but most of it is not super..

    the dci jewlery im getting most of the time has sdi and di on it
    most of the really super weapons dont have di or swing speed on it.
    and a lot of the really super armor pieces dont have high resists.


    not to mention 90% of them are brittle and cant be repaired if they arent cursed.
     
  19. lucitus

    lucitus UOEC Modder
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    The problem i see is also it destroys the whole other looting and crafting. I think of SSI on shields and other crazy things. For now there were clear caps on items, which is special and what can be reached, with Imbuing which was created with that old system it also has the same limitations. Now with the new system the caps are 200% over the top, maybe as intensive test on Test Center i could accept it, but releasing it to Origin and to the world with no change 2 days later that was a failure in my eyes.

    We will see what happen, but one i can say other farming locations these days are completly out now. Designed systems like Doom, ML bosses, SA bosses, HS bosses, are compelty useless now and thats all because one old dungeon get revamped, sad!

    And by the way i like to see stronger old monsters, but OLD monsters not renamed colored earth elements with 300% more hitpoints ;) Revamp old earth elemental no problem, recoloring and renaming no!
     
  20. Hera - Siege

    Hera - Siege Lore Master
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    He is correct. I've picked up a FCR4 ring out of shame with LMC 10% and I don't recall what else. This is essentially an orny without the FC and Energy Resist. I imbue it with some SDI and I'm set to go, I assume, like myself, many PvM mages go for FCR and dump FC due to running protection. Most artifacts are already useless and the useful ones: RBC, etc are having items that are close to them come out of shame.
     
  21. Gospel

    Gospel Seasoned Veteran
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    I haven't seen that screenshot, sounds interesting. Unless the jewelry is spawning with 2FC property on it though, Orny will continue to be the best at what it does.

    Some other examples are;

    Inquisitor's Resolution (3 FCR)
    Crystalline Ring (all but the MR)
    Hat of the Magi (SDI)
    Midnight Bracers (SDI + 20 Skill)
    Totem of the Void (10lmc)
    Crimson Cincture (obvious)

    There's 3 ML arties and 3 Doom arties that cannot be replicated or improved upon by the new loot system. I'm not sure how I can make this any more clear to the OP and his supporters. The old artifacts which have always benn good are still good for the same reasons.
     
  22. Dermott of LS

    Dermott of LS UOEC Modder
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    ...

    [​IMG]

    Here ya go, Orny without the Energy Resist but with MANY other addition properties to make up for it.
     
  23. GalenKnighthawke

    GalenKnighthawke Grand Poobah
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    FC1.

    Orni has FC2.

    In other words with it and the Inquisitor's Resolution, or even the Orni and the Night-Eyes glasses, your ring is a totally free slot on which you can have whatever you wish.

    Don't get me wrong, that is a great bracelet.

    In objective terms it may even indeed be better than the Orni.

    But by definition it can't replace the Orni.

    But even if the Doom Artifacts were to be supplanted entirely, not like it's without precedent in this game for something to be good for awhile, then supplanted.

    Things change.

    -Galen's player
     
  24. Gospel

    Gospel Seasoned Veteran
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    Peed a little when I looked at that. Thanks for digging up the screenshot.

    Still though, the big difference between Orny and any other bracelet is the FC2, and as long as no random drop produces that I think Orny holds its place among the elite.
     
  25. This is the Jester's Dance. Nothing more.
     
  26. Ahuaeyjnkxs

    Ahuaeyjnkxs stranger diamond

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    hey hey now... whats wrong with my dance ?

    :drama:
     
  27. Uvtha

    Uvtha Grand Poobah
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    Yes, Orny is still Orny, but seriously, that bracelet is AS good at LEAST. And honestly the Orny is one of the only artifacts of any gen that got a lot of serious use. The ones you mentioned for example really don't get used that often, except for the crimson, but then again its a slot that only has 2 items with stats, so that doesn't really count. Zero artifact weapons are used, and I very very rarely see armor being used since imbuing. Animated legs and armor with sdi maybe, but those became a lot less special with this new loot system and its its property type and intensity level breaking drops.

    And as it sits the Orny was one of only a handful of artifacts that were relevant in the modern item setting. Imbuing make making arties hard, and this will make it even harder.

    Its true that these items spawn randomly, but still, I had some INSANE jewelry on the shard of the dead.

    As for weapons and armor I think Imbuing will still reign supreme because of the break-ability curses and resist deficiencies but for jewelry the new system can roll up some truly crazy items that are better than any in game before them by leaps, with the possible exception of the orny.

    But I mean seriously artifacts from here on out will have to get much more serious to even consider getting use/having value. Jewelry especially.
     
  28. Gospel

    Gospel Seasoned Veteran
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    You're saying Inquis, HotM, and Crystalline Ring aren't used that often? I can only assume you're speaking from a pvp standpoint as in pvm there are few if any better alternatives.
     
  29. Dermott of LS

    Dermott of LS UOEC Modder
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    ...

    As a melee character, my main suit of equipment is built around 3 arties:

    Spirit of the Totem, Voice of the Fallen King, and Stormgrip

    The rest is imbued and while the new items have some crazy mods, I haven't really found anything yet that simply REPLACES what I've been using.

    As for Artifacts from here on out, I think they should take a bit of a different direction. Sure give them themed and powerful mods (even some "doesn't spawn on this item" and cap-breaking mods), but they should also be made with (and Grimm is gonna cringe at this) unique artwork as well... at least for the armor and weapons.
     
  30. Zyon Rockler

    Zyon Rockler Guest

    I agree, the new arty should embody a power and should have a history. I think whole suits being made that give special powers, if complete would be the best. Like a suit that you could complete and then be able to tame something that bonds only to the suit or person wearing the suit.

    Each piece being a stand alone, like the orny, but if the suit is complete it grants extra powers and unlike the orny could have random properties that don't always max, where some might have 25 physical at its' cap but you might only find 1 with 15.

    Other suits could have a light that covers a radius or a shield that waves out like a beaken of protection for those within.

    That's kind of what's missing from arties, a completeness. Most are just pieces with no history, like, who wore the suit or why was it lost for so long?

    So, arties like in Doom, would be much more powerful and could still be random. You would just need to complete the set or the suit to get the full benefit.

    So, they would look good because they could be fully designed with the robe and cape and even the mount with really neat affects and still be tradeable and upgradeable.
     
  31. Risso

    Risso Babbling Loonie
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    o god
     
  32. Ahuaeyjnkxs

    Ahuaeyjnkxs stranger diamond

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    Sorry mods... a pm would be appreciated, I got distracted because of intense pvp...

    I forgot what I did that deserved the... whatever I'm not supposed to discuss... ? :confused:
     
  33. kelmo

    kelmo Old and in the way
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    Seriously?
     
  34. Uvtha

    Uvtha Grand Poobah
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    Inquis isn't that good anymore. Two useful mods and mediocre resists. The hat and the ring are used for pvm for the SDI, but now that sdi drops on armor from shame the value of sdi armor is going to be decreased, and if you aren't looking for a skill bump from the ring you could imbue something that better suits your needs.
     
  35. Gospel

    Gospel Seasoned Veteran
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    Inquis is obviously still good or it would be going for 16-20m.

    I personally haven't seen SDI on anything but jewelry for Shame loot.

    You can't imbue 20 SDI or 3 MR, enough said.

    You can debate little details all day long but it's pretty obvious my point still stands. Fact of the matter is, few if any people are replacing their artifacts with shame loot.
     
  36. Uvtha

    Uvtha Grand Poobah
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    Good artifacts are greatly devalued, mediocre and lower artifacts are rendered pointless. That was my real point.

    You could grind a dungeon for ages to get a rare drop, or go to shame, get something nearly as or in many cases better item quickly.

    I mean the items weve seen that have been really good came from THREE days of live publish. There will be even better pulls.
     
  37. Hera - Siege

    Hera - Siege Lore Master
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    I wouldn't be so sure about that, I found just a 'major' arti ring today that had FCR 4, 10% LMC, 3% SDI [Boo...], and MR1, and Int 6. Plus your standard -100 luck. If FCR can get boosted, I'm willing to bet FC will be able to as well. I have a feeling in short order there will be a lot of people wearing Shame arti stuff.
     
  38. Ahuaeyjnkxs

    Ahuaeyjnkxs stranger diamond

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    yeah seriously :S


    look I'm sorry, I don't want to cause trouble... and I really got distracted

    I'm human and I think I deserve the little consideration because I've been making an effort to "restrain my character" to a PG-13 acceptable level.

    This required quite a bit of leveraging on my part...

    and you know I'm crazier than you...

    I'm not trolling, you have my word, I really forgot about what I posted :/
     
  39. Gospel

    Gospel Seasoned Veteran
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    The hell? Maybe sober up and come back in the morning there hoss.
     
  40. Ahuaeyjnkxs

    Ahuaeyjnkxs stranger diamond

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    nice to meet you... :confused:
     
  41. 0o0o

    0o0o Visitor
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    My two pennies...

    I think it's a good thing - especially for pvp.

    The fact is faction arties have enabled people to make some massively over powered suits that simply overshadow those who aren't in factions.

    So this just lets the little guy even up the gap and can only be healthy for pvp, which on europa is dying on it's backside.

    As for those predicting some tragedy as a result of these drops...well the game needs to evolve. I don't pvm hardly ever because Ive played for ages and fought everything but this actually has me intrigued and i might have a stab at it. Personally I'd much prefer if the uo devs continued in this way - i.e. revamping old dungeons - rather than creating new enormous lands with impossible monsters that no one bothers to visit.

    Bring back the old school community feel where you'd plod into a dungeon and fight side by side with some stranger and make new friends and fighting buddies. That's what uo needs. What it doesn't need is another whopping landmass to spread a dwindling player base still further...