On Friday I turned orange in the middle of a champ spawn when I started cross-healing a person who happened to be in a VvV guild. I saw the thread about similar occurrences in UHall . I was going to respond there but felt it was turning into a rant, so I moved it here instead. Galen doesn't make a statement but I feel the need to say something: I do not PvP but since both my houses are in fel (and have strong sentimental value), double resources are available there , and prior to trade quests doing champ spawns were the way to get SoTs above 0.5 (as well as still being the only way to EARN the white skill scrolls) I tend to do a fair amount of my play there. One house is a few screens from the daemon temple, so I often use it for fame and sacrifice. I had a goal of trying to get to 33000 karma . Prior to the trade quests the only time I still gained 'a little karma' was from ancient wyrms, balrons, and succubi in fel (and champ spawns are the best way to find and fight the later). Yes I am attacked on occasion and sometimes killed, but when that happens I have the option to decide if a count was earned or to just ignore it. When I am turned orange, I usually no longer have that right as most spawn raiders are associated with VvV. Having to kill myself after spawns so I don't have to be paranoid in fel towns because I happen to adventure with PvPers seems to be silly.