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Official U-Hall Poll: To bump or not to bump?

Discussion in 'UHall' started by Guest, May 21, 2003.

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  1. Guest

    Guest Guest

    There has been quite a bit of discussion on the subject over the past few weeks. It's been quite some time since the U-Hall community as a whole decided how they want it. So read through the pros and cons that will undoubtedly be responding to this, then make an informed choice.
     
  2. Guest

    Guest Guest

    I thought this option was already in the works?
     
  3. Guest

    Guest Guest

    It is, but it doesn't appear to be at the top of the priority list. In the meanwhile, we should probably go with the community wishes.

    Personally, I'd prefer to keep the forum as it is, but I only have one vote in the matter (I am, after all, part of the community). I like that U-Hall is not like every other forum. I like that all posts are "treated equally." I like the tradition from the old days.
     
  4. Farquhar

    Farquhar Guest

    yes...equal...

    Evocare's feedback post has been scrolled off by equal posts like "Any hot loking chicks play uo?" and "thanks to all the hot loking chicks"

    I for one will be very glad to see bump to the top threads in u-hall, important ones stay, stupid ones go.
     
  5. ApocPink

    ApocPink Guest

    I kind of like the fact that everytime someone has some little one liner comment a post isn't bumped to the top.
    Also, all the top would be filled with would be the posts that people argue and flame on back and forth.
    I think that some posts should very well be sticky, and some should fall to the bottom dead and lifeless, but there is no good system for deciding this, so in all fairness Cynewulf, I think you are right to think it should remain how it is. It's sad to see perfectly good posts fall into obscurity, but it's also very very good for some less informative posts (cough*anygoodlokingirlsplayuo*cough) to fall out of view.
     
  6. Lady Starr

    Lady Starr Guest

    I got an email from Den saying that it would be a toggle for those to choose could do so. I want it to stay the same.
     
  7. Farquhar

    Farquhar Guest

    There seems to be ample moderators here, all it takes is a click of a button to lock a thread. Bump is better.
     
  8. DemanKnght

    DemanKnght Guest

    I like it they way it is. Its refreshing to not worry about someone whining about how Begging isnt viable anymore, or some yokel belly aching cause his server happens to be lagging that evening but not bothering to searching to see if it maybe his own ISP dragging him down. Besides plenty of mods to sticky anything important to the front page.
     
  9. Moradin

    Moradin Guest

    pet peeve....
    I wish there was some way to diminish posts without any real subject.

    ie: "Have you ever noticed...."
    "Now I am mad"
    "help...."
    or the ever famous ....."READ ME!!"

    I have no problem ignoring one or two, however they seem to have multiplied latly......

    For pity's sake....the subject line can hold a lot more than 3-4 words.
     
  10. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Please dont change.

    I used to actually look forward to the times when I would check in. It used to be that so much of what was posted was relevant and that the discussions always followed suit, but now (at least in the last 6 or so weeks - draw your own conclusions) I am feeling more and more like I have been cheated when I open up a thread to read it. The percentage of worthwhile posts to not has dramtically changed imho.

    I would hate to find that the first ten posts are all going to be some drawn out discussion/debate/pissing match and that I'll always need to go to page number two to find sorme of the old 'what if ?' / 'what is ?' / 'how can I ?' / 'this is my experience' posts.

    Just 2 cents I know and I'm rarely ever heard from (except for cases like this or if I actually have an answer 'and have no reason to question that my answer is wrong' to someones legitimate question.)
     
  11. Where is the article explaining how the existing system works and how bumping would change that?
     
  12. Ludes

    Ludes Babbling Loonie
    Stratics Veteran Alumni Stratics Legend

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    Wow...this is a hard one Cyne,

    I really don't like having to go back through three or four pages of posts so I can see how a discussion is going on a particular topic I'm interested in. Also sometimes you want a lot of opinions on a topic so you post it....check it a few hours later and it's already on the second page where noone sees it. The result is you only get a few people's opinions, when you really wanted many opinions.

    But...I agree with everyone that hates seeing really stupid post's. Course I'm of the opinion that the only dumb question is the unasked one. However...asking if any pretty girls play Ultima is just plain asinine. But if we implement the bumping system we can control those things by simply not replying to those post.. they will shortly just slip off the bottom of the page.. Course then you get the idiots replying to their own posts just to bump it back to the top.

    So I guess I would want the bump back as long as it can be made so that you can't bump your own post's. Then, ONLY interest by your fellow Stratics members would keep your post up top. But with the increase in irrelevant posts...It would be nice to see the interesting ones that people respond to with actual opinions stay on the front page.

    Sorry for rambling....but I was waiting for my coffee to cool.
     
  13. Guest

    Guest Guest

    That's why I use the Dev Posts link, which gathers all the OSI posts from all the forums. That way, I never miss an "important" post.

    Dev Posts
     
  14. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Coming from MyUO, I enjoy having posts where discussions occur, bumped.

    However, I have come to realize that UO-Hall is not a forum for long discussions. I find the current format useful when you want to find out what's going on in UO "at this very minute" or when you want a question answered quickly.

    The ideal situation would be to have a new forum for UO General Discussions and Debates that bump the posts. The UO Latest Updates forum already serves much of that purpose.

    Having a switch would probably have the same effect: letting me turn on bumping if I want to participate in discussions, and turning it off when I want to view the latest posts.
     
  15. Lady Starr makes a good point (and one which I had forgotten)

    Is it functionally possible to install Dateslip as a toggleable option? That way, we could all have our cake and eat it too...*wistfully*

    If that is a possibility, perhaps it should be added as another option in your poll? (Yes, I know, I know...you'd have to redo the entire poll, then *ducks*)

    Having said that, I must admit that I am clinging to Ye Aulde UHall for dear life. Everything else has already altered so much, recently...

    Okay, yeah...so I'm a dinosaur. :)
     
  16. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Toggle yes, otherwise stick with it as it is.
     
  17. Azrile

    Azrile Guest

    This is not a discussion forum, it is worthless to use it unless you are a boardie and check here every 3hours.

    If you only check once a day, you are likely to miss Evocare's thread and instead by greeted by a double post of *brews coffee* followed by posts about 'good loking girls'.

    Bumping viable threads while letting worthless threads drop to page two is the norm on forums... there is a reason it was invented, because date-slip does not work on busy boards.

    On bumped boards, it is the mods responsiblity to make sure people are not purposefully keeping their thread on the first page by 'fake bumping' it. It's not a lot of work, if you see a thread saying on the front page for a long time, just check that real discussions are going on, and not the orginal poster doing stuff like " I agree" after every other post.

    And again, the biggest reason people are saying to keep it time-slip is because "that's the way it always has been", which simply isn't an argument at all.
     
  18. Guest

    Guest Guest

    <font color=blue>&gt;&gt;Is it functionally possible to install Dateslip as a toggleable option?</font color=blue>

    Apparently it may be possible to have it as a "toggleable" option, but it doesn't come natively with the forum software and has to be programmed in. Teresk would be the one looking at it, but he's got his hands full with a lot of other things that affect the entire site (like the Plus thing) and not just for a single forum.

    I would recommend voting with the idea that the toggle may not be possible at all, or won't happen for another six months to a year. Hey, if we get it next week, cool. The entire poll becomes a non-issue then.
     
  19. tanyuh

    tanyuh Guest

    Cynewulf,

    When will the result of this poll be enacted? How long are you going to keep the poll up?

    Thanks,
    tanyuh
     
  20. If the current format is so great, why is this one locked at the top?

    also

    Please put a link on the news page and possibly the latest updates forum.
    The format has driven a few away, enough so that they don't even look here, but they should get a chance to vote to.
     
  21. rofler

    rofler Guest

    I already made my vote to bump... but alternately, just make a new General Discussion forum that does and keep UHall the way it is. Then, everyone is happy.
     
  22. Lady Starr

    Lady Starr Guest

    Hmm well Cyne if this is true the email I wrote to Den and received a reply on was total hogwash! He told me and I quote "I Just found out we will be getting the toggle option for date slip in the next forum upgrade" Either this was not true and he fed me a line to get me to renew my + membership or not everyone on the Stratics team was informed of this...
     
  23. No no no, Starr...you are both saying the same thing--it's just that the definiton got confused, somewhere along the line. :)

    The "next forum upgrade" is when they pull down ALL of the Stratics fora, to install the newer, updated version of the forum software, across the board. Den was not misleading you, but as you may imagine, upgrading the software domain-wide will necessitate a staggering amount of work. Thus, in light of all of our otherwise increased workload at the moment, the upgrade has been pushed back a bit, while Teresk kills himself keeping up with all of the current, increased demands. (poor, valiant Teresk!)
     
  24. Ack! *gets all protective*

    "Coffee posts" (while they may not be your cup of tea), have been an integral and traditional part of UHall for the 5 years that I know of...You see, first and foremost, UHall is a community forum...a community board where discussions take place. And yes, that is often done over a cup of coffee.

    For anyone simply seeking OSI input in this forum, I would suggest using the following link: http://boards.stratics.com/php-bin/uo/postlistdev.php , which will allow you to go straight to the Wheat, as it were, bypassing the Chaff entirely. For those whom seek straight news, I would suggest using UO Stratics Main (although the same news tends to get posted on UHall, as it happens)

    You must understand that your notion of "not a lot of work" is misplaced, as we read each thread anyway. I cannot imagine allowing Dateslip to babysit the forum, on its ownsome. *grins*

    Finally...while this may not be the forum that you envision, it has a long, LONG, venerable and honorable history. To simply and completely alter that into some generic message board for the sake of expediency would be sad. /php-bin/shared/images/icons/frown.gif

    (by the way, "Dateslip" is the function that allows you to bump posts. UHall does not currently have Dateslip)
     
  25. I want it to stay the way it is, but by the looks of the votes so far. That'll change soon
     
  26. Deepwood

    Deepwood Guest

    I voted to leave u-hall as it is
     
  27. Zigabob

    Zigabob Guest

    I am pretty new to the stratics forums so I don't know much about the history. I am also not quite sure what bumping is.

    I do get annoyed that the first page of this forum sometimes is filled with long threads with 3-4 people basically having a private conversation or on a topic that maybe should be moved to another forum. Maybe I'm too anal, but I like having a strong moderator presence in the forum's I participate in. I thought they did a good job with the uo.com boards and I guess that was what I was hoping these boards would be like.

    If people are just posting to have their topic at the top or are having a private conversation (similar to a chat room), then the thread should be locked by the moderator.
     
  28. Azrile

    Azrile Guest

    Dor,

    Sorry if you took my post personally, let me clarify some things. First off, I've been on u.hall for a few years now. In fact, I was here before there were uo.com boards. I'm not just 'one of those people the migrated over from uo.com when thy closed' and is now invading your community.

    Secondly, stratics, with open arms, took on the role as the 'official' UO boards. With that comes a responsiblity. Cynthe specifically linked this board as the official UO Discussion forum.

    I have the devpost page book marked already, and it does make it easier to follow threads that the devs participate in, but there are many threads amongst players that are lively debates, where important issues are discussed.

    I never said regulating the boards is an easy job, I was merely pointing out that with a little mod intervention in the future, people's biggest fear of people bumping their own threads, is not a problem at all. Mods simply lock threads where the discussion has died down to the point of one or two people bumping the thread to keep it on the front page.

    (by the way... I'm pretty sure you have it backwards... I'm pretty sure that dateslip is the opposite of bumping... Dateslip is where the thread are ordered by the date/time of the original post... bumping is where they are oredered by the last post on that thread)
     
  29. Reachwind

    Reachwind Guest

    As long as this has to be the official UO discussion board then it should work as the old UO.com discussion board did. Active threads will always be at the top letting garbage threads drift away.

    As someone else pointed out already... If you'd like to maintain this board for the people who used before it was the main UO discussion forum then simply make a new board called UO discussion and return this board to an ABM/roll call board where threads last one day.
     
  30. *replies lazily to reachwind, because it's there on the bottom*

    While this forum is functional and traditional and such, there's far too much babble on here for posts not to be bumped. The ideal thing would be to have the option to toggle, but since that'd be a long term goal, I say you just go for the short termed one now.

    Just because we change something now doesn't mean it cant be adjusted later.

    There needs to be a little more lockage going on around here, anyhow. Some things aren't even tolerated in the beggar's forum and they show up here quite frequently. If you want a nice, traditional coffee post, lock one at the top to add to. Even minor questions are more important then serving virtual coffee to the 3-5 people who bother responding to those.

    I've posted on Stratics for a while now, and it'll always be my forum home, but I've avoided this board for the very reasons mentioned until it became the dev hot spot.

    As an alternative, I suggest making a Developer's Forum. Much like this, where devs come in and ask questions, but we can reply to them and ask them questions. That'd cut the need for so many people to flood in here and make "xX*******READ ME DEVS ASAP!!!!!!!1111*******Xx" posts who have a question that's answer is found in the playguide.
     
  31. Casey

    Casey Guest

    An option to have it on or off would be nice. That would make everyone happy I think. Personally I like the Uhall the way it is now, but I know some people would prefer if they could have bumping on.
     
  32. Chinalilly

    Chinalilly Guest

    There is no need for a poll. Den's already stated that these forums will be seeing a post bump feature added to it by way of a toggle. It's only a matter of which one will be the default, and that will probably be post bump so that posts asking why posts don't bump, aren't repeatedly posted.

    You can read his statement and promise here in this thread:


    http://boards.stratics.com/php-bin/uo/showthreaded.php?Cat=&amp;Board=uouhall&amp;Number=3945711&amp;Search=true&amp;Forum=uouhall&amp;Words=Den&amp;Match=Username&amp;Searchpage=0&amp;Limit=25&amp;Old=1month&amp;Main=3916682&amp;what2=&amp;selv=&amp;vwhich=

    Den
    (Founder)
    05/01/03 09:00 PM
    Re: Thank you Stratics [re: Dern_Ironskull]


    FYI: We will be adding a toggle switch for users to personally select between date slip and post bump with the next update to our forums.

    Hopefully that will help,

    Den

    Founder, Editor in Chief
    Stratics
     
  33. DerekL

    DerekL Certifiable
    Stratics Veteran

    Joined:
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    <blockquote><hr>

    I for one will be very glad to see bump to the top threads in u-hall, important ones stay, stupid ones go.

    <hr></blockquote>Far better for mods to delete stupid threads. Important ones won't get bumped, but a thousand dammfool ones will be if the uo.com boards are any indication.
     
  34. Lady Starr

    Lady Starr Guest

    Now why do you say the default should be post bump? I think the default should be the way it is now! There are those of us who has been here before uo boards crowd.. *way longer* and think that we should not change it just for them. If UO is pointing to this as the *official* boards.. Lets them pay for the hosting.. (which we know will never happen)

    This has become a sore subject with me and I apologize to anyone thinkingg I am singling them out. But I have been with UOHall since the very beginning and we have tried post bumping and it just did not work. This is what makes UOHall unique and the way that I prefer.
     
  35. Vidala

    Vidala Guest

    I couldn't have said it any better than Lady Starr just did; she took the words right out of my mouth.

    For the people complaining about not being able to carry on "long-term" discussions in this forum, perhaps using the "Favorites" feature is what you need. Although a post doesn't get quite the same traffic when it's 5 pages deep, you can still have discussions with the people that have interest in that post (and it's happened on numerous occasions).

    I like that every day, I can come here and know that there'll be a whole new list of posts to look at. If I see something very interesting, I'll save the post under my Favorites (talking about the feature on Stratics, but of course you could add it to your browser's favorites list too). If you want discussions that're meant to go 5 pages long and be around for awhile, there's dozens of other places on Stratics to do so. But just because these forums are the "official UO discussion board", because OSI isn't paying Stratics to maintain it, I don't see why they need to change things from how it was before the merger.
     
  36. Vidala

    Vidala Guest

    On the flip side, something must be done about side scrolling /php-bin/shared/images/icons/biggrin.gif
     
  37. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Roger that!

    But, I agree at least the option to use said Dateslip function would be nice(so I could use it). As far as bucking tradition or what not, that was bucked in a manner already. Stratics used to be the place to go to avoid OSI moderation for open discussion. While that is still the case and all(for the most part), the whole UO stratics forum is now completely different. This is The place to come and get feedback from OSI employees as well as community peers. That is certainly a buck from the traditional history of UO stratics, as far as I'm concerned. This is a new place, with new stuff(like +Players Plus, UO official message board, and surely some new income from OSI, as well as an large influx of new people from the now defunct uo.com message boards)... so why is it necessary to hold on to the history of this message board?
    History is just what today will be tomorrow. It's not static.

    edit: Vidala I'd have to say I agree with your first post, but the 2nd is much more of a concern to me(as if either of these should be concerns, heh). I recently discovered the Favorites option in my control panel, and it does help out. I still think an option to choose between the 2 would be nice. However, back in the day when I spent alot of time on forums that bumped posts(like 2-3 months ago), all I had to do to see all of the new posts for the day(or week) is scroll 1 or 2 pages into the forum and look until the date of the posts changed. That way all of the relevant posts(or multi-person flame wars) would always be near the top, and all of the 'hey sexy uo gurrls' posts would drift on down. I'm thinking this all boils down to a person to person preference. Which makes perfect sense for there to be an option to choose either, which I thought was the initial game plan before I read this poll/post.

    So... if I were in charge, I would vote 4. Do both: keep it the same and allow an option to bump(default as is now, to preserve the 'history'; of which I think I have 3 yr.s and maybe 50 posts here; Just because I always preferred to post where OSI employees might be more likely to read).
     
  38. i tried voting for NOT bumping more than once and it wouldn't let me ... oh well

    bumping = crap

    but then again, think of all the annoying *bump* posts I can make now - hehe
     
  39. oops - I did it already





    see how bad bumping SUX!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
     
  40. Dude.. Spam + side scrolling = death sentence, lol.

    Seriously not cool, though. /php-bin/shared/images/icons/frown.gif
     
  41. SirWillow

    SirWillow Guest

    China, I'm guessing you missed Dor's explanation above that Dev is right- it will come in with the next upgrade to the forums, but that upgrade may be a long, long ways off- as in 6 months to a year. That's not as soon as a lot of people may like or hope.

    Personally, I think that it brings up a rather interesting problem, as U.Hall is one of the oldest boards on stratics and has it's own unique flavor (like the coffee posts, which ARE a notable tradition of these boards). While I voted for bumping because that's what I prefer, I would much rather see it as an option, not an "either/ or" deal.

    However, since that may not be possible for a while, and it does seem that the biggest problem has come in with the shutdown of the uo.com's forums, perhaps the idea of a developers forum would be a good idea. After all, it does seem that the ones struggling the most with it are those that are looking for that type of a forum anyways, and that may help to sort things out as a whole.
     
  42. Grond

    Grond Guest

    Note that this vote is, by its very location, biased toward those in favor of the traditional way of not bumping; you'd probably see an even greater majority in favor of bumping if you were to poll potential readers rather than people who've actually stuck around with the current system.

    People like me, who can't hack the quantity of posts here without some form of bumping for active threads, only check U-Hall once in a great while because every time we've tried reading it in the past few years, we haven't been able to stand the balky, archaic, traditional lack of dateslip.

    - Grond, the U-Hall wannabe
     
  43. Guest

    Guest Guest

    I voted No bumping

    but i see most voted for bumping...

    there are goin to be alot of crap posts of 3 weeks ago that will be on top..
    BAH

    BAH

    BAH
     
  44. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Why not just make a new general disscussion forum? That way people can keep their old U Hall with it's no-bumping ways and have a no forum where the posts are bumped. Name it something like General UO Disscussion.
     
  45. Guest

    Guest Guest

    <blockquote><hr>


    Active threads will always be at the top letting garbage threads drift away.


    <hr></blockquote>
    You know that there have been active garbage threads? Right now garbage threads drift away. Change the forum to bumping and they can be bumped to oblivion until a mod HAS to act and lock it. Poor mods might have more work if bumping shows up.
     
  46. JayCee

    JayCee Guest

    if Bumping was on, most of these threads about the price hike would be in the same thread instead of spread out across 3 pages. (yes some people would start their own threads, but not nearly as many.)
     
  47. Shadefox

    Shadefox Certifiable
    Stratics Veteran Stratics Legend

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    oh my... *sighs* there goes the last bumper free place to be.. whay couldent you kust post at teh other forums? there is like a hundred of them...
     
  48. Grond

    Grond Guest

    There's only one truly general-topic UO forum, though, and only one which OSI has designated their official general discussion forum in which the development team will read and respond.
     
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