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Paroxysmus' Swamp Dragon Bugged?

Discussion in 'UHall' started by catfish154, Jan 3, 2011.

  1. catfish154

    catfish154 Journeyman
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    I was playing my sampie the other day and heard someone say they died and their Paroxy that was bonded poofed. The next day I was playing, I died, my swampy died, and it poofed also. I tried logging in and out and going back and looking and all that but its nowhere to be found. Anyone know what the cause of this is? Its a pretty costly bug if its a bug and should be fixed asap
     
  2. Babble

    Babble Guest

    No bugs, UO's features so you replay the content more often!
    :p
     
  3. Thav12

    Thav12 Seasoned Veteran
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    Same happened to me. About 1 1/2 yrs ago. Posted it here on stratics. Costly bug. Will never use that dragon again. Just use bonded swampies. Better for defense anyway.
     
  4. Raptor85

    Raptor85 Certifiable
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    Be glad the bug only took one of your pets! I lost a bonded mare and rune beetle at the same time shortly after ML launch, double poofed on me!

    Curious of where/how you died though, back when mine did that it was a bug with the new dungeon areas and the timers/instance code.
     
  5. Buns Of Glory [ATL]

    Buns Of Glory [ATL] Journeyman
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    A month ago I lost two bonded trained vollems. =(
     
  6. cdavbar

    cdavbar Lore Master
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    This was/is a diff bug than the prox swampy bug. But on the subject of the ML bug i lost a prepatch WW :(

    On the swampy, i lost one years ago, no biggie just go back and do a few proxies and get another one!
     
  7. Kafka72

    Kafka72 Journeyman
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    Apparently mine just poofed as well. I was fighting Slasher of Veils and me and my Paroxysmus swampy died. It's nowhere to be found, and my followers are 0/5. What bull****, I just reupped my account for 6 months of gametime today as well.
     
  8. WarUltima

    WarUltima Babbling Loonie
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    Nope no bug for me.
    What people don't realize is even your cats and dogs in game will eventually go wild if you don't feed it or issue a few successful commands ever.

    All good command was there for sorely that reason.
    If you got a swampy and have never commanded or fed for a long time do yourself a favor and lore it its probably at content or rather happy already. If you got a crafter with a beetle do the same you would be suprised how low their loyalty can go (coz you don't pamper ur pets).

    The main difference is when people pull this type of ID 10T errors cause their pets to go wild, while you can easily retame your beetles and such proxy swampy and vollems simply go poof on the very instant.
     
  9. Aurelius

    Aurelius Babbling Loonie
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    Since it's UO, you probably won't be surprised that doesn't always happen....

    I can be absolutely certain of that since I now own a vollem on Atlantic, which I found 'wild' in Luna. If you release it, it vanishes, so the only way I can think you can ever see a stray vollem is if someone let's it's loyalty fall so far it goes 'wild'. They must be very easy to tame since I got it with a newly made human with 50 taming. Fed it stabled it, and a week later, just like all pets, fed it again and it bonded.

    The real mystery is why nobody else noticed it, beat me to it and tamed if for themselves!
     
  10. Thav12

    Thav12 Seasoned Veteran
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    Although I agree with you that perhaps this is a possible explanation, I can assure you that my paroxy swamp dragon was well taken care of and still decided to go poof. Even more ridiculous was that it happened while he and I were both dead. My hunting partner saw my dragon ghost standing next to me and waited for me to dissapear. I died as a result of a disconnect. when I came back, I was still in the Stygian Abyss - dead - but my dead swamp dragon was not there. I don't think you know what you are talking about exactly, and frankly, it is annoying to read such an hautain post when so many people have experienced the same thing now.
     
  11. Thav12

    Thav12 Seasoned Veteran
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    i am sure that some of these go wild, and i hope your story is true. Congrats on a finding a free vollem. Problem is that ghosts don't go wild. You can't extrapolate this story to explain all the missing paroxy swamp dragons.
     
  12. Kafka72

    Kafka72 Journeyman
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    I guess I should have stated originally that I fed and commanded my Paroxy swampy daily, sometimes a couple times in the same day. Usually after a bit of battle and roleplayed as a reward for protecting me and "sticking by my side" ironically enough!:p
     
  13. WarUltima

    WarUltima Babbling Loonie
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    I know exactly what I am talking about and I am afraid you have little clue why your dragon went poof. Here's the reason why YOURS disappear and this will get a bit technical, and hopefully you can follow.

    There used to be an excellent Japanese website (it was shut down because one of the founder was part of the team that has access to the "codes" and was deemed to leak too much insider info) that has detailed info about exactly how taming/loyalty/commands work in UO. I am trying very hard to recall the details just for you.

    Loyalty value is ranged from 0 to 100. (Hard cap is always 100)
    A successful command (pet will respond with a "roger" sound) gives +1 point in loyalty.
    A unsuccessful command (pet will respond with a "**** you" roar) is -3 in loyalty.
    A fed is always +100 loyalty. Stacking food has no effect whatsoever.

    -Now the following is according to my memory with the #s provided by the JP site.-
    Loyal is always lost overtime. (including afking with your pet out or mounted on your pet)
    ---If the tamer is within the vicinity of the pet (within 15? tiles) the rate of loyalty reduction is minimal. It's either one points lost per RL hour.
    ---If the tamer is outside the vicinity (where pets no longer hears your command) the rate of loyal loss is sped up greatly (5? or 6? points per RL hour).
    ---Sometimes when pets do not log out (improperly logout/pets loaded/server down while pets are out) with the tamer the rate of loyalty reduction is at max... I cant remember the exact amount the site did have it listed but if memory serves it takes at most 6 hours for a pet with 100 loyalty to go wild.

    Ok now you said you died due to dc... which you are physically disconnected from the game while your pets didnt logout properly with you (see above, loyalty loss at max). This scenario is most seem and can be easily reproduced by having your pet out and let the server go down. And in this case assuming you have a greater dragon out, sometimes when you log in you will see your control slot being 0/5 while your pet standing next to you or wandering around. If your pet hasnt gone wild yet by issuing a command your pet "might" respond to you and if it did the 5 control slot will instantly be added back to your character, and congrats you just saved your pet.

    Sometimes things can go seriously wrong where your pet will stay blue and stay "tamed" but will no longer accept your commands and you wont be able to re-tame it before it finally goes wild (this usually happens when doing a shard transfer where one or more of your packies didnt get transferred with you... and after you xfer your character back to the starting shard, you will have no control over the pet whatsoever. The pet will go wild at the longest 5 hours (max loyalty reduction).

    So again in your case after you dc, you didnt log in right away to secure your pet. The pet is now rapidly losing its loyalty because the owner is not logged in in the game world. And tough luck you just lost your pet when you logged on the next day. Also when you dc if your pet is at low in loyalty already you "will" lose it very quickly.

    Also in the case of proxy swampy/vollem, some of them do get bugged and can be xfered between players (with high enough taming is what I heard).

    So there I just explained all the possible reasons why you lost your pet. Be more careful next time :heart:

    But you can always say (making **** up or not) "but but but my pet was at 100 loyalty and i dc and logged back in in 1.25 real life seconds and it went poof" but then again I am just providing some more indepth info on how UO works, so people who actually cares would not encounter this issue again. :thumbup1:

    Safe journey.
     
  14. WarUltima

    WarUltima Babbling Loonie
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    This can be caused by improper log out. Pet in this situation will usually rally randomly in a straight line (yes even if you have reloged into the game)until they get stuck at a rubberband (player houses) or sometimes it will path find its way to a server line. Once it crosses you have to cross over to the same subserver and spam command while trying to get back within the 15-tile command-able range, otherwise your pet will be lost in just a few hours even if its at 100 loyalty and sometimes deleted as soon as it reaches a server line (this usually happens to a pet ghost).

    We used to cause people's (enemy tamers) pet to disappear before auto stable added in by luring it far far away and then lure it to cross a serverline. Once it cross it will be sitting on the serverline on the other side, until either the tamer finds it/petball it back or go wild.
     
  15. Podolak

    Podolak Crazed Zealot
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    Well here is one for you...

    Back in fall of 2009 I was fighting in Yew. I was riding an ethereal horse and was dismounted. Rather than going in my pack as a statue it became a live horse. As is standard procedure it was killed by the opposing faction before I could remount it. Once dead it was completely gone, no statue or anything. I had that ethereal from when the ethereals were first released. So i am not sure if it was some old bug or something.
     
  16. Ender

    Ender Crazed Zealot
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    Ginsu?
     
  17. Aurelius

    Aurelius Babbling Loonie
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    Was replying only to the comment about vollems going poof - sadly I can't think of anything that helps the problem with the Paroxy swamp dragon though :(
     
  18. WarUltima

    WarUltima Babbling Loonie
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    Oh wahhh thats cool, if that ethy became a live horse with ethy hue it's a shame you didnt save it!

    I cant say UO is bug proof but then again 99% of the pet unbond/loss was due to improper log out. And even with the auto stable thing devs put in to prevent people losing their pets it's not foul proof, hence many people (not implying they are doing it unattended here btw) lost their pre-patch golem due to server down because they were training weapon skills and "accidentally" fall asleep.

    The site that got shut down was a great loss to me personally (coz with the info from that site I seem to always have an edge compare to most eastern players in terms of knowledge on how UO works to the tiniest detail). It had nearly everything in UO explained right down to the root and I happened to read Japanese very well. It's a shame UO Japan forced it to shut down and the last message came from that website when it got shut down was "Sorry to all of you, thanks for your support all this years. Due to political reasons we will be indefinitely shut down with no further notice."

    It also had up to date BoD rewards list for EA Shards thats compiled by thousands of users logging every turn ins (last time i remembered it has logged 109000 turn-ins. It's a pity I didnt rip the database when I had chance. :mad:
     
  19. Kafka72

    Kafka72 Journeyman
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    Yes, it is me.
     
  20. Ender

    Ender Crazed Zealot
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    Oh hey, it's Val.


    Yeah, the swampies are pretty bugged, I've heard lots of stories about them going missing in TeamSpeak in the last couple years.
     
  21. Thav12

    Thav12 Seasoned Veteran
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    Thanks for taking the time to write this up. And I agree, this may have happened. The weird thing was, and I did mention it before, that the swamp dragon died right after I died. They don't last long, as you know. If he had gone wild at that exact moment (possible, I guess, although he would have had to loose a boat load of loyalty points by your calculations, in mere seconds (the time it took for him to bite the dust), he would have wandered off as a gone-wild ghost. In stead, he stood by my ghost (per my guild mate, i was disconnected) until my char dissapeared. What i will freely admit is that I do not know if he dissapeared with me when my character's ghost finally poofed as well. Also, I did not log in until the next day. Unless ghosted/dead paroxy swamp dragons continue to loose loyalty points while dead (and are uncontrollable or able to be fed), it is hard to believe that your scenario played out.

    All in all, I think it is a strange situation. Certainly not one that can easily be explained, nor was it a players fault or mistake of not feeding or not recognizing that the darn 10 mil worth creature was about to go "poof". I qualify that as a bug, wouldn't you? Whether it is reproducible or explicable or not, is in that sense not relevant. In fact, the mere fact that it happens to so many people would qualify this as a bug. It should not be allowed to happen.
     
  22. G.v.P

    G.v.P Stratics Legend
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    In summary, if you lose connection due to a game bug (client crash, etc) or a server going down, you better have a Ball of Pet Summoning linked to each and every pet you have on each and every character. Even then there may be bugs, but the best way, and sometimes the only way to save a pet in a 0/5 situation, as WarUltima briefly touched on, is to have a Ball of Pet Summoning.

    However, something that hasn't been touched upon yet is the fact that old Paroxysmus Swamp Dragons used to be dispelled. Via the fan site UO Guide:

    There's no real way to know whether or not your statuette is pre-Pub, I don't think, which is another thing to consider.
     
  23. WarUltima

    WarUltima Babbling Loonie
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    Pets continue to lose royalty regardless if its live or ghosted.
    Same royalty reduction formula is applied.
    In your case the pet stood still in game even after your ghost disappeared...
    This is am "improper log out"
    And as I said you will lose ANY PET IN UO in at most 5 hours from an improper log out.
    It's indeed a bug, but at the same time I explained exactly how the bug works and the easiest way to prevent it is relog ASAP. However you said yourself you didnt log in until the next day, I will say its longer than 5 hours? If so yes, your swampy ghost will be gone just like how I explained in my previous posts.

    The only ways in game to ensure that your pets wont be improperly logged is...
    1. Mount It
    2. Stable

    It's indeed a bug, and now you know how it works I was hoping you would learn something so it wouldn't happen to you again... that's all.
     
  24. WarUltima

    WarUltima Babbling Loonie
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    Hmm you know I have owned 3 swampy and 2 since they were introduced in ML and I still have all 3 of my proxy's swampy today rightnow.

    And I just killed each of my swampy and had my red mage to cast dispel and mass dispel on them... and none of the dispel attempts worked... even with the one that came to me 1 week after ML was released (so pre-patch?) didnt disappear.

    Yeah there are a lot of tools in game and take cares your pets properly can save you from a lot of "accidents".

    The whole reasons of all this stupid pet loss **** is going on is mainly caused by people being spoiled due to auto stable bull****... because before auto-stable was put in, if you dont stable your pets EVERYTIME BEFORE YOU LOG OFF bonded or not dead or alive unless you mount it they WILL DISAPPEAR when you log in "the next day"... see royalty reduction formula 3... owner is physically disconnected from the game world whilst the pet did not.
     
  25. G.v.P

    G.v.P Stratics Legend
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    Hm not sure, the auto-dispel could be a myth, but maybe it has to do with how creatures can do dispel w/o the magery spell dispel, you know? The auto-dispel. Shrugs.

    I haven't owned a paroxy swamp dragon until two days ago, after I got one at an IDOC, so I'll have to use it and see if I lose it ;0.
     
  26. Thav12

    Thav12 Seasoned Veteran
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    Now this is where I think you are sort of righteous. The whole point of autostabling was not that you could be spoiled to not stable your pets. That actually is sort of offensive. The point was that due to connectivity issues that had nothing to do with actual game play (dialup, thunderstorms, crashes, and so on), people would not loose pets that were very difficult to train or costly. The tone of your email puts a lot of blame on those people that in your mind get away with abusing a game system that, in your opinion, promotes laziness. I think that is ludicrous. You do not get to decide that for other people. Perhaps, as in my case, the internet connection did not come back until nearly 12 hrs later. I personally think that this autostabling is fantastic, and it should be bug free. Clearly, as we both agreed, it is currently not bug free. Other examples include people losing their pets because the stable is full. Failing to allow an autostable event to take place should not lead to losing a pet. Could that be abused? I am sure. But guess what? I would take the little abuse over the reduced frustration of losing a well trained or expensive pet. Just because you post 3000 times on stratics does not mean you are right. Maybe if I post my opinions 3000 times I will hold the truth as well...
     
  27. WarUltima

    WarUltima Babbling Loonie
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    Well I simply explained the mechanism of why pets that didnt log out go "wild" or disappear.
    All you got is "OMFG SYSTEM IS BUGGED"
    And if it will take you 3000 posts to understand how certain things in UO should work, then I guess you should really post 3000 times if a few posts explains why the pet is most likely lost didnt cut into your level of comprehension.

    Your internet went down for 12 hours which is why you didnt get back in game in time (then I explained why your pets went away). This happens to any pet in game, NOT just proxy's swampy dragon btw, so I guess you were wrong from the very beginning of your post. All I can tell you is the system isnt bug free, and it's not EA's fault your internet went down for 12 hours neither. EA also didnt put this in their patch note saying "Our new auto stabling will help you protect your pet 100% of the time in the event of internet connection loss for 12+ hours."

    Again it's good if you think it's the system's fault and refuse to take other people's advise so this wont happen again to you... dont come back and QQing about a lost pet, unless of course if it takes you QQing about it 3000 times over to learn about the game, then please go ahead and do so.
     
  28. Ender

    Ender Crazed Zealot
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    Proxy Swampy can disappear within half an hour. Less even.
     
  29. WarUltima

    WarUltima Babbling Loonie
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    I can have a regular bonded blue beetle to unbond in a few minutes and can be easily reproduced. Another way of a quick pet pwnage you can do is dont ever feed your swampy ever and never issue command and play the game normally after couple month (pet loyalty drop is slow during normal game play) you can lore it and make sure the loyalty is low enough (around rather unhappy and extremely unhappy would do), then spam all follow me, you can have your swampy to go poof in less than a minutes on unsuccessful commands.

    Its not hard to do it to any pets actually. Drop your pet loyalty to "confused" level. Mount it and log out, wait till a few minutes before server down, log in and unmount your pet and let server to go down (this reproduce improper log out for the pets). Wait till server is back up and in less than 10 minutes if you dont log in it will unbond and go wild (proxy's and vollem will poof after you see the unbonded message). Feel free to log in with another character to see it happen, its rather amusing actually.

    And I have instantly deleted couple pets by dragging *enemy* pets across server line, then kill it on the other side and if the pet ghost wanders into the server line, it can be deleted instantly. Of course this was before the auto stabling was put in.
     
  30. Thav12

    Thav12 Seasoned Veteran
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    Warultima, your comprehensive reading skills are poor. According to your notes there was nothing I could have done to prevent my paroxy to go poof, yet you keep stating that somehow I should follow your advise. You are a funny man.
    "game system working as designed" vs "game system bugged, should not let ghosted pets go poof"

    Simply annoying to read your judgmental posts. I thanked you for your explanation already before.
     
  31. WarUltima

    WarUltima Babbling Loonie
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    You know I hear ya

    Hope they would put out a publish that prevents people from losing any pet when their internet connection is out for 12+ hours.

    Then another publish to make all pets auto logout as the server go down so everyone can train on their golem fearlessly.

    Then put the following statement in their End User Aggrement.
    "If a pet or any item thats lost due to any reason in game whatsoever especially when a player didnt pay their internet bill and a scheduled thunderstorm in the users' area, EA is responsible to replace all items lost no questions asked. And EA will refund the portion of the subscription charge while the user is unable to access to their internet Thanks for playing Ultima Online."

    I think that will truly solve all your problems. :heart: