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Pet Breeding

Discussion in 'UHall' started by Llewen, Aug 12, 2010.

  1. Llewen

    Llewen Grand Inquisitor
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    The idea for this came from another thread about pet imbuing, an idea I actually hated, but someone in it suggested pet breeding, which is an idea I actually like. This is a development of that basic idea. This actually probably belongs in the Tamer forum, but I want the devs to see it, and I'm not sure they visit all the individual profession forums. So if a mod wants to move it, I don't mind as it will still have the link here in the forums for a short time.

    First off, the main goal of pet breeding is fun, and a way of obtaining a pet you are looking for, without having to endlessly farm for them. However the goal isn't to make the process any easier, or at least not markedly easier. The primary goal is simply to add another fun sub system, similar to the plant breeding system.

    So without further ado, here is my proposal:

    1. Every pet is assigned a sex, male or female.

    2. To breed a pet you right click on a pet, and select "Breed" from the menu. You can then stable the pet.

    3. You can then take the pet you wish to breed the first pet with out of the stable, and once again you right click it and choose the "Breed" option, at which point you get a little window that says something to the effect. "You have chosen [name] for breeding, [name] is the right sex and species, do you wish to breed them? [y/n]" For simplicity's sake choosing "No" will clear all breeding flags on any pets you may have.

    4. If you accidentally choose a pet of the wrong species or sex you will get a message to the effect, "This pet cannot be bred with [name], do you wish to clear the breeding request for [name] and select this pet to breed with another pet? [y/n]"

    5. Once you have successfully chosen two pets to breed they must both be stabled for a period of 1 week per control slot the species requires. You make take them out of the stable during this time, but you cannot issue them a "kill" or "guard" command, and if they are out of the stable for more than a five minute period of time the breeding attempt will fail. When you successfully choose the second of the pair for breeding you will get a message to this effect. You must also have a free slot in your stable before the breeding attempt is accepted and once the breeding attempt is accepted that free slot is reserved and may not be used for the duration of the breeding attempt.

    6. You can check the status of the breeding attempt at any time by taking one of the two parents out of the stable right clicking on them and choosing "Breeding Status". At that point you will get a message stating that "Both the mother and father are doing well." Or "Your breeding attempt has failed."

    7. The chance of a successful breeding attempt is equal to the number of control slots required for the species X -20 + 120. The check for the successful breeding is performed one time during the process on a randomly chosen day.

    8. Once the time is expired, if the breeding attempt is successful, a new pet will be placed in that reserved stable slot with the label [newborn] on it. All it's skills will be 0 and all it's stats except for strength and hit points will be 1 (the reason for this exception is that raising str changes hit points). For each skill and stat the cap will be randomly chosen between the two parents (or it will be 100 for skills or 125 for stats, whichever is higher), with a variation of 5% in either direction (but of course it cannot go over the maximum allowed for the species after taming). The same applies to resists but of course they won't change with training.

    9. For pet colours there is a 20% chance that the pet will be the colour of either parent, divided evenly between the parents, and an 80% chance that it will be randomly assigned as normal for the species, with the exception of blaze cu sidhe. The normal colour chance for each parent is 10% but for a blaze cu sidhe that number will only be 1%. And in future if there are any similarly rare colours for a given species, they will be treated in a similar fashion.

    10. Pets which do not spawn anymore, or pets that have stats outside the normal range for the species type, cannot be bred. I'm thinking here about dread warhorses, the old super nightmares, silver steeds, black forest ostards, or pets that have been tamed using the evil omen/curse trick.

    I think this system is fun, without making it easy to breed super pets.

    edit: Added a couple of thoughts I posted below so that they are all at the top of the thread.

     
  2. Lynk

    Lynk Grand Poobah
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    I think this is a bad idea and would officially state that I do not support this.

    There are plenty of valid things the dev team could spend time on to improve the game, this is not one of them.
     
  3. Llewen

    Llewen Grand Inquisitor
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    Of course you do, I would expect nothing less from you. Maybe if you actually had some well thought out reasons as to why this was a bad idea it would seem like less of a personal attack, and more of a legitimate concern... ;)

    And yes, I know you just don't like tamers. Well guess what, taming is one of the most popular skills in the game, so it stands to reason that it would merit some development attention if anyone had a good idea of how to make it still more interesting.
     
  4. Llewen

    Llewen Grand Inquisitor
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    An alternative to this is that you have to select the male first (doesn't necessarily have to be the male, it's just a thought) and then you receive an inactive breeding token. Once you stable the pet the token becomes active and you cannot remove the pet from the stable until the token is either destroyed (by dropping it), or the breeding attempt fails or succeeds. If the token is not used within a week it is also destroyed and the token has a time stamp on it like peerless keys.

    You can use the animal lore skill on the token and it will give you the father's stats as per the normal animal lore skill, plus a picture of the pet so you can tell the colour, or if that is too difficult just a colour box with the colour of the pet in it. To use the token you double click it and target a pet of the same species and the opposite sex. This would allow players to sell the services of their pets as breeding stock, or friends to breed their pets together.

    I would suggest that tokens with less than a day's time left on them no longer be able to be bought from a vendor.
     
  5. Fink

    Fink Guest

    You're not at all curious to see what might happen?

    First I was like.. :confused:
    And then I was like.. :eek:
     
  6. Thunderz

    Thunderz Certifiable
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    This is an awsome idea, its a take on plants and chicken breeding :) A whole new thing for us to play with [as i enjoyed the plant changes and chicken coop and hatching] Maybe even get pets in new colours like the battle chickens, i think it wouold be good if you have to look after the baby [like the chicken eggs watering them every day] for a period aswell, say 1-2 weeks by feeding/grooming/changing there hay etc..

    Maybe make it also possible to breed with other peoples pets and even [like with plants] cross breeding, im thinking a drake and a nightmare to make a flying ridable horse [is it pegusus?] or a dreadmare and a night mare to make a new horse thats better than a knight but not as good as a dread. This could be soooo fun :D

    Thunderz
     
  7. Lady Michelle

    Lady Michelle Sprite Full SP
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    Tamers need to be out there taming high end pets not breeding them.
    This is not a bad idea thou, but should be only used on creatures like squirrels, ferrets, rabbits, etc. No stable slots breeding hutches that can be locked down in your house like the chicken coops. and you get a 50% chance of getting a unusual colored pet. like a black or white ferret.
     
  8. Dermott already beat you to it...

    [​IMG]
    courtesy of Dermott of LS
     
  9. Lynk

    Lynk Grand Poobah
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    Perhaps your reading abilities fail you. I said I think its a bad idea because dev's should be spending time elsewhere. It wasn't a personal attack. Your reply is merely a troll, if I posted something like that I'd have a flashing message and a deleted post.
     
  10. Llewen

    Llewen Grand Inquisitor
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    I'm not sure what the basis of this is, but I'll just assume that the thought is that this system is too easy, or will make really high end pets very common.

    In answer to that I'll explain what would happen with two high end greater dragons.

    You decide to breed two high end greater dragons. You only have a 20% chance that the breeding attempt will succeed, and on average you will find out whether the breeding attempt is successful or not 2 and a half weeks into the venture. A successful breeding attempt will take 5 weeks.

    That means that on average it will take 15 weeks to successfully breed two dragons, during which time neither dragon can be used for anything. Once you've completed that you've got as much of a chance that the resulting newborn greater dragon will be a combination of all the weaknesses of the two parents as you will that it will be a combination of all the strengths.

    And to top it off, you won't know how good your dragon is until you've trained it up fully. And unlike wild greater dragons that you tame, it won't start with magery fully trained, it will start with magery at 0. Anyone who has done any serious pet training knows how long it takes to train magery on a pet. Imagine training a greater dragon from 0 to 120+.

    Not only that, but you have to have two good quality greater dragons in the first place that had to be farmed or bred by someone. This system is no "easy street" to anything. But I do think it is a fun system, which is the whole point.
     
  11. Honesty one of the best ideas I have ever heard. People are afriad it would eliminate Tamers but think about it, if mythic created a code for basicly a gene pool or animals, tamers would lore them and I would show you about certain features or attributes that they have and you would make the best possible breed.

    It would take like 7 full days to make a "baby" breed and then would take another 7 days to grow into an adult. But doing the growing process there could be diease or deformitys.

    I say it again, honestly one of the best ideas yet.

    Sent from Iphone.
     
  12. This btw would cause so Many tamers, just an FYI. Tamers would be such a vital role for this.

    sent from Iphone.
     
  13. Llewen

    Llewen Grand Inquisitor
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    *shakes head*

    You have a very interesting mind Fink... :)
     
  14. R Traveler

    R Traveler Babbling Loonie
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    Is it multiplayer game? You must find second tamer for this.
     
  15. Llewen

    Llewen Grand Inquisitor
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    My reading abilities are serving me just fine thank you very much. :)

    You said, "There are plenty of valid things the dev team could spend time on to improve the game, this is not one of them." The explicit implication is that this idea is not a "valid thing". You gave no reason why the idea is not a "valid thing". You just implied that it wasn't. On the other hand in my post to you I clearly explained that the taming skill, and by inference taming in general, is worthy of being a priority, and as such good ideas with regard to taming are "valid" because taming is one of the most popular skills in the game.

    I'll be a little more clear. I have read more than one post where it has been stated that taming was one of the main reasons, if not the main reason, why they play UO. I know that is the case with me. Which leads me to believe that the taming "profession" in UO is one of the selling points of the game which brings in subscriptions, and keeps them active. As such I believe it merits a certain degree of attention.

    I believe that makes my post more than "merely a troll", although apparently you didn't like it much... which is fine by me... ;)
     
  16. G.v.P

    G.v.P Stratics Legend
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    Before something extravagant like Pet Breeding, EA needs to balance the current tameables. Off the top of my head, Firesteeds, Reptalons, and Skree need to be balanced, because they all plain suck right now when compared to other pets. Once there is balance, then EA should move on to ideas such as Pet Breeding, but until then, Chicken Lizards is your Pet Breeding.
     
  17. Lord Chaos

    Lord Chaos Always Present
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    Watch as hell freezes over, but I actually agree with Llewyn in part.

    Though as such, I don't believe it should be a pure breeding system, its already annoying enough with plant "breeding", don't want another confusing system.

    Utvha and I had a really good thread going on this:

    http://vboards.stratics.com/showthread.php?t=217141

    You could combined breeding and training with eachother. But the point being that this allows for several ways of reaching the top of the mountain, you can either spend ages finding the perfect pet or spend ages training your pet to perfect status if you want. This would be a time and resource consuming process.

    And as such, Herding is useless, so you could replace it with Animal Training, which as such is "akin" to imbuing, aka it allows you to teach your pet tricks, alter resistances, stats and abilities. As your pet progresses in power, it uses more and more control slots, but in the end, a legendary Animal Trainer could train up a totally customized pet with enough time.

    And I am completely disagreeing that this is a waste of time, in fact its a very important work, as taming is one of the quite unique things of UO and if its enhanced, it will be a great drawing point for people.
     
  18. BeefSupreme

    BeefSupreme Guest

    I will support this idea but only if some really cheesy porn music plays for a few seconds after you have selected the breeding pair.


    BOW CHICKA WOW WOW
     
  19. Llewen

    Llewen Grand Inquisitor
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    Since when does porn have anything to do with breeding? rolleyes:

    *singing* What's love got to do, got to do with it?

    Ya, ya, I know no one said anything about love, but it was the best I could come up with on such short notice... :heart:
     
  20. Llewen

    Llewen Grand Inquisitor
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    Ok, that almost made me spray my coffee all over my keyboard... :lol:
     
  21. Metalstorm

    Metalstorm Seasoned Veteran
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    I would love to see a breeding system.

    It makes a whole lot more sense to breed pets than dabble in the dark arts to imbue pets.

    On an emotional level I think the virtual bond between a player and a pet raised from birth would be so much stronger than that of a pet found and forced into submission.

    All the time & care involved would bond you like no other.

    Of course the need to find that 'perfect' pet would grow two fold as you would now need to find two close to perfect specimens, one male and one female with which to breed.

    It could take months, if not years to get a high quality new born :)


    Lots of time would have to be invested. Lots of care and thought would have to be invested.



    Where do I sign up? :)
     
  22. Metalstorm

    Metalstorm Seasoned Veteran
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    I was going to add that it would be cool to cross breed different species but that might be a bit much to ask.

    One step at a time. One step at a time :)
     
  23. Llewen

    Llewen Grand Inquisitor
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    I just had a bad thought, what about inbreeding... The easy way around that is that you can only breed pets that were tamed from the wild.
     
  24. Llewen

    Llewen Grand Inquisitor
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    Well that's easy enough, reptalons and skrees should be three slot pets. Firesteeds, I'm not sure about. I don't know enough about them to have a real good idea of how they could be "fixed". But I don't see why those issues should be a block to implementing a breeding system. Those would be relatively simple fixes, all it takes is the will to do them.
     
  25. Lord Chaos

    Lord Chaos Always Present
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    Two problems with breeding on its own:

    1. It excludes current pets from improving.
    2. It has nothing to do with taming on its own and is way too much similar to the already failed plant system.

    But honestly, should just have gone against the suggestion outright, so you can get your wanted fight.
     
  26. Metalstorm

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    I fail to understand how current pets would no longer improve.

    I mean pets will only train only so high so once you reach that point you're at that point.
    The breeding system would not alter that.

    I'm also thinking that the breeder would want the pets he/she uses to be fully trained before undergoing the breeding for the best possible results.
     
  27. Metalstorm

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    You bring up one good point though about it not being taming.

    Perhaps it should be like cartography where only the person who digs up the chest can loot it.

    Perhaps the breeder can only use pets that he/she has tamed personally and only once.

    After that he/she must tame new pets to breed again.


    Just a thought.
     
  28. puni666

    puni666 Slightly Crazed
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    You're right, everything else should suck too like greater dragons, dread mares and those new hippy dragons. They need to be brought down to the same level.
     
  29. Llewen

    Llewen Grand Inquisitor
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    I don't see the necessity to improve current pets. You can potentially improve them by breeding them with another quality pet. But as I said, this isn't about breeding super pets, this is about fun, and different people have different ideas of fun. Myself, I would find this system fun.

    As for the "failed plant system", there are gardeners all over the UO universe breeding plants as we speak. It may not be the most popular game system, but I would hardly consider it "failed". Anyone who uses red or orange petals has plant breeding to thank for them, and the same goes for anyone harvesting seeds of renewal.
     
  30. puni666

    puni666 Slightly Crazed
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    Inbreeding for new colors anyone? Or maybe ****** strength?
     
  31. Llewen

    Llewen Grand Inquisitor
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    Well given the challenges already built into the system I have proposed, I'd hate to see this happen.
     
  32. Llewen

    Llewen Grand Inquisitor
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    This would also be another safe guard against breeding "super pets". Although clearly the ultimate reward is that you could possibly breed an exceptional pet. I don't have a problem with that, as long as it isn't easy, because while player equipment has gotten stronger, pets have remained essentially the same.
     
  33. Metalstorm

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    Well having to use new pets each time to breed does stop that inbreeding you're concerned about :D

    I mean at least one new.

    One raised would do fine with one wild (hence the one breed per life thing)
     
  34. Lord Chaos

    Lord Chaos Always Present
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    Yes, but they cannot get better than what they were set as max from taming point.

    Try and read the thread I linked to, these two systems could compliment eachother greatly and there would be nothing wrong with for instance replacing Herding with Animal Training. (which as such could be used for Breeding as well)
     
  35. Thunderz

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    In RL you cant improve a current race horse, what you do is stud it out to a good female racer and hope the foul will have both its parents atributed and become a "better" race horse.
    Thats why studding is such huge business as if you have a male or female that has won every race they have competed in then its top dollar for a baby from that pair [happens at all levels so over decades you can breed your horse with better and better as you earn more money to breed it with a better race horse]

    Simple as that, the beter the parents the more chance your baby will be good. If i have a 4.9 or 5 male i can ask top dollar to breed it with your 4.9 and 50% chance are we will get a 5, or i can breed it with a 2 and then it will need breeding and breeding and breeding untill it hits 5.

    That adds alot more comunication between breeders and more diversirty as a 2. and 2. can breed for a chance at a 2.2 which will take years to reach 5 but making it possible and fun to interact and try for.

    ontop of that, getting a pink 5.0 nightmare will be like 1/1000000 [same as blaze cu sidhes] but its something to work towards and try for and bring pet tradibng back into UO.

    I started as a tamer selling ostards and horses for 300gp each and loved it, it would bring that back. Not just for tamers but also for people who want coloured pets [as long as they dont make it to easy]

    Thunderz
     
  36. Llewen

    Llewen Grand Inquisitor
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    I think only being able to breed pets that were tamed from the wild would do the same thing without ruining someone's chance to make a business out of offering an exceptional pet for a stud. :)
     
  37. Metalstorm

    Metalstorm Seasoned Veteran
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    Stud service! Now you're talking :D

    I retract my once per life idea.

    Pet Stud service might be a really fun venture in UO.


    Brilliant!
     
  38. Lord Chaos

    Lord Chaos Always Present
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    Many of us do. Those of us attached to our pets do like to be able to make them the best they can be.

    If its just a "for fun" system and has no skill or gameplay value. Then I'd agree with that its a waste of time.

    Coupled with that some of the most popular scripts out there for any of the script programs are garden tending scripts. This isn't a popular system, its something people have to go through if they want those resources and decorations (the plants themselves). If they gave neither, then likely no one would be doing it.

    Honestly we don't need another system like that just for the heck of it, especially one that would take so long to create for the devs. Hence why I in seriousness linked to the other thread, because adding breeding to a functional system as he and I suggested would actually be beneficial to develop and would be a draw to people.
     
  39. Thunderz

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    I think even when it gets to the point a few months or years down the line where people are mating studs and winners it should be a 10% chance it gains 1%, so you would have to breed and rebreed 100 pets to make a nice one, taking 7-14 weeks pet new born that you have to look after each of them, so its gona take a year of hardwork breeding to get one nice one and then it can only be mated with a wild one, taking out the posibility of just breeding and breeding epic pets

    Thunderz
     
  40. Lord Chaos

    Lord Chaos Always Present
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    In RL you can't take a sword and rub lube on it to make it magic either. rolleyes:

    And so how does it make sense that every pet in UO can reach GM in all its skills?

    The current suggestion doesn't improve it like that. But that would still be stupid in the sense that all you're doing is just letting it sit in a stable for a week, then ditch the parent and rebreed.

    The system doesn't allow for breeding that way. Why would anyone give away their pet and lose bonding and pass it on to another player and then risk losing it by that player just keeping it.
     
  41. Metalstorm

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    The whole point of playing a game is "fun".

    "Fun" however is many different things to many different people.


    "Fun" is never a waste of time. Excluding the fact that playing a game is essentially a waste of time period. But it is "fun" so we do it.

    One person can not honestly say what is or isn't fun. You know what is fun for you and for the people you know closely but it begins and ends there.

    There are believe it or not, other people with different perceptions of what is fun.
     
  42. Lord Chaos

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    You're missing the point. Fun is always the factor of anything developed, but it just can't be the sole reason, it just won't work at all. It will be a huge amount of work for very little use on its own.

    And as such people would end up simply doing it only to endlessly breed towards more perfect pets with no way of knowing the limits until its trained up and as such would just become endless fodder pets.
     
  43. Metalstorm

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    But would they be having fun doing it?

    If yes, I would call it a success.
    If not than I would say it failed.

    How will we ever know if we don't try?
     
  44. Lord Chaos

    Lord Chaos Always Present
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    There would be a few that would have fun with it, but without functional value this system would simply fall to the wayside.

    Either way, I am not opposed to breeding, only opposed that it be on its own.
     
  45. Thunderz

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    Well maybe you both loose your epic pet and recieve a foul each? Ever
    concider that your 4 and my 5 make 2 new 4.5s ???

    Thunderz
     
  46. Lord Chaos

    Lord Chaos Always Present
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    Which you might keep.

    Either way, if this is what its going to be about, then screw it.
     
  47. Metalstorm

    Metalstorm Seasoned Veteran
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    Why would one have to transfer a pet to breed between players?

    I just figured you would choose "breed" from the context menu, choose the pet to breed with and wait for that pet's owner to click the 'accept' window to start the breeding.

    The owner of the female would be the one who gets the newborn of course.


    Mind you, this is all hypothetical.
     
  48. Metalstorm

    Metalstorm Seasoned Veteran
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    Breeding one's own pets could present a problem. Such as only one greater dragon can be out at a time.

    An npc "breeder" might be needed to select the two pets from your stable to be bred.
    And of course you would need at least one empty stable slot available for the newborn.
     
  49. Holy cow! Is that dragon mounting that polar bear?? :confused: :love::popcorn:
     

  50. OMG!!!!!!!! BEST! IDEA! EVAR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :lol::lol::lol: