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Power Scrolls in Ilshenar/Tokuno Champ Spawn... Something else for Fel.

Discussion in 'UHall' started by UltimaSword, Oct 24, 2008.

  1. UltimaSword

    UltimaSword Guest

    WHHAAAA He's a trammy he doesn't understand fel waaa waaaa. Okay please save your breath.

    Anyway what I do understand is that the current situation with power scrolls is that they are a monopoly on most shards. It isn't like (except for a FEW shards) groups of guilds are fighting for them and it is somewhat easy to get into them. No. One or two guilds dominate the scene and make all the gold. My problem is that Power Scrolls are very important items. So these guilds make millions easily in their monopoly of the champ spawns.

    What should be in fel are strong artifacts (equal to or a lil stronger than Doom). Stuff that while isn't super important would draw the same crowd to them.. You know the crowd? The same few guilds that controlled scrolls. But the difference is that these artifacts aren't so much of a necessity as the scrolls. As long as pvp guilds are allowed to kill and raid people are not going to want to go there. So why leave power scrolls there, such a much needed item by all people, when all it does is support the fact that these guilds dominate the scene and make millions of them. I will not even get into the hacks and cheating that makes it so an average player CANNOT get a group of people and hold their own.

    Anyway I support a move power scrolls to ilshenar/tokuno/mel dungeons. Make it so the better scrolls have a less chance of dropping then the fel ones but they still do. Add powerful doom level arties to champ spawn boss drops in fel only.
     
  2. No, no, no, and no.

    Powerscrolls are currently the ONLY reward for participating in the PvP playstyle. Remove it and you can watch even more people leave the game as they have no wish to participate in Yew gate PvP, as that would be all that's left. The champ spawns in Fel would be abandoned, and there would be nothing left in Fel to fight for/over.

    Additionally, if the scrolls were moved to Ilsh, they would be farmed non stop until they were completely worthless. You would also see the worst griefing this game has seen in all of it's 11 yrs.

    As has been said time and time again, over and over......leave Fel PS's alone. They're better off exactly where they are right now.
     
  3. Lord Kotan

    Lord Kotan Slightly Crazed
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    He is offering another reward. He's not taking away, he's replacing.
     
  4. I understand that. Even so, PS's are the only reason the Fel champ spawns are utilized. In fact, they're the only reason they're there. The PS's being in Fel is the ONLY reason they're still worth anything too. If they were in Tram they'd be worthless in a week. I also don't want to see the griefing it would bring about, nor would I want to take away rewards for PvP, even if one was added to take it's place. So what, they only get to have 1? Pfft.
     
  5. kinney42

    kinney42 Seasoned Veteran
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    Apparently I should have refreshed the page a little faster....thats the bad part of posting while busy at work! oops!!!

    Connor, Your response is to not remove the PS's because that is all fel has.
    He suggested to replace the ps's with something else. Suggested doom level or higher arties instead of ps's. That way Fel would still have something. So YEAH!
    I agree. Something every character needs to play the game should not be available only to PvP guilds. Wether that was intended or not, thats the way it is.
     
  6. I doan like it =/
     
  7. DHMagicMan_1

    DHMagicMan_1 Guest

    Yes but what do you bet Conner is in one of the power Fel guilds that dominates champ spawns on one of the servers and he doesn't want to see the guild's income reduced by making PS available any other way.

    The PS implementation was poor from the beginning. I have no problem with Fel having double resources for Risk/Reward but it shouldn't have some items critical to all aspects of the game (Tram side too) that can only be gotten in Fel and only in huge groups of people...

    It's about time they figured out a new way to have PS drop and replace the Fel Champ Spawn rewards with something new that is good for Reds or good for PvP only ... since that's what Fel is all about.
     
  8. You'd lose that bet. Not only have I never been in any kind of PvP guild, I've never even been any closer to a champ spawn than the dungeon entrance. Hell, my grand total of PvP time is about a month total.

    It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see what would happen if the scrolls were moved to Ilsh, nor does it take someone who's got a personal interest in keeping them where they are to want them to stay to avoid what would inevitably happen if moved.


    Colter is gonna laugh his ass off when he reads this one....
     
  9. kinney42

    kinney42 Seasoned Veteran
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    You can't not make changes/improvments to the game because it might allow for griefing. Progress must be made. Its the players choice to grief or not. The whole of the community should not be punished because of the choice of a few.
     
  10. I repeat:

    So what, they only get to have 1?

    Pfft.
     
  11. You also can't make changes to a game that would cause a significant amount of the players to quit. You also can't make changes to a game that would remove any reason at all to utilize one of the features that has become probably the most used part of the game in it's entirety. That would just be a very dumb move.

    And yes, designers are supposed to be looking at designs and how they would be utitlized by the playerbase, and that does include griefing.
     
  12. Traveller

    Traveller Guest

    You REALLY don't understand, do you? You say that scrolls are a necessity, while the artifacts aren't just because scrolls are in fel while arties are not. Reverse the issue and suddenly the artifacts would be the necessity. Besides, no 120 scroll is a necessity in this game, and don't tell me you don't have money to afford all the +15 you might need.
     
  13. kinney42

    kinney42 Seasoned Veteran
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    You have very good points but every one of them is bunk because they all revolve around PvP needing a reward. Which we all agree with. The OP is simply suggesting that reward needs to change to something the isn't REQUIRED by all playstyles. Except crafting.
    Why would people quit just because the pixle crack PvP reward picture changes? As long as the new items are just as valueable, (which is up to the Devs) then there is no argument to keep PS's in fel.
     
  14. kinney42

    kinney42 Seasoned Veteran
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    Completely wrong.
    Tell me how to get 14 stable slots for a tamer without 120's?
    Tell me how to use a barding skill on a high level boss without 120's?
     
  15. And I say yet again, they only get to have one (1) reward?

    Pfft.

    If you're going to take things from Fel, then give them a Fel-Malas, a Fel-Ilsh, and a Fel-Tokuno, so they don't have to participate in Tram rulesets to get the things that are only available by going to Tram. This would give them their own Luna, their own Doom, and their own Peerless that they don't currently have, along with access to ALL of the monsters.

    Things that are a necessity for THEIR playstyle.


    What's good for the goose is good for the gander.
     
  16. Theo_GL

    Theo_GL Grand Poobah
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    Well, first Connor is no PvPer....

    Second - its unlikely for them to change the PS dropping in fel. It is what it is.

    The way to succeed is to either do something else so you can 'trade' for your PS's. IE do doom - sell arties. When you get 15 mil of gold go buy your 120 magery from your PvP guild. Before you think 120's drop like candy - they don't and it takes quite a bit of effort get the 120 you need. Multiply that by the number of people doing/protecting a spawn and it may take you a few months as part of a spawn guild to get that 120 mage.

    One way around the system is to xfer to a lesser populated shard with a few friends and run champs. Load up on scrolls and xfer back and sell them to pay for xfers.

    We did this last year by going to an asian shard. Our night is their daytime so the area was pretty wide open and we'd run champs with 2-4 people and sometimes I would solo them.

    I came back to GL with about every 120 I'd ever need and I never looked back. i have a stack of 120's in my house in case I need em one day.

    [​IMG]

    We then sold hundreds of 110 and 115's and easily paid for our trips and split hundreds of millions in gold among the team plus it was fun teamwork.

    Thats one way to avoid the PvP guilds on your shard. Some shards overseas have literally a few hundred people tops. Everyone has a castle and there are NO houses outside Luna city. Yes, lag sux and you cant really PvP - but they also couldn't find enough ppl to patrol all the champs all the time. It was easy pickings.
     
  17. Sir Kenga

    Sir Kenga Guest

    I think Fel should have PS's AND new doom level arties available only in Fel.
     
  18. Setnaffa

    Setnaffa Certifiable
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    No, No, No!

    If you want to add stronger artifacts, add those to Trammel. The entire Champion Spawn/PowerScroll arc is one of the few things that keep Fel alive. On some shards 1 or 2 guilds may own the spawns, but I've done the Destard and Despise spawns on Napa with just a couple unguilded friends, so guilds don't own every shard.
     
  19. Tomas_Bryce

    Tomas_Bryce Rares Collector Extraordinaire | Rares Fest Host
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    You are asking him to compare the benefits of power scrolls with some imaginary artifacts that do not exist?
     
  20. Fink

    Fink Guest

    How about.. Powerscrolls/Statscrolls for Felucca champs, Alacrity scrolls for Ilshenar champs, Minor Treasures for Tokuno champs?
     
  21. Traveller

    Traveller Guest

    14 stable slot a "necessity"... sure.

    With a 115, maybe? Sure, you get lower chance, not 0. Another "necessity"...

    Check "necessity" on vocabulary, please. Your abuse of the term speaks a lot about the goodness of your arguments.
     
  22. Nexus

    Nexus Site Support
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    Couple of issues with the OP's suggestion...If items like this dropped, they can be insured right away...no goodies for the PvP crowd and the few thieves left active on prodo shards.
     
  23. UltimaSword

    UltimaSword Guest

    Some of you guys do not get it. Connor it is a monopoly. You say you barely pvp well then you really don't understand. Most of fel pvp is yew gate and the same guilds there do the champs. Most not all.

    Also I said keep scrolls in Fel with a better chance of dropping 120's then in ilsh. Add arties equal to dooms power on fel champs. Add scroll drops to ilsh ect with a less chance of dropping. And yes for a lot of templates 120 is more necessary then an orny.

    not a bad idea. and all the fel stuff will have better chance at drops.
     
  24. UltimaSword

    UltimaSword Guest

    Cannot be insured immediately after looted. Time limit of ten twenty minutes.
     
  25. Oh, but I do understand. Completely.

    I also understand there are quite a few ways to get all of the scrolls that you need without having to move where they drop.

    This is once again turning into the "oh noes, the evil Fel guilds have something that I want, so it should be taken away from them" argument, which never holds water.
     
  26. UltimaSword

    UltimaSword Guest

    I don't understand why you think it is a balanced thing. I never said it should be taken from them. But it shouldn't make them ridiculously rich. I don't think anyone should need to buy something. I am all for making fel sides of ALL facets so reds can do there thing. I am also all for making power scrolls available in tram. it is stupid the way it is.
     
  27. NBG

    NBG Lore Master
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    I did power scroll spawns back when it first implemented and made a good living from it. I agree that this "Special" feature should be kept where it is now (fel).

    But I think there should be some modification for power scroll distribution where the person/group that actually have worked the spawn should be the only ones getting the 120 scrolls.

    With ghost cams monitoring and raiding a champ spawns, there are close to no incentive to do the spawns unless you are in the raiding party...

    Like I said, it should stay in fel but the distribution of the power scrolls should be changed.
     
  28. The only reason any guild holds a monopoly is that people let them. All anyone has to do is put together their own spawn guild, and they can get the scrolls for themselves.

    If that's not good enough for you, then you can always get a small group together, transfer to Drachenfels or some other low population shard, spend a week or 2 spawning, and come back with all the scrolls you'll ever need, and make yourselves ridiculously rich.

    If that's not good enough for you, get a small group together and farm Doom for a week, then either sell or trade the artifacts for all the scrolls that you need, and not have to spend a dime. You might even end up ahead if you play your cards right.

    There are plenty of ways to achieve the ends, both by participating in the PvP game and by not.
     
  29. "Powerscrolls are currently the ONLY reward for participating in the PvP playstyle"

    dont people who love to PVP do it out of love ?? and is that not reward enough ??

    dont people who PVP have all the scrolls they need already ??

    If insurance only worked in Tram would we see more guild to guild war ??
     
  30. UltimaSword

    UltimaSword Guest

    On shards that guilds hold it down on lock it is almost not possible. Expecially with UO's low population. Which is the root of the problem. Your other ideas are possibilities but it shouldn't be like that. having to pay money to transfer to get items in the game because big guilds hold it down on lock.
     
  31. Traveller

    Traveller Guest

    dont people who love to PVM do it out of love ?? and is that not reward enough ??
    dont people who PVM have all the arties they need already ??
     
  32. Urk of LS

    Urk of LS Guest

    I like this idea, It might even bring back some hunting in Tramm, other than Peerless hunts.
     
  33. UltimaSword

    UltimaSword Guest

    Fink's idea was good i agree.
     
  34. GalenKnighthawke

    GalenKnighthawke Grand Poobah
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    I haven't always felt this way, but I think I'm coming more and more to think power scrolls should be left as is, meaning should be left in Felucca-only.

    I like the idea more and more of each high-end PvM thing in the game having a special reward.

    Scrolls of Alacrity, not Power Scrolls, should be the Ilshenar spawn reward.

    -Galen's player
     
  35. YES and YES

    what if you could not sell PS only use the ones you got on yourself ??

    right now you can not put an insured item on a vendor easy enough to do the same for that little red gate
     
  36. Traveller

    Traveller Guest

    what if you could not sell arties, only use the ones you got on yourself ??

    Really, I don't understand why people in this game have become so spoiled that the notion of "commerce" between different playstyles has gone so far from their mindset...
     
  37. Setnaffa

    Setnaffa Certifiable
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    :thumbup1:

    Now that would work.
     
  38. CatLord

    CatLord Guest

    Solution:
    Power scrolls 110 to 115... Trammel and Ilsh.
    Power 120... Felluca

    Stat Scrolls 5,10... tram and Ilsh.
    Stat scrolls 15+... Felluca

    Alacrity scrolls... added to the 105/artefact drops...

    This will not disrupt anything...

    Have Fun.
     
  39. UltimaSword

    UltimaSword Guest

    It is not commerce it is a monopoly. Transferring shards should not be a solution.
     
  40. DHMagicMan_1

    DHMagicMan_1 Guest

    UO should introduce the concept of items that can't be given or sold to other toons... so if you want to camp the PS all day fine... but once you have all the PS for your toon the extras won't do you any good and you can't loot them from others.
     
  41. Again, it's only a monopoly because the players on the shard allow it to be. Any monopoly can be broken if the time and effort is put into it. The same time and effort the guilds that hold the monopolies put into it when they got their starts.
     
  42. UltimaSword

    UltimaSword Guest

    I guess it comes down to the amount of players. Which is at the heart the reason UO is slowly dying. No one on my shard challenges the big guilds. And we dont get new players barely soooo.
     
  43. What's to stop you from stealing members from them? Offer an incentive to join your guild instead. There are always guild members that are unhappy with their current guild. Offer incentives for players that normally don't PvP like teaching them how to without having to deal with the Yew gate garbage PvP. As the old saying goes........where there's a will there's a way.
     
  44. CatLord

    CatLord Guest


    We both know that the control is kept using cheats, hacks and exploits...

    Some of the guilds have client hacks... use something more than uoa... etc.

    But I have FAITH in the current devs... ALL valuable items are taking a HIT... sooner than later it will be PS turn...

    (the devs know how to close one area... peerless works like that... so it will be easy to CLOSE the new trammel PS areas)
     
  45. ColterDC

    ColterDC Visitor

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    Yeah I must admit it was pretty funny.
     
  46. ColterDC

    ColterDC Visitor

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    You mean like the faction items that are being introduced?
     
  47. Lord Patapon

    Lord Patapon Guest

    I understand WHY you guys want some change.
    I don't agree with the author's proposition, though.

    In fact, if you want to make things smoother, there is just ONE little thing that could make things easier for all, even for the non-Fell-at-all guilds (everyone's got his gaming style, I don't judge those guys), and this thing has been asked for months and months: please Devs, do something about the spawn cams.

    No spawn cams means less PK raids on the blues that try to have PS, outside of the big Fell guilds.
    This is not a way to nerf PKs anyhow, these guys sometimes have the balls to raid even if they're 1v3 - even if some of them, at least on Europa, aren't perfectly clean when it comes to speedhack and such- but if you move those to a Tram ruleset location, then Fell will be dead.

    Fix the system, and stop killing Fell play-style (oh, and stop about the paranoid stuff: not everyone is cheating on Fell, far from it. Those who live on Fell and like it and don't cheat are the ones who are bothered about cheating, not Trammel players who spent most of their times "secured". Please.)
     
  48. Rix/\

    Rix/\ Guest

    the pvp guild that do champs on my shard rarely do doom so we deal back and forth. There is no reason to give tokyno or ish power scroll, they do need something but power scrolls wouldn't be fair maybe alacrity scrolls or something instead for ish or tokyno
     
  49. Nystul

    Nystul Lore Master
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    All your suggestion does is takes a "problem" and replaces it with another "problem". What about when people are tired of those new arties being "monopolized"?

    But really, there are hundreds of powerscrolls for sale. It's not hard to simply purchase them.

    If UO didn't take on the whole trammel ruleset over the last X amount of years, more players would be seasoned & experienced in pvp in general. They would also perform a lot better and really this "problem" wouldn't exist. There is thousands of trammel based players. Nothing's stopping them from learning to use better suits and/or survival/killing techniques but themselves.
     
  50. UltimaSword

    UltimaSword Guest

    Meh doesnt matter. Devs wont listen anyway. Honestly the way it is now is just down right stupid.