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"Public" harrower...

Discussion in 'UO Catskills' started by Nystul, Oct 24, 2008.

  1. Nystul

    Nystul Lore Master
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    For the "trammel" based guilds/alliances, who would be interested in participating in public harrowers? No details worked out except us placing the skull, announcing the location of the harrower, mainting a defense & allowing the non fellucians to kill/complete the harrower.

    A more detailed post/announcment will come upon gauging interest. Would be fun & possibly bring a good fight if all the other opposing guilds rally against us and fight for a change...
     
  2. Nystul

    Nystul Lore Master
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    Also would like some input/opinions on if it would be "more fun" for the players to work one of each spawn to obtain the skulls, and then the harrower, or just the harrower.
     
  3. CatLord

    CatLord Guest

    I'm out... one thing is to do an event that will help the community.

    I'll Raid this one.

    Good luck...
     
  4. Farsight

    Farsight Crazed Zealot
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    Now that really depends on which Fel guilds are sponsoring the Harrower and who is representing those guilds and who, specifically, won't be allowed.
     
  5. Nystul

    Nystul Lore Master
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    Good luck with that. Look forward to seeing your corpse all over (as usual).

    Also your defenition of helping a community is only & always something that you agree on and/or benefit on in some way. I'm giving players new & old who don't travel to felluca, don't have guilds who do things like this the chance to experience it and possibly get something from it and do it safely at that.

    Go ahead and raid it, we expect it. But at least you don't think twice about showing your true colors :)

    You're just sour that it's not your "buddies" doing it, because if it was you'd be obviously all over it.
     
  6. Nystul

    Nystul Lore Master
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    Any of the "pvp related" guilds/alliances and or affiliations are obviously exempt from the killing of the harrower. Those guilds and/or members know who they are.

    A member of a major trammel alliance above already spoke his stance, if you're a member or an ally, count yourself out already. You may always come and end up like him though (dead).

    I've already spoke to and gotten quite a bit of players/guilds interested. I figured stratics would be a nice place to spark some interest on the oposing and/or participating sides. Seems it will be sparking quite a few things :)
     
  7. CatLord

    CatLord Guest

    I have no problem helping Calina... but your post is accurate...

    "public" harrower....

    Very accurate.

    please post the details... and we'll have fun on the battlefield... again.

    Hum... last time we fought... you were the one that ended up dead... not once, twice... three times.

    Sad thing considering I ping 140.
     
  8. Nystul

    Nystul Lore Master
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    Make sure you tell all the innocent trammel players why you will be "raiding" them too before we place the skulls. Make it sound as sincere as possible! Explain everything behind your motivation to ruin thier fun for the night.
     
  9. Nystul

    Nystul Lore Master
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    Very believeable...

    If you believe you killed me three times here's a public offer for you. Put 5mil up on whatever character you want to play and I'll put up 25mil. You can ICQ me for the details don't spam my thread any further.

    But really keep your childish unrelated remarks out of my thread and stop spamming it. Do it again and I'll gladly get a moderator.
     
  10. Magdalene

    Magdalene Stratics Legend
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    Guys? try not to make it too personal?
    It's about the shard, the guids and other people not the size of your... egos.
     
  11. Nystul

    Nystul Lore Master
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    Thank you :)

    I don't see what the big deal is anyways. All I'm doing is giving to players willing to participate. Those who choose not to can do just that. It's thier choice to publicly make it aware thier against and will try to stop what others WILL be having fun in.

    These will also be happening quite frequently if I have it my way.
     
  12. Lady_Calina

    Lady_Calina Lore Keeper
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    Nys, I think the problem that people will have with this is that even though it's labeled as a "public" harrower, it has a sort of "list" of who can or can't attend, like an exclusive nightclub.

    For instance, alot of "pvp related" guilds have non-pvp players in it. I think it's unfair to exclude any guild in its entirety based on the playstyle of some of its members.

    Also, you pointed out that because Pitr had an issue with the event, anyone allied or guilded with him would also be killed at the event. I think this is unfair as well, for the same reason. You cannot label everyone who is a guildie, ally or friend of Pitr as holding all the same beliefs as Pitr and exclude them from a "public" harrower.

    I would support this event fully if it was truly open to all to attend or defend, regardless of guild or social affiliations.
     
  13. Callie

    Callie Guest

    Would be intersting...I'd be interested in hearing more of your details and exactly what you had planned. Please feel free to shoot me an ICQ at your convenience and we'll chat.

    As a point of clarification, the guilds in the One Circle Alliance are always free to participate in activities as they please. The alliance exists for folks to have interaction and gather for common events. I will make your offer known to the individual players in the alliance, but their choice to participate or not is THEIR OWN choice.

    Again, please send me an icq and we'll chat.
     
  14. GirlPower

    GirlPower Guest

    How is it not helping the community? It is helping people that don't normally travel to fel see that there is more to fel than just "pk's". There is fun to be had, and it can be rewarding. Maybe seeing some pvp would make it not so intimidating. Some might make new friends. Many people have never even seen a harrower or done one or gotten their own stat scrolls due to some over bearing guilds controlling and not letting anyone else do them on catskills for so long, so it seems beneficial to me. Just might keep people playing the game when they see there is more out there than just bitterness toward different guild tags. Someone who genuinely wanted to benefit the community or help others would see how they could assist, not immediately say "I'll raid this one".
    Why would it matter as long as someone is willing to help people try one out? And as for who isn't allowed, its just people known for being mean, and trying to ruin something like this for people that just want a chance and maybe get some scrolls for themselves for once, not off a vendor. We all know how it is to be newer to the game, or not have all the pvp experience/gear you need, or not be in a large guild that is fel based. Sadly, there are some people that would ruin an event that would benefit others or the game out of pure spite. I don't think its allowed to post who specifically, but I believe one of the guilds and ally being referred to actually raided a champ spawn being worked to donate to a cancer foundation.
     
  15. Lady_Calina

    Lady_Calina Lore Keeper
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    If the event is open to everyone, then I'm totally for it and agree with GirlPower that it would be beneficial for the community to let people who don't pvp see it without threat to them.

    After the Relay 4 Life event, which I was attending and was killed, I would hate for some argument to stir up beforehand with people feeling left out or insulted and then the entire events ruined by 20 people flooding in to rain on everyone's parade...
     
  16. Nystul

    Nystul Lore Master
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    Rules are rules, they exist for a reason. Before anything would have been read, it was obvious there was going to be exceptions. Those who speak out against it with intentions to ruin it put themselves and thier guilds on that exemption list. But I refuse to let half a guild particpate and enjoy the event, while select members and a portion of that guild/alliance has the sole intention to ruin it, I'm not dealing with that headache.

    Pvp related guilds more then have the opportunity to do things like this, and have most likely already experienced this. This is for people who don't have that opportunity.

    I'm not going to go on justifying my choices as an individual or my guilds. We're only giving by doing this event, and in no way recieving except we thought it would be fun to see players who have not had the opportunity to do this, do it.

    I've been left out of trammel based events numerous times out of hatred towards me in the past, was that fair? Obviously not. But that was thier decision to do so, and it may have or have not have anything to do with my decisions now.
     
  17. Nystul

    Nystul Lore Master
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    It should also be noted that the first few words of my first post specifically stated who it was for, hence the "Public" part of it.

    Players who don't understand why some guilds will be exempt from participating are more than welcome to come see why. If the first one goes well with little opposition towards the participating players, I know myself and my guild would be more than happy to start lifting exemptions until a problem arises.

    Preventing a problem from occuring in the first place is what I want to do. It's going to get confusing for my members to understand why part of a guild is fightning us, and the other half is trying to participate. I may as well remove that confusion before hand.
     
  18. Lady_Calina

    Lady_Calina Lore Keeper
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    I don't expect you to justify anything and I understand what a headache it would be to keep an eye on who is and isn't showing up without just excluding based on guild tags. I was just stating that people who get left out may feel justified to raid it and ruin it for everyone. My guild won't, I'll see to that, but other GMs of left out guilds may not.

    My husband and I, I can say, have never completed a non-public Harrower. Alot of my guild has not, simply because of the massive raids on them. With maybe 10 pvpers on at any given time, and only 3 out of those that are well-trained, we just don't have the numbers to stand against over 20 players.

    But I am happy, Nys, that you at least want to do something for all non-pvp guilds.
     
  19. Lady_Calina

    Lady_Calina Lore Keeper
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    I'd also like to add that, although I haven't had a red for awhile now, I would like to try and defend the event.
     
  20. Nystul

    Nystul Lore Master
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    We completed one before when you & my guild was allied in the past. It was a good fight vs. the whole shard and I think we made it out with half the scrolls. I'd post screenshots of it but I just reformatted a few weeks ago.

    Also if you could read the post above shotguns, I've edited it a bit. I'm sure my guild and I would be more than happy to change things around for the next one after we see that the guilds we expect to oppose us are willing to not do so, but allow it.

    It's not only my guild who has to allow this to happen. :)
     
  21. Callie

    Callie Guest

    I'd love to participate in a harrower. Never seen one, never done one. However it seems my guild and I have already been shot in the foot, and it looks like we have been un-invited before the ink was dry on the invitation.

    Let me know if you change your mind....
     
  22. Lady_Calina

    Lady_Calina Lore Keeper
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    Did we do one? I swear I don't remember it, I'll have to ask Mag when he gets home. I believe you though, you've never lied to me.

    I'll put my stamp of support on this and if there's anything I can do, let me know.
     
  23. Farsight

    Farsight Crazed Zealot
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    I'll tell you why it matters. It matters because of the answer to the question, which was, "Farsight, one of your characters wear a GRI tag over your head, in fact, ALL of your characters are in that "Trammel Alliance," therefore you are cordially uninvited." (Just a bit of paraphrasing there)

    That means that any offers of aid or intent to participate on my part would be pointless. I suspected that response was coming, and I just wanted that to be pointed out to me.

    So, best of luck. I hope it goes well, and I'm staying away.
     
  24. Nystul

    Nystul Lore Master
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    Okay now I'm starting to feel bad. Yeah, one of the biggest "assholes" on the shard is feeling bad :x. (Hey that don't happen often).


    I'm willing to give the first one a chance to allow all who do not oppose it a chance to participate. I ask that if guilds possibly can be somewhat generous to allow all guilds the opportunity to get thier stat scrolls. I would like to not see one guild specifically getting the majority of the scrolls lol.


    Guilds who do not have a protecter with max justice can contact me and kill my red characters for justice a few days prior to the event.


    If problems occur I will make sure changes are made in the future.
     
  25. Lady_Calina

    Lady_Calina Lore Keeper
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    *hugs Nystul* That's my Nys, he's just a big ole softy inside.
    You give me a time and date, hun, and I'll see to it that as many guys as I can get will help defend and our blues will help kill the thing :)
     
  26. Nystul

    Nystul Lore Master
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    I'll talk with the guild and members as they get online to plan all that out. I'll be working on getting the skulls this weekend I suppose.


    I'd still like some feedback on if it would be more fun for everyone to do one of each spawn then the harrower, or just the harrower itself!
     
  27. GirlPower

    GirlPower Guest

    It could be a bit of jumping the gun on both sides here.
    Just made it kind of confusing when the person who seemed to always be (not sure if he still is?) the gm of your guild immediately said he was going to raid it. Like nystul said, we just want to keep all the participants safe, and assumed Catlord wasn't going to raid it by himself. When the inital post was made im pretty sure GRI was not one of the guilds that were not welcome, nor thought of GRI as a threat to the event until Catlords post. I for one, was hoping GRI would want to participate too because I know you have many members new and old and it would be fun for all of us. So I do hope you reconsider, and I hope Catlord does as well.
     
  28. Nystul

    Nystul Lore Master
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    I was already harassed ingame about it!
     
  29. Lady_Calina

    Lady_Calina Lore Keeper
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    *steps in front of Nystul*

    I'll protect you!

    *pulls a muscle from turning her head too fast so as to look heroic*

    Nevermind.
     
  30. GirlPower

    GirlPower Guest

    That is probably the best way to do it. It will allow some guilds to shake their bad rep, and allow others to show their true colors. The more the merrier, and it will let anyone trying to hinder the event in any way weed themselves out publicly. Thank u Calina for the support, and I hope all your members jump in, those who want to help defend and those who want to participate =)
     
  31. CatLord

    CatLord Guest

    Greetings Girl Power...

    Either it is a shard harrower, for all the good folk of Catskills... not a VIP harrower... or I'll raid.

    Me... on my own.

    And I am not the leader of GRI.

    I'm a retired old wolf that knows how to read between the lines...


    Do it for the shard... count me in.
    Do it for personal gain... I'll fight it.

    And about my allies... when the Relay for Life Event was raided... I was next to Barefoot and Calina... and we all died...

    About running spawns... I was invited to run them by the current guilds... I wont help anyone... nor former allies nor new guilds since both sides welcome an alliance with a guild that attacked the Circle... leaving any choice out of the picture.

    GRI is run by Callie and all the other 12 GMs.

    I play Drachs.


    Enjoy UO.
     
  32. AnneNomilly

    AnneNomilly Seasoned Veteran
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    Personally, I'd LOVE to see this come off. Anything that exposes more of UO to more people can't be anything but good for EVERYONE in the long run. Giving people the chance to do things they can't do on their own is the true spirit of Catskills and the Friday Nite Hunts. Let me know what I can do to help!

    Nystul, as to your question about the groups doing the champs to get the skulls or just going straight to the Harrower, what about a combination? I know Barefoot and Ally Oop have been taking the Friday Hunt Group to champ spawns and, I gotta be honest, it's been AWESOME to see the results. Watching people learning to work together, helping each other, sharing scrolls at the end, it's been loads of fun. I have several skulls laying around gathering dust I'm sure I could dig up and donate for something fun like this. But what if before placing the skulls for the Harrower, the group did the Oaks spawn? If this turned into something regular, the group could pick a different spawn each time for one of the skulls and work it before popping the Harrower? My thought is that it would give everyone some warm up and practice for working together before the "Big Daddy" while letting everyone truly participate in the process.

    Anyone who has done champs before knows it can take a bit of time to get all the skulls. Some of the spawns are definitely harder than others so it might be hard to get all the skulls in one day or nite of play for a casual group of players. But if they work on one spawn other than the Harrower, it would give everyone more experience and make it even more enjoyable for them. There's nothing quite like the excitement of seeing a scroll pop in your pack (even if you don't realize at first it's a 105 Stealing that you have no use for!). :p

    I know, I know, I'm naive. I'm of the opinion that it's a benefit to everyone in the game if more people are taught how to do these things. I hear on various boards people saying pvp is dead. There aren't any people to fight in Fel. Fel is a big scary place with trash talking, mean ole reds. So let's expose people to some of the FUN that can be had in Fel. Let's show them some reds who actually HELP and are the nicest group of people you'd ever care to play with. Let's help them learn how to survive and play in Fel. In order to do this, though, it has to be FUN for them. I truly believe it starts with things like this Harrower idea and the Champ Spawns that the Friday Hunt Group has been running.

    I also have a red that I'd be more than happy to let people kill to gain Justice. Lord knows I can't seem to figure out any other use for her and I absolutely SUCK at trying to play her. I figure I'm pretty good at dying so standing in one place letting people kill me should be a piece of cake. LOL

    Seriously, let me know when and where and what I can do to help. My travel schedule is starting to pick up again (matter of fact, I just got home last nite from a work trip) but even on the crappiest connections I could probably stand somewhere and rez/heal.

    I absolutely love the idea and I hope more people will get behind it and get involved. :eek:
     
  33. Nystul

    Nystul Lore Master
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    Explain how ANY way we could do this that it would be for personal gain? If we were doing it for personal gain we would do them privatly like we always do...

    If we excluded every guild but lets say SeXi it still wouldnt be personal gain...
     
  34. Lady_Calina

    Lady_Calina Lore Keeper
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    Okay, okay, no more fighting. Let's just get the ball rolling on this event!
     
  35. Callie

    Callie Guest

    I am in. I will have an alliance meeting and discuss with the rest of the allies their wishes. Keep us posted on the details as they surface.

    We are happy to help do some spawns to get the other skulls...with help.
     
  36. a grey wolf

    a grey wolf Journeyman
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    Hi there...

    Interesting thread.

    While I can't speak for everyone else in my guild, I will say chances of us raiding events like this would be slim to none.

    First of all we have never liked to raid events like this. Even the relay for life raid I did not participate in if I remember right, nor did most of us. It was only a select few individuals that did it out of boredom (and immaturity) mostly.
    This even sounds like a good idea to me, if it can help bring people to fel who rarely would experience it otherwise. Our guild has actually done this ourselves multiple times in the past...Usually around or on a holiday tho, and never told other guilds they couldn't come either. Even enemies were welcome, as long as they were not aggressive. We let all come and participate, and only attacked or drove out people who attacked other players. I'm sure there are some other players on this board who will vouch for that, and remember those events too.
    In any case, like I said..I can't speak for everyone in my guild or alliance, but I doubt you would have much to worry about. We usually don't like to raid events like this regardless, and even if we did...we have maybe 5 active players right now? If we don't raid your private harry since theres 5 of us and 25 of you, how the heck would we raid a public, with the same 25, and more (whole shard? lol) with our 5.
    Heheh.
    Funny tho, to see this. Clearly a certain guild trying to improve their image (or to make us look worse, or hurt our feelings by excluding us, lol).

    Should be nice tho for the trammies, if they actually get a chance to do something new.
     
  37. GirlPower

    GirlPower Guest

    Actually grey wolf, as stated above, no one is excluded. If people try to raid or kill other players then we can just go from there. None of this idea has anything to do with anyones image or to put anyone else down. Just wanna get more people involved in the fel side of things and let them try a harrower without other players killing them for it. Hopefully fel/spawns/harrowers won't seem so intimidating anymore and we can liven fel back up a bit. So no hidden agendas, no ulterior motives. Hopefully your guildmates will not be "bored" enough again to raid, but no one is excluded unless they are aggressive toward the players participating. I know you have many good pvpers in your guild as well and we welcome any assistance in keeping the players safe.
     
  38. Nystul

    Nystul Lore Master
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    It should also be noted as obviously stated in my first post that the harrower itself is for the players who have not had a chance to experience one. I'd like to ask that players who already have killed multiple harrowers etc. do not participate in the killing unless there is a lack of participation or actual killing of the harrower.
     
  39. Magdalene

    Magdalene Stratics Legend
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    IMHO you have to take it on honour level.
    People who show up for the harrower hereby declare they are not in PvP/Spawn guild on another character and support the whole thing.
    Take that risk - trust people who show up and work the harrower.

    If they fail - they are not who they say they are or, if you're rided they turn against the group and side with the attackers... you may lose the harrower, but you will identify some scum and know who to invite and who's KOS now :)

    Just sayin'
     
  40. AnneNomilly

    AnneNomilly Seasoned Veteran
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    Awesome, sounds like everyone's in agreement that this is a GREAT idea and it should move full steam ahead! So, how about this then. Why don't we start a thread for Harrower Tips and Tricks?

    In that thread, we can give out tips on templates, strategy, the concept of Justice, etc. That one can be purely informational with things players need to know who have never seen the Harrower. For example, how many players would know about the Tentacles of the Harrower vs. the True Harrower?

    Last nite, at the Friday Nite Hunt, someone got the Skull of Greed and wanted to know what it was used for. We can use the Tips and Tricks thread to explain the whole concept and how the Harrower can be spawned in any dungeon.

    Just an idea. :)

    By the way, I completely agree with Magdelene. This HAS to be started on the basis of honor. Anyone without honor will be shown up soon enough for their true colors. But this has the opportunity to open up a whole new area for a lot of players. And, in the long run, it may open up some excitement for some veteran pvp'ers if we can get more people into Fel having fun. You never know, that die hard "Trammie" today might be wiping up the battlefields in pvp tomorrow!
     
  41. Mish o sha

    Mish o sha Adventurer
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    :party::pint::eyes::shots:, I be there when you post a time,nothin like a little pixel excitement, on a Saturday nite, no matter what happens its a game played for fun:bowdown:
     
  42. Nystul

    Nystul Lore Master
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    I will be posting ahead of time the basics of a harrower, how they're summoned etc. I'll also be explaining the rewards for the harrower, how protection & justice work etc.

    It will most likely be a brief explination that links the readers to the sources on stratics. I believe all the information is on the main uo.stratics.com page.
     
  43. a grey wolf

    a grey wolf Journeyman
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    Thanks for proving my earlier point Shotgun =-)
     
  44. Lady_Calina

    Lady_Calina Lore Keeper
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    After talking with Nys, we decided that what we're going to do is take the skulls from the Zoo Spawns and give them up for the Public Harrowers. If we stick to the dungeon spawns after this first one, we should be able to have a Public Harrower about once a month. :)
     
  45. This is about hosting a public harrower not about bashing other guilds. Unless people have an idea for nytsul on planning the Harrower no one should be posting comments about anything derogatory. If any of my guild mates have a problem with this, please icq me or talk to me in vent. One persons opinion does not represent our whole guild. With that, happy planning lets all have some fun.
     
  46. Lady_Calina

    Lady_Calina Lore Keeper
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    Okay, so it looks like all there is left to do is get with Anne on her thread and discuss tactics. Then Nys and his guild can decide on a date/time to aim for!
     
  47. Rathma

    Rathma Guest

    I can't wait. Hopefully this will be done soon.
     
  48. Shotgun

    Shotgun Guest

    i wasnt bashing anyone i was merely stating the truth but i have removed my post and i will stay out of it.
     
  49. GirlPower

    GirlPower Guest

    Like Hardcore stated, if you have any issues, talk to him on icq or in vent when he is on. This is not the place for it.

    So when would be a good time and day for the Harrower? It might be easier to plan if we knew when the publish/event was happening. I know some people do events and hunt nights, what day of the week is usualy best for those kinds of things to make sure as many can participate as want to?
     
  50. Nystul

    Nystul Lore Master
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    I think they do events already on fridays & saturdays.

    But with publish 56 rolling in closer I think it may be a good idea to wait until after everyone gets thier fix in with the publish and those events before starting the harrowers. I know I myself would like quite a few of the rewards of the halloween events after reading about em ;x