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PVP rewards

Discussion in 'UHall' started by Lady Michelle, Nov 4, 2012.

  1. Lady Michelle

    Lady Michelle Sprite Full SP
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    I was thinking why not reward pvpers for pvping. So n So kills me he gets a drop in his pack that says So n So killed Michelle. When I go and get rezzed I will have something in my pack saying Michelle was killed by So n So. These items you only be able to obtain by pvping. The reward could be a deed of a plaque or certificate that you can place that takes no lock downs. Maybe a clothing item like footwear, shirts, robes etc. The items could be random so you never know what will drop in your pack.
    Players want pvp reward items they will have to pvp or buy the items.
     
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  2. CovenantX

    CovenantX Babbling Loonie
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    I appreciate what you're doing, but this particular idea, would more likely end up being used to "grief" people by Bragging they would have a plaque saying they killed you, and so forth.
    not only that, but it can be abused, to the point it really wouldn't make a difference. (players going to secluded areas in fel, and killing each others characters to create these items.)

    I do like the idea mind you, but I do not think it would really solve anything though.

    The idea of adding exclusive content to all facets (not just fel) would IMO be the best possible way to balance things out, you need to create a Circle and make every facet have a specific reason to go there besides... the scenery.
     
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  3. Winker

    Winker Babbling Loonie
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    I don't need my back pack getting cluttered up with crap saying i killed so-n-so. I am more than happy with the insurance in the bank and knowledge that next time you see me you're going to run for your life. It would just be another thing to clutter up my back pack when were having a big fight.
     
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  4. Berethrain

    Berethrain Slightly Crazed
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    We do, they're called death robes. :tinhat:
     
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  5. Lady Michelle

    Lady Michelle Sprite Full SP
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    I got killed by Berethrain I'll I got was this death robe :D
     
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  6. CovenantX

    CovenantX Babbling Loonie
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    Well... If anyone could come up with something that couldn't possibly be viewed as "luring Sheep to Wolves".... have at it, I don't see it being possible. because like most things exclusive to fel, non-PvPers want them, the same goes for things exclusive to tram for PvPers. So to attract one, without attracting the other would be hard/impossible.

    Equal content for all... or exclusive content/drops for all. both would be balanced. but "equal" content for all really wouldn't change much, because everything available in tram & fel, is always harder obtained in fel... (which isn't completely true, but too close to true for it to make a difference).

    They could just make everything on both-sides be different by adding an "Obtained in <Facet>" tag to items... but really... who doesn't want more artifacts ?

    I myself do not really care how small fel is (the smaller the better, because of the smaller player-base of pvpers now) compared to the other facets, but the rewards need to be different, if it stays as is.
     
  7. popps

    popps Always Present
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    Many years ago, it was possible to cut up killed character's bodies and the killer would keep the cut up parts which would carry the character's name. It was stopped so, I guess, there are reasons that make PvP "trophies" not possible.
     
  8. Petra Fyde

    Petra Fyde Peerless Chatterbox
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    It was stopped because sales of the game were banned in one European country because of it. I don't remember which one.
    The only 'trophy' most reds used to want was their post count. I guess that may have changed. I remember the uproar when a bug with the harrower caused people to take counts they shouldn't have, leading to a wipe of all murder counts. The normally red players were furious and wasted no time at all in going on a killing spree to restore their red status.

    Some people would do well to remember that Trammel exists because people were leaving Sosaria in droves. It was far better that they left Felucca for Trammel than leave UO for Ever Quest.

    Most red characters are set up for pvp aren't they? Which needs a different skill set and different kit to pvm, doesn't it? In the past, people didn't pvm on their red, they made a blue, which gave them access to all other facets? You can't play pvm content without a pvm character? So why all the fuss about taking reds to Trammel? I truely don't understand where people are coming from on this.
    If I want to try for a tangle, I have to leave Trammel and go to Underworld. If I want decor from the Primeval lich spawn I have to leave Trammel and go to the Abyss.
     
    #8 Petra Fyde, Nov 5, 2012
    Last edited: Nov 5, 2012
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  9. Orgional Farimir

    Orgional Farimir Lore Keeper
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    Although I appriciate your idea I don't think it would work at all. The mindset of a PvMer VS a PvPer is completly different. For example, just look at this latest publish. The majority of people who play mainly in Tram thinks this new publish is the greatest invention since sliced bread because it gives out "pixel crack" that allows players to store more "pixel crack". Yet most PvPers thing this publish is a complete waste because it accomplishes nothing. There is no armor/weapon revamp, no O/C, no template fixes (or nerfs) and the list goes on and on.

    %90 of PvPers don't want any "pixel crack" we want a "flag to capture" to quote Cetric from another thread. That is why I have posted a revamp for guild wars that would make it relevent again. Sadly though, inorder for guild wars not to be broken reds would have to be allowed in Tram so red guilds are not at a disadvantage when fighting a blue guild. Because of this the topic ALWAYS gets derailed by the "I don't PvP, but I don't wany any PvP in Tram, even though it doesn't effect me one bit because I don't and I am the most important thing in the world" posters.
     
    #9 Orgional Farimir, Nov 5, 2012
    Last edited: Nov 5, 2012
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  10. Orgional Farimir

    Orgional Farimir Lore Keeper
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    The reason reds in Trammel was brought up, by me atlease, was when the devs mentioned bringing back Order/Chaos. In order for O/C to be worth while there would have to be fighting in every facet, otherwise it would be just like factions, but red PvP guilds would be at a HUGE dissadvantage in O/C if reds were not allowed in Trammel. I the example of having a blue guild mate PvMing in the Abyss and a 3 of Chaos guys roll up. If I am on my red I would have to run, unflag from who ever I am fighting (2 minutes), hope I don't accidently hit a rat as I recall into my house (2 more minutes), switch items and skills around (1 more minute), log out and back in and run to the spot in the abyss (2-3 minutes). So overall we are looking at 8 minutes (worst case) before I am able to get in the same area as my guild mate to help out. Now if reds were allowed in Trammel all I would have to do is run and unflag (2 minutes) and then recall and run to where my guild member is (1-2 minutes). So instead of it taking 8 minutes we are looking at 4 minutes. In an uneven PvP situation, exspecially with monster spawn that extra 4 minutes usually is the difference between life and death.
     
  11. Petra Fyde

    Petra Fyde Peerless Chatterbox
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    Fair enough. When the devs begin discussions on how Order/Chaos is to be implemented this argument in favour of red characters in all facets will be valid. Please raise it again at that time.
     
  12. Winker

    Winker Babbling Loonie
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    The reason people were leaving in droves was because they didn't really want to play a MMO in the first place. Not because of all the reds.
    If they all played the game as a group or in a guild rather than individuals they would have been able to kill the reds.

    Back in the days before the game was split into fell and tram, if you killed a red they were put into stat loss, and not the 20 minuet stat loss there is in factions today. They had to rework there skills. Which back in those days, depending on your skill, it could take weeks to get the character back to a level he was able to PvP again. Pluss you had to try do this while eeryone tried to kill you again and put you further into stat loss
    So playing a red character in the early days was not for the faint hearted.
    Darkfall has carried on where UO left off before the split of the facets. Its a harsh game to play, but it is surviving because they knew the game was not for the masses and expected that many would leave, but they would be left with a core player who did like that type of game play
     
    #12 Winker, Nov 5, 2012
    Last edited: Nov 5, 2012
  13. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Grand Poobah
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    Outstanding try, this would be PvPing for the sake of PvPing, but as you can see with all the PvP posts this is not a good enough reason for them because they want the goodies to go with it. Even if you had a PvP Leader Board that would not be good enough. PvPing for the sake of PvPing is dead without the lures.
     
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  14. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Grand Poobah
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    :thumbsup: QFT
     
  15. cazador

    cazador Crazed Zealot
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    I like this idea and it is the same as the bones it's just deco so it's really not game altering as an item or something super sought after...but what would stop me from creating a character with a cool name on my second account and RKin it non stop to get the drops?
     
  16. CovenantX

    CovenantX Babbling Loonie
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    And the Murder-counts as a "trophy" would likely be a factor today as well, IF there were some form of leader-board. Factions kind of had one, but since the distribution of kill points was able to be abused and essentially "Dupe" kill points it didn't mean anything.
     
  17. Corpin

    Corpin Journeyman
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    I would like to share something the EMs did on Lake Superior not toooo long ago, I'm not sure they did this on other shards or not.

    They had an EM hosted event at the arena in Haven. They told people to seperate into teams, 2s, 3s, etc. The rules were this, you get into the arena and have a skirmish.. but YOU COULD NOT HEAL YOURSELF. You could only heal your teammates. This lasted a good couple hours and trammies as well as pvpers showed up and participated. Granted, my guildies and I won since we were experienced in pvp, but everyone seemed to enjoy it. I was quite suprised with the trammie turn out and participation.

    A few days later, there was a fel event East of Britain, along the coast line where the Ems spawned many monsters and even a custom boss. The turn out was immense, and the previous arena skirmish really did great to get the trammies to band together.. I admit, for a bit there was some reds attacking blues.. but it was a pretty amazing sight to behold, the trammies grouped together and applied the crosshealing and while mostly tamers would spam all kill on the pvpers that were attacking they repressed them quite a bit.. but honestly, there were only a very few reds attacking blues.

    The outcome? The "wolves" vs "wolves" fight was one of the biggest in my recent memory. it was chaos, many pvp guilds in all out open field battle, a true pvpers dream. The trammies killed the boss while the pvper's kept themselves busy fighting each other and the blues were left completely alone except for the few trammies that wanted to actually try to pvp.

    To me, it was a wonderful few hours and I was personally amazed and proud of EM Auto and Aname for organizing, planning and carrying out this event. All had fun.. The pvpers had an amazing fight, the trammies got pixel crack and actually stuck around to watch/participate in the pvp.

    I know this doesn't hold much weight on the current discussion, but man... it was epic.

    Just wanted to share.
     
  18. CovenantX

    CovenantX Babbling Loonie
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    There's really not so much a way to prove it right or wrong. Who is to say UO wouldn't be around today if Trammel never existed ? the only evidence of saying it would be true, is that some fel only free-shards are still populated.

    Check this Promathia originally brought this to my attention.

    50:36 in the video is when UO is brought up, and this guy was obviously a supporter of pre-tram, and he is far from the only one that thinks of it that way.

    Felucca helped form communities both negative & positive, but they are both "good" for the game. Trammel took away from that, BUT I do not agree trammel never should have been part of UO.

    The thing is, (Corpin and I are talking in vent) and he mentioned that on most forums (for almost all MMORPGs (that have any concept of pvp)) There are mentions of PvP from UO, as being the most amazing thing and nothing comes close to matching it. Just sayin, There are a lot of people that would disagree with trammel being the reason UO has survived. but I'm not saying they would be right or wrong, because there is no real way of proving it.
     
    #18 CovenantX, Nov 5, 2012
    Last edited: Nov 5, 2012
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  19. Corpin

    Corpin Journeyman
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    Now, Fel exists for those with a competitive play style, tram the opposite. Give fel a point other then fruitless mindless competitive playstyle.. a goal. Tram offers many things, fel only bragging rights. We want more then bragging rights. That is the foundation of the problem. It absolutely amazes me that some people just don't get this point.
     
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  20. CovenantX

    CovenantX Babbling Loonie
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    Let me explain why Faction Item changes hurt Fel,instead of helping it. First, the items were fine (Except that) they devalued the "Real" Non-faction artifacts. The Faction Items now, with the Ephemeral property, would be ok IMO, BUT it's not only ephemeral, the Items have a 4 week timer (starts upon item creation) regardless if the person having them equiped or not, they will decay after the 4 week timer, Also decays if the person is Unable to play, This cause people to Either Quit or be Forced to play one shard (Atlantic) where you'd get the most out of one faction items life-span then you would be able to do so playing Multiple shards. because they don't want to PvM to get the "real" items, OR they sold the real items because they thought they've become obsolete.

    Factions did certainly help boost pvp (Before the "Fix") but it's because people had easier access to build a pvp suit (I'd mention the Faction-Crystaline Ring specifically as it was the only artifact that was Vastly different than the non-faction version. FCR 3 was a little overboard tbh) but the point is, Much like the whole Tactics & Spec-toggling thing, After people become "use" to it, and it gets changed for the worse, it always results in negative things, like people quitting.
     
  21. Speaking the Truth

    Speaking the Truth Lore Keeper
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    I'd say the biggest reason one sees lower populations in fel is because of all changes that affect pvp. First was the toggle specs, then the 300 combat point, then the faction armor.

    It's not that people don't like fel, but it gets the short end of the stick. I doubt monsters were complaining to devs about specs being toggled while spells were being cast.
     
  22. GalenKnighthawke

    GalenKnighthawke Grand Poobah
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    Again, this neglects what's in Fel already.

    Why would they add more when no one seems to particularly care about the 2 Abyss champ spawns, when people deride the Faction Artifacts (not only available from Fel exclusively but must be maintained in Fel exclusively, though acquisition of points and Silver), and when people now deride scrolls as not enough despite that, when you think about it, they are the only items you actually need these days. You can duplicate artifacts through one form of crafting or another, to one degree or another, but you can't duplicate even the simplest of power scrolls.

    -Galen's player
     
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  23. GalenKnighthawke

    GalenKnighthawke Grand Poobah
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    Remember that most of what you cite were requested by Fellies until they happened, then were derided by the same people.

    The producer at the time of AoS at one point openly said that much of that expansion was driven by PvPers; that there was a prejudice among PvPers against stuff that didn't require player choices.

    The entire AoS expansion can be seen as an attempt to implement that notion.

    Wanted it, until it was here, then didn't want it.

    Also remember that changes for PvP tend to impact PvM much more than the other way around.

    -Galen's player
     
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  24. GalenKnighthawke

    GalenKnighthawke Grand Poobah
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    They are only Ephemeral in Trammel.

    Again, a change requested in some form by Fellies, except you wanted them to 'fall off' which was unrealistic at best.

    The Faction Artifacts make more of a difference than you are suggesting and if they didn't, then we wouldn't be having this discussion, because their changes would have resulted in a big shrug.

    Instead they are overpoweringly important enough to warrant your suggesting that their merely being more difficult to maintain emptied Fel.

    -Galen's player
     
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  25. GalenKnighthawke

    GalenKnighthawke Grand Poobah
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    As stated, the Fellies argued that the Faction Artifacts should either fall off in Trammel or should revert to the stats of the base item.

    No one who was reading Stratics in the months and years reading up to this change can reasonably dispute that such was the prevailing desire, and it wasn't coming from Trammel players.

    -Galen's player
     
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  26. Corpin

    Corpin Journeyman
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    The need for Power scrolls declines greatly with no new players coming to the game. Sure, people make new toons all the time but still, power scrolls being the only true fel reward outnumber those using them by far. Furthermore, Yes, Fel did get two abyss spawns in the latest big expansion but trammel got a new land and dungeon.

    Trammel has many rewards you cannot find in Felucca. Naturally, there should be many rewards you cannot find in Trammel.

    Many people along with myself, are just as loyal to doing things in Fel as those loyal to stay in tram.

    By adding more for PvPers to fight over you accomplish quite a few important things. First being, a purpose in PvPing. Arguments such as "You should PvP to PvP" only works from the outside looking in, we on the inside still want a goal.

    If something was added for us to fight over that offered more rewards then powerscrolls then it would balance the economy of tram and fel. Allow me to explain.

    I am just as capable of going to Trammel as you are Felucca. You don't want to come to felucca because you feel it is a risk of PvP. I don't want to come to Trammel because there is no risk, thus defeating any excitement the game offers. I enjoy the risk.. I don't enjoy rewards without some or a lot of risk. I buy numerous things you can only find in trammel from trammel only players. You should buy Felucca only items from Me and those of the same opinions. That balances the economy between Tram and Fel. Neither of us want to travel to the opposite facet because it ruins both of our gameplay for us.

    I'm not being unreasonable or bashing trammel players, or luring them etc. I just want fun, purposeful pvp, risk while PvMing, and equalities between the two facets.
     
  27. GalenKnighthawke

    GalenKnighthawke Grand Poobah
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    Again, "true" reward is subjective; your not liking the other rewards doesn't mean they aren't there. What if they give you something new and PvP specific that you also don't like? Will it not count?

    Again, most people went to Trammel and didn't look back, for excellent reasons that had nothing whatsoever to do with the rewards or lack thereof.

    Indeed for the brief period that the facets were essentially equal, Fel so emptied out that they had to start a long line of incentives which I've outlined elsewhere.

    Fel being empty isn't a product of the lack of rewards. The lack of rewards is a product of the fact that very few want to play there, hence why alienate the vast majority of your customers by making them?

    The point is that if you make rewards that impact PvM, as basically all rewards will, that are available only through PvP, you're hurting the majority of your customers at the expense of catering to a minority that has already chosen to ignore most of the rewards at their fingertips.


    Elsewhere one of your fellows argued that Fel drives the Tram economy. I take it you think he was wrong?

    I do too.

    I am, however, not all that concerned about balancing out the economies of the facets because as a game it wouldn't make sense to alienate most of your customers for the vocal few.

    Here is where a certain amount of subtle smack talk begins wherein you make assumptions about me, state them, and then I have to waste time establishing my credentials.

    I've been in spawn guilds, done factions, done Spawns and Harrowers (I was present at the first Harrower spawn on LS and might have been the first person to wound it -- hard to tell when something has that much HP), done Yew Gate Combat, etc.

    I don't want to come to Felucca mostly for the attitude. No I don't like PvP but I'd still do it, just to sharpen my skills for PvM, if it didn't mean putting up with all the things it means putting up with.


    And here the game continues wherein I must stop to challenge every incorrect assumption you state as fact.

    There is actually the same risk. You die, you lose insurance money, you may not get to your corpse in time to get stuff you didn't insure, if you don't either insure or get the rewards out before you died you could lose them, etc.


    When they made Dungeon Doom they expected, or so they stated, that there would be a fair amount of shard to shard trade. Scrolls for artifacts. Some say that happened but I never experienced it.

    What I noticed was the biggest PvP guild on LS started to somehow count Doom as PvP (even had it on a list of PvP content they "totally dominated" on their site), and treated as such. Except since they couldn't kill anyone legally so they started to do stuff like "lose connection" while standing in the doors, and lure the monsters out into the main chamber, thus trapping everyone. And started to make characters with no luck that were assured of doing the most damage, thus limiting the number of artifacts. Stuff like that.

    Because power scrolls had the most value of any item in the game at that time they also had all the money (metaphorically) and there were no complaints about "balance" back then.

    They also used to brag about putting spies in 'every' Tram guild and how they would destroy the big Tram guilds from within, etc.

    *shrugs*

    -Galen's player
     
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  28. CovenantX

    CovenantX Babbling Loonie
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    And, the proof of it coming from Felucca Players? Mind you, it's not important, I said, I didn't agree with the faction items being Better than the non-faction ones...

    The Point is, Faction artifacts were an Incentive to PvP And they Worked, for "reward" better items, "Risk" stat-loss. It's broken now, because of the "Fix". now they are Almost useless, unless you play on atlantic, or have all of the time in the world to pvp and maintain your suits on multiple shards.
     
  29. Ashlynn_L

    Ashlynn_L Lore Master
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    Here's a question. Does anyone really believe that players who have no wish to play in a PvP environment will suddenly visit Felucca because there's a new reward available, even if it was a game-breaking one such as say... a scroll of +100 skill point cap increase?
     
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  30. Speaking the Truth

    Speaking the Truth Lore Keeper
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    After AoS UO was at its peak subscribers I have no problem that AoS came out I adapted. It's things like specials being changed which I can't see was pvmers complaining, or 300 combat point change, or faction change.

    I can see some people wanting things changed, however no one asked for them to fix them in a way that ruined them.

    I use to be able to pvp on 11 shards. Now down to 2.

    Factions could have been fine if they put that whole ephermal(sp?) thing in from the get go. Then players couldn't have stayed in tram never having to fight as the gear breaks pretty quickly.

    Also I have to disagree with what you've said about free shards as I have played on quite a few and despite what someone may say in a review, unless you play for yourself you can't really judge it.

    I can read about a restaurant being terrible by some, yet great by others, until I have the full experience I can't weight in on it.
     
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  31. Cetric

    Cetric Grand Inquisitor
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    I pvm'ed because i wanted a slither. Does that answer your question?
     
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  32. Speaking the Truth

    Speaking the Truth Lore Keeper
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    They aren't over powered. However the problem is for those who took the time to make make gold to build suits, get scrolls, and send characters to every shard. My suits used almost every 5 or 6 artifacts. My problem is that now after all that work I can't use my chars, you can't keep rank, and now you have the grind like WoW[you always have to grind for your gear in that game] to maintain your gear.

    If you argue that they are over powered you're off your rocker. A few resits, a little dci, a little mr, hardly game changing. Also anyone could join, so risk vs reward for you. If it was the first person that joined and only he/she could use the artifacts then yes I would say that's over powered. Since thats not the case and it was just a way to save gold in an already expensive venture, it's a shame they ruined that by breaking it, then breaking it slightly less, instead of just fixing it with the ephermal property in the first place.
     
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  33. CovenantX

    CovenantX Babbling Loonie
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    It's not the point of bringing players who don't have any wishes to pvp, to fel. its about bringing Anyone to fel for anything other than Only to pvp.... but if you want my honest opinion...

    I believe people who typically would never go to fel, might feel it may be worth attempting, but nothing is stopping said player from buying an item from someone who is willing to try and get it.
     
  34. Viper09

    Viper09 Grand Poobah
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    I don't think so. Those who rarely ever go to fel seem to hold the idea that it's a horrifically dangerous place, that the second you go out of the guard zone you will be instantly ambushed by pks. This may sound like an exaggeration but sadly it isn't for a number of players. Just try and convince the hard-core trammel players that it is actually safe to fight a champ spawn in certain locations in fel.

    This is the problem with incentives, those who are scared of fel would probably never risk coming here.
    That doesn't really answer the question. Going from fel --> tram is moving from high risk to low risk. Going from tram --> fel is moving from low risk to high risk. Players who have avoided going to fel and PvP altogether would probably be too scared to make the step.
     
    #34 Viper09, Nov 5, 2012
    Last edited: Nov 5, 2012
  35. Corpin

    Corpin Journeyman
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    I'm just amazed at the inability for Tram based players to understand that fel-based players want more, and NEED more to stick around. It is jaw droppingly painful to read the retorts from such stubborn people and their blatantly biased views.

    I'm sorry pvpers killed you.
    I'm sorry PvPers talk trash in "your" gen chat.
    I'm sorry pvpers are generally far more wealthy then you.
    I'm sorry PvPers understand more of the game mechanics even including PvM.
    I'm sorry PvPers are not content gardening, fishing and killing mindless monsters that require zero brain power and ability.

    I'm sorry I tried stating my opinions in a Pro-Tram the hell with everything else digitial retirement home based forums.

    Overall, I'm sorry I spent money and time playing a game for what it once was and not what it is.
     
  36. GalenKnighthawke

    GalenKnighthawke Grand Poobah
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    Remember, I was relating things Fellies had said.

    No need for the personal attacks.

    The argument about cross-shard PvP appears odd. Without Faction Artifacts you could of course just use regular equipment and cross-shard it. If these items are important enough to be critical to cross-shard PvP, then they are much more powerful than you are admitting in your other words.

    The personal attack of saying I'm "off my rocker" does not change the fact that your argument is inconsistent with itself.

    -Galen's player
     
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  37. Petra Fyde

    Petra Fyde Peerless Chatterbox
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    Please keep personal attacks out.

    FYI. The claim that faction artifacts are 'overpowered' did not originate from Galen. It originated from non-faction pvpers who claimed the faction players had an unfair advantage and they were therefore forced to join factions to compete.
    It was further claimed that it was detrimental that people could join factions and simply use the faction artifacts to pvm in Trammel. This lead to the recent changes to those items.
     
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  38. GalenKnighthawke

    GalenKnighthawke Grand Poobah
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    Thank you for pointing this out.

    -Galen's player
     
  39. GalenKnighthawke

    GalenKnighthawke Grand Poobah
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    "Blatantly biased" in this case appears to simply mean to have an opinion that differs from yours.

    As has been pointed out repeatedly, this issue goes far beyond merely being killed.

    Trash-talking in General Chat is clearly something done deliberately, in order to brag to a much-wider audience than you could possibly achieve by only bragging to those who actually care.

    You know it's funny, sometimes the complaints are that "Trammies" are too rich, and sometimes that they are too poor.

    Also it's funny how the PvPers got so rich, assuming your statement is correct, given that you all somehow lack access to meaningful content.

    Demonstrably incorrect. Hence no need to apologize. My favorite incident involved a Spawning Guild I was in some years back, wherein I multiple times had to explain to people that Ice East, Ice West, Ice Island, Ice Dungeon, and the Dungeon Deceit were all separate locations.

    Again, an attack disguised as an argument, and makes assumptions that are often far from true.

    -Galen's player
     
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  40. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Grand Poobah
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    There are no OLD SKOOL TRUE PvPers left in UO.
    PvP for the sake of PvP is DEAD.
    PvP in UO today is all about "Show Me the Money" as a reason to PvP.
    So SAD.
     
  41. GalenKnighthawke

    GalenKnighthawke Grand Poobah
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    As someone who's had, shall we say, some issues with Stratics in the recent past (can't say more without violating the Terms of Service, wouldn't want to say more because doing so would be reopening my own wound, and this much said only to bolster my credibility for talking about this issue.....)

    Anyway, as someone who's had, shall we say, issues with Stratics in the VERY recent past, I am constrained to point out that this post is incorrect prima facie. There's two open threads on the rewards topic alone. And if Fellies were as over-represented in the game as they are in those threads, then we would never have had Trammel, let alone this discussion. But, alas, they are not.

    The funny thing is that as a matter of policy I'd support leaving scrolls in Fel, I'd support some kind of PvP-specific reward (an artifact weapon that is of no value in PvM but is of some value in PvP; more special titles; no Harrower-specific artifact but the Harrower instead can drop ANY artifact, including Doom artifacts and all Champ Spawn Artifacts, 20% chance per Harrower or something; Honor for arena fighting, equaled out by a means to get Justice in Trammel; etc.).

    As a matter of policy I'd support these, and have in the past. But I discovered that my own attempts at accommodation were not matched by the Fellies so I decided to just not bother, and go for broke.

    -Galen's player
     
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  42. Berethrain

    Berethrain Slightly Crazed
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    But you bother to go out of your way to make some strange argument against it? If you didn't care you wouldn't bother putting any replies for or against.

    :postcount:
     
  43. GalenKnighthawke

    GalenKnighthawke Grand Poobah
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    I believe you are quoting me.

    In context I was quite clear that I wasn't bothering with being fair and supporting Fel content and have instead decided to just go for broke.

    Your post, rather clearly a deliberate mis-statement of a statement of mine that was quite clear in intent, is an excellent example of why I've decided to just go for broke, and not bother with being fair-minded.

    -Galen's player
     
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  44. Berethrain

    Berethrain Slightly Crazed
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    I didn't need to quote the rest, it was already implied since you said it anyways.

    I still retain the prior statement. Which if you look back:

    In the end it doesn't really make sense to me. You're saying so instead of being fair minded, you'd rather just "go for broke" so we know you have a bias in something that really doesn't pertain to you at all.
     
  45. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Grand Poobah
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    It was a good try but there are already Faction items being worn by bank sitters in Luna.
     
  46. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Grand Poobah
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    And all your posts are about "Show Me the Money" as a reason to PvP.
    PvP for the sake of PvP is DEAD.
    So so SAD.
     
  47. Winker

    Winker Babbling Loonie
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    I have been playing on OSI/EA shards for 13 years now, 12 of those PvPing. I would like to think i am Old Skool. But since they fracked us over in the last Faction update, i find im PvPing on player run shards with many, many other people. The idea that fel is dead and no one wants to play it is far from wrong. Its more of a case of EA/OSI shards are dead and no one wants to play on them.
     
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  48. Lord Frodo

    Lord Frodo Grand Poobah
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    So because they took away your "goodies" you quit.
    PvP for the sake of PvP is DEAD.
     
  49. Corpin

    Corpin Journeyman
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    Incorrect, fellies are forced to compromise because of trammel. Trammies are unwilling to see they have everything of modern UO value and that fellies have outdated, undesirable spawns/rewards.


    100% Incorrect. This IS the issue. Its the only thing besides lack of content that separates it from trammel.

    Incorrect again. I do not take part in trash talk, but ask any PvPer, trash talk is to make them come back and PvP more. There is not much pvp, getting a rise out of someone to come back insures they come back.

    The difference is, PvPers make their profits by the million, trammies have gold trickle in over time. The reason? personally trying to get slithers for my pvp toons when no trammie was selling them led to many floor tiles and medusa statues (pixel crack for trammies) Note that I was forced to PvM with no other interferrence to make it challenging, the same affect yet opposite reason you and others don't want to PvP.

    A group of newbie PvPers, obviously. point is moot.

    Simple truth. Name me one champ that does not become predictable and easy to solo after a few runs. Even bad pvper's are unpredictable thus leading to some level of excitement.
     
    #49 Corpin, Nov 6, 2012
    Last edited: Nov 6, 2012
  50. Corpin

    Corpin Journeyman
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    I'm forced to participate in your trammie lifestyle or buy items, somethings should require you to have to participate in mine or buy my items.

    Again, it mesmerizes me how this escapes you and so many others.